r/musichistory

▲ 0 r/musichistory+1 crossposts

Exploring the Trojan Horse Role of White Artistry in the Underground

I’ve been reading Amiri Baraka’s Blues People, specifically “Swing—From Verb to Noun,” and I think a lot of what he was describing in jazz still applies to how Black music enters white America today, especially once money gets involved.

Baraka’s point is that Black music comes out of a specific way of living and seeing the world. White musicians could learn the sound without sharing the life that produced it. Once that happens, the white artist can become a kind of shell for that music, a familiar face that helps carry it into a market already built to understand him.

Condition becomes costume.

A lot of Black culture comes from adapting to circumstances that weren’t chosen. Poverty, segregation, incarceration. Black people experience those conditions and create culture inside of them.

Later somebody else can purchase that aesthetic.

You can put on the clothes, use the slang, copy the posture, rap about the lifestyle, and take it back off whenever you want. The cultural appearance gets separated from the experience that produced it.

From verb to noun.

I love the name of Baraka’s chapter.

The verb is the living thing. People doing something because it means something inside their actual lives.

Then American capital turns it into a noun. It gets named, packaged and sold as a genre.

Black experience produces slang, flow, cadence, fashion and sound. Then those things can be packaged so cleanly that somebody can buy the image without ever touching the life underneath it.

The Trojan horse.

This is what I keep thinking about with white UG rappers.

For a lot of America in the 1920s, their first idea of jazz came through white musicians influenced by
Black musicians instead of the Black founders. The Original Dixieland Jazz Band became the first jazz band to record, and Baraka points out that they were heard by much of America before the actual Black innovators.

That’s the Trojan horse role.

The Black culture inside. The white artist gives it a face America already knows how to understand.

The parasitic translation.

As swing moved further into American culture, white swing musicians got access to studio work and higher-paying opportunities while Black musicians were being excluded from those same opportunities.

The creature feasting on it thrives. The people who made it don’t.

Participation isn’t automatically exploitation.

I wanna make this clear because Baraka does too.

He says white participation in jazz wasn’t always just imitation. He gives Bix Beiderbecke credit as an actual innovator and talks about white musicians who genuinely entered the music and made something of their own through it.

The debt still exists.

Even when white musicians developed legitimate styles of their own, Baraka still says the debt to Black music and the culture it came from had to be understood.

You can participate. You can innovate. You can make great shit.

But the lineage doesn’t disappear just because the music wears a different face.

Would love to hear thoughts or criticisms.

u/Minzyfifty — 14 hours ago

Tom Jones experienced prejudice for being a White singer who loved R&B. Never-the-less he ignored critics by inviting lots of Black artists to perform with him... 1969

"Things were different then," he said. "To get a black female singer on my show… you couldn't do certain songs if it had anything to do with relationships. 

"I couldn't believe it, because in Britain it's not like that... In Britain, on British television shows, I never had any trouble."

IN America things were different.

Tom's of American rhythm and blues helped Welsh singer score international hits and achieve fame and fortune. But, back in 1969, that love also gave him a taste of something far less pleasant.

Jones had just welcomed American singer Wilson Pickett to his TV show This is Tom Jones and had been thrilled with their soulful duet of the Beatles classic Hey Jude.

After post-show drinks, Jones told Pickett how much he loved singing R&B and that's when things got a bit "unlovely."

"He said 'That was an excuse for rhythm and blues,'" Jones recalled in an interview with CBC's The National.

Welsh singer Tom Jones published his autobiography Over the Top and Back in 2015. (Penguin Books )

"I said, 'It didn't seem like that to me.'  

"'No,' he said. 'Because you're white.'" 

Pickett went further. 

"'Before long we're not going to need you. We'll have our own TV shows,' Jones recalled the soul singer-songwriter saying.

"I said, 'Wait a minute. Whoa. What's going on? I just love singing it. You know what I mean?'

Jones is among a wide group of British musicians of the era — from the Rolling Stones to Eric Clapton to Joe Cocker — who were inspired by, embraced and borrowed heavily from black American peers.

He recalled that, as his 1965 hit It's not Unusual climbed the charts in the U.S., one black radio DJ found it hard to believe Jones was actually from Wales.

"'Whoever is singing this song is not white. He may be passing for white, but he's not white,'" Jones recalled the DJ saying.

In the years since, Jones has reinvented himself — singing everything from pop to rock to country. But it's R&B he still seems to cherish the most, harkening back to his days listening to BBC Radio as a child.

*Pictured above with Florence LaRue and Marilyn McCoo of the 5th Dimension.

u/Simple_Ddog — 15 hours ago
▲ 296 r/musichistory+2 crossposts

Howlin’ Wolf - Smoke Stack Lightning - You Can't Be Beat - Chess Record Corp.1618

One of Howlin’ Wolf’s most iconic recordings — hypnotic, driving, and unmistakably his. This side captures Wolf’s haunting vocal style and the band’s tight, pulsing groove that helped define the Chicago blues sound. A cornerstone track in blues history and one of the most influential sides ever cut for Chess.

From The Neven78 Radio Archive

https://youtube.com/@mamlishblues?si=Gqffijs3211mMsnH

u/BigAssQuanta — 1 day ago
▲ 46 r/musichistory+5 crossposts

A deep tribute to Elis Regina and the dark prophecy of "Como Nossos Pais" (From an Italian listener)

Hello everyone,I’m an independent content creator from Rome, Italy. I run a small sanctuary for "lonely people" where I deeply analyze the darkest and most emotional pages of music history.Last night, in the dark, I dedicated a full narrative documentary to the immense Elis Regina and "Como Nossos Pais". To me, that song is not just music; it’s a clinical autopsy of a crushed generation.I wanted to focus heavily on the historical atmosphere of 1976, her inner cracks, and the dark shadow surrounding her death at 36—knowing that the coroners who signed her autopsy were deeply tied to the military regime.Even though my video essay is in Italian, I wanted to share this with you as a sincere act of love and respect for Brazilian music and history from an Italian perspective. You can feel the atmosphere and her voice fading into the dark at the end.Long live the Hurricane.

https://youtu.be/N0T869MWny0?is=hqFBE8cqR\_h2kNAl

Thank you

u/Tough_Bat_305 — 1 day ago
▲ 13 r/musichistory+3 crossposts

Armando Orefiche’s Havana Cuban Boys

Afro‑Cuban / Cuban dance music

Mid‑20th‑century Latin orchestra.

A vibrant Cuban dance classic from Ernesto Lecuona, performed by Armando Orefiche’s celebrated Havana Cuban Boys. This ffrr London pressing captures the group’s polished orchestral sound and Orefiche’s elegant piano work. A lively, rhythmic piece reflecting the golden era of Cuban popular music.

u/BigAssQuanta — 1 day ago

Where were you when you first heard Manu Chao?

I saw this (so-so) documentary about Clandestino and it reminded me what a masterpiece this album and his body of work is. Particularly for the way it was made, the way it was distributed, the audience it spoke to, the topics it made visibLe… truly not your average album or marketing strategy. As I remember, all copies had photocopied sleeves and pirate CDs, and I think this wasn’t necessarily a mishap on the artist‘s part. I have a feeling most listeners came across Manu Chao through their foreign adventures, or from a friend who’d just come back from South America or Nepal or some location a little less fancy than Ubud. You listen to it long enough (which is easy to do) and you start (thinking you are) feeling like a refugee or a stateless citizen. His live performances were also insanely energetic - watch him on stage if you haven’t. I’m not a devoted fan by any means, but boy, he's achieved something very few musicians have.

youtu.be
u/PostDisillusion — 4 days ago

aug 16...on this day in music history...we lost both the king (of rock) in 1977 and the queen (of soul) in 2018....

u/oldnyker — 3 days ago
▲ 50 r/musichistory+11 crossposts

Emil Muench “Hobellied (Kreutzer)” (Victor 4583)

This Victor recording made in 1908 disc captures Muench’s clear, disciplined tone in Kreutzer’s “Hobellied,” a sentimental craftsman’s song celebrating honest labor and melody. The label design — featuring the His Master’s Voice trademark and gold‑on‑black typography — represents the grandeur of Victor’s pre‑WWI aesthetic.Digitized and presented by The Neven78 Radio Archive, preserving the artistry and sound of America’s immigrant‑era recordings.

youtu.be
u/BigAssQuanta — 4 days ago

What song to commemorate landing on the moon on July 21, 1969?

***Correction photo taken on July 20, 1969***
Apollo 11 Hasselblad image from film magazine 40/S - EVA. The image of astronaut Neil Armstrong photographing astronaut Aldrin is clearly seen in the reflections on the helmet visor of astronaut Aldrin. Astronaut Armstrong, the Lunar Module Eagle, and the shadow cast by Aldrin are mirrored in the reflection. Astronaut Aldrin showing boots and suit discoloration caused by adhering lunar soil.
Date
20 July 1969
Source
https://tothemoon.im-ldi.com/gallery/Apollo/11/7#AS11-40-5903
Author
Neil A. Armstrong

reddit.com
u/sharegreatideas — 6 days ago

Where to find easy, well organized historical chart listings?

I am looking for a song or 6 to cover, preferably something obscure and not well known. For example, "I Love Rock And Roll", as covered by Joan Jet, was first recorded by the Arrows, and was a top 20 hit in the UK in the 60s. In other words, basically no one in the US had heard it, but it was catchy enough to chart *somewhere*, so was a good candidate for a cover. I'm hoping to finds some similar songs, which will require a certain amount of virtual crate digging, and a fairly efficient way to do that would be to just go through, listening to, say, the billboard top 40 for any given week, any number of decades ago, one song at a time, probably via Youtube, possibly Spotify or similar.

The question is, where to find these lists. I was considering subscribing to Billboard.com, but they are very cagey about what you get with that ($187 a year!) subscription, and I see nothing about access to historical charts. someone on another reddit thread suggested www.thechartbook.co.uk, but it's just difficult to tell what you get for your money - the samples they show never actually list the hits, in order, by week, it's all collated in these very random ways as far as I can tell. Meanwhile, if I just download a single issue of billboard from ages ago, I have to dig though pages and pages of fairly useless articles and ephemera to find the actual charts, which are then hard to cut and paste into youtube to find the songs.

Does know where I could consistently find historical pop/r&b charts in an easy to parse manner? Where I could easily get from "May 8 1963" to listening to the songs on that chart, with the least effort?

reddit.com
u/TheBestMePlausible — 7 days ago
▲ 180 r/musichistory+2 crossposts

Music history- "Satan is busy in Knoxville"

Recorded at the historic St. James Hotel sessions in Knoxville, Tennessee, "Satan Is Busy In Knoxville" is a rare and haunting piece of pre-war blues by singer Leola Manning.

​Rather than a typical blues standard, the track acts as real-time musical journalism detailing two actual local murders that took place in Knoxville in early 1930. Accompanied by piano and guitar, Manning's powerful vocals and moral warning ("the Good Book says they've got to reap just what they sow") make this one of the most remarkable narrative blues recordings of the Great Depression era. Original 78 RPM pressings on the classic blue Vocalion label are exceptionally rare pieces of American music history.

From The Neven78 Radio Archive.

Digitized and available at:

https://youtube.com/@mamlishblues?si=xds1-xSMpttHSXi\_

u/BigAssQuanta — 10 days ago
▲ 6 r/musichistory+1 crossposts

An interactive visual roadmap mapping the evolution of Black Music and its historical context [OC]

Ever since I first listened to Black music, I’ve been deeply moved by its distinct melodies, rhythms, and storytelling. Over the years, my taste expanded from Jazz and Soul to R&B and Hip-Hop. Each genres bring their own unique energy and charm.

As a high school student ,taking AP US History this past school year was an eye-opener for me. I realized Black music is deeply rooted in its historical era, serving as both a response to social struggles and a powerful driver of cultural identity. To map out these fascinating connections, I decided to build an interactive website that visualizes the evolution of Black music alongside key historical events and eras.

Key Features:

  • Interactive Timeline: Drag and navigate through different historical eras—from early Delta Blues, Gospel, and the Harlem Renaissance, to Motown, Funk, the Golden Era of Hip-Hop, and modern Trap/R&B.
  • Immersive "Voice" Exhibition: Centered around the concept of "Voice," this section links different genres across history, showing how music empowered Black artists to express resilience and shape self-identity.
  • Explorative Music Starfield: An interactive galaxy view where you can click through major genres, uncover iconic artists, and listen to landmark tracks that defined each era.

It is completely free, ad-free, and created purely as an educational tool for music enthusiasts.

(I've dropped the live interactive site link in the comments below for anyone interested in exploring!)

Would love to hear your thoughts on the historical framing, genre connections, or any artists you think should be added to the map next!
👉 Explore the interactive project here: https://african-american-music-exhibition.vercel.app/

reddit.com
u/Far-Temperature3591 — 8 days ago