We always talk about how underwhelming playline boy dolls are compared to the girls... what are examples of boy dolls done well?

Note that this is strictly referring to playline/mass market dolls aimed at regular consumers, so no limited-edition collector dolls (sorry Valentine and Spelldon) and no niche lines (sorry Integrity Toys and resin BJDs).

One of the common issues with boy dolls is how bland men's fashion is in general, which limits your options in how to keep them as attention-grabbing as female dolls. The problem is it's easier to name examples of boy dolls doing it wrong and not what they're actually doing right. The one common shortcut I've seen is going ham on the color, like with Rainbow/Shadow High or that one Barbie Extra hawaiian shirt Ken.

I can't explain how, but some MGA doll lines like the OG Bratz and LOL OMG boys feel more... "substantial" than their Barbie/Monster High counterparts. Maybe it's down to details like more realistic clothing construction and actual jewelry/accessories? Or just more daring color choices in general? (Though personally I think G3 Clawd is pretty good compared to some LOL OMGs.)

While they're more inconsistent across the board, Asian blind box BJDs found an approach to boy dolls I'm surprised isn't more common: anime aesthetics. Between most shonen series and games like Genshin Impact, there are more than enough elaborate boy looks that'd probably translate well into doll form. Plus at least one blind box BJD series isn't afraid to dress boys in more androgynous looks, though for obvious reasons this'll never sell in the US.

Thoughts? What's your go-to example of a well-executed boy doll?

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u/axilog14 — 11 days ago
▲ 454 r/mirrormi+1 crossposts

Official look at all the Mirror Mi minis

Official look from Instagram account since we already saw the first four this morning but also the other two girls!

u/Miss_Biv — 1 month ago

Confession: I always felt weird being a doll enjoyer who doesn't like pink.

Yes, I'll admit that it's probably some lingering gender trauma growing up. I'm somewhere on the nonbinary spectrum and am rediscovering my love of toys. I don't have anything against overly "girly" dolls, I just have really specific preferences. And unfortunately one of those preferences is "oh god not pink".

I know there's nothing wrong with that and everybody has their own personal taste in dolls, but I still feel awkward having such a strong irrational aversion to something so central to the doll community. I never really had a proper Barbie phase. I avoid Draculaura like the plague, and I'd probably be one of those weirdos who'd rather buy Elissabat for the sole reason that she's "Draculaura but purple." I got a blind box doll just the other day, and literally the only doll I didn't want was the pink one. Guess which one I opened, lol.

Weirdly the exception to this was when I collected Mini Lalaloopsy dolls, probably because they leaned more into whimsical DIY motifs rather than "traditional" feminine styles. I may also enjoy pink more if it was used in a more "alt" context, like in scene/emo or goth-styled fashions.

Anyway sorry for the rant, just wanted to get this off my chest. Did anyone else ever deal with mixed feelings about pink in their doll hobby?

u/axilog14 — 2 months ago

The problem with the "fashion" in "fashion doll"

Given the Generation Girl post and all the recent Mirror Mi discussion, this might be a good time for everybody to talk about exactly how we understand the concept of a "fashion doll".

We are NOT talking about big heads or body diversity

First of all, this is not the place to discuss body/face sculpts or weird proportions. I'm referring to stuff like larger body representation, skin tones, big heads on Rainbow High, the Ever After High "pancake face", or how everybody just seems to dislike LOL OMG faces. That is 1) a topic for another post, and 2) a MASSIVE can of worms on the history of fashion, femininity, aesthetics and some surprising subcultures.

We are NOT talking about enshittification

This isn't the place to discuss the declining quality of dolls and doll clothes either. That's mostly a capitalism/economics issue out of our control or understanding as consumers.

Fashion vs. "High-Concept"

One of the things I noticed in discussions about playline dolls is the muddying of the waters between dolls actually centered around fashion and "high-concept" dolls, the blanket term for dolls themed around a sort of "elevated" non-mundane concept. Monster High is high concept. Novi Stars and Lalaloopsy are high concept. The various Barbie fairy tale dolls are high concept. Most IP-centric dolls like DC and Winx Club are high concept. This difference is very important.

(For the purposes of this post historical dolls like American Girl are "traditional" fashion dolls, since the clothes are rooted in realism rather than some fantastical concept. And as weird as it sounds, lines like Licca and Disney ILY are closer to traditional fashion dolls than high concept dolls.)

Stating the obvious

This should probably go without saying, but fashion dolls and high-concept dolls are not doing the same thing. They have fundamentally different goals, which means they are following different rules when it comes to aesthetics or character design.

"But it's possible to do both! They're not mutually exclusive", you're probably saying. And it's a fair assumption to make in theory. In practice, however, this often leads to a lot of problems.

The Monster High problem

Monster High, particularly G3, is perhaps the biggest example of how trying to "have it both ways" can backfire. The complaint you hear over and over again is there's nothing inherently "monstrous" about G3 fashion, leaning more towards either watered-down Gen Z microtrends or colorful "child-friendly" styles. (My hot take is that this is not a complaint unique to G3, and that too many people are just biased towards G1 because of millennial nostalgia.)

I think doll consumers/collectors underestimate the balancing act toy designers have to navigate between a doll line taking cues from contemporary fashions while still being "on theme" with high concept. And weirdly I think the weak point here isn't the "fashion" side but the "monster" side.

Looks can't be "objectively" monstrous and are heavily context-specific, and that context is often pop culture. Much of our idea of "fashion" for Dracula and Frankenstein was heavily dictated by the original Universal Studios horror movies. Clowns weren't monstrous until Stephen King, Batman and John Wayne Gacy made them monstrous. Gothic styles aren't inherently "evil" unless you were an Evangelical during the Satanic Panic.

High concept imposes limitations on visual language that a general fashion mandate doesn't. Cleo must always retain some kind of Egyptian motif. Draculaura HAS to be pink. Lagoona's bottoms have to accommodate her leg fins (except when they don't). If I was a fashion designer trying to stretch the limits of what makes an outfit "werewolf-like" for three years straight I'd probably have a headache too.

"Kid-friendly"

Related to the concept of limited visual language is the idea of making a doll generically colorful and "kid-friendly". A lot of people (including actual toy companies) seem to think this counts as a third category alongside "fashion" and "high-concept", but it's really not. And doll lines understanding this could make the difference between longevity and flaming out after a single wave. Lalaloopsy can be considered a high-concept take on kid-friendly, while Decora Girls lean more on the fashion side.

IMO this is one of the biggest weaknesses of modern Barbie: they think just making dolls bright and colorful are enough to make them appealing, overlooking that coherent fashion standards matter too. Barbie Extra and Dream Besties are trying to thread this needle, but the result is still too garish to actually cross over to wider audiences.

Generational baggage

And then there's the matter of both clothes and fashion tastes changing over the years, meaning people have subjective opinions on what makes a doll well-designed or not, and far too many of those opinions are distorted by nostalgia goggles. This is my biggest headache when comparing G1 and G3 Monster High, and I don't wanna get into that here. This is also relevant when discussing different eras of Barbie, or why the Bratz reboot was such a mixed bag.

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u/axilog14 — 3 months ago

BGC to Merville in the morning: alternative to West Service Road?

Just wanted to check if there's an easier way to commute from BGC to Kalayaan in the morning. Is West Service Road still one-way from 6-10am? Is this also on weekends?

So far the best route I've found is taking the FTI jeep at Market! Market!, getting off at East Service Road, taking the DOST/Bicutan jeep then crossing the SLEX overpass to take the Sun Valley/Merville jeep. Is there really no other alternative?

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u/axilog14 — 4 months ago