Login

u/Idleverse

r/mmorts r/SoloDev r/incremental_games r/PBBG r/Space4X r/spacegames r/WebGames r/4Xgaming r/gamedev r/GAMETHEORY r/StrategyGames
How to reward activity in an otherwise idle multiplayer game without leaving casual players behind (article)
▲ 12 r/mmorts+1 crossposts

How to reward activity in an otherwise idle multiplayer game without leaving casual players behind (article)

This is somewhat of a follow-up of my previous post on opportunity cost.

TLDR:

I originally designed Orion Online - a tick-based browser mmorts currently under development - for idle players, with a targeted playtime of 10 minutes per day. Early playtest show that some players like to play much more than that. This is very welcome, but it poses an interesting issue: How to keep both idle and active players engaged, while maintaining agency and relevance for all players.

The article takes up possible ways to address the issue at hand, and goes into the new Masteries system in Orion, which is a talent tree that players unlock abilities in as they do actions in their current alignment/role.

In short, I propose that you can find alternative ways to reward active players beyond making them more powerful, which tends to compound and snowball, such as offering them a player journey, a completionist system, or as in this case, a progression system.

I do recognize that the masteries systems is a form of power reward, but it does not compound (is self-feeding) as other systems tend to do, and my intention is to pivot the system towards more of a tech-tree with unlocks rather the raw % multipliers in the future.

Would love to have some interesting discussions about this if anyone else has experience or an interesting take on this issue.

Read the full artcile.

blog.idleverse.gg
u/Idleverse — 18 days ago
▲ 11 r/mmorts+3 crossposts

Opportunity Cost in Strategy Games (article)

While developing Orion Online, I have put a lot of thought into various design topics, and one theme that kept popping up was that of opportunity cost, which turn out to have very broad application in strategy games!

The general idea is that instead of having hard constraints that limits a player's agency, you instead soft-gate via opportunity cost. As an example: Instead of disallowing changing role, the player loses their mastery of their previous role.

So, I wrote an article about that , and how it applies to my game. I find this a fascinating topic and would love to discuss it further!

Full write-up: https://blog.idleverse.gg/opportunity-cost-in-strategy-games/

blog.idleverse.gg
u/Idleverse — 2 months ago
▲ 8 r/4Xgaming+2 crossposts

What stops larger players from farming smaller ones in a 4X game? (article/discussion)

Bottom-feeding is when players, instead of fighting equal rivals, hunt weaker targets for easy grabs. This is standard practice in many 4X (mmorts) games. Common ways to handle this include a protection window for newcomers, and bracketed attack limitations.

I personally do not like mechanics that hard-gate against behaviors like this, but prefer systems that organically disincentivize them.

My take, in the mmorts I'm building, is to make it legal, but simply not worth doing. Hitting a weaker planet is allowed, it's just a poor use of a fleet:

  • the number of attacks is limited by available commanders: attacking a weaker target ties up a commander that could be used elsewhere
  • attack gains scale with relative size, you get less by punching down
  • consecutive attacks on the same target yield diminishing returns
  • reputation from a smaller target is negligible

Granted that size scaling is itself a bit arbitrary, which is the thing I was trying to avoid in the first place, so not super happy with that.

What is your take on this? Have you played any game that handles this gracefully, or do you have any design recommendations? Full write-up with numbers in the linked post.

EDIT: this sparked a lot of discussion real quick, thanks for that 😄 A lot of users feel that this does not belong in the 4Xgaming subreddit, if that continue to be the case, I will remove it. Enjoy the discussion meanwhile.

blog.idleverse.gg
u/Idleverse — 2 months ago
▲ 10 r/spacegames+1 crossposts

How to handle 4X snowballing without rubber-banding or hard caps (article/promotion)

I am building Orion Online, a browser-based, tick-based MMORTS in the Utopia/OGame style of games. Like every 4X game, it has to deal with snowballing: an early lead that compounds until a player becomes untouchable.

Possible fixes are hard caps or rubber-banding, and I do not like either, because I do not want players to "feel the developer's hand on the scale". When I redesigned Orion's economy I implemented something I call counter-acting forces which are systems inside the game that push back harder the harder you push them, without becoming a hard stop.

  • Employment (idle citizens pay no tax but still eat)
  • The guns-vs-butter trade (soldiers pay no tax, but requires wages)
  • inflation on stockpiled credits(money)
  • a end-game population growth equilibrium

I wrote an article that goes more in-depth on this: https://blog.idleverse.gg/solving-the-problem-of-4x-compounding/

The game itself is in Early Access, and free to play in the browser, if you want to see how it feels in practice: https://orion.idleverse.gg/

u/Idleverse — 2 months ago
▲ 8 r/mmorts+3 crossposts

Round 2 of Orion Online, my solo-built browser MMORTS starts today

Orion Online - Round 2

I am building Orion Online: a browser-based, tick-based MMORTS in the Utopia/OGame style of games. Round 1 ran through July, and I was able to gather lots of great feedback from first-time players, and for the first time I was able to play my own game start to finish, which gave me a lot of great insights.

Today round 2 starts, and after an intensive month of bug-fixing, tuning, and development, the game is shaping up nicely. I still consider it early access, but now is a great time to try it out if you like these kind of games, and want to help shape the future of Orion Online.

Play here: https://orion.idleverse.gg/

TL;DR of a month of live iteration:

* Pacing retuned: faster early game, faster-to-reach endgame, shorter wars
* Many UI/UX fixes, visual feedback and animations added, etc
* Balanced many of the mechanics
* Many Performance improvements
* Better onboarding experience

Full write-up: https://blog.idleverse.gg/orion-online-round-2/

u/Idleverse — 13 days ago
▲ 1 r/WebGames

Orion Online, a browser-based MMORTS

Let me introduce Orion Online, a persistent, modern, browser-based 4X MMORTS where you take control of a planet and fight to grow in the galaxy.

Some game-play features, that you might enjoy:

  • Deterministic tick-engine that respects your time; No waking up in the middle of the night
  • Intuitive, but deep, economic engine: Distribute resources responsibly
  • Unique "discoveries" based roles system; Play as an economist, general, cyber operator, or support deployer
  • Team-based PvP; War against other systems in the galaxy
  • Interactive galaxy; Navigate between your planet, your system, and the galaxy in a zoom continuum
  • No Pay-to-Win: no speed-ups, or resource packs. Monetization is fair and QoL only

The first ever official round is about to begin in ~1 hour (july 1st, 00:00 UTC).

I consider this a beta/EA still though, as there are some rough edges for sure, but I am super happy with the core systems and gameplay, so everything from here will be about fixing those rough edges, squashing bugs, adding more features, and taking in user feedback.

Thanks for playing, and enjoy (please report any bugs you come across).

Also, feel free to join our discord: https://discord.com/invite/Wy58BQrUMY

orion.idleverse.gg
u/Idleverse — 4 months ago
▲ 6 r/mmorts+3 crossposts

Orion Online, Round 1 starts July 1st, 00:00 UTC

Orion Online, Galaxy Zoom Continuum

Let me introduce Orion Online, a persistent, modern, browser-based 4X MMORTS where you take control of a planet and fight to grow in the galaxy.

Some game-play features, that you might enjoy:

  • Deterministic tick-engine that respects your time; No waking up in the middle of the night
  • Intuitive, but deep, economic engine: Distribute resources responsibly
  • Unique "discoveries" based roles system; Play as an economist, general, cyber operator, or support deployer
  • Team-based PvP; War against other systems in the galaxy
  • Interactive galaxy; Navigate between your planet, your system, and the galaxy in a zoom continuum
  • No Pay-to-Win: no speed-ups, or resource packs. Monetization is fair and QoL only

The first ever official round is about to begin in ~1 hours (july 1st, 00:00 UTC).

I consider this a beta/EA still though, as there are some rough edges for sure, but I am super happy with the core systems and gameplay, so everything from here will be about fixing those rough edges, squashing bugs, adding more features, and taking in user feedback.

Thanks for playing, and enjoy (please report any bugs you come across).

reddit.com
u/Idleverse — 4 months ago
▲ 0 r/4Xgaming

replacing my race-select screen with an emergent identity system

this is a re-write of this post

Background

I'm building Orion Online, which is a browser-based 4X MMORTS where you manage a planet.

In most 4X games you pick a race or faction up fron. I tried to lean in on this, by front-loading this decision before account creation. My idea was "the earlier I can get the player to commit, the less likely they are to quit early".

Pushback

Needless to say, this is bad design, and I got pushback on this when floating this idea in the r/gamedev subreddit. The obvious issue with this design is that it requires you to make an uninformed but permanent decision before you understand the consequences of it.

So I re-designed it from the ground up.

Race Select Screen Discoveries

Instead of picking your race up front, in the new system, your identity emerges from "Discoveries". A Discovery is a decision like "Where do we land our Colony ship?" or "Do we build fortifications or solar panels first?" Each option leans toward one of six axes: Warlord, Economist, and so on.

Axis alignment (and abilities)

Your Discoveries accumulates toward an axis alignment that provides passive bonuses towards that direction, plus a unique ability tied to your axis alignment: a Warlord gets a Blitz Attack ability, an Economist can Cipher Resources to teammates, and so on.

This also means you can shift identity mid-round. Early on you can pivot more easily by selecting a few discoveries towards a certain axis, but the deeper into the round you get, and the more points you've put into one axis, the harder it becomes to change.

Discovery Phases

Discoveries are grouped into 7 phases tied to population milestones (the first on landing, then 1M, 10M, on up to 1B). Each milestone triggers a phase, which doubles as a celebration of progress and gives the early game a steady run of meaningful decisions to come back for.

Re-rolling

There's an undo window, which was suggested by a few people in that original thread. You can relocate your colony and redo your early picks until you cross the second milestone (1M population). After that they lock for the round, so you only have to commit once you've had time to learn the game.

Why I like it

By the end of a round you've made roughly 50 of these decisions, and your colony's identity is something you discovered, not something you selected from a list before you knew what any of it meant.

If you want to read more, I have full writeup on the blog: https://blog.idleverse.gg/discover-your-identity-in-orion-online/

Feedback

If you have any feedback on, or experience of, emergent vs upfront identity selection, I'd appreciate hearing about i!

u/Idleverse — 4 months ago
▲ 2 r/gamedev

Re-designing permanent choice in my game based on reddit feedback

Background

I am working on Orion Online, a browser based 4X mmorts. A couple of weeks ago I posted here asking whether it was a good idea to make new players commit to a permanent, per-round, choice before account creation.

The (bad) idea

My (not so brilliant) idea was to hook the user early with this. Needless to say, I got a lot of pushback on this: original reddit thread.

Based on this feedback, I redesigned the system, and came up with something much more interesting, both in terms of not locking users into permanent decisions before they understood the consequences of them, but also some new interesting mechanics.

Account creation moved up front

I reverted this, so that you create an account before you play. This is just expected, and I agree with that. It was a bad idea.

New system: Discoveries

Instead of a single pick (like race or faction), identity now emerges from discoveries. A discovery can be something like "Where do we land", "Do we establish fortifications or solar panels first", etc. Each of these aligns with one of six possible axes; Warlord, Economist, etc.

Axis Alignment

Not only do you get a passive bonus towards your alignment with the discoveries themselves, but also a unique ability per your current axis alignment, which helps with the sense of identity and role.

This system has the nice side-effect of being able to change your axis alignment over time, even though that naturally gets harder the further the round progress, and the more points you have put towards a certain axis.

Discovery Phases

As your colony and planet grows, there are 7 distinct population milestones (the first on landing, then when you hit 1M, 10M, ..., 1B). For each of these, your planet undergoes a discovery phase, which serves as a nice celebration of progress, as well as a natural early game, where the user gets to make a lot of interesting decisions.

Re-rolling

I also added an undo window, that a few redditers suggested. You can relocate your colony and redo early picks until you hit the second milestone (1M population), then they lock for the round.

Summary

I just wanted to share this little anecdote, and I'm very happy I asked about this here, because the result is such a more interesting system, so thanks to everyone who pushed back on that design!

Additional Feedback

If anyone has any additional feedback or experience to share, I'm happy to listen to it!

reddit.com
u/Idleverse — 4 months ago
▲ 2 r/4Xgaming

Finding an elegant (and in hindsight obvious) solution to the problem of eXpanding in space

note: I am building a mmo 4X. I probably should have included that

One of the X's of 4X games is of course "eXpand". However, in my 4X game, you are managing a planet, and I really struggled to implement expanding in a way that felt realistic and thematically consistent.

For example, you cannot just "steal" land from another planet, and transport it back across outer space. And even if you could, why would you? There is plenty of land on your own planet to urbanize.

The solution, once I thought of it, was to drop the concept of land entirely, and instead center the game around population. Your planet's size is simply how many people live on it, and land (buildings) are just a derivative of it.

With this, raiding other planets and kidnapping their civilians makes total sense. You can either grow your population organically and/or by attacking your opponents for theirs, which fits right into the expansion mechanic of your typical 4X game.

Also, once I pivoted to a population-based system, a lot of other interesting mechanics emerged, which I tapped into, such as civilization tiers, and other fun stuff.

This honestly took way too long (embarrassingly long) to realize, and I almost re-themed the entire game around managing a space-station instead of a planet, but I am super happy I didn't.

I have a longer version of this in my devlog if you want to read more: https://blog.idleverse.gg/in-orion-online-population-is-power/

u/Idleverse — 4 months ago
▲ 10 r/4Xgaming

alliances are a net negative for 4X MMOs (devlog)

I wrote a blogpost on why we decided to not include the concept of alliances in Orion Online, our browser-based 4X mmorts.

TLDR:

When a game allows players to form alliances, it concentrates power, which eventually leads to stagnation. Ultimately, it caters to a (relatively) few powerful players, and creates a hostile environment for the rest of the player base, and most of all, for new players.

In Orion, you're placed in a planetary system with up to 19 other players, and you cannot control where you land (but it does carry over rounds (eras)). Your system have to communicate and collaborate to prosper. Any coalition beyond that, to whatever extent they exist, are social agreements, not a built-in game mechanic.

There are formal relations though. For example, hostility between rivaling systems emerge from actions: mutual raids and cyber ops push a hostility meter, and either side can eventually declare war, which ultimately leads to peace via truce or surrender. In other words, relations are organic and emergent.

Players can relocate their colony to another planetary system if they don't like their team, but ultimately, you have to collaborate to prosper. Planetary systems are kept across eras (game rounds), so groups that do collaborate, grow into well-oiled machines over time.

This system is largely based on the one in the old (and amazing) browser mmorts Utopia, and I do understand that you cannot fully prevent players from creating alliances outside the game, so this might all be for nothing. I'm interested to hear others experiences, thoughts and critic against this. There might be other games that have better solutions/system for this.

Full post: https://blog.idleverse.gg/kingdoms-systems-and-emergent-diplomacy/

u/Idleverse — 4 months ago