r/churchofnaoya

What I think Projection Sorcery Technique Reversal would be. Thoughts?
▲ 18 r/churchofnaoya+2 crossposts

What I think Projection Sorcery Technique Reversal would be. Thoughts?

I put a lot of effort into this essay so please I would love to hear your theories and opinions I don't want this to be tossed in the gutter. I will be responding and making future/follow up posts.

I've always thought about this because Projection Sorcery (PS) is cool asf. I think with a better Cursed Energy (CE) pool and physical stats base PS might be able to reach special grade level too, but a technique reversal would definitely help. I will proceed to go about my current understanding of PS and the possible ways its Cursed Technique Reversal (CTR) could work.

Description of Cursed Technique Reversal (skip if you want):

From what we know CTR, which is achieved by running positive energy into an innate technique, is often a "flipped" power compared to when a sorcerer runs negative (the default application) into their technique. We see this with Gojo's CTR, red, being the power of repulsion, as opposed to when he uses his innate technique with negative energy which results in the power of attraction, Blue. This is the same for Kaori's Anti Gravity System which follows the same logic, with the default application being anti gravity and the reversal application being gravity.

Description of Projection Sorcery (skip if you want):

PS allows a user to imagine a set of movements in 24 "frames" that will take place over a second and the user follows these movements after plotting out the frame. Deviating from this path will cause the user to suffer a 1 sec freeze frame penalty in place (or if their path excessively denies the laws of physics). If a PS user touches a person or inanimate object with their palm the technique is applied to them they will have to follow this same system. This is often implausible for most leading to them being frozen in frame for a second themself (especially if they have no idea how the technique works). For inanimate objects they are automatically suspended in frame probably because they lack the ability to think.

P.S. I will not go over how PS provides speed or specifics on how PS operates it works because I don't wish to cause off topic discussion and will make a separate in depth post on PS in another post for I wish to only discuss CTR. The only thing you need to know for this post is consecutive use of PS allows acceleration to "stack up" allowing the user to go even faster the longer they use it.

My Theory:

PS is a modern technique that is based around the concept of animation and frames. A more complicated technique like this leaves a lot of ambiguity to be had around a "reversal" concept of this. To make things simple, when watching an animation, normally the frames are moving forward in a predetermined order set by the animator (sounds a lot like PS huh). The most basic reversal of this that I can see is to watch said animation in reverse order, or in other words the user can forcefully follow the movements they've already taken in their predetermined path in reverse. Essentially one of the main drawbacks of PS in combat is the committal path the user is forced to take. With this concept in mind using RCT would allow the user to follow their actions in reverse meaning they could willingly break committing to a path if it's dangerous mid way at the cost of using more CE (since RCT takes x^(2) more CE to perform).

Now this sounds a little underwhelming so let elaborate on how significant this is.

First of all as we all know our goat Naoya lost twice because he could not deviate from his set path (one of those losses leading to his death). This CTR automatically allows the user to bypass this fatal flaw of PS and would've without a doubt allowed Naoya to beat M*ki in their 1v1. Second this could be a feinting type ability akin to that of Todo's Boogie Woogie. Those who can react to a PS user because they are low on acceleration stacks or said person has really good precognition will obviously defend/counter against an attack, however the PS user could unnaturally reverse their movements backwards and try again but still carrying the same speed and force they had previously (since rewinding an animation will continue it right back again once you've stopped).

However I haven't even targeted the real meat and bones of this which is what happens when a PS user applies this CTR on another object or person via their palm? From what makes sense to me if PS user has unlocked the ability to use CTR, if they touch another person or object with their palm and force their technique upon them, they have two options:

  1. They can apply the default application of PS which most of the time results in the 1 sec freeze frame of the opponent or object

2. They can apply the reversal application, reversing any amount of actions (and potentially changes of state as a result) the object/person has undergone within the last sec.

I would like to highlight how OP this would be.

This could reverse potentially fatal wounds of allies or the user themself. Likewise could even revive people who have definitively died in the past second if the user if fast enough. The changes of state is certainly an op ability, but if we limit the ability to only movements or motion that happened to the person/object the CTR is being applied to, then the combat utility is especially useful for endless combos and stun locking.

Possible Caveats:

  1. The user cannot control amount of frames reversed: The user may not be able to control amount of frames reversed meaning they would have to go back to the start of their actions instead of doing feints and counters but this helps with the Techniques safety at least. Likewise if they can't control this then when the CTR is applied to an object/person via the palm then they will move to the start of their actions in the entire last second.
  2. If the user CAN control amount of frames would they be forced to still follow their predetermined path?:

- 2a) Yes: Feints are still possible but amount of counters are limited during combat and you would sometimes be better off reversing all actions within the path to the start.

- 2b) No: This itself is ideal, allowing for extreme flexible combat potential but sort of takes away the skill floor of PS after learning CTR

- 2c) Limited to a window of 24 frames (Fav and most likely IMO): The user is forced to "use up" 24 frames in their predetermined path and reversing frames counts as "uses" also. For example lets say I travel 16 frames of my predetermined path but decide I want to go back 4 frames. I have 20 frames worth of "uses" so far and must use my last 4 frames uses I have leftover by reversing even more or following the frames that occur after the point I reversed to so I can fulfill the 24 frame rule. The best way this could be used is I travel 21 frames but I realize I will be countered in the next 3 frames so instead I reverse 3 frames, dodging the counter and fulfilling all 24 frame "uses". This frees me to create a new path off the bat to counter. Of course failing to meet the 24 frame rule or purposely deviating from the path results in 1 sec self freeze frame. This is my favorite theory because it still keeps the sort of battle IQ and skill the original PS had instead of a free "get out of jail card".

  1. The possibility that the "reversing of changes of state" is not accepted: This can be exchanged interchangeably among the previous caveats. Honestly this doesn't actually matter as much to me (surprisingly) because 2c is plenty enough for me to be satisfied but this is cool and would definitely guarantee special grade status.

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Whadya guys think. I've always wanted to write my own fanfic lowk cause I always got these ideas floating about in my head but I wasn't sure if I should so expressing my creativity turned into this ig.

also sorry for any bad grammar or run on sentences.

u/Acrobatic_Silver6692 — 9 hours ago

Alright, I've pushed agenda enough today. I'll be literate for a moment.

Naoya didn't lose to M*ki because of arrogance at all and pretty much did everything he possibly could've done to win.

Naoya absolutely did acknowledge M*ki, her strength, her durability and even her pain tolerance. Which is pretty insane for him given his misogynistic statements. Yeah, he refused to believe that M*ki was on the level of Toji but he didn't believe for a second that M*ki just straight up couldn't beat him, quite the opposite.

Naoya literally looks back at his mistake against Choso and says "I won't stop! I won't make the same mistake as before!"

I'm certain this means 2 things.

  1. He "won't stop" as in he won't stop stacking. He fought Choso completely unstacked and stopped to have a conversation with Choso, letting him yap about brotherly love, which led to him losing

  2. He won't make the same mistake of underestimating his opponent and will simply go all out immediately. Against Choso, he was smiling, toying with him, posing on him and just over all having fun even though his main goal was to injure him severely and possibly kill him so he can kill Megumi.

Against M*ki, he does neither of those things. He immediately starts fighting her and keeps stacking nonstop while attacking her from all sides. I don't even think he expects these punches to kill or even severely harm her because in the end he proclaims that he'll punch through her at top speed in order to win.

But he made a very good play against M*ki by trapping her in pretty much the worlds longest air combo to avoid giving her even a moment to counterattack.

Contrary to popular belief, I don't think M*ki tricked Naoya at all in the final exchange of the fight. She crouched down in the Shiranui-gata stance and intended to have Naoya crash into her, more than likely betting on his arrogance to try and beat her with a head on collision.

Naoya sees through this trick, knowing that if M*ki catches him, he would more than likely lose, even if it broke her ribs. He is confident that despite being very stacked and nearing top speed, crashing into her wouldn't blow her off her feet. He believes that M*ki could absolutely stop him in his tracks with her body alone. And he believes she has the pain tolerance to defeat hin in that scenario despite the pain of having her ribs shattered.

He is thinking this highly of a woman despite being a huge misogynist for the entire arc, proving that he is not at all having his judgement clouded by his misogynistic beliefs or even his belief that M*ki isn't on the level of Toji. The fact that he's humble enough to believe he can't overpower her directly at near top speed alone proves that.

So instead of crashing into her, he runs past her while slapping her arm to freeze her, and I don't know about you, but to me, M*ki looks visibly shocked by his choice.

Then the narrator reminds us that unless she follows the 24 fps rule, she'll be frozen while Naoya is moving at top speed.

I genuinely do not believe the anime gave this scene proper justice because in the manga, they're practically screaming at you that M*ki IS in danger here if she doesn't clutch up.

M*ki turning around and punching Naoya while following the 24 fps rule was absolutely a last ditch effort to avoid getting pulverized.

u/Sad-Effective-9676 — 17 hours ago

naoya after he goes for the 3/10 grandma to practice but she lowk gives dubious dentures

u/EL_piddler — 19 hours ago

Am I wrong for not liking the rematch of m*ki and noaya

It's not bad its good. I'll start it with that, I'll probably enjoy it alot when animated but like it's just not

entertaining or you know meaningful as I see it.

It starts off really good. A random curse that's got it about them goes to fight maki and noritoshi and you don't know who it is at first and you then find out it's noaya back for revenge as a curse who looks disgusting.

Then they fight him and he evolves through the fight and obviously giving BTA and creative use of his evolution with his CT and his body etc etc

What i hate is the ending of this. Its stupid.

Halfway through it just get shit. Plot device 1 and 2 appear allowing everyone's fav bum to become fully realised with 0 REPROCUSSIONS. The whole danger and thrill of the fight is killed as they just can hang and all we know is they "cut" and "wrestle". Noritoshi btw was HANGING ON BY A THREAD.

Then maki becomes fully realised and noaya obviously gets jumped and almost finished by m*ki and gang when he pops domain.

COOL RIGHT?

It is, this could be a real game changer.

It wasn't. It was pointless and added 0 real threat and human resources, the MAIN target is immune to domains and can enter recieve a toss from plot device 2 and kill him with 0 reprocussions due to having no curse energy.

MEANING AND MY MAIN PROBLEM ON WHY I DONT LIKE THIS FIGHT. There's no casualties or loss like at all. The only loss is the sword guys arm and we met him literally a chapter ago. M*ki just gets her handheld through every fight with 0 LOSS.

We can analyse the fight with how m*ki underestimates a vengeful curse spirit noaya who COULD OF AND ALMOST KILLED HER THAT JUST EVOLVED and thought she could take what he has to offer at top speed. Doesn't mean anything because she walks the injuries off in 3 minutes to sumo.

This fight that seemed to be a ruthless scrap for survival and in a manga that's supposed to be "unforgiving" turns into m*ki training arc with a happy go lucky ending as 0 DEATH OR LOSS OF ANYTHING MEANINGFUL WITH PLOT DEVICES BEING GENUINELY BURNT INTO YOUR RETINAS.

TLDR: I don't like the ending of the fight as its bullshit riddled with plot devices and just pointless writing leading to 0 loss or death that makes it impactful.

The starting half before the plot devices was good.

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u/Extreme-Debt9734 — 16 hours ago

Pls someone tell my friend that m#ki had plot 100%😭😭😭

Pls tell him or else im gonna k#ll him for misbehaving our lord!!!

u/MrMeow_0 — 24 hours ago
▲ 34 r/churchofnaoya+1 crossposts

Reminder that M*ki hunted down and killed multiple people who didn't even attack her. (All over something that ONE PERSON did btw aka Ogi the bum)

u/Beyond_Heaven9 — 1 day ago

Nayoa was right

Nayoa would have won m### of she didn't have gege help and all the plot armor went to her

u/Greecexampos — 24 hours ago

Naoya x Momo is better than Naoya x Remi ngl

Naoya x Momo works for all the same reasons Naoya x Remi was except Momo is far less loud and annoying, plus unlike Remi, she submits because she thinks it's the only way to really get ahead whereas Remi does it purely for her own benefit and protection.

u/Beyond_Heaven9 — 3 days ago

Naoya would have COOKED maki if she didn't have plot armor

Bro seriously I like maki yes but bro naoya was going sub sonic didt fail once sending thousands of punches and your telling me maki killed him with one punch like bro the most obvious plot armor ever

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u/Jumpy_Comfortable612 — 3 days ago
▲ 24 r/churchofnaoya+1 crossposts

Lugusoya Zenin, Head of bloodbath

Might do other naoya version of lugus lmao

u/ROMGSKN — 3 days ago
▲ 187 r/churchofnaoya+1 crossposts

Ngl Naoya had Yuji looking stupid right here 😂

"Naoya has zero wins" bullshit. He embarrassed Yuji and Choso before Yuta pulled up.

u/Beyond_Heaven9 — 4 days ago

Can Noaya black flash?

I was thinking of ways to distract myself and I was thinking of ways Gege if noaya got more screen time aka joined earlier in the story OR he took his time with the story more, what could noaya realistically achieve if he survived as a human and continued building on his technique.

So I thought of obvious ones like more detailed frame trapping like what we see in his domain but obviously not as detailed or specific.

Shit even him making bindings vows to make using the technique less bitchy and cruel aka allowing him to bend laws of physics more or to have no reprocussions from diverting to his original path

THEN I thought what if noaya was shown to be able to black flash then I realised, he can't actually black flash.

Well he can it would just take EXTREME probably physically impossible luck or for him to somehow learn how to control his CE extremely well which won't happen.

Obviously CE needs to have that time lag of a millionth of a second or smth but noayas 24fps movement isn't at a millionth of a second so its physically impossible however don't know since he stacks speed. He could probably do it whilst he's not stacked but would he still be too fast? Yes if this was possible it would still take the fact he would need to do bursts of ce with every punch. But like run the lottery and win big.

Even if he did hit would it just increase his top speed by 1.2x?

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u/Extreme-Debt9734 — 3 days ago