u/SammaVaco

The Link in Dependent Origination We Keep Ignoring | Dhamma Talk by Bhante Joe | Cultivating Dispassion For Contact
▲ 17 r/theravada+1 crossposts

The Link in Dependent Origination We Keep Ignoring | Dhamma Talk by Bhante Joe | Cultivating Dispassion For Contact

> # The Link in Dependent Origination We Keep Ignoring

> Homage to the Triple Gem. So, there's a Sutta in the Anguttara Nikaya, which is called the Further Shore, the Parāyana Sutta. And in this Sutta, there's a number of monks who gather, and they discuss a statement that was made by the Buddha in The Way to the Further Shore and the Questions of Mettaeya in the Sutta Nipata. And the phrase that the Buddha said in that particular Sutta was, "Whoever a thinker, knowing both sides, doesn't adhere in between, he I call a great person. He here has gone past the seamstress." So, the monks gather together, and they discuss amongst themselves what the Buddha meant by the first side, what the Buddha meant by the end, and what the Buddha meant by essentially the middle. And the very first monk, he says, "Contact, friends, is the first side. The origination of contact, the second side. And the cessation of contact is in between. Craving is the seamstress, for craving stitches one to the production of this or that very becoming." So, the various monks discuss their understanding of what the statement means, and at the end, they all go to the Buddha, and the Buddha confirms that the first monk's statement was the best spoken, although he says that all of the other monks spoke well in their interpretations of the Dhamma. > > There's an interesting phenomena in that people sometimes, when they're looking for the causes of their suffering, chase after things that are the most blatant while ignoring things that are the actual origin. So, I was discussing with somebody just the other day, uh yesterday, believe, about uh a discussion we'd had previously on the channel in a talk called To the Source. And when I was a young man, I started in Korean Zen, and the teacher at the Korean Zen Temple Zen Temple would give this simile of uh throwing stones at a tiger versus throwing stones at a dog. And he said, "If you throw stones at a dog, then the dog chases after the stones. But if you throw stones at the tiger, then the tiger goes straight for the person who's throwing the stones." And so when we look for the cause of our suffering, often times what we feel as the cause, the felt sense is that it's a feeling that arises, that comes up and blows us away, whether it's anxiety or whether it's anger or whether it's sadness, whether the negative feelings that people feel. When these things come up, it's kind of like a storm that whips up and pulls them to and fro. And a person has to find a way to weather that storm so they don't get thrown about by the feelings into this or that bad action or this or that bad way of speaking or this or that bad way of thinking, even ideally. > > And so the Buddhist teaching here on contact is interesting because people often ignore a further up cause of suffering than feelings. And feelings are the most obvious one, they're the ones that are bringing all the pain. But nobody stops to think about whether or not contact has a role in causing suffering and whether or not suffering can be stopped at contact. It's very rarely thought about. So I remember listening to a talk a few years ago actually and it was by a monk who's known to have been very successful in his practice. And he was recommending to contemplate at contact rather than to contemplate at feelings. And one of the things that we tend to notice with the way that suffering arises in the mind is that it often arises from things that seem innocuous and yet are behind are the source and are the origin actually of a great mass of suffering. > > So contact in dependent co-arising comes before feeling and it essentially means the point at which two things connect, where the eye connects with forms, where the ear connects with sounds, where the body connects with tactile sensations, where the tongue connects with flavors, etc. And it's at that point of contact that there's actually desire. There can be a desire to have a contact. You can notice this when people go on retreats, meditation retreats, and they're sitting for long periods of time with their eyes closed, or in a place where there's very stimulant very little stimulation. There's a desire just to have a contact. And yet this contact is generally seen in a positive light and not as something which is the origin or the starting point of what later turns into a storm. > > I was reading I think a while back about this theory behind the way that weather patterns and complex systems operate. There's kind of almost a metaphor in these weather pat -- that if a butterfly flaps its wings somewhere far away, like say Montana, then it can cause a tornado in Florida through this unknown chain of causes and effects. And so often times we see the storm, but we don't see the butterfly flapping its wings as the cause. We don't see the desire to have contact as the cause, the desire for something to touch the eye or the nose or the ears or the body, and think that this could be the cause of suffering. But when we come to contemplate this, what we can really see or one can really see is that stopping the desire there can be like cutting off a stream that's farther up its source. Doesn't have to go down and become a bunch of different world pools and waterfalls and cascades. You can cut it off at the source where it starts out small. Kind of divert it there and bring it to destruction there. And what comes after that won't originate. It won't start. > > So the Buddhist teachings on dependent co-arising are given not as something which is to be used to deconstruct all the reality so that we can know exactly why we're thinking what we're thinking when we're thinking it, etc. But it's to give us a pattern so that we can deconstruct our suffering. And one of the best links, one of the greatest ones we can look at if we want to stop feelings from overwhelming the mind, stop feelings from causing us harm, the good ones that pull us up and the bad ones that pull us down, is to become dispassionate for anything that might contact the body, the mind, the eye, the ear, the nose, the tongue. There's these two different paths that the Buddha lays out. They're kind of different in a way, but overlapping. One is the sukha paṭipadā, path of pleasant uh practice. And this is a path that generally proceeds mostly through concentration. Then you have another path, which is the dukkha patipadā. And this is a path that Buddha calls the suffering or the painful path. And this is a path that mainly proceeds through contemplation, although both of these paths have to overlap. In that the sukha patipadā will definitely at some point have to contemplate things in a negative light. And the dukkha patipadā practitioner will have to develop concentration, which means they'll have to be able to unify their mind at a certain point, and to be able to bring this kind of brightness and positivity into their practice. But in any event, in order to become dispassionate, it requires this dukkha patipadā, the willingness to see something negative in something that one cherishes. > > Because one of the ironies of suffering is not that the most strong, the most insidious, the most powerful forms of suffering are things that are like demons, very scary, big horns, making a lot of noise. And that's where people tend to look, kind of the anger, the worry, or the fear, or the sadness, that seem like these enormous demons. The boss that's behind them seems much more innocuous, a little butterfly flapping its wings. But if a person puts a stop to that, then they stop as well. And the irony of it is that we protect it. Is that we actually protect the things that cause us to suffer. > > So, we learn to turn our minds to contemplate contact in this way, not as something that is to be desired, is to be sought after for the sake of having a pleasant contact at the eye or the ear, but as something that's a danger. Because when one exposes the mind to contact anywhere, a pleasant contact, at the same time one's exposing it to one that's negative. At the same time one is joining it to whatever it is that comes externally, like a storm. And can push the mind left, can push it right, can push it up, can push it down, push it to the side, so long as there's that conjoinment, so long as there's that attachment, and that attachment comes through desire. So, in order to take up these contemplations, it isn't just something in which one sits there and thinks, "Contact's impermanent." Kind of thinks that a couple times. One can develop that as a frame of reference, where anytime something contacts the mind, one looks at it in terms of contact rather than feeling. One looks at it in terms of the way that it touches, and one starts to feel these touches as something that's painful. Okay, that can come through investigation. > > The downstream effects of whatever it is that one grabs onto, where does it lead? What does that happiness end in? How does it go? Does it lead to something that's truly satisfying? One investigates this enough, and then one feels like every time one sends the mind out to search for happiness, one can end in something that's dangerous. Because it's something that has the potential to change, to switch into something that one didn't expect. Happy feelings can turn negative, negative feelings can turn happy, and this is something unsafe. > > So, the Buddha in the suttas recommends to regard contact like a flayed cow. It's a very strong image. A cow which has been hit with a whip so many times that its skin is raw. And wherever that cow goes and stands, if it stands near a wall, then the bugs in the wall eat it. If it sits on the ground, then the worms in the ground, the bugs in the ground eat it. And if it stands in the air, then the bugs in the air eat it. And the Buddha says contact is to be regarded in this way. It's to be regarded as a danger, and something that is painful, that's not desirable. And this comes about through investigation. Through watching the chain of causes and effects that cascade down from contact into feeling, and into craving, and into clinging, and into becoming, and then into ideally birth and aging and sickness and death. And it's just this. It's in this way that the whole mass of suffering can flow out from these various points in dependent co-arising. > > So, wherever it is that dispassion sets in in relationship to one of the factors of dependent co-arising, and especially in this case in relationship to contact, it's there that the chain can be broken. And the chain doesn't break through an act of concentration where one sees the world as more and more beautiful. It breaks through an act of dispassion, through an act of discernment that cuts the chain, that separates the mind from the things that it used to cling to. And this is why the Buddha said that craving is the seamstress. It's the seamstress that sews this and that state of becoming together, essentially. You have contact as the first, the origination of contact as the second, and the cessation of contact is the end. And so long as one is clinging to contact, one is caught up with origination and cessation, with contact, and with feeling, and with craving, and with clinging, and with becoming. But if one contemplates correctly and stops the desire there, stops it such that one sees contact the way that a flayed cow would see insects biting it, then one's mind can incline away from the world towards something that's truly safe. > > So, the beauty of the world is not to be confused with the ugliness of the world. The happiness of the world is not to be confused with its pain. And both of these things are emotions, both of them are feeling, and they're joined together by the seamstress that sews together this production or that production of being. So, it's enough for us to become dispassionate. It's enough for us to observe what it is that makes us happy and what it is that causes us to suffer. Where does it really start from? Is it the feeling that we get rid of it will make us happy? Or is it something further up the line that one didn't want to look at and one is actually protecting? Stop protecting it and start trying to separate the mind from it and see what happens to the suffering that comes afterwards. Suffering that comes from feeling and clinging and becoming can't happen if one cuts it off at contact. So, the Buddha says it's a great man who transcends the seamstress. Gives us these teachings to know how our world is stitched together and how to take it apart to find something that's stable and to find a happiness that lasts beyond the world. And the people who can do this, the Buddha calls a great man. Somebody who's reached the end of the goal and has put down suffering and stress.

u/SammaVaco — 4 days ago
▲ 17 r/theravada+1 crossposts

Deconstruction | Dhamma Talk by Ven. Thanissaro | Awakening is Not Just Letting Go

> # Deconstruction > > Ajaan Fuang wasn't the sort of person who liked to discuss controversial issues. If people brought up controversies of the day, especially in areas of the Dhamma, he'd tell them "Close your eyes, meditate, focus on your breath." But there were a couple of issues that he would bring up himself. One was the idea that the path is all about letting go, letting go. He'd say, that's not the case. You have to do some developing first before you can totally let go. You let go in stages. But as you let go, you have to have something good to hold onto. Otherwise you're lost, you're set adrift. "Kaat loy" was the Thai phrase he would use. > > And unfortunately that attitude, that it's all about just letting go, is still around, you find it in different guises. It usually comes from the idea that the path, the fruit should be visible here and now, so there should be something right here, right now. Don't think about developing a path that will take time or having a goal in the future. Everything should be right here, immediately, it's just letting how to recognize it. That's making discernment do all the work. You tell yourself that you've got to let go, so whatever comes up you just let it go, let it go. You say you don't want to pass judgment. Passing judgment is going to involve some craving, clinging to what's good and what's bad. > > But think about it, the Buddha said the main internal factor for gaining awakening, especially the first level of awakening, is appropriate attention. Appropriate attention makes distinctions. It's basically seeing things in terms of the Four Noble Truths. Suffering is to be comprehended, and not just witnessed or acknowledged. You have to understand, what is it? The Buddha is very precise: clinging to the aggregates. Form, feeling, perception, thought constructs, consciousness. The clinging is in the delight and passion you have for those things, the desire and passion you have for those things. And the clinging aggregates altogether, think of this as an image of feeding. You're hungry, that's the craving, that's the desire and passion. You find something you want to eat, so you latch onto it and hold onto it as you eat it. That's the clinging aggregates. That's the suffering. Which is really counter-intuitive. > > We tend to think that we find our happiness in feeding. Of course here the Buddha is talking about not only physical feeding but also mental and emotional feeding. But these are areas where we tend to find our happiness, and yet he says that's where we suffer. Because it's all very unstable. As you're eating things, you're using them up, which means you're destroying the things you're going to need to feed on into the future, which means you have to keep on looking. It's a very precarious state to be in. You want to comprehend that. And you don't comprehend it by just telling yourself to "Let go, let go." You have to let go precisely, because as the Buddha said, you don't let go of the aggregates, you let go of the clinging and the desire and passion. > > Now the second noble truth, craving, that's desire and passion, and that's to be abandoned. The third noble truth is the total abandoning of that. "Asesa-virāga-nirodho", total dispassion, without any trace at all. We're not talking about temporary rest from a particular desire. And it's something that's neither here nor there[?] Ordinarily when you let go of one desire, and if there's no new desire immediately following it, there's a sense of nothing. And some people claim that that's it, that's the cessation of suffering. But they also admit that it's boring, it's not interesting. The earth didn't quake before because the Buddha found something that was boring and uninteresting. He found the absolute end of passion and desire. That's to be realized, and it can be realized only by developing the path. > > And the path takes work. You've got eight factors. Now they all come together as you get better and better at them, but in the beginning it does take some strategic thinking. It is a path, it's going to take time. It is a goal that you have in the future. You focus on doing what you have to do right now, but you know you're headed in the right direction. Whether the path is long or short is not the issue. The issue is doing it, and doing it all. So when concentration comes up, you don't just let it go, let it go. When mindfulness comes up, you don't let it go. Everything has to be developed in the path. That takes work. > > Which is why when the Buddha was talking about breath meditation one time, there was a monk named Arittha who said, "I do breath meditation." And the Buddha asked him, "What kind of breath meditation do you do?" And Arittha said, "I don't hanker after things in the future, I don't have nostalgia for things in the past. And mindfully in the present moment I breathe in, breathe out, putting aside any passion in the present moment." The Buddha said, "Well, there is that kind of breath meditation, but it doesn't give the best results. The best results is the sixteen steps that he recommends. And they involve learning how to breathe in and out conscious of the whole body, calming bodily fabrication. In other words, allowing the breath to calm down. Breathing in and out, training yourself to breathe in and out sensitive to rapture, sensitive to pleasure, sensitive to mental fabrication, calming mental fabrication. Breathing in and out gladdening the mind, concentrating the mind, releasing the mind. There's a lot of constructive work that you have to do. > > So you're not just settling in and being really quiet. Because that's the other extreme about letting go. Some people say, "Well, who cares about discernment, just reject everything." The mind rejects, rejects, rejects, and goes into a very dull, dark, heavy kind of concentration where you're totally oblivious to your body, oblivious to the world outside. And you can determine ahead of time how long you want to stay. And you come out. And you can tell yourself that you gained discernment as you came out. There's no discernment in that concentration. It's just brutally beating the mind down. And people get addicted to this. Because they like the quietude. And they don't like going back to breath meditation because it requires work, it's not as quiet. > > But the Buddha is teaching his sixteen steps for breath meditation because he wants you to develop discernment at the same time you develop concentration. And as you calm bodily fabrication, calm mental fabrication, you're going to be engaged in his five-step program. Seeing the origination of things, seeing how they pass away. Seeing their allure, why you go for them, why you want to feed on them. And then seeing the drawbacks, comparing the drawbacks with the allure and seeing that the drawbacks way outweigh the allure. That's when you can develop dispassion and gain your escape. So the concentration can't do this all for you. You have to contemplate these things. And where do you contemplate them? In the course of doing the construction, constructing concentration. You learn by building. > > The Buddha gives the image of a house. You've been building houses for who knows how many aeons. Now he says, "Focus careful attention on how you build this house." When you understand how you build this house, then you can start taking it apart, and that way you can take apart all other forms of house building. So there's work to develop, there's work to be done, not just letting go. > > This relates to the second issue that Ajaan Fuang would talk about. There was a teacher in Thailand who said that Nibbana is nothing other than the mind when it has no sense of me or mine. He called it temporary Nibbana. And as Ajaan Fuang said, "Temporary Nibbana? How can Nibbana be temporary? It's permanent, it's unconditioned." That temporary state is just a state of quietude. This relates back to those people who say that the third noble truth is just any moment the mind free from desire. That boring freedom from desire. Nibbana is something extraordinary. As the Buddha said, it's the ultimate happiness. He didn't say it's the ultimate boredom. He didn't compare it to oatmeal and porridge. All of his images are extraordinary. > > Because what happens is you've learned to see how you construct things. All things that you construct. You work on the aggregates in their best form, i.e. the form of the mind in solid concentration, which you've observed carefully how you put things together. Then you start taking it apart. And you can take it apart precisely because you've been the one who put it together. And when you see that even the best aggregates have their limitations, the mind generally is inclined to something that is totally deathless, something unfabricated. Because even those moments of quiet between one desire and the next, there's fabrication going on. The consciousness of those moments, that's a fabricated thing, as the Buddha said it's dependently co-arisen. It depends on conditions. And you see these conditions because you've been using them as your building blocks. > > So you let go not just by telling yourself to let go. You let go through careful deconstruction. After having done the work of constructing. So you know really well where the pipes are, where the air conditioning ducts are. Like the hall here in the ordination hall. I was there every day, every day when things were put together. I know where everything is. If I had to take it apart, I would know where to go. That's when you can really let go. Because when you've been carefully watching yourself as you construct, you deconstruct not just through the power of stilling the mind. You deconstruct not just by telling yourself to let go. You deconstruct because you've been thoroughly aware of how you construct things, where the limitations are, and why you would want to deconstruct. That's when you find an Nibbana that's not temporary at all. You find the real thing. So I can see why Ajaan Fuang would focus on these issues, because they really are important. They make the difference between people who simply tell themselves that they've seen the Dhamma. And those who actually seen it, and gained the full benefits of seeing it in their hearts.

u/SammaVaco — 8 days ago

4:15 The Rod Embraced

> “When embraced,
> the rod of violence^(1)
>  breeds danger & fear:
> Look at people in strife.
>  I will tell how
>  I experienced
>  terror:
> Seeing people floundering
> like fish in small puddles,
> competing with one another—
>  as I saw this,
>  fear came into me.
> The world was entirely
>  without substance.
> All the directions
>  were knocked out of line.
> Wanting a haven for myself,
> I saw nothing that wasn’t laid claim to.
> Seeing nothing in the end
> but competition,
> I felt discontent.
>      And then I saw
> an arrow here,
>  so very hard to see,
>  embedded in the heart.
> Overcome by this arrow
> you run in all directions.
> But simply on pulling it out
>  you don’t run,
>  you don’t sink.^(2)
> > [Here the trainings are recited.] ^(3)
> > Whatever things are tied down in the world,
> you shouldn’t be set on them.
> Having totally penetrated
> sensual pleasures,
> sensual passions,^(4)
> you should train for your own
>    unbinding.
> > Be truthful, not insolent,
> not deceptive, remote
> from divisiveness.
> Without anger, the sage
> should cross over the evil
>  of greed & avarice.
> He should conquer drowsiness,
>      weariness,
>      sloth;
> shouldn’t consort with heedlessness,
> shouldn’t stand firm in his pride—
>  the man with his heart set
>    on unbinding.
> > He shouldn’t engage in lying,
> shouldn’t create affection for form,
> should fully fathom conceit,
> and live refraining from impulsiveness;
> shouldn’t delight in what’s old,
>    prefer what’s new,^(5)
>  grieve over decline,
>    get entangled in
>    what’s dazzling & bright.^(6)
> > I call greed
>  a great flood;
> hunger, a swift current.
> Preoccupations are ripples;
> sensuality, a bog
>  hard to cross over.
> Not deviating from truth,
> a sage stands on high ground
>    : a brahman.^(7)
> > Having relinquished
> in every way,
> he is said to be
> at peace;
> having clearly known, he
> is an attainer-of-knowledge;
> knowing the Dhamma, he’s
>  independent.
> Moving rightly through the world,
>  he doesn’t envy
>  anyone here.
> > Whoever here has gone beyond
> sensual passions—
> an attachment hard
> to transcend in the world—
> doesn’t sorrow,
> doesn’t fret.
> He, his stream^(8) cut, is free
>  from bonds.
> > Burn up what’s before,
> and have nothing for after.
> If you don’t grasp
> at what’s in between,^(9)
>  you will go about, calm.
> > For whom, in name-&-form,
>    in every way,
> there’s no sense of mine,
> and who doesn’t grieve
> over what is not:
>  He, in the world,
>  isn’t defeated,
>  suffers no loss.^(10)
> > To whom there doesn’t occur
>  ‘This is mine,’
> for whom nothing is others’:
> He, feeling no sense of mine-ness,
> doesn’t grieve at the thought
>  ‘I have nothing.’
> > Not harsh,
> not greedy,
> not perturbed,^(11)
> everywhere
> concordant^(12):
>  This is the reward
>  —I say when asked—
>  for those who are free
>  from theorizing.
> > For one unperturbed
> —who knows—
> there’s no accumulating.
> Abstaining, unaroused,
> he everywhere sees
>  security.^(13)
>  The sage
> doesn’t speak of himself
> as among those who are higher,
>  equal,
> or lower.
> At peace, free of stinginess,
> he doesn’t embrace, doesn’t
>    reject,”
> >      the Blessed One said.

vv. 935–954

Notes

1. Nd I: The rod of violence takes three forms: physical violence (the three forms of bodily misconduct), verbal violence (the four forms of verbal misconduct), and mental violence (the three forms of mental misconduct). See AN 10:176 and Dhp 129–142.

2. Nd I: “One doesn’t run” to any of the destinations of rebirth; “one doesn’t sink” into any of the four floods of sensuality, views, becoming, and ignorance. See SN 1:1, SN 45:171, and AN 4:10.

3. This phrase, a kind of stage direction, seems to indicate that this poem had a ritual use, as part of a ceremony for giving the precepts.

4. “Sensual pleasure, sensual passions”: two meanings of the word kāma.

5. Nd I: “Old” and “new” mean past and present aggregates.

6. Nd I: “what’s dazzling & bright” = craving and other defilements.

7. See AN 7:15.

8. Nd I: The stream here stands for craving and the various defilements that arise in its wake. See Dhp 251, 337, 339­–340, and 347. It could also stand for the stream of becoming, mentioned in Sn 3:12.

9. Nd I: “Before,” “after,” and “in between” = past, future, and present.

10. “Isn’t defeated, suffers no loss”—two meanings of the Pali phrase, na jiyyati.

11. Nd I defines “perturbation” as meaning “craving,” and “unperturbed” as meaning unmoved by gain, loss, status, loss of status, praise, criticism, pleasure, or pain (see AN 8:6–7). However, when the Buddha discusses the meaning of “unperturbed” in Sn 5:3, he relates it to the practice of concentration. See Sn 5:3, note 5.

12. Sama. See Sn 1:12, note 11.

13. See Ud 2:10.

reddit.com
u/SammaVaco — 24 days ago

> # Consciousness, Awakened & Not

Dhamma Talk by Ven. Thanissaro.

> YouTube Link

Thanks to /u/Spirited_Ad8737 for edits!

> --- > Years back, I was teaching a retreat on karma. And one of the retreatants, whose background was in Zen, raised his hand, and said, "Why this emphasis on the minutia of actions and their skillfulness, when the unconditioned emptiness is all around us? You can just open up to it and there it is." And I explained you're not going to see that until you get really observant of what your actions are doing. But his question reflects an attitude of quite a few Buddhist practice communities, whether Mahayana or some Theravadin: that we're here to open up to the present moment; the present moment is the goal. That's where the unconditioned lies, our awareness right here, right now. > > Of course, that calls into question, why did the Buddha formulate a path of virtue, concentration, and discernment? In some schools, they define discernment in terms of how you define emptiness, and they have courses of study that go for years so you get the right understanding of what emptiness is. But if you look at the Buddha's take on right view, it doesn't mention emptiness at all, doesn't mention unconditioned consciousness. If you actually look very carefully, you realize that he teaches the path of actions. Training your actions through the precepts, training the actions of your mind through concentration and through discernment. So you become sensitive to what's getting in the way of the unconditioned, and you can clear it away. Which is why people who don't focus on the precepts, don't focus on mastering these skills, tend to mistake present-moment awareness for something unconditioned. They see it's there all the time. Always present. Seems unconditioned. Has no social conditioning, no sense of a person in there, if you don't apply it. So they're missing something really good by falling for something that's artificial. > > Because when the Buddha focused on actions, he wasn't just focusing on the fact that you do act, but he wanted you to see the impact of your actions, the extent to which your actions shape your awareness of reality. What's going on around you in the world, what's going on within you inside. And not only sensitive to the fact of action, but also sensitive to whatever harm you're causing. Either gross harm or more subtle forms of harm. In fact, the path is one of getting more and more sensitive to the subtleties of where you're causing unnecessary stress, unnecessary disturbance. But first you have to be very clear about where you're causing harm through your actions, which is why the precepts are an important part of the practice, why concentration as an activity is an important part of the practice. You go from levels of stillness which seem as still as the mind could possibly get, and then you find they can get even more still, and more still, and more still, and you realize why. Because there are some activities that you were doing that you weren't conscious of in the first stages, but then you become more and more conscious as you progress. > > Now the Buddha does mention an unconditioned consciousness. But he makes very clear that it's very different from the consciousness that you have right here, right now. You talk about the fact that your consciousness right here has food. It feeds on things. It feeds on intentions. It feeds on contact. And it feeds on the act of consciousness itself. You have to be wary of that one. Because this consciousness that people say is the unconditioned one that's right here right now... Sometimes it's just conscious of consciousness itself. It's got an object, and any consciousness that has an object is conditioned. And there's also the consciousness of the six senses. That arises because of the contact between the sense organ and its object. That is very much conditioned. It happens all the time, but that doesn't mean that it's constant and a ground of being. It's just an activity that you're doing all the time. > > And you're not going to see this until you get sensitive to your actions in general. Which is why the Buddha focuses on the precepts, avoiding harm in gross forms. Killing, stealing, illicit sex, lying, taking intoxicants. If you're still engaging in these kinds of activities, then you don't see the harm you're causing. You're not going to see anything more subtle at all. Which is why the people who have the attitude that the precepts are just Sunday school rules... or that they can easily be broken when you say that you have a compassionate motive... are not really learning the lessons from the precepts that they should be learning. They get more focused on the question of attachment to the precepts. Saying that the attachment is bad. Well, you're not going to learn from the precepts unless you really try to follow them. Then you come up against situations in which there is a strong temptation to see that it would actually be better to break the precept. But the Buddha wants you to say no. What would the harm be in breaking the precept? Focus on that. And you're going to see some things you wouldn't have seen before. This is the whole purpose of the path, is to see things you didn't see before. > > Then it gets more subtle in the practice of concentration. Obvious forms of harm have been cleared away. But there's still the burdensomeness of the fact that concentration has to be fabricated. You're very conscious of this fact as you're trying to get the mind into concentration in the beginning, when it's hard. But as you get more and more inclined in that direction, the mind gets more and more happy to be in a state of stillness. The effort goes underground. You have to develop your sensitivity to look for what you're doing right here, right now, if you're going to see that. So that's the question the Buddha wants you to ask. Which is why his teachings on right view – whether they're mundane right view or transcendent right view – focus on action. What are you doing? Mundane right view basically says there are skillful and unskillful actions, and there are the results of those actions. The Four Noble Truths take it deeper; they focus on the problem of suffering. Again, where are you causing harm through what you're doing? > > Each of the four noble truths involves an action. Clinging in the First Noble Truth is something to be comprehended. The craving in the Second Noble Truth is to be abandoned. The Third Noble Truth is dispassion... and dispassion comes about as a result of looking at your actions. When an unskillful form of craving arises in the mind, you want to see what's the origination. The origination is something that comes from within; it's an activity that comes from within. How does it pass away? What's the allure? Like why do you go for it? What are the drawbacks? This involves a fair amount of thinking and observation. And focuses attention again inside. Just as the precepts focus attention inside; they may be dealing with your external actions, but the big issue in the precepts of course is your intention. What was your intention in doing something? If you kill without intending to, or if you lie without intending to... that's not breaking the precept. So the focus is on your actions, and your internal actions. This is where the Buddha wants you to become more and more sensitive. > > Even with discernment, the Buddha points out how you start taking apart your practice of concentration in terms of the aggregates... seeing that these all are fabricated, including the aggregate of consciousness, you can incline the mind to the deathless. But then you have to watch out. The perceptions that incline you in that direction, such as the three perceptions of inconstancy, stress, and not-self... It is possible to cling there. So you have an experience of the deathless and you cling to that. So you have to be very sensitive to what you're doing. Circumspect all around. It's only then that you see something that lies beyond what you have fabricated. And you see it because you've been focusing on the fabrications and clearing them out of the way, clearing them out of the way. It's only then that you're going to see the difference between the consciousness that is here in concentration – which is also consciousness at the senses, at the sense of the mind – and what might be unconditioned. There's a passage in Majjhima 140, where the Buddha takes you through the different elements: earth, water, wind, fire... space. And what's left is consciousness. In terms of what they talk about with the Thai ajaans, that's the knower. You've cleared away your passion for things outside, and your consciousness is aware of feelings arising and passing away. It's able to separate itself out from them, observe them. > > The image he uses is of watching someone making a fire. You rub two fire sticks together, and the fire starts. And then you take the sticks apart, before the fire's got a chance, and everything calms down. In the same way, a feeling comes from contact. You're conscious of that contact, conscious of the feeling. But the consciousness is separate from that. As I said, this is the knower, the pûu rúu that the Thai ajaans talk about But they, like the Buddha, are very clear on the fact that this knower is a construct. And only when you see that it's constructed, can you get a chance to go beyond it and find something of genuine value. > > Years back, there was a book that divided all the Buddhist practices into two sorts, those that tried to create the unconditioned, and those who tell you the unconditioned is already there and all you have to do is relax into it. And the author of the book presented these as the only two alternatives. Now if that were the case, only one of those alternatives would be right. After all, the unconditioned cannot be created. You can't create it through your efforts. It has to be something that's already there. > > But Ajaan Lee gives a third alternative. His image is of getting fresh water out of salt water. The fresh water is there. But just relaxing or letting the salt water sit is not going to get the salt to separate out. You have to distill it. Here, Ajaan Lee is talking about the effort of the practice. And distilling it, you're focusing on getting the salt and other minerals out. You're not focusing on the water so much. You taste the water, if there's still any salt in it, you got to distill it again. You have to put it through the effort of observing the precepts, practicing concentration, developing discernment. Getting more and more sensitive to how you are shaping your experience of reality. Even when the mind is very, very quiet, there's still an intentional element going on. When you're sensitive to that and realize that you've had enough of that, you want something even more peaceful. That's when you have a chance. > > When the Buddha talks about this, there's the image of the light beam that doesn't land. There are places in the canon where he talks about how ordinary consciousness lands, lands on the different aggregates. And once it lands, then it proliferates, it grows. He switches the image then to a seed. You place a seed in the ground, and things will grow. But a consciousness that doesn't land, that's the consciousness of the arahant. It's like a light beam that doesn't land. You can't detect it, but it's there. It's not based on any object at all, has nothing to do with any of the six senses. So it is consciousness, but it's of a different sort. And you're going to see the difference between what you're conscious of now as you get the mind to just that state of aware, aware, aware, awareness that's separate from its objects, and you see where that too is constructed, that too is fabricated. And once you develop dispassion for that fabrication, that's when you'll be free. And you don't have to have a right view about that. What you're going to find afterwards, aside from the right view that it's going to be good. So focus on doing the work that needs to be done. So you get sensitive to what it means to do work, to shape things, to fabricate things, to have intentions, to act on them. Get really sensitive to these activities. Because those are the ones that are getting in the way. But you're not going to get them out of the way simply by letting them go. You've got to master them first. Because they teach you a lot about sensitivity. And it's this sensitivity that will carry you through.

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u/SammaVaco — 25 days ago

4:14 Quickly

> “I ask the Kinsman of the Sun, the Great Seer,
> about seclusion & the state of peace.
> Seeing in what way is a monk unbound,
> clinging to nothing in the world?”
> > “He should put an entire stop
> to the root of objectification-classifications:
> >    ‘I am the thinker.’^(1)
> > He should train, always mindful,
> to subdue any craving inside him.
> Whatever truth he may know,
>  within or without,
> he shouldn’t, because of it,
> make himself hardened,
>  for that isn’t called
>  unbinding by the good.
> He shouldn’t, because of it, think himself
>  better,
>      lower, or
>    equal.
> Touched by contact in various ways,
> he shouldn’t keep theorizing about self.
> Stilled right within,
> a monk shouldn’t seek peace from another,
>  from anything else.
> For one stilled right within,
> there’s nothing embraced,
>  so how rejected?^(2)
> > As in the middle of the sea
>  it is still,
> with no waves upwelling,
> so the monk—unperturbed, still—
> should not swell himself
>  anywhere.”
> > “He whose eyes are open has described
> the Dhamma he’s witnessed,
> subduing danger.
> Now tell us, sir, the practice:
> the Pāṭimokkha & concentration.”
> > “One shouldn’t be careless with his eyes,
> should close his ears to village-talk,
> shouldn’t hunger for flavors,
> or view anything in the world
>  as mine.
> When touched by contact,
> he shouldn’t lament,
> shouldn’t covet anywhere any
>  states of becoming,
> or tremble at terrors.
> When gaining food & drink,
>    staples & cloth,
>  he should not make a hoard.
> Nor should he be upset
> when receiving no gains.
> Doing jhāna, not footloose,
> he should refrain from restlessness,
> shouldn’t be heedless,
> should live in a noise-less abode.
> Not making much of sleep,
> ardent, given to wakefulness,
> he should abandon weariness, deception,
>  laughter, sports,
>  sexual intercourse,
>  & all that goes with it;
> should not practice casting spells,^(3)
>  interpret dreams, physical marks,
>  the stars, animal cries;
> should not be devoted to
>  doing cures or inducing fertility.
> > A monk shouldn’t tremble at blame
> or grow haughty with praise;
> should dispel stinginess, greed,
> divisive speech, anger;
> shouldn’t buy or sell
> or revile anyone anywhere;
> shouldn’t linger in villages,
> or flatter people in hope of gains.
> > A monk shouldn’t boast
> or speak with ulterior motive,
> shouldn’t train in insolence
> or speak quarrelsome words;
> shouldn’t engage in lies
> or knowingly cheat;
> shouldn’t despise others for their
>  life,
>  discernment,
>  habits,
>  or practices.
> Annoyed on hearing many words
> from contemplatives
> or ordinary people,
> he shouldn’t respond harshly,
> for those who retaliate
>  aren’t calm.
> > Knowing this teaching,
> a monk inquiring
> should always
> train in it mindfully.
> Knowing unbinding as peace,
> he shouldn’t be heedless
> of Gotama’s message—
> for he, the Conqueror unconquered,
> witnessed the Dhamma,
>  not by hearsay,
>  but directly, himself.
> So, heedful, you
> should always do homage & train
> in line with that Blessed One’s message,”
> >     the Blessed One said.^(4)

vv. 915–934

Notes

1. On objectification-classifications and their role in leading to conflict, see Sn 4:11 and the introduction to MN 18. The perception, “I am the thinker” lies at the root of these classifications in that it identifies oneself as a being. Because a being requires food, both physical and mental (see SN 12:63–64 and Khp 4), this creates conflict with others seeking food. Because an identity as a being also involves attachment (see SN 23:2), this perception involves internal conflict as well, as whatever one identifies with will inevitably change. The conceit inherent in this perception thus forms a fetter on the mind. To become unbound, one must learn to examine this perception—to see that it is simply an assumption that is not inherent in experience, and that we would be better off learning how to drop it.

2. This reading follows the version of the verse given in the Thai edition of Nd I, as well as an alternative reading given as a footnote to the Sri Lankan edition of Sn 4:14: n’atthi attaṁ kuto nirattaṁ vā. The Burmese and Sri Lankan editions of this verse read, n’atthi attā kuto nirattā vā: “There is no self, so how what’s opposed to self?” The Thai edition of Sn 4:14 reads, n’atthi attā kuto nirattaṁ vā: “There is no self, so how what’s rejected?” This last reading makes no sense; the Burmese and Sri Lankan readings depend on the notion that nirattā is an actual word, although it appears nowhere in the Canon except in two other verses of the Aṭṭhaka Vagga, where it is cited as a possible alternative to niratta (Sn 4:3 and Sn 4:10). Because the Buddha in SN 44:10 refuses to take the position that there is no self, and because he says in MN 2 that the questions, “Do I exist? Do I not exist?” are unworthy of attention, all of the readings of this verse that say n’atthi attā would appear to be wrong. Thus I have adopted the reading given here.

3. Āthabbaṇa. Some scholars have identified this term with the Atharvaveda, but the identification is uncertain. It could also be a generic term for casting spells and curses of any sort. Nd I interprets this term simply as referring to spells for bringing about calamities and diseases for one’s enemies.

4. The Chinese version of the Aṭṭhaka Vagga adds, at the end of this sutta, the verses in Sn 1:9.

See also: DN 2

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u/SammaVaco — 25 days ago