u/Venjunnah

Image 1 — Infinitives in Konehian: internally verbs, externally nouns.
Image 2 — Infinitives in Konehian: internally verbs, externally nouns.
Image 3 — Infinitives in Konehian: internally verbs, externally nouns.
Image 4 — Infinitives in Konehian: internally verbs, externally nouns.

Infinitives in Konehian: internally verbs, externally nouns.

Hello folks. Today I put some effort into learning syntax trees*, because I got stuck with my grammar*, although I haven't gone through the more recent theories yet, so the way I illustrated these trees might be wrong or even outdated in fashion. I provided some glosses to help you out with the morphology. Now you might ask, why this specific look? I think my conlang is meant to be an a priori, but inspired from Romanian, Ancient Greek and with a funny twist, some active-stative alignment.

To be more specific, we are talking about an agentive-default fluid-s typology. I believe this means that the agentive case is the default unmarked one, whereas the patientive case is marked. In most cases, Konehian behaves like a Nominative-Accusative language I'd say. Verbs may have the active voice, the passive voice. But also, an antipassive, or at least, that is my goal. I would say that the S argument, the subject of an intransitive clause, can be either agentive or patientive, depending on volition (Sa and Sp). If A is the subject of the transitive clause, also known as an agent, and if P is the object of the transitive clause, the patient, I might just say that Sa = A and Sp = P, when it comes to case morphology. For these reasons, I dropped entirely labels such as NOM, ACC, ERG, ABS and just went with A (agentive case) and P (patientive case).

I believe the antipassive voice is used in Konehian to express a lack of volition, for a transitive clause. I would think that:

1SG.A pour-PRS.ACT.1SG water-DEF-P
"I pour the water."

would turn into:

1SG.P pour-PRET.ANTIP.1SG water-INS
"I spilled with water."

I am not sure 100% if this is how an antipassive may work, but that is what I concluded from my discussions with fellow conlangers. Word order is indeed SVO mostly. Konehian is not afraid of obliques. You can see what happens to "water" above. Also, the active voice is yet again, unmarked I'd say.

Now onto infinitives. I am not sure yet how bare infinitives work in Konehian, but "articular" infinitives are surely funky. They introduce an infinitive clause. In the main clause, these may function as nouns, they can be agents, patients, maybe even oblique. But within their own clause, they function as verbs. They decline for tense, which is really just aspect, voice but not number nor person! How are articular infinitives made? You just add the DEF.ABST article? -or, after the stem. Konehian definiteness works like in Romanian most likely, you do not have a separate determiner or article that precedes the noun, you just glue it to the end of the stem. Metasti (people) becomes metastia (the people). Mozu (zombie) becomes mozur (the zombie). Ruz (war) becomes ruzor (the war). Ditas (station) becomes ditaste (the station). You get it. Different articles, I suppose depending on the gender. Konehian has three genders: abstractive, animate and inanimate. You can see some of these featured in the given glosses. So I suppose that the articular infinitive uses an abstractive definiteness marker. Much like other abstract nouns. This makes sense, after all, if ubrèq means "to liberate", ubrèqor means "the deed of liberating", this deed being an abstract concept.

Funny thing, infinitive clauses, whose verb is the articular infinitive itself, accept both a non-overt subject and an object. The case marker on the articular infinitive is actually the case function of the NP of the infinitive clause, as governed by the matrix verb. In gloss 2.1.1, you can see that Ubrèqor Eyzenlomon functions as the NP, and it is the subject of the main clause. But in 2.1.2 example, ubrèqoron Eyzenlomon is the object of the main clause, as such, the infinitive shows that. In both instances, Eyzenlom is the direct object within the infinitive clause. Hence the -on ending.

In 2.2.1 example, I tested how a reflexive aorist agentive articular infinitive may work (weird naming convention, I know). By reflexive, I think I mostly mean the middle voice, although there is also a mediopassive voice when I tried to use the reflexive as an intransitive (but this happened in indicative verbs). See Romanian "Se moare mult." as such an example. The verb is reflexive and it accepts an adverb, but otherwise it has no object I'd say. Mediopassive in Konehian also happens only for 3SG. Anyways, since the subject is implied in infinitive clauses, and since the reflexive voice implies that the agent is also the patient of the clause, I tend to believe that the object of the clause is simply dropped, as it is equated to the implied subject. The focus is not on Thirinda (see the gloss for 2.2.1.) but on the deed of self-liberation itself. This also might imply that Thirindae (genitive of Thirinda) is not part of the infinitive clause. You could switch the articular reflexive aorist infinitive ubrèdàtor for something like english "cat". You can totally say "Thirinda's cat encouraged people further.", according to Konehian grammar, which could further be simplified to "The cat encouraged people further."

I would say that the aorist form of the infinitive is the least marked of all forms. I am really curious to see how this will work for the antipassive voice. An antipassive infinitive? That sounds fun. I could imagine the object of the infinitive clause to be put into an oblique case, or perhaps entirely dropped, but not so sure what happens to the implied subject. Overall, I am not sure if my reasoning for all of this is proper, nor how naturalistic any of this may seem, but I tried my best, it isn't perfect and there is plenty of work to do, but I was wondering what you think about this, overall. If you got some advice, it is welcomed.

u/Venjunnah — 11 hours ago

Hello, this is part two of showcasing one of my newest projects, the one of the Banatian language, for the country Banatia, which includes the historical region Banat. Feel free to check my other post, should you wish to know more. In this post I will talk about prosody (stress for now) and the possible choices I got. You can find the reasoning also in the second image, for those who prefer images. I have also included a map of the Temeschwar metro, in this alternate timeline.

We have the word Banatzënismusch (compare to Romanian bănățenism, German Banatismus and Hungarian Bánátizmus). When I came up with this word, I wanted to test the limits of Banatian prosody and potentially its phonotactics. I wanted a pidgin-like vibe, one where Romanian, German and Hungarian influences would be felt. Maybe I will also include Serbian ones in other words. But for this particular one, here is the plan:

Etymology: Banatzën + -ismusch. Banatzën comes from Banat + -ën. Compare -ismusch to German -ismus and Hungarian -izmus. The reason for the final consonant being [ʃ] instead of [s] is due to a Hungarian substratum borrowing. The inclusion of -ën- when compared to Banatismus and Bánátizmus is a Banat Romanian dialect influence (see Romanian bănățenism), from -an (ex: bănățan, compare to standard Romanian -ean, bănățean).

Notice the German inspired orthography. Based on previous comments on reddit on my first post, I have chosen ë to represent the Schwa. I am still yet to determine what [ɨ] would be.

Translations of terms:

Banat: (historical region. The name of the country Banatia derives from it).

Banatzën: (of people from Banatia, especially male) Banatian. Romanian bănățean rather refers to the people from the historical region of Banat).

Banatzënismusch: (of a doctrine, system, philosophy or social movement) Banatism, bănățenism.

Stress placement examples according to various prosody. Arrows indicate stress intensity:

  1. Ba↑-na↓-tzë↑-nis↓-musch↑ [ˈba.naːˌt͡sə.nisˌmuʃ] (Hungarian-based, quantity-insensitive, trochaic)

2. Ba↑-na↓-tzë↓-nis↑-musch↓ [ˈba.naː.t͡səˌnis.muʃ] (Hungarian-based, quantity-sensitive, irregular)

3. Ba↑-na↓-tzë↓-nis↑-musch↓ [ˌba.naː.t͡səˈnis.muʃ] (German-based, quantity-insensitive, irregular)

4. Ba↓-na↑-tzë↓-nis↑-musch↓ [baˌnaːt͡səˈnis.muʃ] (German-based, quantity-sensitive, iambic)

  1. Ba↑-na-tzë-nis-musch [ˈba.naː.t͡sə.nis.muʃ] (Hungarian-based, no discernable secondary stress)

6. Ba-na-tzë-nis↑-musch [ba.naː.t͡səˈnis.muʃ] (German-based, no discernable secondary stress).

I tend to believe that the Swabian led administration established in Temeschwar, the capital of Banatia, would have had somewhat of an influence on the orthography of this new national standard. As for whether the prosody is Hungarian or German inspired, I like the German one more, it just so happens that it coincides somewhat to the Romanian one too (see bănățenism).

What do you think of these prosody examples for this given word, Banatzënismusch? Hope you liked the metro map, still working on it.

u/Venjunnah — 2 months ago

Hello, I would like to attempt to create a mixed language surrounding the Banat region in Europe. Things would branch off ever since the proclamation of the Banat Republic, in 1918, at Temeschwar (Timișoara), after which the rest is alternative history. In this scenario, the republic not only survives all perils but also (perhaps, although very unlikely) becomes a Greater Banatian state, including much of the current DKMT Euroregion and Bihor, with its capital in Temeschwar.

I believe that since the efforts to constitute a Banatian state were mostly lead by German Schwabians, German would be initially seen as a language of the elites, used in high administration and would influence the progress of the making of this conlang. But perhaps sometime after the 30s or 40s, a Banatian language reform would occur, which would aim for some sort of compromise.

My question is, how could I make a compromise between German, Romanian, Hungarian and Serbian? The vocabulary seems fairly easy to handle, as even Romanian Banat dialect speakers have borrowed many such words from these languages; same can be said for the others in the region. But the tricky part is the actual morphology and syntax. I would either go with a German based substrate grammar or a Romanian based one. In the second attached image, I have provided a showcase of the Romanian based example, for the German word for street, rendered in Banatian.

Would the Romanian based example be plausible? I would imagine German feminine Straße becomes Banatian neuter schtross [ˈʃtrɔs]. Why neuter? Because Romanian nouns ending in a consonant can either be masculine or neuter. In the nominative, the indefinite plural is kept like in German. However, this noun gains definite enclitic forms: schtrossu and schtrossel (compare to Romanian sg. indef. picior - sg. def. piciorul and pl. indef. picioare - pl. def. picioarele, meaning "leg"). In Romanian, -ul in informal and regional speech is often rendered as -u (picioru'). For the indefinite plural, I just used the German feminine one, hence in Romanian, the neuter is in fact a feminine for the plural.

Lugosch is a city in Banatia and in real life Romania (Lugoj). I would imagine that German Lugoscher ("from Lugosch") would become Lugoschär [ˈlugɔʃər]. I think Banatian reform would render written as [ə] and written as [ɨ], Banatians would write Romania as Rumënia perhaps, or Rumënien. But what if we want to say: Calea Lugojului (a city main arterial road going towards Lugosch) in Banatian? Would this reform adopt a romance-like syntax, making it Schtrossu Lugoschär? Or would it be more German, such as Lugoschär Schtross?

I wonder what you think of this, how a compromise could be achieved. I am aware there are many factors to take into consideration, such as how the demographics of Temeschwar might have progressed, since the administration would be there, but also how to make the provinces happy. I do wonder if in 100 years the Banatian language could be somewhat unrecognizable from its parent languages.

u/Venjunnah — 2 months ago