u/Capital_Court_9413

Oh look, it’s the Bulls, again, shock. 🙄

That’s a pretty brutal group with Montpellier and Bath

Am I the only one who wishes they would go back to when they announced squads by position?

The new format with the two alphabetical lists is awful, makes it far less clear to read.

I know it’s a minor gripe to have, but I just don’t get why they changed it.

Just had a chance to watch the pre game pieces and saw the interview with Furbs; heartbreaking. I reckon I’m more gutted about this than when Courts left; he was at the latter end of his career, and the setup of that side (the crop of academy boys being so established, the core of the side) was just changing.

I know we have to balance the books, and I understand the thinking from the club at the time (recurrent injury issues, Hendy/Todaro in good form, Pater coming through), and they did offer him a years extension, but that was a tough watch. He brings so much more to the club than just his quality on the field, he bleeds black, green and gold, family season tickets, kid on the terrace, the Saints wardrobe in the bedroom (brilliant!).

I think it stings so much more than others because he genuinely doesn’t want to leave, he still has so much to offer (going into his prime years as a player), has more association to the club than most, and is the heartbeat of that side (one of the older players of that crop, along with Hutch, who is the perfect middle between a really young playing group and young coaches). We have the space in the cap it seems, with a lot of leavers and only a few lower profile additions.

There is talk of this side becoming a dynasty (early days), but you have to be careful not to look too far ahead, and risk missing out on the here and now, chasing the next title rather than the current one.

Would have been great to pull a Waisake Naholo and keep him, but wish him all the best, and grateful for everything he’s done.

O captain, my captain.

Anyone else pissed off that all the kick off times are the same in the Premiership/Top 14?

I understand with the football premier league as it adds jeopardy to the final day, but that’s primarily because there’s no play-offs, so there’s often still ‘all to play for’ going into the final day.

I get that there is still jeopardy in many of the games with regards to who gets a home semi/makes the semi’s, who makes Europe, but, but there’s still two rounds of the season. I would personally much rather be able to watch all of the games (without having to do so on their daft split screen option), for context, the URC didn’t put all final round games at the same time, and they have play-offs.

Surely it’s less financially beneficial for the game too, as people are forced to choose just the one game?

On paper, any team would be desperate to have him, he has an exceptional record in both international and domestic rugby, and has transformed/brought an identity and solidity to every team he’s been involved with, though it’s been conspicuously quiet, (guessing that’s until there’s an official announcement).

Ultimately it comes down to where he wants to go, and what kind of position he wants (head, defence, domestic, international), but the right offer could sway that. Listening to the BBC pod Monye said Edwards had stated he wanted security, and to an extent, autonomy, over his role.

The RFU will never take him; he is his own person, and wants to control his area - they will stick with the dross they have now as they are all ‘yes-men’ & friends, though he may want to wait and see what happens after the WC. I think Sale are dark horses; Sanderson is an excellent coach, but will they stick or twist after this season; Edwards would be a similar type of coach (strong defensive base, build into attack), they may want to switch.

I think he would be perfect for Saints; a defence coach is the final piece of our puzzle - so many of our games this season we have been exceptional in attack, but conceded far too many in defence.

- Style of play; we operate as a cohesive unit in attack, but can’t seem to do so in defence, if we had someone committed in defence coaching, coupled with our speed of transition, it would improve our defence no end, and possibly even our attack - France at their best were brutish in defence, and flowing in attack within one play. The French club sides are the pinnacle at the moment, and SE would have intimate knowledge to allow us to compete.

- Security; if Edwards wants security, where better? We have a crop of young talent that will hopefully be together for a long period, hopefully under the same coaching team - we could offer him a long term contract. I’m not sure how coaches contracts fit into salary restrictions etc (happy to be advised), but assuming they don’t, and our new financial incomings, we could pay him what he wants.

- Would he fit with the coaching staff? Hearing from players, Dowson & Vesty are a lot more honest and fiery than their media personas show (a good thing), so Edwards wouldn’t upset the applecart there; he could have autonomy over defence, but an open relationship with the coaching team would prevent that from hindering our attack (he has coached the attach at Wasps before).

We are a team on the up, and would afford him the opportunity to win trophies. Look at our play pre-Radford (scored the most tries, conceded nearly the most points), but he’s dropped off since his head got turned by the SRU. In my opinion, we can’t afford to miss this opportunity.

Edit; everyone is commenting based on money - no one knows what he’s on other than him and his employers.

- He is being let go, not leaving of his own accord (allegedly),
- there are apparently personal issues involved (he may not want to jump into a high pressure role and may value more than just the money,
- many other international coaches (including head coaches) have gone from international to domestic; Borthwick, Lancaster, Gatland, Nienabar (coming off the back of a winning WC)

There are a lot of direct assumptions being made about his financial situation/demands, and what the club can afford with how they’re structured

Malik Faissal was only officially announced a few weeks ago, and the week before that there was tell of a new back three signing coming in, but Faissal had been known about for months, around the same time Zigiriadis was announced. I’m guessing at that time they already knew Furbs was likely off.

We have great options, but none are the full package at the moment;

- Hendy; needs work under the high ball
- Pater; natural Furbs successor but needs game time for a season, maybe two
- Todaro; preferred position with centre but coming back from injury
- Faissal; got the size but needs to learn the team/system

With other options;

- Freeman; all the skills but world class winger
- Hutchinson; better as a second distributor from 12

We clearly need someone experienced, good quality, versatile, and happy enough to give space for the others to come through and develop. Someone mentioned Lane yesterday, which would give Premiership experience, but may be a touch slow for our system.

I liked the idea of Juan Cruz Mallia (28, Toulouse); his contract is supposed to be up end of the season, can play anywhere from 11-15, and is used to being behind one, if not two, player(s) in each position at ST, so would not be on a huge amount comparatively. He has international experience, so would give the others breathing space a few weeks here and there (like Furbs), and given the announcement of ST being under investigation for salary breach, and recently signing Menoncello, I think we could/should push for him.

Thoughts? And who else is out there that would actually be achievable in terms of availability/fits team?

Pretty simple question, for those are a full time supporters of a club side, would you rather see your club side have success, or your national team? And why?

Your answer does not make you any less patriotic, nor does it mean you love your club any less, but it’s an interesting question, and one that is huge in football.

For me, I’m a Northampton Saints fan, and have been there through the thick, and the very thin, and also an England supporter, but I would take a Northampton title over an England title any day. I will always support England, have found myself really disillusioned with the team/setup under Borthwick/Sweeney.

Win or lose, Saints have an identity, an ethos, and have a fantastic, solid, setup, which looks to build up young players, values the academy and real rugby values, and everyone who comes in buys into that. England couldn’t be more different; Sweeney’s only concern his the lining of his own pockets, he appoints an out of his depth Borthwick as his personal ‘yes-man,’ and that has resulted in a completely disjointed England set up from top to bottom, clueless on the pitch and toxic off it, that makes it incredibly difficult to watch both emotionally and financially.

I’d love to find that love for England rugby again, but it still wouldn’t mean more to me than Saints silverware.

Across the world, what’re everyone else’s views?

Just read an article in The Rugby Paper where Borthwick is quoted as saying “I see him generally at 13.” This follows on from dinosaurs of the game in Woodward and Guscott continually crowing for the move.

I can understand the idea of Freeman playing at 13, he certainly has not only the skillset to play there (speed, physicality, intuition, defence, kicking game, distribution), and has acquitted himself well enough there in the past.

My issue is, he’s a good, (could be very good), outside centre, but he is an absolutely world class winger. He showcased the very best of his game against Bristol (accepting they had the upper hand) with all the aforementioned attributes dialled up to the max; he set up a number of tries in incredible fashion.

As brilliant and well deserved as it is for the players, it’s painful these days seeing our boys called up for England duty, because you know they’re going to be stripped of any creativity, instinct, and enjoyment of the game, and will come back either injured, or severely out of form, but certainly with their confidence shot, and will have to rid themselves of the mundane bad habits picked up on international duty - Mitchell is a prime example. Dowson/Vesty see him week in, week out, and they pick him on the wing, week in, week out. Whenever he’s interviewed about it, you can see his heart isn’t really in the switch.

Freeman has had a Six Nations campaign scoring in every round, he was a full series starting Lion, has already broken the Saints try scoring record, and I have no doubt he could break the England one, but taking one of England’s few truly world class players and playing him out of position, in a team environment/set up/playing style that is the opposite of what he is used to, is a travesty.

What’re Saints fans thoughts on it?

Leinster fans, if Leinster aren’t able to come back from this (no shames as this is champagne rugby), what’s the verdict on Cullen?

He’s had a strong win percentage for Leinster, 75% +, but that has only yielded one URC title in four seasons, and one Champions cup in ten seasons (I think that’s right). I’m aware they’ve made four more finals, and that Saracens and Toulouse were in their pomp at the time, but La Rochelle came out of nowhere, and conversely, Leinster were in their prime, and had a team that had been together around ten years, majority played for club and country together, and were heavily rested/well managed domestically (URC) compared to the likes of Bordeaux/Toulouse/ Saracens at the time, who often play/played their best players both domestically and in Europe.

He’s also been incredibly spiky in the media recently (echoes of Eddie Jones/Jose Mourinho), snapping at perfectly valid questions regarding team success, without actually providing any response.

Given all the resources available to him, the support from the club in terms of high quality signings both on (Barrett, Snyman, Ioane) and off (Nienenbar) the field, is his time up now and is it time for a change?

Interested to hear what Leinster fans think, and who would take over?

I watch pretty much any rugby going, and am fortunate enough to be able to watch across all platforms (I know not everyone can).

There are some first class pundits/commentators out there (Warburton being a particular highlight), some who polarise opinions but are still knowledgable on the game (Healy), some strong newcomers (Ashton, Care), some real dullards (Robshaw), and some desperate for the limelight (Monye).

But there is no worse collective than that of Premier Sport, particularly for European games.

There’s a few great pundits on there who balance good interaction with solid knowledge (Barclay/Zebo), but unfortunately they are overshadowed by the dross around them, particularly Ryan Wilson (loud, boorish, and downright moronic, desperate to be ‘mates with the boys’ at every opportunity), Andy Goode (bigoted, bloated, and seriously out of touch), and Lawrence Dallaglio (irrelevant, interrupting, rude, preening, and desperate for attention/cash).

I don’t know whether this polarises opinion, apologies to those who like them, but it’s just painful to listen to - PS offer the opportunity to choose the game you watch, shame they don’t do the same for the comms.