u/errolprowse

What do you guys think? What benefits does a customer see with this tech?

Does this AI system require sending data to a cloud server? How will customers feel about that?

LFP degradation rates are well established. Even a budget battery can determine SOH through capacity pretty easily.

Currently in the EV BMS world, lfp batteries are using internal resistance meters to determine state of health. You can feed all the data you possibly can into an AI but it won't test the internal resistance. There is natural variance in cells and you can't really get around that. You have to test it and that's the only way to find out if the cells are healthy.

I was doing some googling today, and Panasonic is the largest manufacturer of lithium-ion cells in America. They also have a dry electrode process in the works and the site in Nevada (which people argue in this group is the best place to build these cells) makes 6 million cells every single day.

Their research and development labs are absolutely insane: https://www.panasonic.com/global/energy/products/battery/takumi/technical\_development.html

The company is worth $69 billion, and their r&d budget is 2.1 billion.

This company is an absolute behemoth and they are having trouble scaling dry electrode process: https://www.automotiveworld.com/news/panasonics-4680-mass-production-pushed-back-yet-again/

Seems like Tesla is the only cell manufacturer in America using dry electrode process and pulling it off at scale.

What exactly does dragonfly energy have here that's better? What proof do we have? How are they going to be better than Tesla?

If the batteries that dragonfly currently assemble are not competitive, how is this dry electrode process competitive? Is there a third party testing the dry electrode tech claims?

Would love to learn more. Why do you guys think dfli can pull it off? I keep seeing people mention the dry electrode tech, but I don't think anyone is seeing what the competition is doing here. I would love to see your guys's perspective.

I'm starting to realize that no one here understands this industry at all or the technology. If you mention anything about the underlying industry or tech, everyone here tries to question your "intentions" or calls it fud. I don't understand the financial stuff but I can tell that no one here knows the battery stuff. At all.

Does anyone here even know what a dry electrode is? Do you guys know what a solid state battery is? Do you guys know what other solid state batteries are currently available and being manufactured at scale?

Is anyone reading this currently cycling lithium iron phosphate batteries to run their home?

Does anyone here know the UL standards for energy storage systems? What are they?

Has anyone here purchased a dragonfly energy product in the past? If no, what other company did you purchase from instead?

What are the weak points of lfp versus cobalt based lithium ion variants? Why?

Specifically what edge does dragonfly energy have in this industry?

What's the average battery capacity of an eAPU?

What type of cell is Dakota lithium using? Who is their supplier?

What cell design of LFP caused market disruption a few years ago?

What is difficult about dry electrode process at scale?

If you can't answer these basic questions in a few seconds then I don't understand how anyone here is actually invested in this company. I thought I could get a differing perspective here but all I'm seeing is ignorance to this technology entirely. How problems are approached in this group is very interesting. It's always a personal attack or accusation and trying to figure out someone's intentions. I'm sharing my intentions and I'm not getting a single useful bit of information here at all. I would imagine that people that put their money into this business understand this industry well. Or the technology.

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For years their packs have been overpriced compared to the competition and their supplier makes their cylindrical cell packs without UL1973 or UL9540.

Seems like the previous owners were very nice people. I've heard a lot of good things about them.

I just talked to an installer and he said he never ever sees Dakota lithium batteries. No one seems to buy them.

Morton's on the move who was sponsored by dragonfly energy said that the Dakota lithium battery he tested was a complete failure. It only pulled half the capacity it was rated for and the cells were getting really hot: https://youtu.be/gXjiPaYRXms

What do you guys think dragonfly has in plan for this brand? I cannot see a single benefit. What do you guys think?

I have been reading about the difficulties of this manufacturing method at scale and am trying to find evidence of how well their tech works for this. If I understand it correctly, there are many companies who claim they can pull it off, but only a couple including Tesla, have been able to do it.

Is there evidence of a manufacturing line or proof that their tech works?

Has a third party lab verified the results?

To create a line with this process, it can take a few hundred million dollars. Why hasn't another company came in and bought dfli if their tech works?

Would love to see any and all evidence for this. I haven't been able to find anything. I am ignorant to dry electrode process, but would love to learn more.

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https://www.facebook.com/share/v/1EHppCuPMP/

Wow! What do you guys think about what he's saying here?

I've seen endless false posts here about me and I'm tired of it. Anytime someone says anything factual, it's dismissed or everyone claims they are "FUD" but doesn't care to look at the actual evidence or consider the people affected by these batteries.

I do not own the stock, or a short position against the stock. Never have, never will. I have zero clue about how stocks work, and don't care to learn.

And I don't think the people that criticize this companies products care about the stock at all. What they are mad about is the company denying the issues that people bring up. And the endless rejection of any criticism at all.

When I first heard about the overheating terminal issues, not a single person could provide evidence. No pictures, videos or anything else. I denied the issue and sided with battleborn. I was annoyed because I didn't want to test a battery that has been off my recommendation list for 3 years, for a problem I have zero evidence of. Then more people continued to complain and a forum member sent me a battery. While charging it, I burned my thumb on the terminal. I opened the battery and found melted parts that were overheating from a loose connection. The company claims that this is a "safety feature", but instead it creates a loose connection that creates more heat. This is present before you remove the lid. I continued to investigate and found more issues. And more. And more. Everything I found is on video and you can see it for yourself.

In recent times I've found a major issue with the cells they use. The cells in these batteries disconnect themselves over time which causes the remaining cells to overheat. If a temp sensor is on a dead cell, these packs can melt if used as advertised. I have 18 of these batteries that are at least 6 years old and there's a 100% failure rate in capacity. This renders some of the safety protection of the BMS completely useless. The owners had no idea. If you use the advertised current, the battery can melt. And this also means all of these batteries qualify for a warranty. Every single one.

I don't know stock stuff, but I can share more information about these batteries issues. I tested them for months and found a lot more issues.

Ask me anything! What do you want to know?

I've been getting quotes for the lithium eAPU's and I cannot believe what I'm seeing.

Most of the name brand ones are $8,000-$26,000! And some of those do not even include an air conditioner.

But I can get the same exact system, including the lithium batteries and high output heat pump, for $2,000 if I install it myself. There's multiple companies selling kits to do this.

Why are these so damn expensive? These APUs are just a $1,000 battery and a $1,000 heat pump. And I kid you not they are selling them for $26,000. The company that gave me that quote said I can't share it but it is a common brand we all know and they have shops all across America.

Are you guys just throwing cheap batteries into a box and adding your own heat pump? Or do you pay these companies these crazy prices?