u/GlamorousNoodle

German 150 hours update
▲ 12 r/ALGhub

German 150 hours update

Hi! This is the second progress update of me trying to learn German with ALG. You can read the background information in the 50 hours update.

Notes

Nothing has changed since the last post, except that I had to abandon the rule about watching only one channel at a time, since some channels have so much content that it gets tiring to watch the same thing for 10+ hours. My daily average was 105 minutes, and I only missed 2 days out of 87. Now come the notes --- as always, feel free to skip this part if you are not interested in minute details.

  • 50 hours. I'm watching Learn German with Falk's video podcasts, it is more or less comprehensible.
  • 57 hours. I feel like this channel is actually a bit above my level. Even though my comprehension is probably at 80%, I still miss phrases regularly, and there are a lot of unknown words.
  • 58 hours. I tried to watch an Eleos Corner's video outside of Easy playlist. It was a podcast and it felt about as difficult as Falk's podcasts. Then I watched a "14 >!Minuten!<"'s episode, and I understood almost everything. Funnily enough, back at about 20-30 hours I tried watching it, and it was so difficult to me that I thought it was a native podcast added to the spreadsheet by mistake. However, when I tried to watch the next episode, I quickly realized that I just got lucky, and it is not that simple.
  • 62 hours. I think I finally accepted the idea that I should stop caring about words, and the only thing that matters is that I understand at least 80% of meaning. For some reason I keep questioning the method... I guess it's hard to believe that you can improve with audio-only content, since I relied on visual cues before. Anyway, I'm back to Falk's podcasts now. I still understand about 80-90% of meaning there.
  • 65 hours. Today I tried listening to >!Deutsch Fluss!< podcast before sleeping, looks like a nice way to get extra 30 minutes per day thanks to my insomnia.
  • 69 hours. Tried watching ">!Ein Bisschen Besser!<"'s video about (presumably) Atomic Habits, and wow. Sure, I've read that book, but it was still pretty funny that I could understand about 60% of that video. I hate the fact that even native videos use visual cues, while in lots of beginner content best you can find is translating subtitles. Then I tried watching Easy Breezy German, and it was... easy, quite uncomfortably so. Apparently I got so used to listening to those podcasts that I cannot fully comprehend, that it feels weird to understand everything. I think I will watch it for now, just to change things up, although I don't find that type of content engaging. Or, rather, this channel, just like other beginner content, seems to focus on a narrow range of topics that I'm a little sick of.
  • 70 hours. Today I clicked on a random recommended native video just to see if I can follow it at all, and I ended up watching all 31 minutes of it. While I missed a lot of details, it was still pretty comprehensible, and way more engaging than a house cleaning vlog. Not sure what to make out of it... that channel is listed under level 6. The strangest part is that despite the host speaking much faster than I'm used to, I didn't get lost like I did at 50 hours, except for a few parts where she spoke really fast, like in the outro. Also, just to make sure I wasn't going crazy, I watched a similar Japanese video and I didn't understand anything.
  • 72 hours. Today I had my first dream in German: I said that I couldn't speak German... in German. I did it in a really forced way and I'm pretty sure the sentence was wrong, so that's pretty sad. That dream aside, it looks like I have watched all Easy Breezy German videos that don't strike me as overly boring (I can't believe that house cleaning vlogs is a real genre that people watch). Now I'm mostly back to watching Falk, along with some Eleos Corner's videos sometimes.
  • 80 hours. Today I watched a random video from "NITA | Study German daily", and it was pretty comprehensible, similar to podcasts in terms of difficulty. I guess it's time to accept that I can watch intermediate videos and I have been doing so for quite some time already. Not like there is much of a choice though, I have run out of beginner content by about 50 hours, since Learn German with Falk along with other podcasts are now classified as intermediate. I also wouldn't call Eleos Corner's videos outside of the aforementioned playlist beginner-level, especially the podcasts.
  • 92 hours. I haven't written anything about my German perception for quite some time. Well, because subjectively nothing has changed, and at this point consuming CI is a routine for me, so I don't need to motivate myself by seeing my level increase. I think it's getting more effortless, e.g. sometimes my mind wanders a little but I still hear everything. But, other than that, I haven't noticed anything: I still comfortably understand at least 90% of content (Learn German with Falk, Eleos Corner, ">!Deutsch Fluss!<") with an occasional sentence going over my head and some details missing. Oh, and nonnative accents do not even register as German to me, I have to exert effort to maybe catch something. And, just for record, today I learned the words for surprise and reason, they kept jumping at me for a long time.
  • 96 hours. Today I finished (well, at the moment, since new episodes are still being produced) listening to ">!Deutsch Fluss!<". I liked it a lot, the language was really simple, which works perfectly for first time pure listening. I guess now I will switch to Learn German with Jen.
  • 100 hours. I decided to revisit "N>!atűrlich!< German"'s Rammstein video that I struggled with at 26 hours, and well... I could have probably watched it with my eyes closed, it was really easy. But I can certainly see why it was difficult, there were indeed a lot of not-super-common words without visual cues. Additionally I tried watching the pre-intermediate playlist, and it's pretty comfortable, I guess I'll go through it now. It is basically as comprehensible as the beginner playlist was when I watched it, i.e. somewhere around 90%. Learn German with Falk is amazing, but I have been staring at his beautiful face for about 30 hours already, give me a break.
  • 105 hours. Well, I had a really stressful couple of days, so I decided to finally take a break for 2 days. I didn't really notice anything special today, like my comprehension suddenly getting better or something. Pretty sure the din in the head got progressively more silent with each day though. Also I finished "N>!atűrlich!< German"'s pre-intermediate playlist, it is actually less engaging than I expected. Afterwards I watched a random native video for 10 minutes (it was a Harry Potter trailer analysis or something), and I could understand about 80% of the message but not a single word. It was surprisingly interesting to watch, but I still want to reach at least 150 hours before seriously considering native media.
  • 125 hours. Finished "N>!atűrlich!< German"'s intermediate playlist, now what? Tried Comprehensible GERMANi's A2/B1 playlist, the first video was about >!prepositions!<. Looks like the teacher used every >!preposition!< in German, and I literally knew all of them. So much for learning functional words at higher levels... Anyway, I don't like these videos because they focus on grammar. Apparently I'm back to Falk.
  • 136 hours. I got tired of German with Jen, so I'm switching to "14 >!Minuten!<". Definitely a step-up in difficulty, but not too much. Today I relistened to the episode that I got completely lost in at 58 hours and... I didn't get lost but it wasn't comfortable either. For record, it is about the history of a radical left terrorist faction in Germany, while other episodes are about things like jogging, public transport, apartments, etc. This podcast is an absolute roller coaster in terms of difficulty.
  • 148 hours. Looks like I've watched all Learn German with Falk's video podcasts... I'm not a big fan of his older audio-only podcasts, as they seem to rely too much on English translations. Also they just feel different, probably because they are scripted unlike his newer episodes. Well, that only leaves "14 >!Minuten!<" until 150 hours, which is my made-up prerequisite for native and level 4 content.
  • 150 hours. Finally I can dive into native content (okay, I did try it before but only a little bit). Surprisingly there are already some shows for kids that are comprehensible enough, like in the 80-90% range. Some episodes are available on YouTube, but most of them are exclusive to mediatheks.
    • >Die Maus!< is a show that everyone recommends, but I find it too difficult for now.
    • >Checker Welt!< is similar to it, but it seems much easier and actually comprehensible to me. Each episode is a documentary about a random topic with a simple language and lots of visuals.
    • >Wilde Tierwelt!< is a program about animals, which naturally means that there are also lots of visuals.
    • logo! is a daily news program for kids with a pretty simple language. Works especially well if you know the news in advance.

The results

TL;DR version of the previous section:

  • Most of my input came from video podcasts, at 65 hours I supplemented it with pure listening.
  • At 70 hours I watched a native video and realized that I no longer had issues listening to people speaking at a normal pace.
  • Since 80 hours I have been regularly watching intermediate-level videos.
  • At 125 hours I watched a CI video that focused on >!prepositions!<, and I knew all of them despite the roadmap claiming that you learn functional words much later.
  • At 148 hours I (almost) ran out of CI, so at 150 hours I started watching native content.

You probably have two questions: how could I possibly run out of CI if there are so many channels and how can I watch native content at 150 hours. Let me explain.

First, the channels. Unfortunately, most channels in levels 3 and 4 simply teach grammar (or words, or idioms) in German, which is a big no for ALG purposes. Then there are a few channels with (most likely) AI-generated dialogue/podcast videos that I'm not watching because I don't want to sound like ChatGPT. What remains is a handful of creators, and I have watched nearly all of their videos at the intermediate level. It also doesn't help that I don't like vlogs which a really popular genre in German CI, so I miss some content too.

Second, the native content. I still can't really watch YouTube videos, for example, but there are lots of shows for 8-something year olds. And even then I can't watch all of them, but only those that have a lot of visuals. My comprehension is by no means high, but it is good enough. These shows also happen to be pretty interesting, so it probably helps a lot as well.

Now to the benchmarks.

  • The news episode: not sure if anything has changed at all.
  • Peppa Pig: I have watched several episodes already, it's really easy.
  • Adventure Time: I have definitely noticed one detail that I didn't see before, but it's still too early.
  • My Little Pony: I could certainly get the gist, but that's about it, quite a lot of details went over my head. There were not that many details though, so it is probably usable as a CI on the harder side.
  • I also tried to listen to a couple of Rammstein's songs... not sure what I was expecting lol.

And the roadmap. Similarly to the previous post, I can't really relate to it. Level 3 seems to be true except that I feel like I'm used to the sounds. Level 4 seems to be kind of true as well, since it looks like the only difference is being able to listen to podcasts, which I can do. But then again, I don't think I can fully understand a patient native speaker just yet. Basically, except for the number of hours, it is more or less accurate.

Conclusion

Frankly it feels like my German didn't improve at all since the 50 hour mark, although I can certainly point out some new words. Hopefully this is just a subjective feeling, and the magic of language acquisition will do its thing.

As always, if you have any questions, feel free to ask them. See you at 300 hours!

u/GlamorousNoodle — 8 days ago
▲ 21 r/ALGhub

German 50 hours update

Hi! I always felt that ALG is too good to be true, so I decided to try it out myself. Reading other learners' reports has been really helpful to know what I'm getting myself into, but unfortunately there don't seem to be any detailed posts about German. Finally I can make one, so a long and detailed post it is.

Background

Native Russian speaker, learned English in school, had one year of French classes. At some point I also tried learning Mandarin with a reading-heavy approach and managed to get to intermediate plateau before losing motivation.

As for German, I haven't studied it at all, so I only knew some random words, e.g. numbers from one to three or Ritter Sport's motto. I am planning to move to Germany this autumn, which means that I probably will not be able to maintain the silent period all the way to 1000 hours. In the future it may become a problem, but right now it means that I have some extra motivation.

Notes

I did exactly what DS suggests: watching channels linked in the CI spreadsheet, paying full attention, not thinking, etc. One extra rule I've set for myself is that I must choose a playlist and watch every single video in order, unless it is about grammar. This rule allowed me to not spend time thinking whether a video is interesting or not, and instead to put more hours in.

My initial goal was watching at least one hour of CI per day, which I managed to meet. In fact, my current average is 100 minutes per day. What follows is my notes about the process that I wrote down at various points of time. Feel free to skip them if you are not interested in minute details, as I basically wrote what I wish I could read in other German learners' reports when I was starting out.

  • 1 hour (first day). I started with "N>!atűrlich!< German", Total Beginner playlist. It certainly felt weird that I could understand about 90% of meaning despite not knowing a single word. I also managed to pick up some vocabulary from the context, although it's mostly English and Russian cognates. It is especially strange to hear Russian words in German, since my brain expects it to be English-like. The only problem is that sometimes when I infer the meaning of a word from context I involuntarily subvocalize it in English (and not in Russian, interestingly enough). Other than that, I think I'm doing a good job at not thinking. Also, contrary to what DS says, I have zero problems with hearing the sounds or word segmentation. If anything, German sounds like a Russian dialect of English or something. It kind of feels like I've been hearing this language for my entire life.
  • 5 hours. Finished the total beginner playlist, now going through the pre-beginner one. The step-up in difficulty is real, although things are still largely comprehensible. I don't know if it is only because of cognates, but sometimes I manage to understand sentences purely from audio. It also seems like I'm starting to derive information from sentence structure. And I already have to consciously silence the din in the head, since it keeps rehearsing the phrases I've heard (sometimes in the teacher's voice, sometimes not).
  • 7 hours. Finished the pre-beginner playlist. The difficulty was diverse, depending on visual information, unlike the total beginner playlist that had plenty of it. I still get completely lost when the host speaks complete sentences without any additional cues. Nevertheless, I could follow all the videos, despite missing a sentence here and there. Also I'm starting to notice some prepositions and conjunctions, contrary to what the DS roadmap states. The progress is still intangible.
  • 8 hours. Now I'm watching super beginner ALG German. And... wow, that's repetitive. All the videos are about 4 minutes long, and after watching like 20 of them I can certainly say that "N>!atűrlich!< German" was more enjoyable, albeit it was more difficult and English proficiency was assumed. Judging by the titles, the rest of the videos are going to be similar, which is sad, since I'll probably go through them anyway. The main problem I have is that, because the content is boring and too slow, I can't help focusing on grammar. Not sure if that is a bad thing, since I don't really think about it.
  • 11 hours. Finished ALG German's super beginner. Even though it is repetitive, it is still manageable. The only part I really dislike is the fact that videos (excluding the Italki promotion part) are like 4 minutes long, so you have to constantly click on the next one. My comprehension was perfect here, although the vocabulary range was really limited, so these videos were mostly about repeating the things I know. Also I kept noticing random grammar points and I can't help drawing parallels with Russian. Nevertheless, I only acknowledge the similarity and I don't think about it further. It is really difficult to not notice grammar at all when it has been drilled into you for 14 years in Russian, English, and French.
  • 12 hours. Watching ALG Beginner, and it's comprehensible. I can certainly follow the narrative and understand each sentence (but not necessarily each word), and the number of familiar words seems to hover around the 95% mark. However, why does the entire playlist consist of "Which superpower would you choose"?... My boredom tolerance is high, but after 16 videos it seems a bit excessive. Afterwards I tried watching an Easy German's A1 dialogue, nope, not even close. Tried watching "N>!atűrlich!< German"'s beginner playlist --- while I can follow the story with a bit of ambiguity tolerance, sentences regularly go above my head. It is manageable, but for the sake of efficiency I want to stick with easier content.
  • 14 hours. I have watched the entire "Learn German from 0" playlist by ">!Deutsch mit!< Lari". Not sure why it only has 8 videos, apparently there are older beginner CI videos too. As for comprehension, it was okay, I understood about 90% of the meaning. The words randomly appearing are annoying though, but I ignored them pretty well. The main problem is that my vocabulary is really limited, and the host doesn't explain the meaning of words (assumably you could see translations in the top right corner, but I covered it), which makes this playlist better suited towards level 2. The speaking pace is slow enough though, so I could comfortably hear every single word. As for compellingness, it was perfect, and the filming quality was surprisingly high for such a niche genre. Overall, it was a nice break from the whiteboard content, even if wasn't that effective.
  • 16 hours. I decided to watch Comprehensible GERMANi's PreA1/A1 playlist. Even though there are words appearing on the screen, I can ignore them. The difficulty seems perfect: I can fully follow the story, even if sometimes I miss a phrase here and there. And it seems interesting enough so far, as evidenced by the fact that today is the first day I managed to do two hours of CI. Also, I think I can finally say that I did learn something: as I was watching a video today, I realized that I'm following the story without trying hard, even though there are almost no visual cues (in fact, I was barely looking at the screen to avoid reading).
  • 19 hours. Finished watching Comprehensible GERMANi's PreA1/A1 playlist (except for reading videos, grammar, etc.). While these videos are certainly not perfect because of words appearing on the screen, I liked them, my comprehension was near-perfect. They are definitely not suitable for learners with no prior experience, because the visual cues are usually only about specific words, i.e. you cannot follow the story with visuals alone, but I think they are pretty accessible in the middle of level 1.
  • 20 hours. Tried watching "N>!atűrlich!< German"'s total beginner playlist, that's too boring to rewatch. Then I skipped straight to beginner, and it seems pretty good. In particular, I can fully follow the story, even though sometimes I miss a phrase here and there. (Except for the Star Wars quiz video, because I don't remember the characters' names, and I couldn't reliably differentiate between names and unknown words)
  • 26 hours. The Rammstein video is definitely not beginner level, also it has some language analysis. Other than that, I don't have much to say, since I just keep grinding and there is nothing I can complain about in those videos.
  • 30 hours. I noticed an interesting phenomenon today: even though I don't pay attention to individual words, I can somehow predict adjective placement. And it happens even if I don't fully understand the meaning of the sentence or each individual word. My brain is just like "the next word you hear will be adjective", and it's always right. I guess it goes back to how I used sentence structure to assist understanding at 5 hours, but now it seems like I started internalizing those patterns.
  • 32 hours. Finished "N>!atűrlich!< German"'s beginner playlist (except for the last video because it sounds language-focused). Except for like 3 videos that were inherently not beginner-friendly, my comprehension has always been nearly perfect. Afterwards, I decided to revisit the first video --- the one that I couldn't watch at 14 hours --- and it was fully comprehensible. I know, I know, rewatching is always easier, but from my experience if I don't understand something then there is no point in repeating it, as it will go over my head just the same. Thus, it is not simply a matter of familiarity. I tried to see what I can watch next, and it looks pretty dire:
    • Easy German still looks out of reach (and nearly all of their A1 videos seem language-focused).
    • Chill German and Eleos Corner were great, but these videos have words popping up all over the screen.
    • Extr@ seemed a bit out of reach, and I'm not sure if I want to watch it anyway.
    • Surprisingly, Learn German with Falk's A2 podcast felt somewhat comprehensible (~80%), but I think I'm overrelying on ambiguity tolerance, since it's way too early for audio-only CI.
  • 34 hours. I settled on Eleos Corner. While those words are annoying as hell, I simply do not look at the video directly. Nevertheless, sometimes I may glimpse a word here and there, but I usually do not subvocalize them. As for difficulty, it's about the same as "N>!atűrlich!< German"'s beginner playlist, especially if you look at the screen (there are some visual cues, but words are all over the place, so I barely look at the hints). I have no problems following these videos with a bit of ambiguity tolerance/guessing.
  • 35 hours. Finished Eleos corner's Easy Everyday German playlist. Not much to add, the videos are cool, although sometimes I lost the thread. Overall my comprehension was good, even though I focused too much on not reading the words on the screen. Afterwards I tried watching ALG German's intermediate playlist. I'm not a big fan of this format, and it feels like the vocabulary diversity is lower than in his super beginner videos. Looks like I won't watch these either. Ended up watching the remaining CI videos from ">!Deutsch mit!< Lari".
  • 42 hours. Finished watching ">!Deutsch mit!< Lari"'s CI videos. Not much to say here, these videos are similar to the ones I've watched before, and the difficulty is perhaps a little higher. I'm not going to complain about words appearing all over the screen, since I did it plenty of times already. Now switching to Easy German's A1 playlist.
  • 45 hours. This playlist has turned out to be pretty good, and it's got more than a couple of CI videos. I definitely cannot hear every single word, and sometimes I miss entire sentences, but the visuals help a lot. Hearing Janusz is particularly difficult, but it seems to be the point anyway. It is still unfortunate that out of 83 videos only 15 or so are not about grammar.
  • 49 hours. Finished Easy German's A1 playlist. It got pretty easy towards the end (except for Janusz, he is too mumbly, and I could barely hear what he said), but it probably has more to do with the fact that beginner videos usually talk about the most basic things (food, clothes, simple actions), so I got used to them. I liked this playlist (or, rather, the aforementioned 15 or so videos), looking forward to the point when I can watch the A2 one. Also it should be noted that in most videos there are relatively few visual cues, but it didn't hinder my comprehension that much. As such, it is probably a good point to give Learn German with Falk another try.
  • 50 hours. I'm watching Falk's Easy Listening playlist, and I can understand about 95% of what is being said. The weirdest part is that I don't recognize that many words, but I can still clearly comprehend nearly every sentence, although I may or may not rely on guessing. I don't remember ever guessing wrong though, so maybe it's something else.

The results

I know you haven't read the previous section, so here is the TL;DR version:

  • At 0-19 hours I was watching super-beginner content.
  • At 20-32 hours I was watching beginner whiteboard content.
  • At 33-49 hours I was watching beginner vlog content.
  • At 50 hours I was watching a video podcast.
  • My comprehension of meaning has always been in the 80-95% range.
  • By 20 hours I knew a vague meaning of all prepositions and conjunctures that I kept hearing, and by now I have some familiarity with sentence structures. Also I couldn't help noticing some verb-related grammar.
  • Somewhere between 42 and 49 hours I started being able to follow slowly spoken German even if I barely recognize any words. The most surreal part is that quite often I can understand the meaning anyway.

As far as the DS roadmap goes, I think I am about halfway between level 2 and 3 (plus some function words). It seems like I basically skipped level 1, since I don't remember German sounding foreign at all, and I could always hear more than a random noun here and there, thanks to cognates. (I don't take into account the known words part, since I don't know how to measure it)

I also tried some benchmarks of my current level:

  • A random news episode. I could understand like 10% of what was being said and like 70% of the story with visuals. It probably helped that I was familiar with the topic though. I am also surprised that they speak so slowly, pretty sure people talk faster in real life, let alone in news.
  • Peppa Pig. In two episodes that I've watched I could understand 100% of the story and about 90% of what was being said. In fact, it felt pretty slow. Maybe I got lucky with the video, since, according to the DS subreddit, most people can only watch Peppa at 150-200 hours. Perhaps the German dub is easier than Spanish.
  • Adventure Time. I watched one episode for about 3 minutes. I could understand about 40% even when taking visuals into account. Not really surprising since I remember struggling to watch it in English without subtitles.
  • I still get completely lost when people talk at a normal pace, especially when they mumble or the sound is not clear.

Conclusion

So, in the beginning I said I was skeptical about ALG; in particular, I wasn't sure you could develop a listening ability from scratch in the amount of time stated in the DS roadmap. Needless to say, I don't have any doubts now.

Actually, not exactly, since I find it suspicious that I seem to progress at twice the intended speed. While it obviously helps that I speak Russian, it is still nowhere near as closely related to German as e.g. French and Spanish. I'm inclined to believe that I simply rely too much on guessing, and my real comprehension is lower than I think. Not that it matters, since, at the end of the day, comprehension is comprehension, even if it is backed up by guessing.

Nevertheless, it still feels illegal that after one month of just watching videos I can already comprehend native content, even if it is aimed at toddlers.

I hope this post will be a useful point of reference for the results you can expect from ALG. See you at 150 hours!

P.S. Since my account is new, Reddit didn't let me make this post for quite some time. As a result, at the moment of posting I am already at 148 hours. Feel free to ask any questions, but keep in mind that I have already forgotten what it was like at 50 hours :(.

reddit.com
u/GlamorousNoodle — 28 days ago