u/othelloblack

Question about the frontage of Detmer's brigade at the height of the attack of the Middle Guard.

Question about the frontage of Detmer's brigade at the height of the attack of the Middle Guard.

Its 450 yards from the cross roads behind the sand pit to the three way intersection thats now just north of the current Lion Mound. Halkett's location is usually centered on that three way intersection. The map from the Waterloo Assoc. that one labeled Second Attack shows a gap of 300 yards from left flank of Halkett's 5th brigade to the right flank of Ompteda's brigade. And shows both Kruse and Detmer inside there represented as 100m wide blocks. 

https://www.waterlooassociation.org.uk/2018/05/31/attack-of-the-imperial-guard/

then later in the Third Attack map they have Detmers in 6 columns, taking up some 250 yards. These are battalion columns and if following standard practice, some 40+ men wide and about 12 men deep. So perhaps a 50 yard frontage realistically and you need gaps between the columns too; for horse artillery, heavy cavalry, skirmishers, scouts, guys running under cannons, etc.  That just doesnt seem like enough space to hold all that.

For example the 5 battalions of Middle guard that are attacking this area are about the same size as Detmer's 3100 man brigade and they are possibly 5 columns, but more like 3 in mixte order formation and one or two others in column. And these take up almost that entire 450 yard corridor as shown in the maps.

almost none of the officers in Waterloo Letters that are part of Siborne's legacy mentioned Detmer's role at the climax of the charge although several of them in Halkett's 5th brigade  do recall the Brunswickers being in rear and to the left of Colin Halkett's brigade; identifying them by white insignia (crossbones) on their Shakos.

It seems accepted that Kruse's brigade was driven back leaving Brunswick's indep division between Ompteda on their left and Halkett on their rights. Its possible both these Halkett's 5th and Brunswick were driven back somewhat

Even though the Waterloo Letters are maligned, at least one British officer in the Waterloo Letters did see them: 
Lt COl Taylor of the 10th Hussars in Vivian's brigade must have seen both the Brunswickers driven back and the advance of Detmers:  on p172 of the Waterloo Letters:

" ...they rather fell back upon us and one battalion of Brunswick Oels in close columns retiring being in want of ammunition, I believe, but in good order was now passing through us between my squadron and Major HOwards. Just then two or three battalions to the left of it advanced in double quick their drums rolling and drove back the enemy.." 

Interesting that he mentions the double quick pace because Chasse himself recalls ordering  the Storm Cadence and others mention that pace as well; presumably a double quick step. 

Two or three battalions in column makes a lot more sense given the spacing involved

waterloo letters can be seen here:

https://archive.org/details/waterlooletterss00sibo/page/150/mode/2up

At least one officer from Halkett's brigade did see the Dutch attack. Im not sure the original source this quote from a prior thread on reddit:

British eyewitness (captain Edward Macready, 2/30th regiment of Foot), wrote: "The Dutch troops advanced in a state of high excitement, cheering wildly and lifting their shakos on their bayonets." 

Macready fought in the left most (comprising 30th and 79th regiments) of the two giant squares that Halket's brigade had been forming earlier. Halkett's battalions are at the time of the Guard attack apparently going into a line formation from square but like a lot of things no one is real sure when and if. One of the main issues is was Halkett driven back, which Halkett says no except this one time he had to pull back the 69th regimenet IIRC, but then Halkett was wounded around 630 pm and probably did not witness the firefight/highwater mark of the Guard.

So I dont doubt Detmers was there facing the MIddle Guard that lead off the attack. but I question the 6 column wide formation doesnt seem to fit. It is reported that CHasse had the brigade march to their place in front with 3 columns across. Then later when he realized the danger he went back for the other 3 brigades also in column. These accounts then claim he went in 6 brigade columns across. I think it more likely that there were two waves of 3 columns each. And these columns would have maneuvered around clumps of stragglers as they move forward possibly through remants of Halkett's brigade and the Brunswick division.

u/othelloblack — 1 day ago

why didnt General Bertrand command troops in the Waterloo campaign?

Tried go google everything about Henri Bertrand but no explanation. One source even says he "commanded" at waterloo but thats not true.

ALso as Bertrand was by Napoleon's side almost constantly during this time why was he not considered as Chief of Staff? Thanks I do not know much about this

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u/othelloblack — 6 days ago

I cant seem to find if this unit existed surely it must. Google seems to confuse the unit with either the 1st Han under Kielmansegge or the 4th under Best seemingly referring to both. Any help with that?

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u/othelloblack — 17 days ago
▲ 0 r/cancer

This is on behalf of my friend (Im her caregiver) who has been in a clinical trial for almost a year now. THe trial is going fairly well there has been some shrinkage of the GIST tumor but more would be better. Still here we are. THe issue is that recently one of the two clinical coordinators (call them A and B) has been sitting in with the Dr who leads the study when the Dr discusses my friends treatment and any other medical issues that are relevant. Im not sure how long exactly probably the last 5 or 6 months. (she goes to the clinic once a month to monitor progress)

SO far my friend tolerates A sitting in on these. A is female and has been somewhat helpful to my friend with several issues that have come up along the way. A is not really a medical person she has a degree is pharmacology but is not a nurse or dr. Recently they told my friend coordinator B will be sitting in on the next meeting. My friend does not like B who is male and also is not a nurse or doctor. My friend really does not want him there at the meeting. Is there any good way to approach this issue? One would think there would be an issue of medical privacy that she should raise.

Thanks for all your help.

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u/othelloblack — 21 days ago