r/SovereignCentral

(It is a long one so hold your horses)

So for some reason game gate keeps so hard when it comes to dragon lore my guess is there gonna be a big reveal.However when it comes to sovegrins we know so little Apep and Xiuhcoatl is confimend ones while Azdaha has a chance to be a geo sovegrin or related to them since in Chinese he shares the same title as Xiuhcoatl however unlike the rest of the sovegrins names coming from their respective culture/myth xiuh=aztec and apep=egypt azdaha takes his name from Persian snake Azhdeha so for that reason I will also pretend like he isnt the geo sovegrin.And we dont know rest of the sovegrins(before you say Neuvillette I am talking about the OG hydro dragon we dont know his name)so when we look Apep and Xiuhcoatls name both of them are snake like serpent who opposses their respective god or tied to their in game element Apep is enemy of Ra the sun god and order while in game makes it clear order=Phanes while irl Xiuhcoatl was weapon of Huitzilopochtli who was also a giant fire serpent so lets look at our possible other sovegrins:(also i ordered them what i belive is mostly top while least at the bottom)

HYDRO:

Leviathan:

Leviathan is a multi headed sea serpent killed by God(and in gnostisism God=Demiurge=fake divine and Neuvillete was killed by Phanes)after his death

Jewish Eschatology: In the Talmud, it is said God created a male and female Leviathan but allowed only the female to survive so that their immense offspring would not destroy the earth. According to legend, the Leviathan will eventually be slain upon the arrival of the Messiah, and its skin will be used to create a canopy for the banquet of the righteous I think this part paralells both Egeria and Neuvillette being heart of the primordial sea after Hydro sovegrins death Phanes and Naberius took his heart to create Egeria the first hydro archon

In Islam:

Islam also made references to the Leviathan in its texts that it is said to be a Leviathan id a female creature while the Behemoth is a male creature. Leviathan is a male Dragon sovegrin as we see from Neuvillette but Hydro sovegrin is heart of the primordial sea all life created from primordial sea and it make PS work as womb of the planet so it covers both male and female parts in Islam

ELECTRO

Ryuji:

Now this one is interasting becuse name Ryuji also used as Watatsumi irl legends and in game watatsumi island used to worship Orobashi a serpent god who is connectted to celestia but after he read the before sun and moon he got punished while their pristess Kokomi's constellation called sleeping dragon not only he rulled an underwater civilication(paraleling enkonomiya being under the watatsumi island where we first met with out but inazuma is filled with vishaps and humans abondened by PO) as for personality he is respected for his generosity and bounty, but he is equally feared for his wrath and ability to unleash destructive storms. Idk chinese and Japanese so pls enlighten me but Ryuji's name also translates as Drahon king in Japanese mhyts so is it the same as apep and xiuh?

GEO

Huanglong

In chinese belives he is the avatar/reincarnation dragon Huanglong is considered the animal form or spirit of Huangdi (the Yellow Emperor), the legendary founder of Chinese civilization. It is said the emperor manifested as a golden dragon to ascend to heaven at the end of his rule. He represents imperial authority, benevolence, and cosmic harmony. Often depicted with golden-yellow scales, the creature represents the central direction among the four cardinal points and is associated with the color yellow, which was exclusively reserved for the emperor and imperial family in ancient China what really mak him as a strong candidate as geo sovegrin is imo he is not only yellow in game color of geo but irl he is also dragon of the earth and directions and he represents equilibrium

Tianlong

This one is in the second because even though I belive he is the inspo behind Zhongli and there are visual differences betwen however since Zhongli is also a dragon there are way to paralells betwen geo sov and zhongli too. So Zhongli and Tianlong is tasked with protecting the heavenly palaces and mansions of the gods, ensuring the celestial realm remains stable.These majestic dragons pull the chariots of deities and serve as cosmic steeds for heavenly beings They act as bridges between heaven and earth.

CRYO

Zmey/Zmeya/Zmaj:

Main dragon belived in Russian folklores means serpent but they sometimes shares a human like character with dragon like traits.Zmeya is female belive of the same dragon while Zmey is male one and they sometimes in fairytales belived to be demon which paralels them being against divinity/Celestia. The most important ability of this dragon is its shape shifting abilitiy and can turn into both human and dragon.What makes it interasring this is the dragon of snezhnaya a nation having an archon trying to rebel against celestia with her harbingers while ruins of Hyperborea is there and this one comtains a bit of 7.0/snezhnaya leak so skip this part if you like to

(From leaks we know cryo sov died in the first war against phanes and 4 shades after their death their bones experimentted on. Now bone thing is sus cause not only nibelung is the forger of the earths bones, creatted moon marrows and said voyager let his bones protect the land if the tide must come,so like i said after cryo sov died their bones experimented on from Neuvillette and Xiuhcoatl we know if a sovegrin loses their elemental purity they reborn as humans,Neuvillette lost his element purity because of the vishaps experiments so i ask you this if the bones and marrows this important and an sovegrins connection to element(like vishap or in this case bones) getting experimentted on losens it and makes cryo sovegrins reincarnation as human possible and Zmey/Zmeya's story about sharing both human and dragon like features

Lamya:

Lamya is a female fearsome dragon/serpent and she is destructive force of nature that terrorizes villages, controls the weather, and devours humans what interasting about is her and Zmey are mortal enemies while in Greek belives Lamia is a child devoring monster from Linnea we learn that child swapping among faes and humans something happens but what makes her to my list is her apperince as we can see vishaps paralles their respective sovegrins for ex: Neuvillette has pink/lavender eyes blue horn/outter skin and white hair/white inner skin/scales while in Lamya in myths most important depiction was her having golden scales/eyes and how does the cryo vishaps look like?: Golden eyes, inner white scales,light blue horns:

ANEMO

Fafnir:

Fafnir was originally born as a dwarf, the son of the dwarf king Hreidmar and the brother to Regin and Otr.After the trickster god Loki accidentally killed Fafnir's brother Otr, Hreidmar demanded a massive payment in gold from the gods as compensation. This gold came with a curse, including a magical ring named Andvaranaut

Consumed by greed, Fafnir murdered his own father, Hreidmar, to claim the cursed treasure for himself. He took the treasure to the wilderness, turning into a venom-spewing, wingless dragon (a serpent or Lindworm) to guard his ill-gotten hoard. Only later him to be getting killed by siegfried

Now I put the anemo last because Der Ringen Das Nibelungen is a Germic opera inspired by a real life German epic and Mondstad is Germany so even though I put names in anemo category i think there is names worth mentioning besides there is someone suspicous in hsr and hi3 paralels Nibelung while in Hi3 there are characters who directly named after Der Ringen Das Nibelungen and a skin called Nibelungen Traumlied which directly translates as Nibelung/Nibelungs Dream song/songs so lets dive into:

So the person I belive Nibelung paralel is:Kevin/Phainon now before you come at me "No it is Phanes shades are Kiana who are fragments of Po what are you talking about!" Well that is what I belived too however this post makes really good points so I think you might want to check out both of the parts and the second section will include this too and shout out author it is very well put and observed

https://www.reddit.com/r/SovereignCentral/s/7cc9l2X96B

So we talked about their most likely names in myths however i wanna mention other characters from myths and hi3 and hsr characters who is linked epic of Nibelung,dragons in other hoyo games or Norse myth where Nibelung draws a lot of inspo from so lets take a quick look:

Ymir:

The first creature to come into being in the Norse creation myth. As the first giant, he’s the ancestor of all of the other giants – and, since almost all of the gods are partially descended from giants, he’s their ancestor as well. Ymir was born when fire from Musphelheim and ice from Niflheim met in the abyss of Ginnungagap.Now Ymir's birth myth is important for two reason 1) Nod krai's old name was Nephilheim and it is name comes from Nephelim+Nifheim in Christianty if an angel and human had a child that child would Nephelim that child would be a giant perfect birth place for giants eh? Amd the second reason: bro is canon in manga(welcome to venti being sus episode 20479482929)

Long/Lóngwang

We know this name from Hsr as the Aeon of Permenance THEY represent path eternity and in their animation THEY showed birthing themsefs from an pearl who works like a egg in before sun and moon it is said Primordial one born from egg however in Nod krai trailer Nicole says "Primordial Being who once rulled the planet" which we know is Nibelung (so maybe possible title + origin story stolen from Nibe? Not Phanes's first time stealing something from him so wouldnt suprise me) anyway our topic is Long's egg looking like a pearl and this is important because: In chinese myths there is a celestial dragon called Long he represent yang(masc energy) and always chases a flaming pearl genshin said dragons(or sovegrins+nibelung) posses a genesis pearl and nibelung is called father of the genesis then where is his pearl?

Pearl thing is sus cause in battle pass cutscene we see a snake corrupting a pearl while in chinese belives pearl represent wisdom,enlightement and prosperity if the pearl in the cutscene was nibelungs pearl and snake representing him getting corrupted and possesing FK. Also irl long rules 4 major seas/kings(east,south,west,north)while in hsr we have direct paralels to this and danfeng seems to inspired by Dilong(one of the 4 kings)so nibelung could be really connectted to danfeng and Long could be ancestor of all dragons in Hoyoverse

Panlong

Panlong is a massive, serpentine creature that resembles a river dragon or crocodile.Panlong controls the rain and weather. It is believed to bring rainfall necessary for farming, bestowing good fortune and prosperity upon the land. Panlong is frequently used as a metaphor in Chinese culture. A coiled dragon represents a powerful, formidable force that is simply waiting for the right moment to strike or unleash its true potential. This one i belive is the inspo behind Osial since it posses power similar to Neu and a water serpent I though he was worth a mention

Jörmungandr

Or known as world serpent child of Loki in Norse myth it is such a big snake it can bite it is own tail whis becomes a catalyst of ragnarok(appoclypse) . In so many belives Oroboros represents infinity it's the snake biting its own tail in hsr oroboros represents infinity endlessly devouring everything no we talked about North mythologies importance in so far but one thing important about this snake is that not only it starts apocalypse but also things left has ring called Oroboros he was also the one holding the moon gate easily (something even though weakend colombina struggled to do) and among all the sinners (maybe exception of rhine)him and his brother are closest to Nibelung. Esp Ved since his prophecy is the biggest catalyst of Neu getting his authority back(he was the one propocsied to Focalor and the rest is Fonteine AQ)

Sigurd(siegfried)

In myths/epics:In Norse lore, "Sigurd" (or Siegfried in German tradition) is the celebrated dragon-slaying hero. He claimed the cursed dwarf-hoard and ring and we know genshin draws most of its inspo from Nibelungs ring opera one of the most important thing about him however is in legeds it is belived Odin himself helped Sigurd so he became king of the Denmark and there is characters who paralel odin such as: Phanes King Irmin and Hroptatyr

IN HI3:

Ah yes our Kaslana husband of Cecilia (we will be coming her in a moment) and father of Kiana our main protaganist and Hoyo's it girl.

Siegfired Kaslana: A former Schicksal Knight born into the powerful Kaslana family, possessing immense physical strength and the ability to channel the Shamash Divine Key

Cecilia Schariac: The pinnacle of the Schariac bloodline and the strongest S-Rank Valkyrie of her era. She possessed holy blood capable of neutralizing Honkai energy and wielded the Divine Key, Abyss Flower.

Their marriage was political at first but at time they fell in love with each otherDuring the Second Eruption in Siberia, Cecilia was forced into a desperate battle against Sirin (the Second Herrscher and most likely one of the inspo behind Asmoday). To stop the overwhelming Honkai corruption, she sacrificed her powers and life force to cleanse the area.When Schicksal’s overseer, Otto Apocalypse, launched nuclear missiles to eradicate both Sirin and Siegfried, Cecilia used the Abyss Flower to shield her husband, allowing Siegfried to survive but ultimately costing her her life

Kriemhild/cecilia Schariac

And we just talked about husband so why dont we continue with the wife?

Kriemhild:

Kriemhild is a central figure in Germanic heroic legend, most famously featured in the 13th-century epic poem Nibelungenlied. Originating from the Norse myth of Gudrun, her tale begins as a beautiful Burgundian princess and evolves into a dark tragedy of love, betrayal, and blinding revenge.In the continental German tradition (Nibelungenlied), Kriemhild starts as a gentle, passive princess.She marries the invincible dragon-slayer Siegfried. But things isnt sunshime and rainbows always: Hagen(siegfreids bff) tricks her to reveal his weak spot and this revelation ends up killing himKriemhild mourns Siegfried for 13 years while plotting her vengeance against her own family and Hagen. To secure the military might she needs, she marries Etzel (the legendary counterpart of Attila the Hun). After giving birth to a son, she invites her brothers and Hagen to a great festival at Etzel's court in Hungary.Once they arrive, Kriemhild initiates an all-out battle that utterly destroys the Burgundian kingdom and the Hunnish forces. In the climax of the epic, she successfully executes Hagen and her brother Gunther. However, her bloodlust is so extreme that Hildebrand, a visiting warrior appalled by her brutality, strikes her down on the spot

NORSE VERSION:

marrying Atli (the Hun) after the murder of her first husband, Sigurd (Siegfried).Rather than using her Hunnish husband's army to destroy her family, she actively murders her own sons with Atli and serves them to him as a meal, before finally burning Atli in his own hall to avenge her brothers.

In HI3:

Now in myths Cecilia means nothing however as I said earlier she is the wife of Siegfried and mother of Kiana however since i mentioned her story in Siegfried section i wanna mention somone different: Ana schariac or should I said Tsaritsa? Ana and Cecilia are relatives.While Cecilia achieved the pinnacle of S-Rank power and purity as a Valkyrie, Ana started as an A-Rank, but underwent a dramatic and dangerous transformation that elevated her into Herrscher of Ice. After becamoing god of ice howevee she tries to hide her coccon from world serpent. And who is the world serpents leader while in gi game non stop tells snakes and dragons are kin while there is a primordial power sleepimg there ;)

(And guess whos drip was introduced by Cecilia flowers and used to be friends with Tsaritsa?Yep.Venti.Again.)[at this point i would be suprised if he or istaroth isnt in the crime sceme]

Tiamat:

Tiamat is a primordial goddess in ancient Mesopotamian religion, representing the salt sea and the chaotic forces of original creation. As the "Mother of the Gods," she gave birth to the first generation of deities, but was famously slain by the storm god Marduk, who used her divided body to create the heavens and Earth. I think she is worth mention since in game god of salt died while trying to protect her people only to them try to kill her

(En is my second language and it is a long thread so pls ignore the typos also most likely a pv comming out this week so if this turns out about dragons i would be really happy but ig it will be about sinners or khanriahns still we have to see )

So, a lot of people have been pointing out the similarities between Teyvat from Genshin Impact and Amphoreus from Honkai: Star Rail. As Haoyu Cai (one of the producers of HoYoverse) confirmed, Genshin is a canon part of the Honkai Universe, which is why we see characters resembling those from the Honkai games in there. However, besides Asmodey there are no direct Honkai variants, but rather characters loosely inspired by them (Venti - Wendy, Raiden Ei - Raiden Mei, Alhaitham - Su, Mavuika - Himeko etc.) which leaves a lot of room to speculate who might be the inspiration behind a character we know little of unless we dive deeper into the lore. Hence I present to you this analysis that compiles all of the striking similarities I found between Phainon and the Dragon King Nibelung - as a big HoYoverse lore nerd with too much time on their hands. I worked really hard on it so I hope you enjoy the read, even if you end up disagreeing with it! :]

contains spoilers/leaks…. >! so we know that moon sisters took human forms to interact with humans and were not created in shape of humans, now assuming that moon sisters are similar lifeforms to dragons and kulkukan‘s ability to take human shape…!<

Surely, there is a possibility of our dear dragon kings that are still alive can also take human shape and hoyo can make them playable? what do you guys think?

We also know from xbanlaque‘s dialogue on neuvillete intro card ( was that it? i don’t remember but i think that‘s where it was, correct if i am wrong.) that all sovereigns are gonna eventually return.

Next patch, we get dialogue from the Moon Sisters explaining why they took on human forms. It seems they did so in order to visit humans "on the surface." There also seems to be an attempt to address why the Moon Sisters allowed the Heavenly Principles to overthrow the dragons and reshape Teyvat. [a poor attempt imo 💀]

• Canon: "Ah, Aria. It seems you've already chosen a "human" form for yourself as well."
• Aria: "That said, I didn't expect that you would proactively create such a form for those lovely little beings."
• Canon: "It is only natural, Aria. Those fragile lives trust me and call out to me, so I shall respond to their voices. We were born to preserve the world. If the beings known as "humans" are willing to settle it, listening to their pleas also fulfills the mission our King bestowed upon us...
• Aria: "Yes. After all, he did say that all life across the sea of stars are allies. They fight alongside us against the darkness. But I wasn't talking about that. I mean, I didn't expect you, the "Frost Moon," to have such a sentimental side. It's very cute."
• Sonnet: "Sisters, now that we've shaped bodies for ourselves, shouldn't the first thing we do be sneaking out to have some fun with the people on the surface? Otherwise, we'll have made them for nothing! Hurry, before anyone discovers us—"
• Aria: "Why, I remember that when they first started building their civilization on the surface, you even said, "That outsider is bad news, and naturally, its creations are the same." You wouldn't even spare them a glance."
• Sonnet: "I still think you two shouldn't have let that outsider in, but the people on the surface..."

We also get some Istaroth sus crumbs

• Canon: "That Descender's servant said they had matters to discuss with me about this world's gravitational potential and metric tensor {laws of time}. [Istaroth] perhaps it's just my imagination, but I have a certain... feeling about how she views that Descender... I won't jump to conclusions, Aria. But I'll keep an eye out."

One of the locations on the moon is the Golden Hall; I came across this text and think maybe it will be in this area somewhere.

• I am Euthyphro, hailing from Arcadia, the eternal holy city.
• O Mother of the silver shuttle, the ever-blessed goddess Prusmene, by thy grace, I take up this meager quill to chronicle the night's final splendor.
• I beseech thee: grant me once more the hallowed gift of inspiration; preserve thy devout believer, lest my soul descend beneath the silver tree, to be sullied by the dust.
• O wise and radiant queen, bringer of the light! I beseech thee: deliver thus thy devout believer; That my mortal frame may find eternal rest within thy holy embrace.
• O wondrous Prusmene — ancient mother of the night and daughter who brings the light, mistress of the Golden Hall! Countless times hast thou guided my vessel, permitting me to usher unsullied souls unto the lunar palace above the clouds.
• Thou grantest mortals slumber within thy pale embrace; thou grantest them dreams that are theirs, and theirs alone. Yet this is to be the final night — the final rest. For there sits the eternal throne in the heavens, the Primordial One, O world-shaking lord!
• It forgeth the bones of the earth. It biddeth all dreams return to the earth, and all dreamless things to return to the earth. It seeketh to shroud the dreams of man with its own dream, that we, the mortals of this fleeting world, shall abide an age without beginning or end, passing through a life of tranquil, dreamless rest.
• O wise and radiant queen, bringer of the light, deliver me from the hands of my dread master! For thee, I have ushered the unsullied souls. For thee, I have steered the great and silver-shimmering vessel.
• I beseech thee: deliver thus thy devout believer, that my mortal frame may find eternal rest within thy holy embrace!

Hey, can anyone tell me how is nibelung's form and appearance is described in the game texts? I would like to make some fan arts of him so any information is appreciated!!