u/Low_Needleworker5366

Our oldest is 17 and just graduated high school. The last 2 years have been very hard on my husband and I with him. He has fought us to the point where he argues just to argue. Of course he doesnt see it that way and feels we are being too hard on him. Last month we were on a family vacation and he and dad got into it. Grandma came with this time and felt we were too hard on our son and sided with him. One item she kept bringing up was the fact that we took his phone away when he was being rude to me. I told him to come to dinner and he told me to leave him alone. Very rudely. Now it was a very late night the night before so there was some attitude because he was tired, but no reason to speak the way he did. Which is why I took the phone.

Of course my mom told my sister and my sister is now worried about our family dynamics. She asked me about the situation and I explained that son either needs to move out or realize there are rules. She said that in all our years she has never heard me use the tone I had especially when speaking about my son the way I was. She sides with the son and grandma at least partially explaining that if he pays for part of the phone (which he does because he wanted the upgraded model) she wouldn't have taken it away. Its his. I said I took it away based on how he was speaking to me, not because he was tired and asked if she would let her kids speak that way. She said no, but she would have not taken the phone but found an alternative method to use. She asked what's changed so dramatically that he would tell grandma he hates his family and wants to leave along with me saying I want him to leave. She also stated that my husband is too hard on the kids and this is why our oldest pushes back. Then we end up in an argument with him. She's worried he will leave and never return and that our family dynamics have changed for the worst.

So basically we are bad parents. In a nutshell.

We are not perfect. We make mistakes. Yes, my husband is strict with the kids. He definitely has a "dad" voice where hers is very "let's sit down and discuss in a calm tone" kinda guy.

So are we really that bad that my mom and sister both think we messed up parenting our oldest?

Couple weeks ago we got back from a family vacation. We told our 17yr old that he could run as long as he was back to room by a certain time and we wanted at least 1 family dinner. This was a cruise.

7 days.

Not once did he come and do anything with us. We tried swimming, golf, dinner etc. He was always too busy with the friends he made.

We both understand hes 17 and while he wanted to do the cruise, hanging out with friends is way more fun than your family.

1 dinner is all we wanted.

We are home now and my spouse is still very bitter over the whole thing. He told me this is probably one of our last family vacations with him and he couldn't even spend an hour eating dinner with us.

I asked how long hes going to be bitter and he said he didn't know. It hurt him real bad and our son has yet to listen to my spouse when hes tried to talk to him about his disappointment. Every conversation turns into a battle between the two of them and I feel like I need to keep the peace.

Do I let my spouse be and have him work it out internally? What do I do? If I try to let him see another side I'm "coddling" our son. Yes, I'm disappointed too but NOT as much as my spouse.

What do I do?

Couple weeks ago we got back from a family vacation. We told our 17yr old that he could run as long as he was back to room by a certain time and we wanted at least 1 family dinner. This was a cruise.

7 days.

Not once did he come and do anything with us. We tried swimming, golf, dinner etc. He was always too busy with the friends he made.

We both understand hes 17 and while he wanted to do the cruise, hanging out with friends is way more fun than your family.

1 dinner is all we wanted.

We are home now and my spouse is still very bitter over the whole thing. He told me this is probably one of our last family vacations with him and he couldn't even spend an hour eating dinner with us.

I asked how long hes going to be bitter and he said he didn't know. It hurt him real bad and our son has yet to listen to my spouse when hes tried to talk to him about his disappointment. Every conversation turns into a battle between the two of them and I feel like I need to keep the peace.

Do I let my spouse be and have him work it out internally? What do I do? If I try to let him see another side I'm "coddling" our son. Yes, I'm disappointed too but NOT as much as my spouse.

What do I do?

How to manage next few months.

My seventeen year old son has always been very difficult to parent from the day he was born. When he was little, we would say things like, wow, that's a pretty blue sky. And he would respond back, that's not blue. That's perrywinkle, for example. He would get in trouble for something.And I would tell him to bring me his legos, and he would say, okay, package them up and walk them up to me.

He will argue with you on the smallest things.And I would even buy shirts that would say, i'm not arguing.I'm explaining why i'm right.

He's seventeen now and graduating high school.In three weeks. We just got done with a family cruise vacation.And yes he wanted to go. However, the entire trip, even after we commented that we would like to have dinner as an entire family At least one night, he was off running with the friends that he made on the trip. His siblings asked him to play mini golf.Go swimming, go on the water sides.Come to a show.And each time was met with no.I'm hanging out with my friends.

On the last night of vacation my husband got really sick because he has an autoimmune issue, and we ended up in the emergency room. Of course.Our oldest was worried about us and stayed up all night, so we knew the next day that he was gonna be short tempered.And extremely tired. My husband is okay, and we told the kids this. Because our son was up all night. We just let him be alone by himself (we had an Airbnb at this point). Six hours later, we asked him to come out.And eat dinner to which he yelled at me and said, leave me alone. Not once but three different times. In none of this did he say I'm not hungry or I'm tired or I'm exhausted. Please, leave me alone. It was a very derogatory. Leave me alone almost with an f.U tone. This is the same tone that I have in the mornings from him.When I try to get him up to get him off to school. So after the third time of him yelling at me, I took his phone and said, if you want the phone you can come out and eat. He still refused to eat anything, but a half hour later came out.And looked at me said, I took one bite.So now give me my phone back. Not a please. I explained to him that you need to ask in a different tone, and this is the same tone that you used. And that's why I took the phone away. He doesn't understand it and continued to tell me to give him his phone back.

He does pay $25/month for the phone because he wanted the latest and greatest. Hes a minor so I still pay for the service.

This continued throughout the entire night. And even resulted in him sitting outside our bedroom window on patio furniture rocking it so that it was making a knocking noise right outside the window. When I asked him to please stop 3 times he looked at me and said, no. You're making my life miserable.So I will make yours equally miserable.

The next day, we asked him to engage in a positive manner with the entire family.And we will look at giving him his phone back, and he said that's not going to happen.So can I have my phone.

It's now been three days of him Not having his phone, he's telling us he does not care about anything Anymore. he does not want to go to school.He's been late the last two days.

Of course. My mom was along on this trip and she doesn't understand why we took the phone away. I explained to her. It's because of the way he chose to phrase his words. If he wants to be treated like an adult, you cannot talk to others. That way, she still thinks it's wrong that we took his phone. She even told me today that if I gave him his phone back, things would probably be better. And I had to explain that he's got five and a half hours of detention, because every morning he yells at me telling me, I need to leave him alone, and it's my fault that he's late for school.Because I don't leave him alone.

And before people want to harp on him too much, I do want to explain that he actually is a really good person. He's held a job for over a year at a local hospital.And they do drug and alcohol, testing every 2-3 weeks so none of that is a factor in this. Many people will have conversations with him and tell us that he's a very well-behaved individual. And having a conversation with him is like having a conversation with a 30-year-old man. He's just been defiant by his very nature for his entire life. Even sometimes to the point where he'll manipulate a situation to get what he wants. And while he does feel that we don't treat him like an adult, or we don't treat him fair, he doesn't understand that he's still seventeen.And our house, our rules.So of course, he can't wait to move out.

He did call me on the Alexa at home when he got done with school and asked when he can have his phone back and I explained to him that we need to have a conversation about positive interaction. And I don't know, even after that conversation when he will get his phone back and he came back with fine.It doesn't matter anyway.

Good people of reddit. How have you managed these children and what can we do better?

My seventeen year old son has always been very difficult to parent from the day he was born. When he was little, we would say things like, wow, that's a pretty blue sky. And he would respond back, that's not blue. That's perrywinkle, for example. He would get in trouble for something.And I would tell him to bring me his legos, and he would say, okay, package them up and walk them up to me.

He will argue with you on the smallest things.And I would even buy shirts that would say, i'm not arguing.I'm explaining why i'm right.

He's seventeen now and graduating high school.In three weeks. We just got done with a family cruise vacation.And yes he wanted to go. However, the entire trip, even after we commented that we would like to have dinner as an entire family At least one night, he was off running with the friends that he made on the trip. His siblings asked him to play mini golf.Go swimming, go on the water sides.Come to a show.And each time was met with no.I'm hanging out with my friends.

On the last night of vacation my husband got really sick because he has an autoimmune issue, and we ended up in the emergency room. Of course.Our oldest was worried about us and stayed up all night, so we knew the next day that he was gonna be short tempered.And extremely tired. My husband is okay, and we told the kids this. Because our son was up all night. We just let him be alone by himself (we had an Airbnb at this point). Six hours later, we asked him to come out.And eat dinner to which he yelled at me and said, leave me alone. Not once but three different times. In none of this did he say I'm not hungry or I'm tired or I'm exhausted. Please, leave me alone. It was a very derogatory. Leave me alone almost with an f.U tone. This is the same tone that I have in the mornings from him.When I try to get him up to get him off to school. So after the third time of him yelling at me, I took his phone and said, if you want the phone you can come out and eat. He still refused to eat anything, but a half hour later came out.And looked at me said, I took one bite.So now give me my phone back. Not a please. I explained to him that you need to ask in a different tone, and this is the same tone that you used. And that's why I took the phone away. He doesn't understand it and continued to tell me to give him his phone back.

He does pay $25/month for the phone because he wanted the latest and greatest. Hes a minor so I still pay for the service.

This continued throughout the entire night. And even resulted in him sitting outside our bedroom window on patio furniture rocking it so that it was making a knocking noise right outside the window. When I asked him to please stop 3 times he looked at me and said, no. You're making my life miserable.So I will make yours equally miserable.

The next day, we asked him to engage in a positive manner with the entire family.And we will look at giving him his phone back, and he said that's not going to happen.So can I have my phone.

It's now been three days of him Not having his phone, he's telling us he does not care about anything Anymore. he does not want to go to school.He's been late the last two days.

Of course. My mom was along on this trip and she doesn't understand why we took the phone away. I explained to her. It's because of the way he chose to phrase his words. If he wants to be treated like an adult, you cannot talk to others. That way, she still thinks it's wrong that we took his phone. She even told me today that if I gave him his phone back, things would probably be better. And I had to explain that he's got five and a half hours of detention, because every morning he yells at me telling me, I need to leave him alone, and it's my fault that he's late for school.Because I don't leave him alone.

And before people want to harp on him too much, I do want to explain that he actually is a really good person. He's held a job for over a year at a local hospital.And they do drug and alcohol, testing every 2-3 weeks so none of that is a factor in this. Many people will have conversations with him and tell us that he's a very well-behaved individual. And having a conversation with him is like having a conversation with a 30-year-old man. He's just been defiant by his very nature for his entire life. Even sometimes to the point where he'll manipulate a situation to get what he wants. And while he does feel that we don't treat him like an adult, or we don't treat him fair, he doesn't understand that he's still seventeen.And our house, our rules.So of course, he can't wait to move out.

He did call me on the Alexa at home when he got done with school and asked when he can have his phone back and I explained to him that we need to have a conversation about positive interaction. And I don't know, even after that conversation when he will get his phone back and he came back with fine.It doesn't matter anyway.

Good people of reddit. How have you managed these children and what can we do better?

Help with teen.

My 17yr old son is having a hard time. He feels everything we do is because we "hate" him. I asked him to come and eat dinner and he told me "leave me alone" in a very derogatory tone. I asked again and even more derogatory the next time. So I took his phone and said he could have it back one he ate. He then threw something across the room claiming it fell off the bed.

Once he finally came out he ate one bite and said "there now can I have my phone back" with attitude still. I said no...not with the attitude. Think about how you are approaching this. He walked away pissed. Not upset. Pissed.

10 min later came out of his room knocking on the windows to outside wanting me to come in. Told him when I am done with what I am doing. He kept on knocking. I kept telling him to be patient and let me finish. He kept on to the point where my husband told him to stop. Son then came outside and kept up saying come inside. I still told him to be patient and let me finish. He kept on. Husband again told him to stop and son went off on husband. Saying he doesnt like him and he is going to treat my husband the way he treats our son. Then said he gets yelled at all the time and never does anything wrong.

Told him until you can calm down and talk like an adult you dont get the phone back. He threatened to leave.

Today he has been in his room all day. Grandma is here and even tried to talk to him. He refuses to budge. He feels we are unfair at everything we tell him to do. Which btw isn't much. We even said come and hang outside with us in a positive manner and we will discuss the phone. He refused to come out lentil 5pm....then looks at me and says "im outside so give me my phone back". Told him no....we said he has to engage in a positive manner with the family. He said we'll thats not happening so do i get my phone. Told him again positive engagement. He looked at me and said give me my phone and I will. Told him thats now how this works. He walked back inside.

Grandma doesnt understand why we took the phone away. I reminded her I had that done to me as a teen also.

What are we doing wrong? Im worried he will up and leave and we have lost our son then.

My 17yr old son is having a hard time. He feels everything we do is because we "hate" him. I asked him to come and eat dinner and he told me "leave me alone" in a very derogatory tone. I asked again and even more derogatory the next time. So I took his phone and said he could have it back one he ate. He then threw something across the room claiming it fell off the bed.

Once he finally came out he ate one bite and said "there now can I have my phone back" with attitude still. I said no...not with the attitude. Think about how you are approaching this. He walked away pissed. Not upset. Pissed.

10 min later came out of his room knocking on the windows to outside wanting me to come in. Told him when I am done with what I am doing. He kept on knocking. I kept telling him to be patient and let me finish. He kept on to the point where my husband told him to stop. Son then came outside and kept up saying come inside. I still told him to be patient and let me finish. He kept on. Husband again told him to stop and son went off on husband. Saying he doesnt like him and he is going to treat my husband the way he treats our son. Then said he gets yelled at all the time and never does anything wrong.

Told him until you can calm down and talk like an adult you dont get the phone back. He threatened to leave.

Today he has been in his room all day. Grandma is here and even tried to talk to him. He refuses to budge. He feels we are unfair at everything we tell him to do. Which btw isn't much. We even said come and hang outside with us in a positive manner and we will discuss the phone. He refused to come out lentil 5pm....then looks at me and says "im outside so give me my phone back". Told him no....we said he has to engage in a positive manner with the family. He said we'll thats not happening so do i get my phone. Told him again positive engagement. He looked at me and said give me my phone and I will. Told him thats now how this works. He walked back inside.

Grandma doesnt understand why we took the phone away. I reminded her I had that done to me as a teen also.

What are we doing wrong? Im worried he will up and leave and we have lost our son then.