Truly there are a lot of takes on how much protein we need and I was listening to Dr. Zsofia Clemens on a podcast where she discusses how much protein we need. She says a 70 kg male needs 50g to 60g of protein.

https://youtu.be/Pii00TcOruk?si=OqIhUy5IGPlO2inK&t=4177

Later, at 1:14:53 the interviewer asks about athletes. Clemens says protein needs may go up slightly but what they really need is more energy. The interviewer pushes back and then she says that the 2:1 fat to protein ratio should be unchanged and that the athlete should just eat more at that ratio.

But I can't see how that makes any sense. An active 70kg male needs about 2500kcal (I do at least). Splitting that into a 2:1 means roughly

227g fat
112g protein

which by no stretch of the imagination aligns with her previous comment that they only need slightly more protein.

But if fixing the protein at 68g (my choice of slight increase) and increasing the fat so that we hit 2500kcal then we land at 3.7:1 ratio with

248g fat
68g protein

Their website

Reviewing their original website https://www.paleomedicina.com/en/questions I can only find the same ambiguity.

Q1 states the 2:1 ratio should be maintained until satiety.
Q18 states eating more than 2:1 can cause nausea.

vs.

Q15 states that athletes may need to eat upwards of 4:1 (the interviewer states that this is the Dr. Csaba's own position and the doctor does not protest directly).

So what's their position exactly? All in all it seems to me they lean more towards fixing protein at 68g in this example case and adding fat rather than eating 2:1 until satiety since their practice focuses heavily on ketones. 110g of protein is usually enough to brake ketosis machinery somewhat in my experience.

If you have any personal experience or opinions I'd love to hear that as well. I know u/exfatloss survived just fine on very low protein while sedentary. Impressive testosterone levels my guy.

When I write ratio I mean fat:protein in grams.

25M 68kg 10-14%BF. Beef, lamb, salmon, butter.

I'm so bloody tired all the time, I wish it would go away. Electrolytes and calories tracked and in range. I make sure to eat until satiety and clock in at ~2800kcal daily.

Been keto since Feb 1st. Ketosis 2mmol/l made me sharp, social, and in an excellent mood, <1.5mmol/l make me feel fatigued and low mood which is how I've felt my entire life. But I didn't care for eating that much fat (ratio > 2:1) to maintain >2mmol/l and I still had a bitch of a time waking up in the mornings. Maybe it was the vegetables, so went carnivore 8 days ago. Started off heavy on pork belly, but it gave me such stomach pain and diarrhea. Switched to beef and stomach problem vanished (linoleic acid?). Never had stomach issues before.

I still absolutely don't want to eat that much fat (>2:1) which is a lot more difficult for me on carnivore than keto, so I'm wondering if indeed that feeling of being sharp, social, and having excellent mood is caused by strong ketosis or if carnivore has a different mechanism that gives the same result of being sharp etc.

I've reviewed much footage from Richard Smith, Anthony Chaffee and so on, and it still remains unclear to me what I can expect from my brain when ketones are modest <1.5 mmol/l which they are at ratios <2:1. Chaffee specifically says he's never measured a ketone in his life.

I seem to recall a video where Richard Smith explains how while he was keto, high ketone levels masked problems that didn't stop bothering him until he finally quit vegetables, which is exactly what I'm hoping for. But he slams back MCT oil daily to raise ketone levels which I don't want to, so I bet he's in decent ketosis most of the day just from that anyway.

Users here seem to support the high fat approach, e.g. https://www.reddit.com/r/carnivorediet/comments/1ncstij/ketones_are_your_super_power/

So does prominent figures like Amber O. Heard https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAWReEm4l0w although she points out that modified atkins (with lower fat ratio) has similar benefits to high fat for epileptics (see 27 minutes).

I absolutely intend to do carnivore for 31 days so that I may find out for myself with regards to my body, but I might as well gather what your experiences are so I may temper my expectations. Since I have no auto-immune or leaky gut symptoms (it's hard to say if fatigue is or isn't, depends), I'm worried the carnivore mechanism is lost on me.

So tell me, is carnivore necessary but insufficient for you to feel sharp, socially inclined, and in an excellent mood with strong ketosis being necessary as well? How do you feel when you're just in modest ketosis say <1.0 mmol/l?