Do you guys think Ei, Skirk, and Ronova have a lot in common in terms of their characterization?

Do you guys think Ei, Skirk, and Ronova have a lot in common in terms of their characterization?

Because those three are my favorite characters, I think I’ve finally realized what my type is when it comes to anime waifus.

First of all, all three of them give off a very cold, even hostile, first impression. The first time we meet Ei, she fights us over taking Thoma’s Vision. Skirk first appears near the end of the All-Devouring Narwhal incident, while our encounters with Ronova so far have involved her trying to claim Mavuika’s life, and later fighting the Traveler in Snezhnaya when she attempts to take Paimon back.

But as their stories unfold, we gradually realize that beneath that cold exterior, all three of them are driven by fear. Ei, after witnessing the horrors of the Abyss and the Heavenly Principles destroying entire nations, chose to imitate the Heavenly Principles and shut away her own emotions. Skirk, traumatized by Surtalogi’s abuse and threats, isolated herself out of fear that innocent people would be dragged into the consequences. Ronova likewise closed herself off emotionally after being reprimanded by the Heavenly Principles.

And once we get to know them on a deeper level, we realize that all three are actually very emotional people. Ironically, the coldness they show on the surface is something they chose largely for the sake of others.

For the first two, the progression of their stories follows a very similar pattern: clearing up misunderstandings, then gradually bringing them back into the human world and helping them embrace their emotions again. Ei begins taking part in ordinary human activities, while Skirk starts playing the instrument she loved as a child again.

Because of that, I think Ronova may eventually follow the same path. Just as the Sacred Edict cards seem to foreshadow, she may leave behind her duties as one of the Four Shades, descend into the mortal world, and begin interacting with ordinary people.

I’d even go so far as to guess that she might settle down in either Inazuma or Liyue. Maybe she could become a consultant at the Wangsheng Funeral Parlor like Zhongli, or perhaps go to Inazuma and stay with Ei as an honored guest.

Let me indulge in a bit of personal bias here: perhaps, as the first god in Genshin whose story centered on stepping down into the mortal world and reconnecting with ordinary people, Ei could end up playing a role for Ronova similar to the Wanderer’s role for Durin.

Someone who once rejected the world and suppressed her own emotions could become the person who helps another being, equally alienated from the world, learn how to live among people and embrace those emotions again.

u/JollyCapital7589 — 3 days ago

Do you think Ei's attitude toward her people is actually similar to that of the Four Shades?

For example, in the 6.6 story, the Four Shades basically watched Dottore cause chaos for quite a while without stepping in. They only appeared to say a few words when Irminsul was actually about to burn. Dottore himself also said that the Four Shades had been watching him all along, but chose not to interfere because they believed he would never succeed.

Whether in Sumeru or Nod-Krai, he committed plenty of atrocities in the course of trying to transcend fate. In Nod-Krai, he even went as far as swapping the consciousness of humans and animals, which resulted in quite a few deaths. Yet the Four Shades continued to stand by and watch, because as long as he never actually managed to transcend fate, none of what he did would affect Teyvat as a whole.

Venti's assessment of Istaroth:

To her, all living beings were equal, both in value and insignificance

I feel like this is exactly how the Heavenly Principles and the Shades view their people, and it’s also the fundamental reason behind Ei’s statement that

Eternity is the closest unto the Heavenly Principles

reddit.com
u/JollyCapital7589 — 4 days ago

Do you think Ronova’s position among the Four Shades is similar to Ei’s position among the Seven Archons?

Most of their peers are pretty calculating and scheming, except Furina, who isn’t actually a god. But those two both come across as unusually naive, and they also both ended up opposing the Traveler largely because they were afraid of something on a higher level than themselves.

So I feel like the two of them are basically built from the same character template. Ronova will probably end up becoming playable after she’s defeated, then get a story quest where she reflects on some of her past actions, much like Ei did.

u/JollyCapital7589 — 4 days ago

As a Raiden Shogun fan, I feel a level of despair I've never experienced before.

First of all, because of the political tensions between China and Japan, the new region in Honkai: Star Rail also seems to have removed its Japanese-inspired elements. The character who was originally suspected to be the main focus and a Yae counterpart has apparently been pushed to the sidelines.

Raiden Ei has also been absent from the main story for almost two years now. Even before that, most Inazuma-related content consisted of limited-time events that had little to do with the game’s broader lore or overarching worldbuilding.

By comparison, Venti has remained consistently involved in major story content since the Natlan arc, appearing in things like the Natlan summer event and Hexenzirkel-related storylines. Zhongli also returns during the annual Liyue festival events, which usually reveal more information connected to the larger world and its lore, such as details involving Zibai.

Raiden, on the other hand, received almost none of that even in the Version 5.4 event. Instead of expanding on her role in the world or revealing anything substantial about Inazuma’s deeper lore, the story mainly revisited the tale of one of her old friends—something we already knew about.

And because the writing of Inazuma’s Archon Quest suffered from the development team’s relatively limited narrative execution at the time, the controversy surrounding Raiden has persisted to this day. At this point, it also seems increasingly likely that she will end up being the Archon with the least amount of meaningful story content among the Seven.

Looking at factors outside the story itself, Raiden’s popularity has also clearly fallen out of the very top tier after such a long period of receiving neither meaningful gameplay relevance nor substantial story content. Among the female characters alone, Furina, Columbina, Sandrone, Skirk, Arlecchino, and—at least within the Chinese community—Hu Tao have arguably already surpassed her in popularity. And with the Tsaritsa and Ronova expected to become playable in the future, Raiden’s position is likely to face even more competition.

In terms of how their power is portrayed in the story, the contrast is just as frustrating. Zhongli’s deal with the Tsaritsa strongly suggests that he is about to receive another major moment in the spotlight; Nahida and the Wanderer have just defeated Dottore in the story; Mavuika has been shown defeating formidable opponents such as Capitano and Gosoythoth; and the Tsaritsa is seemingly poised to defeat Ronova.

Raiden, meanwhile, was introduced in the Archon Quest as an antagonist whose signature strike was blocked by Kazuha, before she was ultimately overcome through the collective ambitions and wishes of the people of Inazuma. Compared with the increasingly impressive combat portrayals given to the other Archons, her own main-story portrayal feels particularly unfavorable.

A large part of Raiden’s initial appeal came from her overwhelming combat strength and the sheer authority and majesty she projected as a god. But as the story has expanded and introduced characters on an entirely different scale—such as an extraterrestrial figure like Skirk and even more powerful divine beings like Ronova, who can take on major antagonistic roles—those qualities no longer feel nearly as unique as they once did.

As a result, one of the core elements that originally made Raiden so compelling has been steadily diluted, and her overall appeal has taken a significant hit.

Ronova is also worth mentioning here. I like her a lot as well, but her handling in the story seems to reflect lessons learned from the controversy surrounding Raiden. The writers have deliberately avoided having Ronova directly harm anyone on-screen, which makes it feel as though they are already laying the groundwork for her eventual release as a playable character.

Raiden, by contrast, suffered from the limitations of the writing at the time. Because many of Inazuma’s darker world quests and tragedies were presented under the broader context of her rule, a significant portion of the player base ended up attributing those tragedies to her personally, whether or not she was directly responsible for each individual case. As a result, she accumulated a great deal of lasting resentment.

Ronova has so far been handled much more carefully. Despite occupying an antagonistic role and possessing an even more intimidating level of power, the story has given players far fewer concrete reasons to hate her personally. In that sense, she has been able to preserve the awe and danger that made early Raiden appealing while avoiding much of the moral baggage that damaged Raiden’s popularity.

I like many characters in this game, but Raiden has always been the most special one to me. She was also the first character I truly fell in love with after I started playing. But the way HoYo has treated her—and how neglected she feels—has genuinely been heartbreaking for me. I feel like it may have even contributed to some mild depression.

I used to be a very friendly person toward others, but lately I've become noticeably more bitter and irritable. Sometimes I find myself making sarcastic or passive-aggressive remarks at people, because in the moment, it gives me a sense of pleasure and emotional release.

I really hope the writers will give Raiden more meaningful development in the future. But with her popularity having declined so much, and with the character potentially being affected by real-world political factors as well, I honestly wonder whether the writers will still be willing to invest in her properly—to continue developing her character and finally give her a moment that truly conveys the grandeur and presence of a god.

Even in the notes accompanying her rerun, they once again fell back on the same old traits: that she likes sweets and enjoys hot springs. But repeating these surface-level quirks does nothing for her character arc. What I want to see is actual progression—new conflicts, new choices, new revelations, and moments that show how she has changed since the Inazuma storyline, rather than endlessly recycling the same harmless character gimmicks.

If I never get to see her have that kind of defining moment again, I might end up completely going from being a HoYo fan to becoming an outright hater.I don’t think I’ll ever be able to care about another fictional character this deeply or this sincerely again.

u/JollyCapital7589 — 7 days ago
▲ 26 r/RaidenMains+1 crossposts

Honestly, I genuinely think Ei's characterization is stronger than Scaramouche's.

I think Ei's characterization is far more nuanced than most people give her credit for. A lot of her development is hidden beneath symbolism, philosophy, and worldbuilding rather than direct exposition. As Genshin's lore continues to expand, many of her ideas and decisions have gained a deeper context.

Some concepts don't translate very well from Chinese into English, so I'll use the original Chinese text whenever possible.

In the Narzissenkreuz questline, René introduces a concept called "the severance of the self."

>…斩去自我并不代表着死去,而是在死去之前死去。因此无命可终,依此法得永恒。此举非常重要,可以预防不慎获得神之眼。获得神之眼是将自身出卖给世界的「命运」——即「黑玛门尼」——的行为,会无法走上正确的道路…

Interestingly, the same idea is later referenced again in the Temple of Space.

>Yu Huangyi: Though the relentless torment and tempering within the Apathic Interval sought to erode our will and desire, it somehow aligned with the ancient art of severing the Three Deadly Selves.

>Yu Huangyi: But even if that tiny creative spark fades, a single good idea will suffice to bring it back to life.

>Calcerius: Indeed. The Apathic Interval has stripped away my faith in Phobos, but I still get the urge to write every once in a while.

From an English-speaking perspective, this is almost impossible to fully grasp.

But once you look at the original Chinese wording, its deeper and more mystical implications become immediately apparent.

In the original Chinese text, Raiden Shogun's signature move is called "Wuxiang Yidao" (无想一刀), while "Apathic Interval" is translated as "Wuxiang Zhijian" (无想之间). Both names share the term "Wuxiang" (无想), a concept that carries strong philosophical connotations of transcendence, detachment, and a state beyond ordinary thought.

Yu Huangyi also points out that the concept of Wuxiang (无想) is fundamentally aligned with Zhongli and René's idea of the Three Deadly Selves.

>Before long, the fighting ended, and the three figures merged into one, alighting before her — it was none other than her astonishing friend.

>This matter piqued Zibai's curiosity, and her friend did not withhold his secrets, imparting them most generously. And so she came to learn the ancient art of "Tri-Factor Excision" — or how to excise the "Three Deadly Selves."

>These so-called Deadly Selves are the impure thoughts and wicked desires that pollute the practitioner's mind. To cast them aside is to glimpse the unmarred self, pure and clean.

Here we have another issue with the English translation.

For here, according to the descriptions given by the Raiden Shogun and Zhongli, the ultimate state of the "Three Deadly Selves" is actually the same. This nuance is completely lost in English.

This is raiden

>她心中空明,本已臻自我之境,可听见人民的呼喊,便要为之停下脚步。

>明镜之上不再澄空,无我的殿堂终闻鸦鸣。拂晓来临时,武士将握起她的刀。

This is zhongli

>兹白对此分外好奇,那人也不藏私,慷慨相授,原来此为一古技,名曰:斩三尸。

>所谓三尸,意为修行者心中的浊念与恶欲,斩去三尸,得见澄净自我。

Ei secluded herself within the Plane of Euthymia to avoid being disturbed by the distractions of the mortal world. The further she distanced herself from emotions, the more powerful her Musou no Hitotachi became.

And she did succeed. After centuries of meditation and isolation, Ei had come close to a state of transcendence.

When the people's wishes broke into the Plane of Euthymia during the Archon Quest, it was, in a sense, a disruption of Ei's spiritual attainment.

Faced with the hopes and aspirations of her people, the loving and protective instincts she possessed as an Archon made it impossible for her to remain in a state of Wuxiang (无想).

René serves as a useful comparison: after his defeat, he too fell from his elevated state of existence.

>Narzissenkreuz: Impossible... I had already reached the stage of "no return." How have I fallen to this point?

>Narzissenkreuz: And I have lost all control of the Primordial Sea.

>Narzissenkreuz: Until, at last, my weak, ordinary self has returned to its physical body.

As for Visions, they can be seen as one of the major obstacles preventing people from achieving transcendence. Ei wished for every one of her subjects to follow the same path she pursued: transcending the self and ultimately attaining eternity. In a sense, it resembles a form of collective cultivation.

That is why she enforced the Vision Hunt Decree and the Sakoku Decree, preventing people from leaving Inazuma and limiting the influence of outside change. From this perspective, Ei's grand project was interrupted by the Traveler before she could fully implement it.

Kitsune Saiguu's assessment of Ei is the same:

>She sought to sweep away the tangled delusions of the mortal world, all in an attempt to free herself from the shackles of the cycle of life and death. Few could truly understand her, and she had little interest in being understood. The Shogun was, in truth, a deeply contradictory person.

This also explains why Ei can appear so naïve despite being over 3,000 years old. The pursuit of Wuxiang required her to keep her distance from others, so she spent centuries isolated from ordinary human relationships. As a result, the human side of her personality remained remarkably innocent and underdeveloped.

And it was precisely because of this that the Musou no Hitotachi became so powerful. The closer Ei came to Wuxiang, the closer she came to a state beyond ordinary human limitations.

reddit.com
u/JollyCapital7589 — 3 months ago

Phanes Fans Reading Surtalogi Lore: 💀

Phanes: Spent 40 years defeating seven “native” rulers whose leader wasn’t even there, and still couldn’t wipe them out completely. Then got beaten into an irrecoverable cripple once the planet’s true owner returned.

Surtalogi: In just 500 years, he has defeated countless powerful beings across the universe — star-level weapons, gods sustained by the collective will of humanity, entities that strike fear into civilizations throughout the cosmos. Even his own disciple stated that no one has ever managed to force him to go all out.

Phanes glazers are honestly comedy gold.

u/JollyCapital7589 — 3 months ago