u/Sweet-Collar-4642

Basically either an OOC lancel or flat out an OC lannister, but it'd be similar to lancel in it that he has lancel's flaws and weaknesses. But he's better with a sword and yearns for more, he not only wants to be a great knight but he wants to make his father and lord tywin proud. Because it seemed like lancel was fine being a cupbearer for robert rather than a true squire. So here lancel will be like a young Jamie and yearn for true knighthood and glory, but he's not all honor and chivalry, robert got him a special night at chatays on his 14th nameday, and since then he enjoys going out to the brothels with tyrion.

Now when lancel poisons robert it's not something he does lightly, and he didn't think Robert would flat out die. He thought that he would drug him and he would be injured and this would allow cersei and tywin to remove nes stark from the board. But It takes a great deal of convincing on cersei's part, lancel is unsure if robert being incapacitated is what's best for house lannister. How with everything going on with tyrion, jamie, and lady stark. He doesn't want to upset his father or tywin, and at first cersei isn't able to convince him. But finally cersei just lies and says she's already talked this over with tywin and he's all for Robert being poisoned.

But of course when robert dies lancel is terrified, how he's just killed a man(he's never killed before) and not just that he was the king, and when lancel suggests asking lord tywin what they should do cersei seduces him and convinces him that it should stay their little secret.

Now things would stay similar, but from the pov of lancel we would see how he was aware cersei was a poison apple for him, yet he couldn't stop. The thrill of sleeping with the queen and the pleasure he felt from it was unlike anything he'd experienced before. Greater than any whore, yet everytime he looked in the mirror he would wonder what he'd become. What he was doing.

The change happens when jamie arrives. Lancel had discovered the truth when cersei called out jamie's name during their coupling. And with that he was able to know that stannis's "lie" wasn't a lie. And because of this he's terrified when jamie returns, he thinks jamie will kill him for sleeping with cersei while he was away. And not only that the guilt of his actions has slowly been eating him alive, but the fear of death was what pushed him over the edge.

So he goes to tywin, he confesses everything. Robert, his relationship with cersei and how he knows that the children aren't robert's. At first tywin doesn't say anything, he goes through several emotions. At first he refuses to believe it, but when lancel provides some messages that cersei had sent him over the moons and he hands one of cersei's undergarments to prove that they have... fornicated. Slowly he shifts towards resignation and grief, grief at the complete and utter failure his children had become. Then to rage, his summons cersei and jamie and when he suggests that he suspects something, jamie just flat out confesses thd truth proudly. Tywin slaps jamie in the face and calls him a fool, and then calls cersei a idiotic whore. He tells them that he'd disown if he could, but their mother would crawl from the grave to smite him, but he refuses to let them taint the lannister name anymore. He sends cersei to casterly rock to live out the remainder of her days in her room like a child. And tells jamie that if he likes his lifetime oaths so much, then he'll enjoy the nights watch. He sends jamie to the wall for the crime of kingslaying, he gets joffery to give the order. Convincing him that jamie slew one king and that he'll slay another and that robert was a fool to trust jamie to guard him, that if joffery wants to be a proper king he had to have proper men and proper justice. So jamie is sent to the wall.

Now that tywin is short an heir and he refuses to name tyrion. He considers tommen and lancel. But the knowledge of his grandchildren being incestuous monsters grates at him. That if the realm ever found out it would ruin their dynasty. He needed their dynasty to last a thousand generations. So he begins making preparations for shieern baratheon to be captured for tommen(who he then plans for their children to sed joffery's), and he also makes efforts to get mya stone for tyrion(he figures a bastard will fit his imp of a son) They need baratheon blood to ensure the survival of the royal line.

And involving lancel, after this event he forever changes. In canon he drastically changed to redeem himself. Here he feels he can gain redemption from his sins by doing what lord tywin says. Tywin wants tommen as heir, but has lancel as a backup, so he begins training lancel in lordship and whatnot. And also marries sansa to lancel.

That's all i got. This is a rough idea. So drop any ideas you or changes you got. I wanted to post this because i feels their aren't enough lannister stories that aren't about Jamie, cersei, or tywin. So maybe this'll inspire an author to write a lannister centric story. I was thinking that joffery could live? So that tommen could marry shieern. Don't feel good about a grown man marrying a sweet innocent girl like her. And for tommen to marry her, joffery has to still be king to marry marg. But haven't really worked out how ollena would be ok with joffery

So I'ma through my idea of how jon snow can cast aside his honor, but if you have any fic recs where jon isn't honorable let me know.

So basically a lot of fics have jon snow have the perfect reaction to him finding out he's rhaegar's son(wether he's trueborn or not). But jon could've just as easily reacted terribly.

Right before robert's party arrives in winterfell jon decides he wants to go through the crypts one last time before going to the watch. To say goodbye to his ancestors. But he finds a letter in his aunt lyanna's tomb. Detailing his origins(in this case lyanna and rhaegar married in front of a heart tree. And though that's good in the north. That's worth crap in the south, especially because rhaegar was already married. But most importantly this means the world to jon). Jon weeps, knowing that he had a mother who loved him. But of course he's filled with such conflicting emotions. But he stuffs them all inside and tries living as if nothing happened, he tells himself that it doesn't change anything. Robert won the war, and his father and mother are dead. But it constantly naws at him, and he broods excessively, because he's unsure if he still wants to join the watch. Eventually the king arrived, and cat makes special point to have jon not there to great the king, and to not sit with the family. Unlike before when he would ignore it, he is overcome with rage. He wants to tell lady catylen the truth, to shout it from the castle walls and to stop living this lie. He goes outside and has his chat with tyrion(except slightly different, jon doesn't try and defend himself by saying "lord stark is my father". Instead "lord stark is my blood". Which tyrion catches). But when tyrion gives him his advice this further enrages jon, the idea of wearing the lie of "bastardy" and of being "lord stark's son" as armor disgusts him.

That night he can not sleep, his rage boils over and he goes to lord stark's chambers. He tells the guards that the king asked for extra guards, and that they should go to their new posts, and that he'll inform lord stark of the new development. He rushes to ned's sleeping forms and lifts him from his bed and holds him against the wall calling him a "lying bastard", that his whole existence is a lie. All the scorn from lady cat, and the shame he's put on himself his entire life was for nothing. That ned encouraged him to through his life away at the wall.

Through all of this cat calls for the guard, but when they don't come she tries to force jon away from ned. But jon pushes cat away int a cabinet and she twists her angle and screams.

Ned yell's "enough!" And punches Jon, then he tries to talk jon down. Jon then jumps on top of ned and yells "i won't listen to more of your lies uncle!" and punches him repeatedly. When ned is bloody and bruised. Jon tells him "I'm leaving uncle. But not as a bastard headed for the wall. But as the trueborn son of lyanna Stark and rhaegar Targaryen, and i can go wherever i please." He moves to leave, but then he stops "and I'll be taking your precious sword ice". And he takes ice.

When jon walks out he begins shaking, his shocked by what he had just done. He considers going back in and falling to his knees and beg for forgiveness. But he steels himself and heads to his room to get ghost and pack his things. But before he leaves he has one more stop.

He goes to arya's room, he gives her needle. Telling her he had it made just for her. He tells her that no matter what he does or where he goes. That he'll always love her. Then he kisses her on the head goodbye forever.. but when arya notices ice she questions it. Jon smiles and knocks her out by hitting her in the head.

It's only after he's left winterfell does he truly realize the gravity of what he's done. He's attacked to lord of winterfell and stolen house starks ancestral blade. He'll be hunted for the rest of his days. It doesn't matter who's son he is. He realizes he needs to leave westeros and makes for white harbor and gets a ship to bravvos.

That's kinda the setup for the story. In the beginning jon will have boughts of rage, and kinda be shocked that he did what he did(eventually the shock will go away). But he's still disgusted by what he did, but at the same time doesn't regret it. He feels that ned deserved it for lying to him all those years and for trying to send him to the wall. It's like how Anakin was disgusted by his actions, but didn't regret them because "it was all for padme". Here jon thinks it's "all justified"(wether he's right or wrong, it's how he feels).

Now it'll take a while for jon to become "honorless". He still has a good heart, but while in bravvos he'll try to be honorable and constantly get punished for it. Getting stabbed in the back, getting his belongings stolen. He finds himself in an honorless world, and he has to adapt. He realizes how worthless honor is. And the final straw is when he finds a mother and her child starving. He bends down to help them, but then the mother shouts "now!" And a man comes up from the bushes and trys to stab him. But jon manages to kill him. The mother begins begging for her life "says me and my family were starving" but it's all a farce and she moves to stab him with a hidden knife. He's forced to kill her. Then he's left with a crying child....who will starve in a few short weeks. He makes a difficult decision.

And from then on jon doesn't trust anything anyone says. He always second guesses and never drops his guard. He's full of hate, self loathing, and a desperate longing for simpler times. Because he realizes that ever since he's discovered the truth his life has gotten so much worse. How life was better when he was a bastard.

Eventually he'll meet dany, and it will be a serious slow burn. Because Jon is a broken man. But he's very moved by how dany is essos's mother. How she's genuinely good. But it takes him a while to trust her.

All i got. If you have any recs on a jon who goes rogue and forgoes his principales let me know.

I've kinda gotten tires of reading from the very beginning in every fic(at least for now). So any fics that start after AGOT(preferably with jon's Resurrection). Basically WOW. I'm fine if it's before then, like the fic starts when jon becomes lord commander or something. But to where i don't have to read slightly different versions of canon starting at the direwolves birth over and over.

So basically aemon's death gets pushed back to like 2 months before baelon's. And he impregnated Jocelyn right before hand.

At the great council Jocelyn is pregnant, but is grieving and doesn't tell anyone, and is angry at the realm as a whole for rejecting her daughter. So she doesn't bother announcing it to the world. Though she told king J, J can't pause everything on the chance her baby will be a boy, and even then he will be a babe when the realm needs a king. So it doesn't matter.

She gives birth and her son takes after her(basically like jon snow). He has black hair and blue(slightly purplish) eyes. And because of this, people doubt that he is actually aemon's and not just some random man she took to bed after his death.. and J needs the realm to be at peace, and even though there are rumors about the boy, and that should help maintain viserys's reign he doesn't want to take any chances. So with a heavy heart he once again disregards his emotions and does his "duty" for the realm. He disinherits aemon's and Jocelyn's son as a Targaryen and proclaims him a baratheon, he forbids him from claiming a dragon and sends him to storms end. This act basically makes rhaenys forever hate viserys(and J) because her brother had to give up being a Targaryen to secure his reign.

All this is to setup the story of having a big badass baratheon warrior in the dance. And by him being a "Targaryen" and the "rightful heir" he has a personal connection to the crown.

And i think you see where this is going, robert will eventually start his rebellion or in this case dance. His mother and rhaenys were honest with him about what was taken from him, so he has an innate dislike borderline hatred for Targaryens. But at the same time he has this conflict within himself because he is one(sorta). Robert loves being a baratheon, he feels he is the embodiment of his house words "ours is the fury". He never lets a slight go unpunished, and he's the greatest warrior since maegor the cruel. He's beaton everyone his age and beaten full grown knights to a bloody pulp with his bear hands. He feels a deep anger when he sees a dragon flying overhead when he's in kingslanding.

But at the same time, he can't help but imagine if he was a Targaryen. If he was the king. And when he's in the air riding with his sister, feeling the air and being on top of the war. It's even better than the trill of bashing a man's skull in with his war hammer.

And he has to admit that despite Targaryens being cunts, their beauty knows no bounds. The realms delight is truly a delight. And sarea Targaryen is a sight to behold, he'd even partook in her on a trip to essos and it was divine.

So he had a love/hate relationship with them.

Though despite their beauty he couldn't see any of them tying him down. Sure it'd be a hell of a week. But he'd move onto the next eventually.

Robert will eventually break precedent and " usurp" his cousin and become lord of storms end. He won a bet with his uncle, he challenged his son borrus to a duel proclaiming him a coward if they refused and if he won he became lord of storms end over borrus. He proceeded to smash his head against the ground, knocking him out for 3 days. This should happen when Robert is about 16, meaning about 117

When Robert is young he will be a renowned womanizer. He father's many bastards. One of which happens to jace. He slept with rhaenyra on her wedding night, he charmed her all throughout the night, rhaenyra gave in. Plus she had a bit of a childhood crush on him. Despite his nature with women robert was the most built man in the kingdoms, both in bed and in arms. Though when rhaenyra suggests that Robert stick around to father her children for the throne, Robert is insulted that she would use him like a whore, proclaiming "I charm women, then i fuck 'em, i fuck whores then I pay 'em. But I ain't no manwhore for no woman. Even a princess". They have a falling out.

Pretty soon after Robert marry's his niece laena. When he found out corlys sold her to the sea lord of bravos, he is shocked that corlys could value his daughter so little. Saying she is worth a lord paramount at least. Not some essoi swordsman. And when he sees her, he is shocked by her womanly beauty, for he doesn't see the fiery friend he used to tumble with in his time visiting his sister. He is impressed by her shapely figure and beautiful face. Her silver-gold hair and pale skin. He proclaims her the most beautiful woman in the world, more stunning than any Targaryen. He declares that he will marry her as soon as he beats the living shit out of the man who thought himself worthy of such a woman. They marry that night, and it's said that their son daeron was conceived the same night.

Robert returns to storms end with his new wife and her mighty dragon. They spend the next several years raising their son and twin daughters baela and rhaena, fierce girls those. They often visit dragonstone, laena insisting that vhagar needed time on the island.

Though eventually conflict arises. Corlys and rhaenys raise the matter of driftmark's succussion. Claiming they need to change it. While rhaenyra insisting things stay as they are. They all meet at dragonstone to discuss matters. Robert clearly sees both laena and rhaenys want someone of velaryon blood to inherit driftmark. He suggests that if laena's pregnancy(she is about 6 months along) yields a boy that he inherit, if not then baela should inherit. Rhaenys and laena eagerly agree.. though things get tense and viserys insist they sleep. That night aemond claims the wild dragon the cannibal. Though he is unable to completely control the beast and begins to wreak havoc on the island. Laena insists she stop it, but she is pregnant. Daemon and caraxes go out, but they struggle against the mighty beast. Robert sees no other option. He goes to the dragon caves and finds vermithor. Verimithor roars at him and robert roars back "listen here you beast! I Robert baratheon command you to calm the fuck down! There's a battle going down and i need your fury! With Your fury and mine no dragon, not even the mighty cannibal can stand against! No lower your damn neck and let me claim you!". Verimithor is impressed by his courage and fury, and allows Robert to get on. Together with caraxes they greatly wound the cannibal. Forcing it to land and allowing aemond to get back control. Every one is angered and enraged at aemond, but viserys is disappointed in Robert. He broke to old kings law. The old king said that if Robert ever claimed a dragon he were to leave the seven kingdoms, but viserys is a kind man. And says that robert has 1 year to prepare his son to rule stormsend before he is to leave the seven kingdoms.

The following day viserys announces the succussion of driftmark is to stay the same.

Involving aemond, he doesn't become one eyed. But he becomes ostrized by his family and the realm. He claimed a dragon he couldn't control(at the time) and destoryed a village as well as caused robert baratheon to claim a dragon.

And Robert claiming a dragon finally puts the rest all the rumors about him bot being aemon's son

Robert goes back to storms end. But not to prepare to leave. He goes to prepare for war. He plans to swat the lords who prefer a male king to his side, as well as gain his sisters support by promising baela inherit driftmark(his first born son will inherit the throne, his second born son storms end, and barla driftmark).

Robert declares himself king, though to the surprise of many he doesn't change his name to Targaryen. He remains a baratheon. Though he does change his banner, basically the stag one, but a dragon. It's a single crowned bronze dragon on a yellow field. He makes his new words "with fury, we bring fire and blood". The stormsend baratheons will become like the branch house, while there will be the royal baratheons in KL.

Anyway that's all i got for now. If you have any ideas feel free to add any. There aren't really any baratheon related fics relating to anything that isn't "trueborn son of Robert". So i came up with this, i don't have any plans to write this at the moment. But i thought to get the idea out there, maybe it'll inspire someone.

Now from here it'll be a 3 way war, but aegon's faction will be much worse off since he isn't the only male option. So he'll basically just have the hightowers and the lannisters.

And with dragons, robert has verimithor and vhagar. But baela gets sheepstealer because laena took her out to claim him. And larna also took a dragonstone egg for daeron on their way out. So daeron had a young dragon(though it won't be useful until the very end of the war or afterwards) . Though daeron could probably use him on the ground. Like daeron fights beside his dragon while fighting in the vanguard.

And Robert should have a super badass moment where he kills a dragon. Like how daemon killed vhagar. Like i imagine robert jumps on cannibal, kills aemond. Then using a valryain steel spear(specially prepared for this) he stabs it as deep as he can get it into the cannibal's head. And it begins to die because of this, but he like begins to throttle the beast. Using it's head to force it into a crash landing. Then as the cannibal is hurting and dying from the brain injury he stabs it in the eye. Then verimithor bits it's neck off and screams into the sky with it's mouth drenched in dragonblood. While simultaneously robert has does the same, like i imagine he's a bit in shock like "i killed a dragon!? HA! i killed the damn beast! Take that you scalely egg eater!" Then he proceeds to take a bite out of the guts in it's neck and scream into the air while laughing in his pure awesomes. Until a kingsgaurd interrupts his moment and he's like "ohh.... Heyyyy" while dragon blood is dripping from his mouth.

So the dragonborn(they don't bother giving him a name) is the first of his kind. The sorcerers of valryia were trying to further their knowledge and power, they combined man and dragon into one. A man with the soul of a dragon, granting him powerful abilities.

He has captain america like strength and speed, he's fire proof, he has hardened skin(not like impenetrable. But like as hard as wood. So difficult to slash and cut), he lives for centuries, and he has dragon shouts, by shouting he can breath fire, or release a great push of air(like a force push), he can see in the night and has the ability to talk to dragons.

Here is a rough outline of events:

He was created to be a weapon, raised from a young age to serve the valryain empire. As soon as he was 15 he was sent to essos with his valryain greatsword. Valryia had just conquered volantis and lys, now they set their eyes on pentos, so he was sent alone to see if he was worth a dragon. He proved worthy, by destroying their army.

Valryia was proud of their creation and saw it as a success, so they began to make more. But they are unable to truly replicate it, the others are inferior. Though in the mean time they continued to send their attack dog all across essos. Why bother lowering themselves with war when they had an animal to do it for them?.

But after essos was conquered he was allowed to rest. He went to lys and was given the finest bed slaves(he ends up creating a line here. Like to the point where like 30% of the lys population is from his seed). He spends 100 years in lys, drinking, partying, eating, fucking. But as time passes he loses purpose in life. Valryia is at peace. He asks if they could conquer westeros, but the dragonlords tell him they are an uncivilized and unrullable people. Not fit for conquest. He asks if he could be allowed to make a house, he asks for tasks or something. Anything to give him purpose. But they laugh at his face, Telling him that he is a dog, an animal. And when a dog isn't needed it goes to it's cage, they tell him to go to lys and continue as he has been for the last 100 years.

He is outraged and kills every dragon lord in his presence, outside their dragons rage. He swiftly kills the ones trying to attack him on the ground. Cutting through their brains with his valryain sword. But a few take to the skys. He uses his shout of force, directing the energy beneath him. Propelling hik upwards, he does this several times, while swiftly changing directions as to a avoid dragonfire. He positions himself within striking distance then goes for their heart.

Valryia hears that the dragonborn killed 15 lords and their dragons(the lords obviously had some of the biggest dragons). They send the loyal dragonborn, numbering 50. But only one returns. In a panic they summon the entire army of dragons and rush to meet him in the dothraki sea . It is a fierce battle, but the dragonborn is too quick and small. He kills 20 dragons before they order a retreat.

Valryia decides another approach, they summon their strongest sorcerers and they spend 5 years making a spell to seal him(during these 5 years the dragonborn wreaks havoc across essos). The plan is simple, While he is busy killing the dragons they will sneak up close. They will prepare the spell. Then when the dragons retreat and he falls back to the ground. His fate will be sealed.

Valryia quickly destroys all record of the man, and vow to never again make more. Though the one place that holds any records of the dragonborn ever existing is lys. They bedmasters have him in their records as the most prominent buyer for 100 years straight.

The dragonborn remains in a deep sleep for nearly 5,000 years until one day he awakes to find valryia is gone, his masters are gone. He is free.

This is like his backstory. And he wakes up during the 100 years of blood. His sealing held until the magic ran out, which was a few years after the doom.

The dragonborn doesn't have a name, his people are gone, his home is gone, but he still has one place so he heads to essos and immediately notices the lack of dragons and wonders if the dragons have completely vanished. He asks around and he discovers that the empire has completely collapsed and the only dragons are on an island called dragonstone with the minor house of house Targaryen. The dragonborn considers going their and conquering the last of valryia but decides he is done with war and battle.

At lys he finds his home is long gone, though he notices a great deal of the Valyrians resemble him. Using some of the treasures he had taken from old valryia, he buys a new home and decides to rest. After 5 years of constant fighting (and then 5,000 years of sleep) he needs time to recuperate, so he studys and learns what he has missed. Though he surprises himself when he doesn't feel the need to enjoy the pillow slaves, he bought some. But after a few nights, the pleasure of an animalistic fuck seems to have worn off after 100 years. So he makes them servants instead, after their 9 months of rest though.

After a time in lys he spends the next hundred years living as a bard, traveling the continent. Learning songs, stories and people. During this time he adopts the name aerion.

But at the end of this hundred years he decides he wants to meet the last of valryia. And heads to dragonstone.

That's the setup. Obviously with a character that lives for hundreds of years he'll be around for the whole story. And when he's OP you have to be smart. Though i think you could get away with a nerf because he slept for 5,000 years and during that time the magic that gave him his powers had faded. So he has the same powers, but it takes much much more out of him to use it. He can't spam his shouts, and because of that he is no longer a match for a dragon in the sky(since he can't "fly" anymore). Though he can still kill a dragon on the ground.

He'll be in the conquest fall in love with visneya. And for the first time live truly happy.

That's all i got for now

There's a great fic called "broken dreams" it's a time travel story that has jon meeting bloodraven and becoming a lot like him. And it made me realize that jon is the first person since bloodraven to have Targaryen blood and first men blood. And stark blood is arguably more magically potent than blackwood blood.

So are there any fics where they use that? Where jon kinda becomes like bloodraven. Because bloodraven is a badass guy, and i wish George would write a full on book about him(honestly more likely than WOW and DOS). But anyway recs?

Or maybe even cool ideas or scenarios with a jon with bloodravens powers and/or demeur or appearance.

Like imagine jon running into bloodraven before bran, and they have a nice chat. Some good old man advice, dark sister. And jon awakens greenser powers. Jon could meet bran, but I'm not sure if he would leave him. Do you think he could live with himself abandoning bran beyond the wall. Even when bran insists that he let him train. Jon might let his emotions rule him and abandon his mission to infiltrate the wildlings. Though maybe bloodraven will say something like "you gotta go boy, your girl's gonna wonder where you went". I can see bry giving jon relationship advice, telling him to enjoy the moments he has. To not be held back by his bastardy.