r/Arvanites

Going forward moderation of the subreddit will be MUCH stricter. There will be ZERO tolerance for Albanian nationalism, cultural or historical appropriation and disinformation. There will also be ZERO tolerance of posts and comments in Albanian.

Some things that will get you banned are comments like:

"Epirus was Albanian"❌

"Arvanites descend from Albanians"❌

"Arvanites are Albanians"❌

"Arvanitica is Albanian"❌

"Greece has Albanian lands"❌

What you CAN say is:

"Arvanites and Albanians come from the same group"✅

"Arvanitica and Albanian have a common root"✅

So be VERY mindful of what you post.

What is a "perceived ancestor"? This is a term I have translated from Greek (νοητός πρόγονος), it means the ancestors which someone THINKS he has, and the ancestors someone sees his CURRENT identity into. When it comes to "perceived ancestors", the objective reality doesn't matter as they factor in only when national consciousness (a social construct defined by sense of belonging) comes into play.

Who were Mercurios and Thomas Buas? They were Arvanites from Argolis. With ties to the power families of Angeloi and Spatha. Their ancestors ruled Aetolia until Karolos Tokos took it.

Tzanes Koroneos writes: "And Karolos ruled Angelokastron, and took what wasn't his. And 2 nephews, Buas of lord Mouriki, hid and run away. [They went to Constantinople] then the king welcomed them and said they should not be afraid (of Karolos) anymore and sent them in the Moreas to rule.[...]"

Mercurios Buas:

Mercurios Buas was born in Nauplio in 1478. At 11 years old he had to leave the Peloponnese with his father and some other rebels. It was at that point he changed his name from Maurikios to Mercurios. From then on he went to become a general of the Holy Roman Empire.

Kostas Krystallis writes: "He fought with no end as the head of his Hellenic combrades in the plains and the mountains of Europe.[...] Always giving victory to the lord that hosted them and glory to his Hellenic heritage."

He was a founding member of the Hellenic brotherhood of Venice.

Thomas Buas:

Around 1514 king Henry of England hired some Greek Arvanites "Stradioti" in his army. Nicander Nucius from Corfu follows a division lead by Thomas of Argos(Buas), Antinios Stisinos and Theodoros Louchisis.

During the siege of Boulogne, Thomas and Nicander find themselves face to face with 1000 French cavalry, with only 500 soldier of their own.

At this moment, Nicander writes, Thomas turned to his soldiers and said: "Comrades, as you understand we have found ourselves in a place far away, serving a monarch of the far north. We have nothing of our country except our bravery and courage and the courage we will use to fight the enemy, because their numbers are not enough for our own virtue. We are children of Hellenes and we have nothing to fear of this barbarian horde, all we have to do is fight bravely and win, proving through our actions the ancient military might of the Hellenes."

Sources:

Konstantinos Sathas: HELLENICA ANEKDOTA

Kostas Krystallis: APANTA

Tzane Koroneos: MERCURIO ANDRAGATHEMATA

Nicholas Pappas: STRADIOTI BALKAN MERCENARIES IN THE 15TH AND 16TH CENTURY ITALY

"Αλβανικόν αλφαβητάριον κατά το εν Ελλάδι ομιλούμενον αλβανικόν ιδίωμα :Εκκαθαρισθέν και επιδιορθωθέν βοήθημα των γονέων και εγχειρίδιον των αλβανικών τέκνων ... Εν Αθήναις :Εκ του Τυπογραφείου ""Η Φωνή της Αλβανίας"", 1882."

"Eκ των παρατεθειμένων συμπεραίνεται νομίζω ότι η ιλλυρική γλώσσα ην ουχί αλλότρια της ελληνικής, αλλά διάλεκτος αυτής απωτέρα των άλλων και οι Ιλλυριοί ελληνικόν φύλον."

Identified Albanian settlements in the Peloponnese, according to the Ottoman taxation cadastre of 1460–1463. Many of these settlements have since been abandoned, while others have been renamed.[36] Out of the 580 inhabited villages, 407 are listed as Albanian, 169 as Greek, and four as mixed; the average number of families residing in Albanian villages was 3.5 times smaller than that of the Greek ones.[37]

Source:Liakopoulos, Georgios C. (2019). The Early Ottoman Peloponnese: a study in the light of an annotated edition princeps of the TT10-1/14662 Ottoman taxation cadastre (ca. 1460–1463). Gingko.

When Irene passed away, I was surprised to learn that Albania was mourning the death of an Albanian actress at the same time as us. Until I learned that the actress was Irene Pappas.... So what was the nationality of Irene Pappas and what was the evidence of her being Albanian? There are 3 reasons she is considered Albanian by some. I will try to present them fairly and debunk them.

Argument 1) "Her real surname (Lelekou) is Albanian" The surname "Lelekas/Leleku" comes from the Turkish word "leylek" meaning "stork". Its not a uniquely Albanian name. "Lelekas" exists in Greek as a loanword for "tall".

Argument 2) "She was an arvanite" while the reasons why the term "Arvanite" and "Albanian" are not interchangeable has been explained already I need to mention that there is no strong evidence of her being of Arvanitic roots. Her 2 villages of origin (Chiliomodi and Preveza) are not historically Arvanitic. Not that I completely reject the possibility of Arvanitic roots from the villages neighboring Chiliomodi

Argument 3) "She said she was Albanian in an interview." While this argument is strong. It contradicts live action footage of Irene declaring not only her Greek nationality but also her descent from Ancient Greeks. In the below 1995 interview the question of Greek contributions to European culture comes up. For which Irene had this to say "They (the Europeans) need to understand that we are a preserved people that lives in the same place and speaks the same language with few differences since ancient times."