u/Betaparticlemale

There are now assertions from multiple people who have had accurate information before (Grusch coming out, hearings, legislation, etc) that not only is there a UAP crash retrieval/reverse engineering program, but that the legacy program *and* now the White House are shooting down UFOs, in order to take their technology. The conversation regarding it has been pretty nonchalant, with the most of the focus being on US intragovernmental dynamics rather than the whole, you know, we’re-shooting-down-aliens part.

Can we all agree that, if true, it’s the most reckless, foolhardy action in history? Completely aside from the ethics of it?

This is a power that could destroy us if it wanted to, and we’re attacking it. Even if one felt it was justified, you would think someone in charge would have enough sense of self-preservation to bring up that maybe it isn’t the best idea. And anyone who thinks the NHI wouldn’t be able to is fooling themselves. *Humans* have the ability, right now, to destroy our own civilization. You think a vastly superior technological intelligence wouldn’t also be able to, and more?

I’ve seen some people assert it’s justified, either because they’re “in our territory” or because of abductions.

A) NHI aren’t part of the UN. It’s absurd to apply the same standard. Would they even know what the borders are, or have that concept? They’re literally aliens.

B) We have laws regarding kidnapping. We normally don’t just kill them or shoot their vehicles, assuming we could even tell “which ones” are doing it. And if foreign nations are involved our response involves threat assessment, not just automatically declaring war, which could be fatal.

C) They’re allegedly being invited as a trap anyway, out of greed for their technology, not some noble and necessary defensive measure.

And again, all that notwithstanding, ***they have the capability to destroy the human species should they decide to***.

Just because they apparently haven’t yet responded to us attacking them doesn’t necessitate that it will perpetually be consequence-free for eternity. We don’t even know their intent or why they’re here. There could be a counter. Or a time window. Or it could be a test. We have *no idea*.

Does no one think it’s exceedingly odd that they’re apparently just letting us do it? Does that not seems bizarrely mysterious? The “AI drone” explanation doesn’t make any sense. You obviously can program AI to react to external stimuli. They’re *letting it happen and we don’t know why*.

TL;DR

Shooting down UAP is the most foolish and reckless action, and greatest threat to the species, in history. They could destroy us if they wanted to. This policy has to stop.

It’s odd to me that none of the highest-profile commentators or journalists in the UAP space have commented on Lue Elizondo’s former (and possibly current) lawyer Danny Sheehan asserting that Lue was security chief for a Pentagon program dedicated to “capturing” UFOs to reverse engineer them for weapons.

Despite this and the recent allegations that Lue had a much larger role in the legacy program than has been thought, influential figures you might otherwise think would address this development have not, across the board, including: Ross Coulthart, UAPGerb, Chris Sharp, Matt Ford, Jeremy Corbell, Jesse Michaels, George Knapp, and Richard Dolan.

It seems strange, especially as it would appear to fit some theses that have been proposed, and is very much relevant and topical to recent conversations. Now, Danny Sheehan is certainly controversial, and his statements should be taken with a grain of salt (especially on the nature of NHI itself), but he definitely has historically had insider information.

Of particular significance, he knew about David Grusch prior to Grusch going public. That’s a pretty huge indicator to me that he knows some substantial things (I even remember people calling him “Loose Lips Sheehan” at the time). Add to that his actual role as Lue’s own lawyer, it gives credibility to the idea that Sheehan was privy to extremely notable behind-the-scenes information, that he let slip (as he has before).

To encapsulate and clarify the issue:

\\\\-Chris Sharp has reported that James Clapper ran a program with to shoot down and capture UAP

\\\\-David Grusch stated in the Megan Kelly interview that Clapper “managed the crash retrieval issue”

\\\\-Grusch also asserted that Clapper “placed people in critical roles to mange this issue, both publicly… and non-publicly as well”, and Grusch pointedly says he’ll “allow the audience to distill what \\\\\\\[he’s\\\\\\\] saying at the risk of being inappropriate or going too far in \\\\\\\[his\\\\\\\] discussion”. Which implies Grusch has knowledge of people with positions the nature of which have yet to be revealed

\\\\-Clapper has personally admitted to at least knowledge of a previously undisclosed Air Force UAP program, appeared in the Age of Disclosure, according to the director took time from his dying wife because the film’s effort was “too important”, and has some personal connection to Lue

\\\\-There is tension between Grusch and Lue. Lue was offended by Grusch’s statement in the he is being the only former officer being open. Grusch also didn’t participate in the Age of Disclosure, and IIRC Coulthart and others have said he wants people to be more forthcoming.

\\\\-Ross Coulthart recently also claimed that Lue had a much larger role than he had previously revealed, and said that at some point Lue was going to have to be more open about his position

\\\\-Lue himself has never actually denied being part of the legacy program, including when questioned directly about it

\\\\-UAPGerb has openly accused Lue of being deceptive in his disclosure efforts, and IIRC in a manner directly related to and under the purview of Clapper. In his excellent analysis, Gerb discusses how Lue’s position as NSC liaison meant he was more cleared into programs than the Secretary of Defense himself, which is significant

\\\\-And to reiterate, now Danny Sheehan, who is known to have been Lue’s lawyer (and possibly still is in some capacity) and who has previously held accurate behind-the-scenes knowledge of internal dynamics among whistleblowers and Congress, stated that Lue was “chief of security” for a Pentagon program to capture and reverse engineer UFOs to develop weapons

To be clear, I think all the commentators and journalists have done excellent jobs, and we owe them much (even if I strongly disagree with some of their viewpoints). I think it is also an objective fact that the modern disclosure movement clearly started with the 2017 NYT article prompted by Lue and Chis Mellon coming forward, and would not have happened otherwise. I think Lue has sacrificed much, and believes he has done the right thing (although I have serious disagreements with his stances as well).

But a coherent potential picture develops from connecting these data points:

Lue worked for James Clapper in capacity as security chief for a Pentagon UAP legacy program that attacked UAP in order to capture and exploit them, possibly to develop weapons (which you’d imagine would be a primary goal of such a reverse engineering program).

That this picture has yet, to my knowledge, been completely formulated or publicly addressed by major disclosure figures seems unusual to me, especially with regard to Sheehan’s statement within the context of recent allegations regarding Lue’s legacy program role.

It’s possible some just may not know, or are withholding comment out of respect for Lue, but i feel like it’s very important that this be talked about, given the seemingly confirmatory elements from multiple areas.

But more importantly, because an effort in which a few officials, in secret, decide to commit acts of war against a vastly superior technological intelligence of unknown capability and intent, in order to benefit from their technology (at least in part), and without the consent or knowledge of Congress or the American people, would be the greatest, most reckless threat to national security and humanity in general in human history, regardless of whether the people involved thought themselves justified or patriotic.

History is full of examples of good people participating in evil endeavors. Whether someone is “a patriot” is not relevant. People can rationalize anything. What matters is what actually happened, and the predictable consequences of one’s actions.

TL;DR: Lue’s Elizondo’s lawyer said Lue was security chief for a DoD program that captured UFOs, which fits other more recent allegations, and no one influential seems to be talking about it.

Thoughts?

It’s odd to me that none of the highest-profile commentators or journalists in the UAP space have commented on Lue Elizondo’s former (and possibly current) lawyer Danny Sheehan asserting that Lue was security chief for a Pentagon program dedicated to “capturing” UFOs to reverse engineer them for weapons.

Despite this and the recent allegations that Lue had a much larger role in the legacy program than has been thought, influential figures you might otherwise think would address this development have not, across the board, including: Ross Coulthart, UAPGerb, Chris Sharp, Matt Ford, Jeremy Corbell, Jesse Michaels, George Knapp, and Richard Dolan.

It seems strange, especially as it would appear to fit some theses that have been proposed, and is very much relevant and topical to recent conversations. Now, Danny Sheehan is certainly controversial, and his statements should be taken with a grain of salt (especially on the nature of NHI itself), but he definitely has historically had insider information.

Of particular significance, he knew about David Grusch prior to Grusch going public. That’s a pretty huge indicator to me that he knows some substantial things (I even remember people calling him “Loose Lips Sheehan” at the time). Add to that his actual role as Lue’s own lawyer, it gives credibility to the idea that Sheehan was privy to extremely notable behind-the-scenes information, that he let slip (as he has before).

To encapsulate and clarify the issue:

\\-Chris Sharp has reported that James Clapper ran a program with to shoot down and capture UAP

\\-David Grusch stated in the Megan Kelly interview that Clapper “managed the crash retrieval issue”

\\-Grusch also asserted that Clapper “placed people in critical roles to mange this issue, both publicly… and non-publicly as well”, and Grusch pointedly says he’ll “allow the audience to distill what \\\[he’s\\\] saying at the risk of being inappropriate or going too far in \\\[his\\\] discussion”. Which implies Grusch has knowledge of people with positions the nature of which have yet to be revealed

\\-Clapper has personally admitted to at least knowledge of a previously undisclosed Air Force UAP program, appeared in the Age of Disclosure, according to the director took time from his dying wife because the film’s effort was “too important”, and has some personal connection to Lue

\\-There is tension between Grusch and Lue. Lue was offended by Grusch’s statement in the he is being the only former officer being open. Grusch also didn’t participate in the Age of Disclosure, and IIRC Coulthart and others have said he wants people to be more forthcoming.

\\-Ross Coulthart recently also claimed that Lue had a much larger role than he had previously revealed, and said that at some point Lue was going to have to be more open about his position

\\-Lue himself has never actually denied being part of the legacy program, including when questioned directly about it

\\-UAPGerb has openly accused Lue of being deceptive in his disclosure efforts, and IIRC in a manner directly related to and under the purview of Clapper. In his excellent analysis, Gerb discusses how Lue’s position as NSC liaison meant he was more cleared into programs than the Secretary of Defense himself, which is significant

\\-And to reiterate, now Danny Sheehan, who is known to have been Lue’s lawyer (and possibly still is in some capacity) and who has previously held accurate behind-the-scenes knowledge of internal dynamics among whistleblowers and Congress, stated that Lue was “chief of security” for a Pentagon program to capture and reverse engineer UFOs to develop weapons

To be clear, I think all the commentators and journalists have done excellent jobs, and we owe them much (even if I strongly disagree with some of their viewpoints). I think it is also an objective fact that the modern disclosure movement clearly started with the 2017 NYT article prompted by Lue and Chis Mellon coming forward, and would not have happened otherwise. I think Lue has sacrificed much, and believes he has done the right thing (although I have serious disagreements with his stances as well).

But a coherent potential picture develops from connecting these data points:

Lue worked for James Clapper in capacity as security chief for a Pentagon UAP legacy program that attacked UAP in order to capture and exploit them, possibly to develop weapons (which you’d imagine would be a primary goal of such a reverse engineering program).

That this picture has yet, to my knowledge, been completely formulated or publicly addressed by major disclosure figures seems unusual to me, especially with regard to Sheehan’s statement within the context of recent allegations regarding Lue’s legacy program role.

It’s possible some just may not know, or are withholding comment out of respect for Lue, but i feel like it’s very important that this be talked about, given the seemingly confirmatory elements from multiple areas.

But more importantly, because an effort in which a few officials, in secret, decide to commit acts of war against a vastly superior technological intelligence of unknown capability and intent, in order to benefit from their technology (at least in part), and without the consent or knowledge of Congress or the American people, would be the greatest, most reckless threat to national security and humanity in general in human history, regardless of whether the people involved thought themselves justified or patriotic.

History is full of examples of good people participating in evil endeavors. Whether someone is “a patriot” is not relevant. People can rationalize anything. What matters is what actually happened, and the predictable consequences of one’s actions.

TL;DR: Lue’s Elizondo’s lawyer said Lue was security chief for a DoD program that captured UFOs, which fits other more recent allegations, and no one influential seems to be talking about it.

Thoughts?

It’s odd to me that none of the highest-profile commentators or journalists in the UAP space have commented on Lue Elizondo’s former (and possibly current) lawyer Danny Sheehan asserting that Lue was security chief for a Pentagon program dedicated to “capturing” UFOs to reverse engineer them for weapons.

Despite this and the recent allegations that Lue had a much larger role in the legacy program than has been thought, influential figures you might otherwise think would address this development have not, across the board, including: Ross Coulthart, UAPGerb, Chris Sharp, Matt Ford, Jeremy Corbell, Jesse Michaels, George Knapp, and Richard Dolan.

It seems strange, especially as it would appear to fit some theses that have been proposed, and is very much relevant and topical to recent conversations. Now, Danny Sheehan is certainly controversial, and his statements should be taken with a grain of salt (especially on the nature of NHI itself), but he definitely has historically had insider information.

Of particular significance, he knew about David Grusch prior to Grusch going public. That’s a pretty huge indicator to me that he knows some substantial things (I even remember people calling him “Loose Lips Sheehan” at the time). Add to that his actual role as Lue’s own lawyer, it gives credibility to the idea that Sheehan was privy to extremely notable behind-the-scenes information, that he let slip (as he has before).

To encapsulate and clarify the issue:

\-Chris Sharp has reported that James Clapper ran a program with to shoot down and capture UAP

\-David Grusch stated in the Megan Kelly interview that Clapper “managed the crash retrieval issue”

\-Grusch also asserted that Clapper “placed people in critical roles to mange this issue, both publicly… and non-publicly as well”, and Grusch pointedly says he’ll “allow the audience to distill what \[he’s\] saying at the risk of being inappropriate or going too far in \[his\] discussion”. Which implies Grusch has knowledge of people with positions the nature of which have yet to be revealed

\-Clapper has personally admitted to at least knowledge of a previously undisclosed Air Force UAP program, appeared in the Age of Disclosure, according to the director took time from his dying wife because the film’s effort was “too important”, and has some personal connection to Lue

\-There is tension between Grusch and Lue. Lue was offended by Grusch’s statement in the he is being the only former officer being open. Grusch also didn’t participate in the Age of Disclosure, and IIRC Coulthart and others have said he wants people to be more forthcoming.

\-Ross Coulthart recently also claimed that Lue had a much larger role than he had previously revealed, and said that at some point Lue was going to have to be more open about his position

\-Lue himself has never actually denied being part of the legacy program, including when questioned directly about it

\-UAPGerb has openly accused Lue of being deceptive in his disclosure efforts, and IIRC in a manner directly related to and under the purview of Clapper. In his excellent analysis, Gerb discusses how Lue’s position as NSC liaison meant he was more cleared into programs than the Secretary of Defense himself, which is significant

\-And to reiterate, now Danny Sheehan, who is known to have been Lue’s lawyer (and possibly still is in some capacity) and who has previously held accurate behind-the-scenes knowledge of internal dynamics among whistleblowers and Congress, stated that Lue was “chief of security” for a Pentagon program to capture and reverse engineer UFOs to develop weapons

To be clear, I think all the commentators and journalists have done excellent jobs, and we owe them much (even if I strongly disagree with some of their viewpoints). I think it is also an objective fact that the modern disclosure movement clearly started with the 2017 NYT article prompted by Lue and Chis Mellon coming forward, and would not have happened otherwise. I think Lue has sacrificed much, and believes he has done the right thing (although I have serious disagreements with his stances as well).

But a coherent potential picture develops from connecting these data points:

Lue worked for James Clapper in capacity as security chief for a Pentagon UAP legacy program that attacked UAP in order to capture and exploit them, possibly to develop weapons (which you’d imagine would be a primary goal of such a reverse engineering program).

That this picture has yet, to my knowledge, been completely formulated or publicly addressed by major disclosure figures seems unusual to me, especially with regard to Sheehan’s statement within the context of recent allegations regarding Lue’s legacy program role.

It’s possible some just may not know, or are withholding comment out of respect for Lue, but i feel like it’s very important that this be talked about, given the seemingly confirmatory elements from multiple areas.

But more importantly, because an effort in which a few officials, in secret, decide to commit acts of war against a vastly superior technological intelligence of unknown capability and intent, in order to benefit from their technology (at least in part), and without the consent or knowledge of Congress or the American people, would be the greatest, most reckless threat to national security and humanity in general in human history, regardless of whether the people involved thought themselves justified or patriotic.

History is full of examples of good people participating in evil endeavors. Whether someone is “a patriot” is not relevant. People can rationalize anything. What matters is what actually happened, and the predictable consequences of one’s actions.

TL;DR: Lue’s Elizondo’s lawyer said Lue was security chief for a DoD program that captured UFOs, which fits other more recent allegations, and no one influential seems to be talking about it.

Thoughts?