u/Szymon96803

Hello Guys

MRActivist from Poland here (still consider myself as left-winger). Here are few arguments why you still should use the draft and conscription in discussions with your counterparts.

This issue especially bother me because I'm gay, and idea of "protection your women" doesn't fit me. But I know many straight men opposing conscription, as they have nobody do protect. If we are equal citizens, why only one gender has to protect another in case of war or spend extra time working for society? Why men are in prison for trying to live the same life as women?

In many discussions in other subreddits, I've noticed that whenever someone brings up the argument of draft and conscription, there is ALWAYS ready American feminist to respond: "Oh no, conscription hasn't exist since Vietnam War" or even more often "it's just a piece of paper for federal government, not your life, man up". This really shows how Americancentric they actually are. I want to offer some ammunition and a word of support to you American guys:

Always remember while arguing, that world does not end at the East or West coast. There are around 60 countries with active conscription in the world, and in 50 of them it applies only to male citizens. Male-only conscription is not just an issue of third-world dictatorships, it happens right in the heart of Europe - even in so called "progressive" nations, where women rights are highly respected. There we go (fact check):

Austria Every male citizen has to serve 6 months when they turn 18. If they refuse military service, they must spend 9 months doing "civil service," which is basically underpaid forced labor in hospitals or elderly care, completely acceptable by Austrian standards of "equality." If you refuse of course you go to prison. The process start for 17 year old boys forced to undergo "musterung" humiliating 2 day process of medical and stamina tests, often female personel check ability of young men body. A gap year for an Austrian boy means cleaning vomit in an ambulance on night shifts; for an Austrian girl, it's Thailand, the Maldives, or Copacabana.

Finland Same as above, but military service lasts between 5.5 and 11.5 months, and civil service takes 11.5 months. If you refuse both, you face up to a year in prison. Women, of course, are free to volunteer if they want to, or they can do literally anything else. Many of Finns I met online or by person are somehow indoctrinated by the army, during their service they hear nonsense arguments like: there is no enough space for women in barracks (maybe conscript less men?) or women serve by pregnancy (one of the lowest FTR in the world).

Switzerland In a referendum, men and women equally voted to keep military service (up to 8 months) or civil service (about a year) for young men only. If you are unable to serve due to health issues, you have to pay a special 3% income tax as "compensation to society." This tax applies strictly to men - even disabled men have to pay, unless their disability is severe (like being in a wheelchair or completely blind).

Estonia Military and civil service lasts up to 12 months. Recently, a high-ranking female politician stated that maybe by 2040 we could talk about conscription for women, simply because not enough boys were born in recent years to fill the quotas! (boys are just an object, so after we use all of them, we will think about force priviliged citizens to service).

Lithuania Military service lasts 9 months, and civil service is 10 months. Women can volunteer, while men are drafted every year through a randomized computer "lottery." You are the lucky one boy and don't want to serve? Prison welcome.

All the countries listed above rank incredibly high on "equality," "human rights," "democracy," and "freedom" indexes. But when it comes to young men, they are forced to serve their country and sacrifice the best years of their lives. They start their careers later, they start university later, they end up financially behind girls their age.

(to moderators: don't remove, AI used to check if the post is gramatically correct only, it's not my native language - orginally written in polish)

Hello Guys

MRActivist from Poland here. Here are few arguments why you still should use the "draft" argument in discussions with your counterparts.

In many discussions in other subreddits, I've noticed that whenever someone brings up the argument of draft and conscription, there is ALWAYS ready American feminist to respond: "Oh no, conscription hasn't exist since Vietnam War" or even more often "it's just a piece of paper for federal government, not your life, man up". This really shows how Americancentric they actually are. I want to offer some ammunition and a word of support to you American guys:

Always remember while arguing, that world does not end at the East or West coast. There are around 60 countries with active conscription in the world, and in 50 of them it applies only to male citizens. Male-only conscription is not just an issue of third-world dictatorships, it happens right in the heart of Europe - even in so called "progressive" nations, where women rights are highly respected. There we go (fact check):

• Austria Every male citizen has to serve 6 months when they turn 18. If they refuse military service, they must spend 9 months doing "civil service," which is basically underpaid forced labor in hospitals or elderly care, completely acceptable by Austrian standards of "equality." If you refuse of course you go to prison. A gap year for an Austrian boy means cleaning vomit in an ambulance on night shifts; for an Austrian girl, it's Thailand, the Maldives, or Copacabana.
• Finland Same as above, but military service lasts between 5.5 and 11.5 months, and civil service takes 11.5 months. If you refuse both, you face up to a year in prison. Women, of course, are free to volunteer if they want to, or they can do literally anything else.
• Switzerland In a referendum, men and women equally voted to keep military service (up to 8 months) or civil service (about a year) for young men only. If you are unable to serve due to health issues, you have to pay a special 3% income tax as "compensation to society." This tax applies strictly to men - even disabled men have to pay it, unless their disability is severe (like being in a wheelchair or completely blind)
• Estonia Military and civil service lasts up to 12 months. Recently, a high-ranking female politician stated that maybe by 2040 we could talk about conscription for women, simply because not enough boys were born in recent years to fill the quotas!
• Lithuania Military service lasts 9 months, and civil service is 10 months. Women can volunteer, while men are drafted every year through a randomized computer "lottery." You are the lucky one boy and don't want to serve? Prison welcome.

All the countries listed above rank incredibly high on "equality," "human rights," "democracy," and "freedom" indexes. But when it comes to young men, they are forced to serve their country and sacrifice the best years of their lives. They start their careers later, they start university later, they end up financially behind girls their age, and they can't even compete on equal footing in today's dating market.

Hey everyone,

I’m part of an organization fighting for the rights of men and boys here in Poland (The Association for Boys and Men). The scale of systemic inequality in our country is honestly massive. Just to give you an idea of what we’re dealing with:

• Retirement age gap: Men retire at 65, while women retire at 60.
• Tax perks: If a woman actually decides to work as long as a man (until 65), she gets a complete exemption from income tax. Men get no such benefit.
• Mandatory military registration: While we don't have active conscription right now, only men are forced to go through a mandatory military evaluation. It involves pretty humiliating group medical checkups just to get slapped with a military readiness category.
• The threat of conscription: With the war in Ukraine next door, there’s an ongoing debate about bringing back active conscription (which was suspended in 2009). And yep, you guessed it—it would only apply to men.
• Family courts: Men face massive bias in family courts, where about 80% of the judges are women.
• Education: Boys are falling way behind academically. They are much less likely to go to college or graduate.
• Life expectancy vs. Work: Men in Poland die 7 years earlier than women on average—yet we are forced to work 5 years longer.
• Healthcare neglect: There is a total lack of state-funded programs for men’s health. Meanwhile, the government pumps millions into fighting cervical and breast cancer.
• The "Motherhood Reward": Poland has one of the lowest fertility rates in the world (around 1.06). Despite this, legal privileges are strictly handed out to women, framed as a "reward for motherhood," which completely ignores fathers.

Our organization has grown to over 150 members now. We’re actively lobbying, meeting with politicians, and organizing an annual Men’s Congress. Unfortunately, we don't have an English version of our website or materials just yet.

I’m curious—do you have similar organizations in your countries? Are any of you active in them? And what are your thoughts on the situation in Poland?