u/Kind_Security_9931

HAWKS VS PIES REVIEW & PLAYER RATINGS

I’d like to think I’m a pretty optimistic person when it comes to Hawthorn, sometimes probably overly optimistic. But this was just too much for me. It wasn’t a lack of skill or talent tonight, it was a pure lack of effort and willingness to win the ball. There are too many players out of form and too many passengers at the moment. It feels like it’s always the same names showing up and trying to drag us over the line while the rest just watch.

There are so many different ways next week could go and so many different places we could end up on the ladder. But one scenario I can genuinely see happening is us ending up against Freo at Optus in the first week of finals, which is probably the last place anyone in this country wants to be unless you’re a Fremantle player or fan.

I also don’t really blame Moore at all. Yeah, he probably should have got that well over the line, or at least close enough for it to just be rushed through, but we did not deserve to draw tonight, let alone win. If anything, the draw at least keeps some hope alive of finishing 3rd, although at this point I doubt it.

Just going to get straight into the backline, which I thought was absolutely terrible. I guess there are two ways you can look at it. We lost the inside 50 count 60-47, which is a pretty significant margin, yet both teams finished with the same amount of scoring shots. You could argue that means our defence actually held up reasonably well while constantly being under the pump, but watching the game, I think Collingwood were just pretty wasteful with their opportunities.

Sic, congratulations on 200 games, but unfortunately it was just another disappointing performance. I genuinely cannot remember the last time Sicily looked like Sicily. At one point he was arguably the best defender in the competition, and the version I’m watching now just looks so far off that level. Tom Barrass has genuinely been so below average recently that it’s not even funny. When was the last time he really imposed himself on a game and looked like the player we brought him to the club to be?

Battle was good again and is probably the one defender who hasn’t really put a foot wrong this year. I genuinely don’t have anything bad to say about him. He also did a decent job in the ruck when asked today and was swung forward for a bit as well, so he basically did everything we could have asked of him.

Josh Battle: 8.0/10 — 20 disposals @ 85%, 6 interceptions, 6 marks, 5 tackles, 5 rebound 50s.

James Sicily: 5.6/10 — 19 disposals, 8 interceptions, 5 marks, 5 score involvements, 3 rebound 50s. The thing is, the stats actually look pretty good. But I know there is a version of Sicily that is so many levels above what we’re currently seeing, which is what makes his form so frustrating.

Tom Barrass: 5.2/10 — 8 disposals, 4 marks, 4 tackles, 4 interceptions, 4 rebound 50s.

Hardwick was okay, probably just a bit of a quieter game from him. Bailey MacDonald was pretty good for me and proved again why he needs to stay in this side. His willingness to take the game on was really impressive, especially in a game where so many of our players looked hesitant with the ball.

Amon was decent. He had a few crucial moments, but overall he also looks so far off the old threatening player he use to be . I just don’t think he’s adding enough to the side right now, and at some point you have to wonder whether we’d be better off giving someone younger an opportunity who can provide a bit more run. Then again, I don’t think tonight was really a selection issue at all. For me, it simply came down to effort.

Weddle, I actually cannot defend him anymore. Defensively, I thought he was pretty good, but Jesus Christ, with the ball I genuinely don’t know if he did anything positive. Jars was class as per usual and, like I said earlier, it just feels like it’s always the same names lifting us when things aren’t going our way.

Jarman Impey: 8.3/10 — 25 disposals, 7 marks, 5 interceptions, 8 score involvements, 5 rebound 50s.

Bailey MacDonald: 7.8/10 — 13 disposals, 4 interceptions, 2 score involvements, 2 marks, 304m gained.

Karl Amon : 7.0/10 - 18 disposals @ 94%, 5 interceptions, 5 score involvements, 5 rebound 50s, 415m gained.

Blake Hardwick: 6.5/10 — 13 disposals, 2 interceptions, 6 rebound 50s, 3 marks.

Josh Weddle: 4.5/10 — 11 disposals, 5 marks, 3 interceptions, 4 rebound 50s, 4 turnovers. Is it getting to the point where he needs to go back to Box Hill for a game or two, or am I jumping the gun?

The biggest issue for me is just how lacklustre our defence looks at times. There seems to be absolutely zero confidence when we’re moving the ball out of the backline or trying to win it back once we lose it. The amount of easy marks Collingwood were taking inside 50 because our players were constantly caught out of position was extremely infuriating.

I don’t know exactly what the solution is, but this has genuinely been such a poor last three weeks of footy from us, and I’m including the North game in that. The talent is clearly there, which almost makes it more frustrating. Right now it doesn’t feel like we’re being beaten because we aren’t good enough; we’re being beaten because too many players aren’t consistently bringing the effort, confidence and intensity that made us such a good side in the first place.

The midfield was kind of impressive and disappointing at the same time. Individually, I thought Josh Ward had a really good game and Newcombe worked his backside off all day, while the others kind of popped up in moments. Ward was massive in that fourth quarter and deserves a lot of the credit for us even managing to get a draw. Newcombe copped a tag all night but just kept working through it. I loved both of their games, and I think if the rest of the midfield had stood up around them, we’d probably be talking about their performances as elite.

Will Day was pretty disappointing again, and I think we’re well past the point where I can keep giving him too many excuses. Yes, I don’t expect him to immediately come back and play like one of the best midfielders in the competition, but the standard he has dished up these last few weeks just isn’t helping us at all. We know how important he can be to this midfield at his best, which is why his current form is so frustrating.

Cam Mackenzie was solid. He had some really good moments but was also pretty fumbly with the ball in my eyes. Nothing overly negative to say about his performance though, and he was definitely the least of our troubles.

Josh Ward: 8.6/10 — 20 disposals, 2 goals, 9 score involvements, 5 centre clearances, 4 interceptions, 5 tackles. Just a perfectly well-rounded game both offensively and defensively. This is all I ask for.

Jai Newcombe: 8.4/10 — 24 disposals @ 62%, 1 goal, 9 score involvements, 4 clearances, 3 inside 50s.

Cam Mackenzie: 7.6/10 — 18 disposals, 1 goal, 5 score involvements, 4 clearances, 4 tackles.

Will Day: 5.7/10 — 16 disposals, 6 interceptions, 5 turnovers, 4 score involvements, 3 inside 50s.

Despite three of our four mids having decent individual games, I still felt like Collingwood looked so much better at stoppage whenever it mattered. They just looked hungrier. They constantly had us outnumbered, ran harder both ways and applied an insane amount of pressure compared to us.

The numbers back that up too. The tackle count was 92-50 in Collingwood’s favour, while the inside 50 tackle count was 20-3. That genuinely disgusts me. I can cop Nick Daicos, who is arguably the best player in the competition, absolutely dominating us. What I cannot accept is a complete lack of intensity and pressure around the contest.

That was especially obvious in the first half. It felt like every tackle we tried to lay was broken, there was basically no pressure being put on the ball carrier, and the ball spent what felt like the entire half inside Collingwood’s forward 50. You’re not going to win many games of footy when the opposition is bringing that much more pressure and willingness to compete than you are, regardless of how talented your side is.

Onto Meek, who outside of that one horrid error towards the end, I actually thought had a solid game. He was good in the ruck and chipped in around the ground when he could. There were several players who made costly errors throughout the game, it’s just a shame his happened with less than a minute remaining and will obviously be remembered more because of it.

Morrison was actually really good. He worked so hard all day and was genuinely one of our most threatening players with ball in hand, which isn’t necessarily something you expect from him. He’s been one of the shining lights of this season for me and has completely flown under the radar.

Massimo was okay, but pretty average overall. I definitely thought he could have impacted the game more, especially considering Collingwood’s wingmen kind of dominated us. Swadling was extremely influential behind the ball and Roan Steele had a pretty good game as well.

And that brings me to my next issue. Why is a basically full-strength Hawthorn side nearly losing to a Collingwood team that had what felt like half a VFL squad playing?

There was a reason Craig McRae was reacting like Collingwood had won after the siren despite the game ending in a draw. It’s because there is absolutely no reason we should have been that close to losing that game. We got embarrassed by Brisbane last week, then got handed an undermanned Collingwood side and an opportunity to make a statement in response. Instead, we made a fool of ourselves.

That’s probably the most disappointing part for me. After what happened against Brisbane, you would expect the response to at least be there from an effort and intensity perspective. Instead, an undermanned Collingwood side looked hungrier, tackled harder, ran harder and competed harder than us for large parts of the game. Regardless of who is actually available on either side, that should never happen.

Harry Morrison: 8.5/10 — 20 disposals @ 90%, 6 marks, 4 tackles, 4 score involvements, 4 inside 50s, 3 interceptions.

Lloyd Meek: 7.0/10 — 11 disposals, 43 hitouts, 1 goal, 6 tackles, 4 score involvements, 2 clearances. Darcy Cameron probably got the better of him overall, but I’m not upset about this Meek performance.

Massimo D’Ambrosio: 6.2/10 — 15 disposals, 8 marks, 4 turnovers, 4 score involvements, 2 inside 50s, 2 rebound 50s.

Onto the forwards, who were once again pretty disappointing as a collective, particularly the smalls. HawthornZone addressed this on Instagram, but I’d just like to reiterate it because what used to be such a threatening and dangerous part of our side has become so disappointing.

A year ago, MacDonald, Ginnivan and Watson were absolutely dominating the Pies, whipping out their celebrations and playing the game completely on their terms. Compare that to what we saw last night and the difference is pretty significant. Watson and Moore I thought had decent games, but Ginni and CMac were absolutely awful.

Watson played a fair bit higher up the ground, saw a lot more of the ball and generally used it well. Despite not kicking a goal, I actually didn’t mind his performance at all. Sometimes we get too caught up in judging small forwards purely on goals, and I thought he still found ways to impact the game further up the ground.

Pretty crazy that Moore once again had the deciding kick against the same side in the same season. Despite not being able to convert, I thought he had a decent game overall and, like I said earlier, I’m not putting the result on him.

Ginnivan has been really poor these last couple of weeks. His decision-making in particular has been awful at times, and considering he started the season in arguably the best form of his career, the drop-off has been pretty significant. He’s gone from being one of our most dangerous players to almost reaching the point where you have to question whether his form warrants keeping his spot.

MacDonald was basically nowhere to be seen. He just couldn’t get near the ball for most of the game. He actually did alright when he had it, and six score involvements from eight touches proves he was still able to make something happen, but we simply need a lot more involvement from him.

I thought Beattie was extremely impressive early and put together a really solid debut. He brought pressure, his decision-making was great and he looked really composed for someone playing his first game. I actually rate him pretty highly and would love to see him stay in the side.

Dylan Moore: 8.0/10 — 19 disposals, 1 goal, 8 marks, 13 score involvements, 2 tackles.

Max Beattie: 7.5/10 — 10 disposals, 1 goal, 5 score involvements, 4 marks, 1 tackle.

Nick Watson: 7.4/10 — 20 disposals, 7 score involvements, 5 turnovers, 5 inside 50s, 3 marks, 350m gained.

Jack Ginnivan: 4.8/10 — 13 disposals, 2 marks, 2 tackles, 4 score involvements, 4 inside 50s.

Connor MacDonald: 4.4/10 — 8 disposals, 1 goal, 6 score involvements, 3 marks, 1 tackle. Six score involvements from eight touches is actually pretty impressive, but yeah, just completely unlike himself last night.

I thought Lewis and Chol both had really impressive games. They were strong in the air and made the most of what were pretty limited opportunities. Our kicking inside 50, and honestly our ball use further up the ground in general, has been awful recently, so I thought both of them did extremely well considering the service they were receiving.

Chol in particular was massive towards the end of the game and was a big reason why we were able to fight our way back after going 20 points down. His work in the ruck was really good as well, and I’d definitely keep giving him opportunities in there.

Gunston was okay without doing anything special. Obviously 2.4 isn’t the return you want, but a few of those misses came from pretty difficult angles. Knowing how good Gunston normally is around goal, you’d still expect him to convert a couple more of them. But overall, I can’t be too mad at any of the key forwards when the service they received for most of the night was awful.

Mitch Lewis: 8.5/10 — 15 disposals, 8 marks, 2 goals, 10 score involvements, 4 inside 50s, 362m gained.

Mabior Chol: 8.0/10 — 11 disposals, 1 goal, 7 marks, 4 inside 50s, 4 contested marks. Really good in the ruck as well. Keep him in there.

Jack Gunston: 7.0/10 — 14 disposals, 2 goals, 4 behinds, 5 marks, 4 turnovers.

I probably shouldn’t, but I care way too much about footy and take these performances personally, so when we play like this it’s just incredibly frustrating. Especially because I know how much better this side can be, and the biggest issue right now is so obvious. Talent isn’t the problem. We have more than enough of it. The pressure, tackling and overall willingness to compete just hasn’t been at the level it needs to be.

I’m sure there will be a massive focus on tackling and pressure this week before we head into the West Coast game, which simply has to be a win. There’s no other way around it, and I’m confident it will be.

As for finals, I genuinely have no idea what is going to happen. We’re looking pretty likely to verse Freo in that first week, and while going over to Optus is obviously far from ideal, we can beat them. I know we probably wouldn’t go in as favourites, but if we actually show up, bring the pressure and put everything out there for four quarters straight, I truly believe this side is talented and skilled enough to go all the way.

That’s what makes the last few weeks so frustrating. I can genuinely see a version of this team making a deep finals run, because we’ve already seen how good our best footy can be. Unfortunately, based purely on the way we’ve played over these last few weeks, I can just as easily see us going out in straight sets. At this point, it feels like it’s completely up to which version of Hawthorn decides to show up.

As for changes against West Coast, I don’t think it’s necessarily a game where we need to make a heap of them. However, I would like to see a bit more youth in the side. Potentially bringing in Dalton, Greaves and Dear could be good, especially because you can always count on those boys to put everything out there when they get their opportunity.

What does everyone else think?

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u/Kind_Security_9931 — 4 days ago

HAWKS VS LIONS PLAYER RATINGS & REVIEW

Oh god, what a genuinely terrible night. First and foremost, some of the overreactions to this game are laughable. I’ve seen people saying we should drop Weddle, Barrass, Sicily, Chol, that our season is over and all sorts of other ridiculous takes. It’s just so far away from what actually needs to be taken from this game. I’m usually a little over-optimistic when it comes to us, but there’s no defending that performance. It was absolutely disgusting.

For me, that was comfortably worse than the Melbourne game. At least against Melbourne we were able to reset at half-time and put together two genuinely good quarters of football. Last night, there was no response at any stage. I genuinely can’t remember the last time I watched us play four straight awful quarters of football. You’d probably have to go back to 2023.

I was out with a few mates watching the game, so I kind of got distracted afterwards and forgot just how badly we’d been belted. Then I woke up this morning and it hit me like a truck. I genuinely couldn’t have been more embarrassed by the way we played last night. I know they’re the back-to-back premiers, and I know it was at the Gabba, which is probably one of the hardest grounds in the competition to play at against Brisbane, but dishing up four completely uncompetitive quarters is just so poor.

The only real silver lining is that Brisbane themselves got done even worse last week and responded like that. We now have the opportunity to do the exact same thing. I’m still confident that we’re a good football team, and as Sam Mitchell said after the game, we are so much better than what we showed last night. That performance was so far below the standard this team has built that I don’t think it suddenly defines what we are. What matters now is how we respond to it.

Let’s just get right into the midfield. Against arguably the best midfield in the competition, clearance-wise we were actually really strong, and that was probably one of the biggest positives to take away from the game, especially early on. We won centre clearances 16–12 and stoppage clearances 27–20. So despite how badly the game went overall, we were actually able to win the ball at the source and compete with them around stoppage.

The problem was what happened after we won it. Our skills completely let us down, particularly our kicking going inside 50. We were doing enough work at the contest to give ourselves opportunities, but we just couldn’t capitalise on them. Against a team as good as Brisbane, you simply cannot continually win the ball and then give it straight back through poor execution.

Along with that, I thought our defensive effort around the contest was terrible. The amount of times Brisbane were able to get a handball or kick away after we had an opportunity to lock the ball in, simply because we couldn’t stick a tackle, was ridiculous. That was probably the biggest difference between the two midfields. They just went harder at the footy, but more importantly, they were prepared to do the defensive work after it as well. They were damaging offensively while still applying pressure defensively, and we just couldn’t match that intensity.

The tackling numbers summed it up perfectly. Up until three-quarter time, 16 Hawthorn players had one tackle or less. Sixteen. You can talk about structures, match-ups, selection and individual performances all you want, but when that many players are having basically no impact defensively, you’re going to struggle against anyone, let alone the back-to-back premiers at the Gabba. That is absolutely awful.

I thought Newcombe played somewhat well. He was tough in the contest, worked hard all night and genuinely tried his heart out. His execution wasn’t fantastic and there were definitely moments where he could’ve used the ball better, but he was one of the few who consistently competed, and he’s definitely not someone whose performance should be blamed for the result.

Day I can’t say exactly the same for. I thought he actually started the game really well and looked like he could have an impact, but he was swung all over the place throughout the second half and eventually just disappeared from the game. Whether that’s something we hold him accountable for or whether it falls more on the coaching team, I’m not exactly sure. It’s difficult for anyone to build themselves into a game when their role is constantly changing, but at the same time, you still expect someone of Day’s quality to find a way to have more of an impact.

I really liked Mackenzie and Ward’s performances. Mackenzie especially was a massive shining light on such a terrible night. He was one of the only players consistently looking to drive us forward and actually create something with the ball. In a performance where there really wasn’t much to take away positively, his game absolutely is something we should. He continues to look more confident and damaging with every opportunity he gets.

Ward was also really tough in the contest, found plenty of the footy and overall had a decent day. However, his skills were definitely below his usual standard. For someone who is generally such a clean user of the ball, he turned it over a fair bit and some of those mistakes were costly. Still, eight clearances and 28 disposals in a midfield that actually competed pretty well at stoppage is a strong performance.

Cam Mackenzie: 8.4/10 – 20 disposals, 6 tackles, 5 score involvements, 4 centre clearances, 6 inside 50s.

Josh Ward: 8.4/10 – 28 disposals, 7 marks, 6 turnovers, 6 score involvements, 8 clearances.

Jai Newcombe: 8.0/10 – 25 disposals, 11 clearances, 5 marks, 4 tackles, 3 score involvements, 420m gained.

Will Day: 6.3/10 – 16 disposals, 3 score involvements, 4 clearances, 3 rebound 50s.

Massimo D’Ambrosio, in my opinion, was our best player. He looked like one of the very few who was genuinely trying to make something happen. He drove the ball forward, took the game on and actually looked threatening when he had it. On a night where so much of our ball movement was stagnant or ended in a turnover, Massimo was at least prepared to be aggressive and try to create.

Harry Morrison, on the other hand, was pretty poor. I thought he made some really uncharacteristic mistakes after putting together such a good stretch of footy over the past couple of months. He’s normally someone you can rely on to make the right decision and execute the simple things well, but that just wasn’t there last night.

I am so certain on the fact that we do not need to play two rucks. I understand the idea behind it, but I just don’t think what we gain at stoppage outweighs what we lose around the ground. It becomes even more obvious in a game like this. When we’re already using the ball terribly and struggling to connect going forward, having Meek or Reeves win a clearance only to throw it on the boot and send it straight to an opposition defender just makes matters so much worse. Winning the clearance means very little if the next possession immediately gives the opposition the ball back.

Meek was okay, but Draper got the better of him on too many occasions and I didn’t think he was anywhere near physical enough. Reeves was decent at stoppage, but useless elsewhere as usual. That’s ultimately my issue with playing both. If Reeves isn’t dominating the hit-outs and giving us a significant advantage at stoppage, I just don’t see enough value in what he provides around the ground to justify sacrificing the extra runner.

Massimo D’Ambrosio: 8.5/10 – 22 disposals, 1 goal, 8 marks, 6 turnovers, 4 score involvements, 7 inside 50s, 4 rebound 50s, 648m gained.

Harry Morrison: 6.0/10 – 16 disposals, 5 marks, 5 tackles, 4 score involvements, 2 rebound 50s.

Lloyd Meek: 5.5/10 – 12 disposals, 21 hit-outs, 5 score involvements, 4 clearances, 3 inside 50s. Just let Draper get the better of him on too many occasions and wasn’t physical enough.

Ned Reeves: 5.0/10 – 7 disposals, 17 hit-outs, 3 score involvements, 3 clearances. Rating probably isn’t as low as it should be because, realistically, this is what he does most games.

Onto the backline, allegedly one of the best in the competition. Yesterday, though, we made it look like Essendon could put 15 goals on us.

I don’t think I have ever seen Tom Barrass play that poorly. What made it so much worse was watching Harris Andrews down the other end absolutely dominate us and have the exact sort of influence we normally expect Barrass to have. Barrass is an elite defender and one of the best in the competition, so I’m not suddenly questioning him as a player after one game, but his performance was genuinely a massive factor in why we got beaten as badly as we did. He dropped marks he would normally take, gave away free kicks and just never looked comfortable.

Sicily wasn’t great either. He had some good defensive moments and his numbers on paper don’t look terrible, but I just feel like he is playing so far off his best at the moment. For someone who can completely control games from behind the ball, we just aren’t seeing that influence consistently enough. Logan Morris absolutely torched both Barrass and Sic, and when two defenders of that quality are struggling against the same forward, it’s always going to make life difficult.

Battle was probably the best of the three talls. He wasn’t amazing by any means, but I thought he held his own defensively and competed pretty well considering how much pressure the backline was under. His ball use was disappointing though, and that became a common theme across basically our entire defence.

Josh Battle: 7.6/10 – 20 disposals, 6 interceptions, 8 turnovers, 6 rebound 50s.

James Sicily: 5.8/10 – 18 disposals, 2 marks, 8 interceptions, 5 rebound 50s. Stats don’t look awful, but I really didn’t like his performance, especially as a captain.

Tom Barrass: 4.6/10 – 4 disposals, 2 marks, 2 interceptions, 5 one-percenters. Dropped marks, gave away free kicks and did almost nothing positive. I rate Tom Barrass so highly, but this was really poor.

Hardwick was good. He actually fought all day, competed defensively and is one of the few defenders who can genuinely hold his head high after that performance.

Jars just couldn’t impact the game. Brisbane got their match-ups right and unfortunately, we didn’t. He’s normally such an important part of our transition out of defence, but they basically took away his ability to influence the game with the ball in hand.

Amon is an interesting one. I almost want to say he was really poor defensively, but at the same time, I actually thought he had some good defensive moments. His ball use was okay in patches, but overall it was just such an average performance. I just don’t rate Amon as highly anymore, to be honest. He was decent at the beginning of the season, but since having some injury troubles, he just seems a step off the pace.

I understand Bailey MacDonald was probably due for a rest, but I think I’m genuinely starting to prefer him in that role. The entire reason we have Amon back there is because of what he can provide with his kicking and his ability to generate drive out of D50. Yesterday, his ball use was poor, there was basically no drive coming out of defence and he didn’t really offer much run either. If those things aren’t there, what exactly are we getting out of him?

Maybe I’m jumping the gun, because we know how good Amon has been for us over the last few years, but I do think it’s becoming a conversation that needs to be had.

Weddle was just a really tough watch. Missing easy kicks and handballs, dropping marks, getting beaten defensively. It felt like everything that could go wrong for him did. He’s obviously far better than what he showed yesterday, but there’s not really much else to say about his game. Just not a good day out for him at all.

Blake Hardwick: 8.3/10 – 19 disposals, 7 interceptions, 5 turnovers, 3 score involvements, 8 rebound 50s.

Jarman Impey: 6.1/10 – 18 disposals, 3 interceptions, 1 goal, 3 rebound 50s, 2 inside 50s.

Karl Amon: 5.0/10 – 14 disposals, 4 tackles, 4 turnovers, 3 rebound 50s, 3 interceptions.

Josh Weddle: 4.7/10 – 10 disposals, 1 goal, 5 marks, 6 interceptions, 2 score involvements.

Having a look at the amount of turnovers coming from players who are typically really good users of the ball tells you a lot about how we went last night. Battle had eight, Hardwick had five, Amon had four and that was happening across the entire ground. When one of the biggest strengths of this team is normally how cleanly we can transition the footy, you’re simply not going to win many games when so many of your better ball users are giving it back.

One thing I really do want to point out, though, is how well Brisbane did their homework on us. I don’t think our defenders all simultaneously forgot how to play football. Brisbane clearly identified where our ball movement starts and went after it.

Hardwick took three marks, Sicily took two and Impey took zero. Sicily and Impey average around seven marks this season and Hardwick averages six. That is such a significant drop-off across all three players that I don’t think you can just put it down to them individually having bad games.

Our uncontested marking game is a massive part of our system, particularly behind the ball, and those three are so important to it because of how threatening they can be once the ball is in their hands. Brisbane didn’t allow us to get those easy possessions, prevented us from controlling the tempo and forced us into a much more rushed style of football. They clearly identified something that is fundamental to the way we want to play, took it away from us, and they prevailed.

That leads into something that has frustrated me at different points this season: why does it sometimes feel like we just don’t study opposition teams well enough?

Why does it genuinely sometimes look like there has been nowhere near enough effort put into nullifying the opposition’s biggest threat? Brisbane clearly came into this game with specific things they wanted to take away from us. They identified the players who generate our ball movement from D50, made those uncontested possessions incredibly difficult to get and forced us away from the way we want to play.

I understand that we want to back in our system and play our brand of football. I actually like that mentality to an extent. But there has to be a balance between backing your own system and respecting what the opposition does well. Sometimes you have to accept that an opposition player or part of their system can seriously hurt you and give someone the direct responsibility of taking that away.

That’s where I think our defensive work across the entire team needs to improve massively. And I don’t just mean the back six. We need to become better at giving players direct defensive responsibility and actually shutting down specific opponents when they’re threatening to take over a game. You can back your system all you want, but sometimes the system needs to adapt to who you’re playing. Brisbane did that to us perfectly last night. We didn’t do it nearly well enough to them.

Onto the forward line, and honestly, it was so bad that I don’t even want to speak about it.

It genuinely hurts me to see Nick Watson go goalless. Fair play to Noah Answerth, because it’s the second time he has technically shut Watson down, but I really wouldn’t be giving him too much credit for this one. Our own players were partly the reason Watson couldn’t impact the game. The service he got was absolutely disgusting, and the exact same thing goes for Lewis and Chol. I don’t really blame any of the three that much, because what could they have possibly done with some of the entries they were getting?

When you’re constantly kicking it on top of forwards’ heads, kicking to outnumbers or giving the opposition enough time to set up behind the ball, you’re basically asking your forwards to create something out of nothing. Watson thrives when we can move the ball quickly and give him opportunities before the defence gets set. Lewis and Chol need the ball put into areas where they can actually compete. We gave none of them that consistently.

Lewis definitely could have done a better job of preventing Harris Andrews from impacting the game as much as he did. Even if you aren’t getting good service offensively, there still has to be some awareness of how much damage the opposition’s best interceptor is doing. Andrews completely controlled the air and we never really found a way to make him accountable.

Chol had next to no impact, so there honestly isn’t much to say about him. Again, though, I find it difficult to put too much blame on him considering how starved he was of any genuine quality opportunity.

Gunston was decent and basically just did what Gunston does. He made the most of the limited opportunities he got and finished with three goals.

The stat that probably sums up our forward line better than anything else is that we actually had 50 inside 50s. That isn’t even an incredibly low number. For context, we average 57.1 for the year, so we were only around seven entries below our usual output, yet we produced our lowest score of the entire season.

Watching the game, it genuinely felt like we had about 20 inside 50s. That tells you everything about the quality of those entries. Getting the ball inside 50 wasn’t necessarily the problem; what we did once we got there was. There was no connection between the midfield and forwards, very little space created and far too many entries that played directly into Brisbane’s hands. You can have 50 inside 50s, but if half of them give your forwards almost no realistic chance of scoring, the number becomes pretty meaningless.

Jack Gunston: 7.5/10 – 6 disposals, 3 goals, 3 marks, 3 tackles.

Nick Watson: 5.5/10 – 9 disposals, 4 score involvements, 3 clearances, 1 inside 50.

Mitch Lewis: 5.3/10 – 13 disposals, 7 marks, 3 tackles, 2 score involvements.

Mabior Chol: 4.5/10 – 3 disposals, 1 mark, 1 tackle, 3 score involvements, 2 hit-outs. Him being given this incredibly low rating seems a little unfair because of how starved he was of any quality opportunity.

Jack Ginnivan had one of his worst games of the year, particularly with his ball use and just his general cleanliness with the footy. He actually found plenty of it, but his execution was well below his usual standard. That was especially disappointing considering how good his kicking inside 50 has been this year. He’s normally one of the players I trust most to lower his eyes and actually create something going forward, but that just wasn’t there.

CMac was okay. Nothing special, nothing absolutely terrible, but he definitely could have done a lot more. On a night where we desperately needed someone to create something forward of centre, he never really imposed himself on the game.

Dylan Moore, on the other hand, actually had a decent game. He showed up every quarter, continued working and tried his heart out despite what was happening around him. He was one of the few players who looked determined to keep finding a way into the game rather than allowing the scoreboard to completely take him out of it.

Sam Butler was given his chance and unfortunately, he just didn’t take it. There were some really costly errors and his execution was poor. I didn’t expect heaps from him coming into the side, and I do feel for him because it’s difficult coming into a team on a night where basically nothing is working, but you have to be better when you get your opportunity.

Dylan Moore: 8.0/10 – 22 disposals, 7 marks, 5 score involvements, 3 inside 50s, 1 goal.

Connor MacDonald: 5.2/10 – 13 disposals, 1 goal, 5 score involvements, 4 marks, 5 tackles, 3 inside 50s.

Jack Ginnivan: 5.2/10 – 20 disposals, 4 marks, 5 turnovers, 4 interceptions, 3 score involvements, 6 inside 50s, 4 rebound 50s. Got heaps of the footy, but the execution just wasn’t there.

Sam Butler: 4.7/10 – 14 disposals at 43%, 4 score involvements, 3 inside 50s, 2 marks. Feel for him, but you have to be better when you get your chance.

Now we just have to make a statement against Collingwood. We genuinely have no other choice.

I know I said something similar after the Melbourne game, but I genuinely believe we couldn’t possibly play like that again. There’s losing a game of football, there’s being comprehensively beaten by a better side, and then there’s putting together four quarters where the effort, execution and defensive pressure are that far below your normal standard. That can’t happen again.

If there is anything positive to come from it, it’s probably a pretty valuable learning lesson heading into September. Our defensive work across the entire ground needs to improve massively. The tackling numbers, the inability to lock the ball in at contest, the lack of accountability at times and how easily Brisbane were able to move the ball all exposed areas that will get punished even harder in finals.

You’d much rather have those problems exposed now than in a must-win final. Luckily, our spot in the top four is still somewhat safe, so we actually have an opportunity to learn from it rather than having a performance like that end our season.

But the response against Collingwood has to be massive. Brisbane themselves showed us exactly what a good side can do after being embarrassed. They got belted last week, came home, responded and absolutely dismantled us. Now it’s our turn to show whether we can do the same.

I’d be making two changes for next week.

OUT: Reeves, Butler

IN: Greaves, MacDonald

No idea why Greaves got dropped and then played almost no game time last week. I must have missed the reason whenever it got posted, because I really didn’t understand that decision.

And Bailey MacDonald has simply been too good this season to not be playing. He is part of the future of this team and, honestly, at this point you could argue he is offering us more than Amon. His run and willingness to take the game on are things we desperately lacked against Brisbane, and I think he deserves to come straight back in.

Overall, it was probably the most embarrassing performance I’ve watched from this team in a long time, but I’m not buying into the idea that the season is suddenly over or that half the team needs to be dropped. One horrific performance doesn’t erase what we’ve shown throughout the year.

What it does do is expose some things that need to be fixed, and quickly. Our defensive effort needs to improve, our forward entries need to be far more calculated, we need to become better at taking away the opposition’s strengths, and personally, I think we need to move away from the two-ruck setup.

We know this team is so much better than what they showed last night. Now they get the opportunity against Collingwood to prove it.

What does everyone else think?

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u/Kind_Security_9931 — 12 days ago

HAWKS VS BOMBERS PLAYER RATINGS & REVIEW

Another game that played out almost exactly as expected, and it’s hard not to be impressed by the consistency we’re building. As strange as it sounds after a 93-point win, though, I am feeling more disappointed than excited because of the injuries to Noah Mraz and Mitch Lewis.

Mraz suffering a lacerated kidney is absolutely gutting. While, from a list management perspective, he’s probably easier to replace than someone like Lewis, it genuinely hurts because of the football he’s been playing. Since making his debut, I don’t think he’s had a single performance that I’d call average, let alone poor. Every week he’s looked composed, competitive and well beyond his experience, and it’s a cruel reward for someone whose career was building so much momentum.

Hopefully Lewis’ concussion only sidelines him for a week because we’ll need him against Brisbane. That said, given how heavy the collision looked, combined with the travel to the Gabba, I wouldn’t be surprised if the club took the cautious approach and gave him two weeks to recover.

As for the performance itself, did we really expect anything different? We controlled the game from start to finish and some of the players who have been driving this team’s recent form once again stood up. Ward continued his outstanding season, Morrison keeps proving how valuable he is, Cmac had another influential game, and Jarman Impey somehow found another level.

If there was one slight concern, it was our efficiency going inside 50. Against a side that isn’t exactly among the competition’s best, we still butchered a few entries and our goal-kicking inconsistencies haven’t completely disappeared. It’s certainly not a major issue after winning by 93 points, but it’s something that will need to improve against the better teams.

One aspect of our game that has noticeably improved, however, is our ball movement. Over the past few weeks we’ve seen far more scoring chains generated from the back half, with our defenders setting the game up brilliantly. Moore, Morrison and others have been executing their running patterns superbly, while Impey and Weddle continue to overlap, support and move the ball with speed. When We get it right, we’re transitioning from defence to attack far too quickly for opposition teams to set up.

Yes, the quality of opposition has to be taken into account, but the system itself looks far cleaner than it did earlier in the year. Hopefully it’s something we can carry into the much tougher stretch of football that’s coming over the next few weeks.

The backline was once again outstanding. Credit has to go to Essendon because I actually thought they competed reasonably well, particularly Nate Caddy. He gave us a few headaches and was difficult to contain at times, but fortunately for us he didn’t have a great deal of support around him, which allowed our defence to stay in control for most of the afternoon.

Jarman Impey is the obvious place to start because the form this bloke is in is just ridiculous. The season he’s putting together deserves so much more recognition. Yes, the quality of opposition always has to be considered, but at some point you just have to acknowledge how good he’s been. If this club is going to make a genuine run at a premiership this year, Impey is going to play a massive role in it.

Blake Hardwick is another player who somehow still feels underrated. Week after week he quietly gets the job done, uses the ball brilliantly and rarely loses his contest. Surely he’s a genuine chance to at least make the All-Australian squad of 40.

Josh Weddle also looks completely at home in defence. As much as I wanted to see him develop into an elite wingman, he’s simply so much more damaging across half-back. His athleticism, composure and willingness to take the game on make him a genuine weapon, and I love the freedom he’s been given to attack from defence.

Jarman Impey: 9.8/10 - 37 disposals @ 81%, 1 goal, 11 score involvements, 2 goal assists, 8 intercepts, 12 marks, 9 inside 50s, 836 metres gained.

Genuinely one of the most absurd stat lines I’ve ever had to type out. What a performance.

Josh Weddle: 8.7/10 - 19 disposals @ 90%, 7 marks, 6 intercepts, 7 score involvements, 2 inside 50s.

Blake Hardwick: 8.5/10 - 22 disposals @ 86%, 8 marks, 6 intercepts, 6 score involvements.

I also think Noah Mraz has had a massive influence on James Sicily’s form. Since Mraz came into the side, Sicily has looked much more like himself. Having another reliable key defender has taken some of the defensive responsibility off his shoulders, allowing him to play with far more freedom. We even saw him spend time pushing onto the wing against Essendon, and his kicking going inside 50 became a genuine weapon. I’d comfortably say this was one of Sicily’s better games of the season.

As for Mraz himself, I watched him during the pre-season and at Box Hill quite a few times, so I knew there was talent there. But I honestly didn’t expect him to settle into AFL football this quickly. Every game he’s looked composed, physical and far more experienced than someone who’s only played a handful of matches. He genuinely looks like he has the potential to become one of the premier defenders in the competition, which makes this injury so heartbreaking. To become such a fan favourite after only four games says a lot about the impact he’s already had.

Thankfully, I think we have the depth to cover his absence. Scrimshaw isn’t too far away from returning, although I’m not convinced he walks straight back into the side. We’re still tall enough down back to manage for a few weeks, but Mraz will certainly be missed.

James Sicily: 9.0/10 - 27 disposals, 10 marks, 5 intercepts, 7 score involvements, 5 rebound 50s, 492 metres gained.

A performance much closer to the Sicily we’ve come to expect. Hopefully he can maintain this level.

Noah Mraz: 8.5/10 - 17 disposals @ 94%, 6 intercepts, 5 marks, 5 score involvements, 2 clearances, 4 hit-outs.

For a key defender, his versatility is unbelievable.

Huge credit also has to go to Bailey Macdonald. He’s been playing some really solid football and has done an outstanding job filling the void left by Karl Amon. At this stage, I think he’s well and truly cemented his spot in the best 23.

Josh Battle was another beneficiary of Mraz’s inclusion, spending far more time pushing up the ground, similar to Sicily. While that experiment will probably be put on hold with Mraz sidelined, I really liked what I saw. Battle is such a clean user of the football and was involved in several scoring chains by getting higher up the ground.

Tom Barrass was solid without needing to dominate. Caddy got the better of him on a couple of occasions, but nothing that would cause any concern. Barrass is one of those players you don’t worry about. When the big games arrive and the pressure is at its highest, he’s one of the most dependable defenders in the competition.

Josh Battle: 8.4/10 - 21 disposals, 5 marks, 3 intercepts, 7 score involvements, 3 rebound 50s.

Bailey Macdonald: 7.6/10 - 13 disposals, 3 marks, 3 tackles, 3 score involvements, 2 inside 50s, 2 rebound 50s.

Tom Barrass: 7.5/10 - 11 disposals, 6 marks, 4 intercepts, 3 score involvements, 2 rebound 50s.

One thing that really stood out to me was the number of score involvements our defenders accumulated. Those aren’t numbers you typically see from a backline, and I think it’s a big reason why our ball movement has looked so much more dangerous lately. More and more of our scoring chains are being generated from defence, and when your backs are contributing that heavily to the scoreboard, it shows just how well the system is functioning.

Onto the midfield, who were very good without completely taking over the game. There were some excellent individual performances, but I probably would’ve liked to see a little more dominance as a collective against a side like Essendon. Maybe I’m being overly critical because we still finished +32 in inside 50s (68-36), won centre clearances 16-7 and stoppage clearances 22-19. On paper those numbers scream complete domination, but watching the game it didn’t quite feel that one-sided. Perhaps I’m asking for too much after a 93-point win, but I’d love to see this midfield completely bury sides of this calibre.

Josh Ward, though, was absolutely outstanding. At the start of the season I’d have said he and Cam Mackenzie were developing at a very similar rate, but over the past month Ward has gone to another level. He’s finding the football with ease, he’s incredibly clean by hand and foot, and he just looks so composed every single week. Despite still being a young player, he’s starting to carry himself like a genuine senior midfielder.

I don’t think Ward’s ceiling is necessarily built around explosive brilliance like an Isaac Heeney or Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera. Instead, he reminds me of the type of midfielder who becomes the heartbeat of a team. Not in terms of playing style, but in terms of role. Players like Josh Kennedy, Sam Mitchell or Scott Pendlebury who you know are going to give you 30 quality disposals every week, make the right decision under pressure and lead by example. That’s the path I can see Ward heading down.

Cam Mackenzie also had another terrific game. He might not be exploding at quite the same rate as Ward, but every week he gives me more confidence that he’s going to become a genuine star. His work in congestion is electric, he’s so quick with his hands and feet in tight spaces, and his ball use has improved dramatically over the last 12 months. The more I watch this group develop together, the more convinced I become that this Hawthorn midfield can eventually become one of the best in the competition.

Jai Newcombe has flown under the radar over the past few weeks. He was still very good against Essendon, but he’s allowed others to take the spotlight while simply playing his role. That’s perfectly fine, although when we come up against Brisbane and Collingwood I’ll be looking for him to stamp himself all over those games. In saying that, he spent most of the afternoon dealing with a hard tag from Will Setterfield and still found the ball 28 times, so I’m probably being a little harsh.

Will Day started the game brilliantly and looked dangerous whenever he went near the ball. He’s just such an important player because of the goal-scoring threat he adds to our midfield, something we’ve really lacked at different stages this season.

Connor Macdonald also deserves a heap of credit. His midfield exposure has increased significantly over the last few weeks and he’s flourishing because of it. His running power, work rate and ball use are all making him a genuine weapon through the middle.

Josh Ward: 9.3/10 - 33 disposals @ 88%, 9 marks, 10 score involvements, 4 clearances, 4 inside 50s, 4 tackles.

Genuinely elite.

Cam Mackenzie: 8.9/10 - 23 disposals, 1 goal, 6 marks, 6 tackles, 9 score involvements, 4 clearances, 3 inside 50s.

Jai Newcombe: 8.6/10 - 28 disposals, 9 score involvements, 5 marks, 4 clearances, 4 inside 50s, 342 metres gained.

Connor Macdonald: 8.6/10 - 26 disposals, 9 marks, 7 inside 50s, 6 score involvements, 456 metres gained.

Will Day : 8.6/10 - 21 disposals, 2 goals, 5 marks, 5 tackles, 5 score involvements, 5 clearances, 5 inside 50s. Just 5 of every thing really.

Lloyd Meek had a solid afternoon. There were periods where he completely took control, but there were also patches where you could see the weaknesses in his game. At times, Blakiston, who isn’t exactly one of the competition’s premier ruckmen, was getting the better of him in the hit-outs, and it does make you realise what Ned Reeves brings in that area.

That certainly isn’t a knock on Meek, because he’s held his own really well as the sole ruck. The bigger question is what we do when Reeves is available again. It’s becoming increasingly difficult to justify going back to two rucks when we’ve been playing such good football with one.

There are genuine pros and cons. Reeves is probably the better centre bounce ruck and has adapted really well to the new ruck rules, but his impact around the ground isn’t close to Meek’s. Meek’s mobility, follow-up work and ability to contribute outside the contest are massive strengths, whereas Reeves gives you more dominance at stoppages.

Personally, I’m starting to wonder whether we’re better off committing to one recognised ruck, whether that’s Meek or Reeves, and using the extra spot on a more versatile player. Normally Chol can provide support as the second ruck, but with both Mraz and Lewis sidelined he’ll be needed more as a permanent forward. It’s a really interesting selection dilemma and one I’d love to hear other people’s thoughts on.

Lloyd Meek: 7.9/10 - 15 disposals, 23 hit-outs, 6 clearances, 5 score involvements, 4 marks, 3 tackles, 3 inside 50s.

Finally, the wingmen have been outstanding over the past few weeks. Harry Morrison produced another elite performance, working just as hard defensively as he did offensively. If Hawthorn were playing in a Grand Final tomorrow, I’d have absolutely no hesitation locking him straight into one wing.

Massimo D’Ambrosio was exactly what we’ve come to expect. Reliable, disciplined and incredibly consistent. He understands his role perfectly and executes it week after week, and this was another really strong performance.

Harry Morrison: 8.8/10 - 26 disposals @ 81%, 1 goal, 9 marks, 10 score involvements, 3 inside 50s, 315 metres gained.

Massimo D’Ambrosio: 8.7/10 - 24 disposals, 6 marks, 4 intercepts, 9 score involvements, 4 inside 50s.

Onto the forward line, where I thought Dylan Moore was absolutely elite. His last few performances have been a timely reminder of just how good a footballer he is, and it’s not because he’s kicking bags of goals or producing flashy highlights. It’s everything else.

The running patterns to create space for teammates, the constant gut-running from contest to contest without always getting rewarded, the defensive efforts, the pressure and the willingness to do the unrewarded work. Those are the things that make Dylan Moore such a valuable player. He’s peaking at exactly the right time of the season and if we are going to make a deep finals run, he’ll be one of the biggest reasons why.

The Wizard had one of his quieter afternoons, with Gunston understandably stealing the headlines, although he still managed to finish with three goals. I actually thought Andrew McGrath did a terrific job on him. Looking back over the last 12 months, McGrath is probably one of the toughest match-ups Watson has faced. Across both games against Essendon this season he’s largely kept Watson under control for long periods.

That being said, the scary thing about Nick Watson is you have to be perfect for four quarters. Give him an inch and he’ll make you pay. He still finished with three goals and probably should’ve had six after missing three very gettable chances. So did McGrath really shut him down? Maybe not. That’s just the type of player Watson is becoming.

Dylan Moore: 9.0/10 - 23 disposals @ 91%, 1 goal, 11 score involvements, 5 inside 50s, 4 marks, 21 pressure acts.

One of those performances where the stat sheet doesn’t even tell the full story.

Nick Watson: 8.5/10 - 14 disposals, 3 goals, 8 score involvements, 4 intercepts, 3 tackles.

Jack Ginnivan finished with another really strong stat line, although I actually thought he was a little quieter than the numbers suggest. I didn’t notice him as much throughout the game, but when he did get involved he made things happen. His decision-making is elite and I’d argue he’s probably our best kick going inside 50. He just sees options that others don’t.

Oliver Greaves continues to impress every single week. Everyone talks about the energy and enthusiasm he brings to the side, but he’s a seriously talented footballer as well. His ball use is exceptional, he’s strong overhead and he looks incredibly composed for someone so early in his career. As he develops physically, I genuinely think he has the tools to become an elite midfielder.

It’s going to be fascinating to see how we fit all of these young players into the side once everyone is healthy. Greaves, Dalton, Mraz, Bailey Macdonald and others have all shown enough to suggest they deserve opportunities, and that’s exactly the kind of selection headache every successful club wants.

Jack Ginnivan: 8.6/10 - 20 disposals, 8 marks, 9 score involvements, 1 goal, 3 inside 50s, 3 intercepts.

Oliver Greaves: 8.5/10 - 16 disposals, 8 marks, 6 score involvements, 3 inside 50s.

Mabior Chol was fairly quiet. He had a few opportunities but just couldn’t clunk the marks we’ve become accustomed to seeing him take. It’s certainly nothing to worry about because his form has been strong overall, but Hawthorn is a much more dangerous side when Chol is up and about.

Then there’s Jack Gunston.

Just when I started thinking time might finally be catching up to him, he turns around and kicks seven goals. That’s now 601 career goals for one of Hawthorn’s greatest ever players. Personally, he’s probably my favourite Hawk of all time, and performances like this are exactly why. The intelligence, the leading patterns, the finishing and the professionalism he has displayed throughout his career have been unbelievable. What a player.

Jack Gunston: 10/10 - 16 disposals, 7 goals, 11 marks, 11 score involvements, 403 metres gained.

A vintage Gunston performance.

Mabior Chol: 7.3/10 - 9 disposals, 5 marks, 2 goals, 6 score involvements, 2 hit-outs.

Next up is North Melbourne. They’ll provide a much tougher challenge than Essendon, but it’s still a game I expect Hawthorn to win. If we’re serious about finishing in the top four and making a genuine premiership push, these are the games we simply have to bank.

We’ll be without Mitch Lewis and Noah Mraz, which will force a couple of changes. If Ned Reeves is fit, I’d expect him to come straight back into the side. We could also see the return of Calsher Dear, while Aidan Schubert might even come into the conversation for a debut. If the club thinks he’s ready, this feels like a pretty good opportunity to give him his chance.

What did everyone else think?

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u/Kind_Security_9931 — 24 days ago

My favourite movie is seven, red dragon or heat so anything similar would be ideal.

I think I have watched all the big ones, zodiac, prisoners, silence of the lambs, the usual suspects. Anything popular and higher rated in this psychological thriller type of movies genre

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u/Kind_Security_9931 — 4 months ago