r/siders16case

What would be the best case scenario for Elizabeth if this lawyer really goes up to bat for her and she gets no jail time?

I’m 36 with two kids and I feel overwhelmed with maintaining my house, caring for them and my
Pets most days. I’m also full time employed, make good money and have a great support system. I pay a house cleaner twice a month and have a laundry service. My kids are also developmentally on par. This woman has obviously never held down a job, and doesn’t seem like she has the mindset to.

I just have no idea how she would ever manage this many kids solo, her family seems like they dropped the ball with her. I just feel like there’s almost zero positive outcomes for anyone in this situation and that’s what is the most heartbreaking aspect of it all.

I’m wondering how far into the dementia diagnosis Lynn is, bc at the bond hearing, she does seem mentally “there.” I’ve worked with dementia patients and once you get far enough into the disease, you don’t really know what’s going on and there’s almost an absence to your eyes. Her eyes had a look of presence. So while her health could have contributed to the situation spiraling out of control, I don’t think it’s the main driver. Gary Sr. seemed way less present mentally than Lynn at the bond hearing.

Hello everyone, this is my first time posting here. I have done some research into the Siders case and I would like to share my opinion and read your thoughts on that. This is going to be a long post and I will clarify my train of thought as the post progresses.
So the core of my opinion on this matter is that this is a case of religious psychosis, specifically perpetrated by the hand of Gary Jr. (the children’s father).
Gary Jr. was born into a conventionally Christian family—a poor family in terms of money but rich in “blessings”: a lot of children, and more daughters than sons (I believe Gary Jr. is the only male son of Gary Sr. and Christina? Correct me if I’m wrong). He was born in a beautiful county but one limited in terms of real opportunities. It is my understanding that marriage between underage girls and older boys, as well as marriage between relatives, is common and often looked over in old Appalachian rural areas.
Gary met Elizabeth. A little about Elizabeth: Elizabeth's family is from Gallipolis, Ohio (42 minutes from the house on Ohmer Street). They are very active on FB. It is a family formed by a mom, a dad, and three siblings: the older brother, a middle son, and Elizabeth. The two brothers have been in and out of jail since forever; the older brother was, in fact, just released recently after spending almost a decade in prison. I’ve noticed that the mother is very close with the older brother, doesn’t seem to acknowledge the middle son very much, and keeps Elizabeth in “her thoughts” on her online persona. In my mind, they are not unlike the Milkoviches.
Elizabeth was reportedly 13 when she met Gary Jr. (that’s what the older brother said) and she fell pregnant very quickly. Since Elizabeth was born in 1992, this happened in the year 2005. Gary Jr. was born in 1989, so he was 16. Since we have a lot of people saying that Elizabeth was in fact pregnant at 13, I wonder what could have happened to the child, because we know that the first-born daughter of the couple, who is alive and now 18, was born in 2008 when Elizabeth was 16.
Elizabeth, after falling pregnant, threatened her mother that she would never let her see her grandson or granddaughter if she wouldn’t let her “run away” with Gary Jr. Now, Elizabeth was 13 and the age of consent in the state of Ohio is 16, so the mother could technically have called the cops or CPS on Gary Jr. I get that he was also underage, but he reached the age of consent while Elizabeth did not.
Elizabeth, along with Gary Jr. and his parents, was allegedly reported to be moving states, but could they have passed unnoticed by the authorities for 20 years? I don’t think so, and in fact, that is not the case. I found something on Christina’s side in Gallipolis, OH, but I cannot trace everything exactly because they moved states and I don’t have the information for the various counties.
First of all, where did the money come from? 20 people living without a dime? Not even Steinbeck could write something like that. Christina and Gary Sr. could have had some sort of retirement fund, or they were all stealing. I don’t think Gary Jr. was working, not legally at least, because that means he would have had to provide his employer with documents. He could have qualified for food stamps and benefits for the children, but that would trigger CPS.
He probably relied on his parents' benefits, and I think they broke into the Ohmer Street house just to stay off the government's radar.
Now, why do I believe some sort of religious psychosis is involved? Well, the poor hygiene matter struck me first. In 2026, what is the reason to not take a shower or use a stick of deodorant? Well, maybe you don’t have running water and electricity, you can’t afford deodorant, or maybe you are against hygiene because of some sort of religious belief. Gloriavale’s members, for example, do not use hygiene products, and neither do FLDS members, the LeBaron Colony, the Amish, and so on. We know that the Dollar General employees gave the family hygiene products but they never used them.
Second of all, fundamentalists are strongly against contraceptives of any kind and they purposely have as many children as they can. Also, they are often in a codependent relationship with other members of the family (like the parents). Why would a family of 18 want to live with their parents? One could say they can provide help with the children, but they were not. One could say they can help run the household more efficiently, but again, they were not. They could split the bills? That could be, or maybe it is a “family of Nazareth” thing.
Another thing that fundamentalists do is stay out of the government’s watch. No tax payments, no driver's licenses, no birth certificates, no employment contracts, no hospitals, and absolutely, for any reason, NO COPS ever. Sometimes they don’t accept benefits either, with very few exceptions. The FLDS collects many benefits from the state(s - Arizona and Utah), but they justify the action by referring to it as “bleeding the beast.” Others accept pension benefits but not child benefits in order to not trigger CPS.
In 2014, we also got a FB post on Gary Jr.'s (second?) page, where allegedly Elizabeth asks everyone to remove her picture from the internet (yeah, it doesn’t really work like that). I’m presuming that was Gary’s request to Elizabeth to write this because Elizabeth’s mother was sharing a picture of her every year on Elizabeth’s birthday. So the reasons could be:

1. Gary Jr. was purely pissed off that the pictures were on FB and asked Elizabeth to write the post.
2. Gary Jr. wrote the post pretending to be Elizabeth because he thought that could really work, meaning that he thought the pictures would be erased from the internet at his demand.
   Having 16 children is very, very time- and energy-consuming. It is also reported that the average cost of raising a child from birth through age 18 in the United States is roughly $300,000 (4.8 million dollars for 16 children). Having just one child is the most significant and hardest part of your entire life; you have to provide safety, emotional support, education, entertainment, a balanced diet, mental help if needed, and so on. So why have 16 if you are not taking care of even one? It is not like Elizabeth was parading downtown with her pregnant belly for attention, or that they were collecting so many benefits that they were “working” with that.
   In the FLDS, the more children you have, the higher degree you reach in the Celestial Kingdom. You will—after passing—have your own planet with tons of your children on it. Of course, they have multiple wives, so sometimes a man can have 100+ children.
   Orthodox Jews have as many children as they can because they want to replace all the Holocaust victims.
   So it could be a religious point of view, or simple abuse by the hand of Gary Jr. They could also be pro-life (they were pro-guns too).
   But why then did Gary Sr. and Christina not intervene if they were all together in the same house? A grandparent who doesn’t share his opinion with his youngest son regarding his children's education strikes me as simply not possible. Did they just hate Elizabeth that much? Or is it because, in my opinion, Gary Jr. manipulated everyone into believing that he was doing “the work of God” to justify his actions? This is similar to the Lafferty brothers explaining a double homicide with “God told me to do it” and the brothers' mother referring to the older brother (Ron Lafferty) as “the one mighty and strong.”
   We don’t really have any information right now, but that is what I’m thinking. What do you guys think?

I know the investigation is ongoing, but what did Gary’s sisters know about the condition of the house and children?

I’m not naming names but there is a picture of Gary’s sister with the parents sitting on a green bench in front of that house. There is no way she didn’t know about the state of the home.

Also, Elizabeth’s mom knew she had a lot of kids, but never once was concerned enough to visit or ask for a welfare check? I don’t think she lived far away. Was all of this just ignored and swept under the rug?

This is so true. Beyond having to approach questioning differently because they’re kids, they have to also factor in the lack of communication. It’s all so unfortunate and heartbreaking. I feel for all of the authorities and professionals who have a hand in helping these kids move forward. I can’t imagine.

Nothing bombshell or anything, but there is hardly any info so I went digging.

A niece I came across was shocked to hear her aunt and uncle were arrested. She had knowledge of the kids but didn’t stay in touch. Her dad is Gary Sr.’s brother. She didn’t know the family was back in Ohio. Elizabeth got pregnant at 13, and left to West Virginia to get married. Until 2023, there was no legal minimum age to get married there. It’s not clear if just Elizabeth and Jr went or if the whole family went for a time. They’ve been bouncing from house to house over the years. Also, apparently Elizabeth told relatives she wasn’t going to “get fixed” and wanted as many children as God would allow.

This niece, along with other family members who grew up with Gary Sr and Christina Siders, have fond memories and thought they were the sweetest people. Another member of the family said they remember their aunt Christina as hateful. The niece was told in recent months her aunt Christina had dementia.

Christina has several daughters and I believe several sons. Some of the family believe Gary Jr. was running the show there. Maybe a momma’s boy?

I’m sure there’s more, so I’ll drop it here if I remember. This all seems like some the stories I come across in my genealogical research in places and socioeconomic groups like this: low IQ, generational trauma, dirt poor, blindly adhering to perceived religious tenets, and view kids as subhuman.

Gary, Srs brother passed last year at age 71. His wife was 37 then. Their daughter has two children of her own. Do the math on that one.

I don’t want to argue lol because I do deeply feel bad for all victims in this horrendous situation including the mother. But I do truly think she still needs to be held accountable.

If I’m being super honest it seemed like NONE OF THEM UNDERSTOOD ANYTHING GOING ON AROUND THEM. (I’m from the Midwest not rural but I’ve been in and around my fair share so I know there’s a knowledge gap) the grandma and grandpa looked like they were not even sure where they were.

Like the fact that (to my knowledge) none of the neighbors or interviewees talked about interacting with the older adults. Are they mentally sound? Do they actually know what’s happening ? What if they are victims of son and wife now? (I don’t really believe this but my mind has asked it lol)

Idk. I just feel so deeply saddened and lost on how Ohio is going to truly assist these children.

I haven't heard anything re: jobs. They apparently weren't getting government assistance. How were they paying for house/utilities/food?

It’s not just cartoons it’s a teen girl in a dinosaur mask talking, and lots of videos of her showing her stickers off with babies crying in the background. Has anyone else seen this?

I give it a few months before it pops up on my Netflix homepage

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