Solaris, The End, and (kinda) Time Eater Rebunk

Solaris, The End, and (kinda) Time Eater Rebunk

This will simply be a response to a recent post, albeit it was deleted on this sub for some reason. I also won't put as many links since I sorta just want to get this done, maybe in the future I'll add some but for now yknow

SOLARIS

The rift itself was created by Solaris and the light that engulfed everything by his mere birth, and was rapidly expanding throughout all of space-time given the urgency of the situation in End of the World. Notably, Solaris reduced the sky to a void with no celestial bodies, the cast only being saved by the "spatial distortion." Essentially, it's an attack that messed up past, present, and future of the universe. Eggman makes his ever-famous statement of Solaris intending to engulf all timelines and annihilate the very meaning of time itself, and later on we see Eggman say Solaris is messing up other dimensions, meaning it's not just one universe at stake.

https://imgur.com/a/sonic-06-solaris-P7uErfi (credit to VSBW for the imgur compilation)

Now, let's get into the fight. When the fight begins, Eggman states Solaris had absorbed various dimensions and couldn't be attacked half-heartedly. We see this proven when Sonic and Shadow attempt a non-charged attack on Solaris' and his light shells. (The barrier DOES occur during phase 2, but it's at random and phase 1 specifically does this with non-charged attacks, AKA half-hearted attacks) Not only this, the hedgehogs can withstand Solaris' beams of light (same light that engulfed everything) and his meteors, which deal the same amount of damage and stun as the light. Not only this, but Solaris' light shells and his core can withstand his own meteors being thrown back at him via. Silver.

Now, I don't buy dimensional tiering, but some people do so I'll quickly address it. Eggman states the light shells are anchoring Solaris, but it's implied Eggman was incorrect as Solaris simply rose back up. And even if we assume Eggman is 100% correct and Solaris was dragged down a whole dimensional tier, Solaris was still eating the cosmology.

There's no backing for all of this to be just "hax," he uses the same light for his attacks which damage the hedgehogs, we even have backing from sources like the Encyclospeedia (which is a bit more reliable than Prima Guides) calling his lasers "world-ending" and so. He also physically absorbs dimensions into himself and even used the Chaos Emeralds to complete his fusion

THE END

The End was trapped in Supreme, and was assumingly weakened from there as Sage states during the fight against The End. Cyber Space was powered by the Chaos Emeralds, with Cyber Space being a whole reality containing suns and gathering information from around the world (assumingly other planets like Donpa Kingdom) as per Egg Memos.

https://preview.redd.it/nzujh79zsibh1.png?width=962&format=png&auto=webp&s=3b408eda57feb173233d1f7878106690403572ff

Ian Flynn is an unreliable source with the official twitter account of Bumblekast admitting he is a troll. He occasionally says things that contradict the games entirely (he claimed Chaos Control doesn't manipulate space and that the light speed dash isn't lightspeed, despite both being blatently stated.) And even his exact words about The End were "boasting" which doesn't mean lying, especially when everyone agrees that guy is something else. Also bumblekast has an entire disclaimer that its not a guarantee of information, or smth like that.

I feel like The End is one to toy with its food, part of the reason the Universe is still remaining. Though outside of that, Sonic's statement of "save everyone, everywhere" is more support for The End's superiority over all his past enemies. The End also states it made "countless stars" fall to him, just thought I'd throw that in there.

TIME EATER

I don't entirely disagree with this, mainly because of the rewrite (granted, it's a bad and unnecessary rewrite and was a stupid decision on Sonic Team's part but that's for another time.) But I do still think the Time Eater has a solid feat here. By about the end, Eggman states that "all of time" was his to do with as he pleased, thus, the Time Eater eventually got all of space-time. It's also supported by multiple external statements of the Time Eater erasing all space-time. While Tails does say "the more your monster tears through the timeline, the more damage you do to it!" Eggman isn't just erasing the timeline, he's rewriting and reshaping it, he's able to tear through a timeline he erased because he can access it and do as he pleases. We also see Crisis City, Stardust Speedway Bad Future, Sunset Heights, and Chaos Island in White Space as well. The former two are separate timelines entirely that shouldn't exist and the latter two are from the future, locations Eggman shouldn't know about. He's also capable of knocking out characters like Sonic in one-two shots, showing how powerful he is. He was also stated to have thrown the universe into chaos in the original manual for Sonic Generations.

Another point I'd like to bring up, Eggman sought to erase his past defeats, and some of them included entire dimensions, like Sonic Rush and Sonic Shuffle where the Sol Dimension and Maginaryworld (failed to obtain the Precioustone) were heavily involved in Eggman's defeat.

One final thing I'd like to bring up is when Time Eater erased Space Colony ARK, he actually wasn't even looking at the ARK and it was implied the blast made it to Earth as Sonic's screen turned white

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u/TheStinker45 — 8 hours ago
▲ 9 r/SonicScaling+1 crossposts

How fast would the Egg Mobile have to be here to make the Earth and Moon move like this?

Feat found in this stage. I'd like to use it as support for my own personal scaling

If it helps any, Classic Sonic should be about 75cm, about 2'5 or so (and at most 3'3 as per the height of his Modern counterpart.) The Egg Mobile seems comparable to his size in this specific game, tho a little taller.

it also performs a faster version of this feat, but I think this one is a good middle ground

u/TheStinker45 — 3 days ago

Infinite is NOT weak!

Let me preface this that I don't personally think Infinite is reliably stronger than people like Solaris and people like him, but I do think he gets a lot of downplay with the whole "erm, BASE SONIC beat him bro!!!" and such. Therefore, I want to make this post to highlight that Infinite is indeed worthy of the title of Eggman's ultimate weapon, and how I would scale him. I might not get every little detail but there should be a lot here. I would like to note that I'll mainly use a translation done by Windii, who has made many other translations on the Sonic franchise and I would encourage you to check them out! but you should be able to get similar things from the English localization.

Before anything else, let's establish Infinite's Phantom Ruby Prototype. Eggman had continuously worked on the Phantom Ruby Prototype before incorporating the finished product into Infinite, and even used energy sources such as the Death Egg itself to power it. He even saw it as enough to build multiple spare power sources for Infinite.

So let's go over Episode Shadow. Infinite effortlessly deals with Shadow and Omega, stating that Omega is "no better than a tot" and toyed with Shadow, and this was before he and Eggman even tuned it. Stating he has unlimited power and that he had no match, being the mightiest of all, and is confident that not even Sonic will be able to defeat him.

At the start of Sonic Forces, Infinite clowns on Sonic. Sonic is completely unable to land any attacks on him with his homing attack or boost, Tails even doing his whole "this guy is faster than Sonic!" Sonic even has trouble properly reacting to the guy, where he could at least react to Metal Sonic, Chaos, and Zavok. We then get Infinite dealing with Silver once again taking down another strong character. Sonic, however, intercepts Infinite and now he's far stronger than before, finally able to start landing some hits on the guy with techniques Infinite previously avoided effortlessly. Infinite even confirms Sonic's abilities exceed his previous data, with Sonic agreeing he grows stronger, with Infinite still holding his head in the transition to the cutscene. But despite Sonic's massive power growth, Infinite beats him.

There's not much to cover until the end, other than the cast trying to weaken Infinite and a showdown between the Rookie and Infinite, where the Rookie faces their fears with Sonic's influence. (my goat fr)

Now we're at the end of the game, Infinite still showcases his power when he deflects Omega's lasers and knocks everyone away. He then makes a virtual sun with the Phantom Ruby's power that will destroy the Resistance. However, this uses up a lot of his energy, and Tails notes that it's a golden opportunity to defeat Infinite. Sonic engages in battle, able to fight on about equal terms, but Infinite's power recharges, where the Avatar steps in to help, and the two ultimately defeat Infinite with a Double Boost. What I like about this is that Sonic may be extremely strong, but if he's having trouble, he'll have his friends to back him up. Meanwhile, Infinite has nobody to back him up, he threw everything away for power.

Then we have the Death Egg Robot, who surpasses Infinite and overclocked the original Phantom Ruby to make thousands of him, with Sonic, the Rookie, and Classic Sonic fighting and dealing damage to it.

So what does this all show us? Well, Infinite was defeated by "Base Sonic," sure, but it ignores a lot of how they got there, it ignores how Sonic first got completely clowned on, it ignores how everyone was trying to weaken Infinite, it ignores Sonic having to get much stronger to even touch the guy, etc.

So, Infinite scaling. This'll be less about the tiering but who he can scale above. Eggman himself says Infinite is his ultimate weapon, so we can solidly place Infinite above anything Eggman created by himself with little to no external support. Such as Gemerl, Super Egg Robot, and True Area 53 Boss for example. He also effortlessly beat Base Sonic and was stated to be Sonic's most powerful enemy yet, an external statement that is backed up by everything here. We can use this to say he's stronger than all of Base Sonic's enemies making him much stronger than previous base foes. These include Erazor Djinn, Master Core: ABIS, Nega Wisp Armor, Egg Dragoon, Emerl, Adventure Perfect Chaos (Gens), and so on.

Of course, maybe you can make the argument that Infinite (& DER) > Egg Salamander, Wizard, and Time Eater since they fall under his defeats and weapons, but overall I think this is the most solid thing.

u/TheStinker45 — 8 days ago

The Arabian Nights, and why it likely isn't 1,001 Universes

Before we start, I agree Erazor Djinn scales pretty high, I'd say he's solidly Universal to possibly low-multiversal, and planetary with downplay. However, I've seen "Erazor Djinn absorbed 1,0001 Universes" thrown around and at first I believed it, but this isn't actually the case I think. Let's look at why this is:

First off, different stories/worlds are visible from each other and regular people seem to be able to casually travel from them. This doesn't mean some other stories don't take place in other realms, but a lot of them take place within the main realm.

Next, Sonic's statement of "worlds of endless adventures." Firstly, this was likely just a metaphorical statement since it's supported by the previous point and that he was talking about the sheer variety in the world of the Arabian Nights, from genies of flame to pirates. But also, that the original Japanese script just says "a world of endless adventures."

Finally, we have the Prima Guide statement of "an infinite space," but the big problem here is that the Prima Guide, is, well, a Prima Guide. It's not a very reliable source and there's not much in-game to support the hallway being infinite.

So how big is the Arabian Nights actually? We have three (technically 4 or 5) realms, the main realm which a majority of the adventure takes in, including a planet, the moon, the sun, and starry skies. We have the Spirit World, which is said to be the spiritual part of the world and is seemingly connected to Night Palace. It visually contains innumerable stars and Big sees it as the Milky Way. We have Jahannam, or hell, mentioned by Erazor and Sonic, and is where the Ifrit Golem comes from. Finally, we have Lost Prologue which is a space that connects the Book World to Reality, and the Night Palace door that also connects reality and the Book World.

So all in all, the Arabian Nights contains 3 realms that are considered part of the world, and 1-2 things in-between. As we know, Erazor Djinn was reaping the words of the book and was absorbing the power of the book, causing the world inside to be erased. He also seemingly controls Night Palace, which likely encompasses him controlling the Spirit World. I would also even like to note the World Ring of Sadness was located in the Spirit World. So, while we don't have the 1,001 universes, we have a solid Universal to possibly Low-Multiversal feat for our favorite blue hedgehog, which is still really good!

Edit: Bolded a few things and adjusted my wording at some points, pretty much the same thing.

u/TheStinker45 — 9 days ago

Doodles of a possible personal take of Needles and M0uses

Image 1: Reference to a Dragon Ball cover. Also meant to be a "what-if" scenario where the real Sonic enters Sarah's world after a "bad-end" of the series. Sarah has refused to move on and continued to harm others, and Sonic recognizes that, so the only thing he can do is take her down and turn a bad ending into a neutral ending. This one I'm pretty happy with, so I put it first!

Image 2: The first doodle I made. Sarah's design is based off of the old U.S Sonic covers as well as some more recent art by ShutupJojo, particularly the palette and somewhat the eyes. I wanted to help carry a "twisted circus" vibe with her design. Also some lazy doodles of what could be her outfit in the 60's.

Image 3: Possible Luther design. Since I did the U.S thing with Sarah, I decided to do it with Luther. I ended up removing the tails since I felt the design would get a bit too overwhelming. I also wanted to show him being an old ass man here lmfao

u/TheStinker45 — 2 months ago