HeroQuest adjacent - Dark Word mini remake

HeroQuest adjacent - Dark Word mini remake

I found this page while looking for some reference materials for my website.

Fabian Bautista does some amazing rework on Dark World miniatures. Too big for HeroQuest but inspiring to look at.

Yes, it is all digital; none of it is real.

u/Lord-Drucifer — 3 days ago

Making A 3D Dungeon for HeroQuest

3D dungeons are a wonderful thing to use while playing HeroQuest. I built mine using Mage Knight 3D Dungeons kits. Could I have used a 3D printer? Sure, but let me show you a photo of the finished board.

https://preview.redd.it/k3ehgq69fi6h1.jpg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=547a4df39a14a883e9afc0254875bea07dbafc99

There are too many images to post the full thing here on Reddit.

A link to the PDF of this article is located at the end of the article on my website.

I kicked around the idea of using a 3D printer in the beginning. Why did I not go that way? Well, it's simple, really. I do not own a 3D printer. Buying one, buying feeder stock, and spending time learning to use it seemed to be an undesirable task. One I did not have the time for, the patience for, and I dislike the layered look that 3D printers produce. Add to that the cleaning of the printer, prepping the model parts, and painting... I was just not into that amount of work. I know, spending more money for a high-quality resin printer solves a few of these issues, but not enough in my opinion.

Bit of History

Back in 2003, WizKids produced their Mage Knight 3D Dungeons expansion for their Mage Knight Dungeons miniatures skirmish game. The naming convention can lead to some confusion, as they were named the same except for the "3D" nomenclature. There were 3 releases specifically for Mage Knight 3D Dungeons.

First was the starter set consisting of 4 "wooden" doors, 4 "iron" doors, 24 walls, and 36 floor tiles, a full 1/3 of the flooring tiles recommended to play a game. According to the pamphlet inside the box, a game should use a square of 10 x 10 floor tiles, so 100 squares. There were 2 versions of this item: the Promo Pack and the Retail Pack. The promo packs were sent to stores to use as promotional materials to spur interest in this version of the Dungeon expansion. The promo pack also had 6 pillars included and rules for them, while the retail starter set did not.

The second release, Mage Knight 3D Dungeons Floor Pack, marketed as an accessory, was a box of 36 floor tiles. No doors, no walls, just flooring tiles and the same rules from the retail starter set. The idea was for each player to bring their own starting set and flooring tiles expansion to build the maps for play. There were 2 versions of this release as well: the retail box and the promo box. Both had the same contents.

The next was an interesting choice. It was a plastic blister-on-card peg hanger, Mage Knight 3D Dungeons Trap Pack. There were 8 trap miniatures, rules, and a red lens "decoder". The article Drucifer’s Advanced Traps For HeroQuest was inspired by these traps. The blister pack also contained 12 floor tiles with built-in trap dials. These dials had game information obfuscated using red reveal steganography. This required using the red lens to expose the information on the trap dials. As with the other two releases, there were 2 versions: the blister-on-card peg hanger and a promotional box. Both had the same contents.

Scale Issue

The Mage Knight 3D Dungeons tiles were larger than the 1.5-inch squares used in WidKids' other Mage Knight Dungeons releases, poster-sized paper maps, and cardstock map sections from the Mage Knight Dungeon Builder Kits. That size difference made the two Mage Knight Dungeons systems less compatible than they were originally intended.

The dungeon doors from the Mage Knight Dungeon Builder Kits were notably smaller as well, measuring in at 1.5 inches wide. They did not look right when compared to the Mage Knight 3D Dungeons Doors and the 2-inch floor squares.

I am not certain why there was a change in the square size. I am certain it was part of the reason the 3D Dungeons line was canceled. There were other releases for the Mage Knight Dungeons game after the Mage Knight 3D Dungeons, but those releases retained the maps with 1.5 inch squares.

As with all Mage Knight products released during the early 2000s, the Mage Knight 3D Dungeons parts came prepainted. This is one of the reasons it attracted me. I had no desire or time to paint a gaming board.

What it Actually Took to Build

HeroQuest is basically a large grid with a few pronounced lines for "Walls". The grid is 19 squares x 26 squares; this totals out to 494 floor tiles for the entire board. Counting the wall sections results in 261 individual internal walls. I am treating a single tile as a single square on the HeroQuest board. Yes, this will significantly increase the physical size of the playing field, but will not alter the basic board layout.

The Starter set of Mage Knight 3D Dungeons has 36 floor tiles and 24 Walls. It is the only product with walls. To acquire the 261 walls necessary, it would take 11 starter boxes, with only 3 wall tiles in excess. The doors could be used as false doors/walls, and that would reduce the number of boxes to about 9. I did not choose to go this way.

With 11 starter sets, there will be 396 floor tiles. These will need to be supplemented by an additional 98 tiles. This is where the Mage Knight 3D Dungeons Floor Pack comes into play. With 36 floor tiles in each box, it will take 3 boxes, with only 10 excess floor tiles. I also chose to avoid this path.

I highly recommend not bothering with the Mage Knight 3D Dungeons Floor Pack. It is only floor tiles, and though they have their uses, I prefer to have the spare doors and walls. I found that the walls and the floor tiles can be brittle. Breakage is a real concern during assembly and use. I went with 14 starter boxes. This allows me some extra parts if something breaks.

Floor Tiles, Walls, and Doors

The floor tiles are interlocking on all sides. Once assembled, they are very sturdy with little flexibility. The following images show how the tiles interlock using the black and grey tabs and a finished floor/board.

The 2 little holes at each corner have 2 functions. First is to hold up walls and doors. The second is to act as a bracing passage for wall and door pegs, providing perpendicular support for the floor tiles. Each junction has a minimum of 2 supports and a maximum of 3 if a wall or door is involved. This interlocking method leads to a very stable playing environment.

The walls have a single sculpt; this is really only noticeable upon close inspection. The wall's base flares slightly wider than its top and gives the wall some additional support once it is installed on the board. The only issue with the walls is the little plastic pegs that slip into the board holes. These can be temperamental; they do not flex, so rocking back and forth will break them. With one peg down, the wall is still useable; with both, though, it becomes less stable and will fall at the least provocation.

The doors come in painted "iron" and painted "wood". They have 2 points of articulation and can swing open or snap closed. When they are not installed on the board, they are easy to open, as they are slightly sprung. The frame compresses when installed. Also, they only swing slightly more than 90 degrees; if you push them past that point, they will break. I recommend that if you intend to use the open door, open it before you place it on the board.

Board Assembly

With all of the parts in hand, the assembly takes a little over 30 minutes to an hour. This depends on how many parts you break or how proficient you are. I found that assembling long sections of floor rather than square sections of floor worked better and allowed me to progress quickly.

The HeroQuest board is separated into quadrants. Building the outside walls of these quadrants next will help ensure that you have the right layout of the rooms and the halls.

When these items were released back in 2003, I was not in a position to acquire them. This was unfortunate, as they were more rationally priced then than they are now on the secondary market. Most, if not all, of these items are still available on sites like eBay or on miniature trading sites like Bartertown.com.

- Dru

https://preview.redd.it/5hzusp16ki6h1.png?width=2908&format=png&auto=webp&s=8f5a95ea20659aa979bf17a454a5ddad2a8995d8

reddit.com
u/Lord-Drucifer — 26 days ago

Visual Reference for HeroQuest - Talisman The Magical Quest Game – 5th Edition (2024)

This is a visual reference for HeroQuest 2021 Edition using the Talisman: The Magical Quest Game – 5th Edition 2024 by Avalon Hill. Talisman is a classic board game from the 1980's that has seen a ton of editions and expansions. Many players own various editions and may not want to plonk down the MSRP of $50 USD.

One of the nice things is that Avalon Hill is very consistent with the quality of their miniatures. It can be hard to shell out that amount of cash for only the 12 miniatures in the basic box. The fourth edition of the game had 18.

Because I prefer the female elf miniature from the 2021 edition of HeroQuest, I have chosen it as the scale reference miniature for all images in this article. All 12 Miniatures are shown here. A link to a downloadable PDF for the visual reference is provided at the end of this article.

https://preview.redd.it/n45kuwgpit5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=faae63f33500cc930921b4da2f2576416aae503b

Elf -vs- Assassin, Human Fighter

I have always had to wonder about the use of capes on assassin miniatures. Sure, they are cloaks, and the term cloak and dagger hints at their use, but for someone wanting to remain innocuous, this seems a little flamboyant. While it is very dynamic in appearance, the long hair and a cloak are easy to catch on things while trying to escape. Perhaps it could be used as a performer in a sideshow or circus act.

https://preview.redd.it/d4cnx6frit5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2c0a080305dd3f35549fab0492bac7f6e811f074

Elf -vs- Prophetess, Human Caster - Female

A nice solid and simple sculpt that could be used for multiple caster types or as a villager NPC.

https://preview.redd.it/cop49p9tit5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=29cbd3797d7844012caf66403719768167749f4b

Elf -vs- Elf Ranger - Female

This is a gender swap from the previous four editions and has a more dynamic pose.

https://preview.redd.it/qi1yq10vit5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8dcf5c5281dbdbaaba3ad61fcada86c6f2263dba

Elf -vs- Dwarf Fighter

Other versions of this character in the older editions leave a lot to be desired. This one looks like he means business and is not as cartoonish as the third edition or as hunched over and constipated as the fourth edition.

https://preview.redd.it/83gtbb0yit5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=811d4a73190114ecd246e7f442e48d43a96007ef

Elf -vs- Wizard, Human Caster

I love the details on the book and the robes. He doesn't need to be only a wizard; he could also pass for most caster classes.

https://preview.redd.it/flc6j7nzit5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5f8c26279cf2c1e2fee5ad226b914fd6e751fc43

Elf -vs- Thief, Human Rogue

As with most rogue miniatures, this could easily pass as a ranger or even as a courier.

https://preview.redd.it/pa915c11jt5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=be39da9def546213dfd284542e222a93a3351522

Elf -vs- Ghoul

The details on this miniature make it an easy jump to "undead elf ghoul", assuming ghouls are undead in your games.

https://preview.redd.it/4k0fxdh2jt5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0478b633fd3f723c24716b44f525d06239730ac1

Elf -vs- Warrior, Human Fighter - Female

Another gender swap. I like the dynamic pose; she really looks like she means business.

https://preview.redd.it/nskvjg65jt5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=95330c1cad3f7747cb846ef84ad0140ad81d94e8

Elf -vs- Sorceress., Human Caster - Female

With all the skulls on this lady, she could be a warlock, a necromancer, a demonologist, or a nethermancer.

https://preview.redd.it/xuu1awq8jt5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8638a992e2ef7d567533be859d2063c73471c7e7

Elf -vs- Priest, Human Caster

Typical proselytizing priest. A static, stoic statue of a sculpt.

https://preview.redd.it/1614r4majt5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8b58055e5a2abfc8a1e09b67f5476fb67298fd55

Elf -vs- Monk, Human, Fighter, Cleric

This is another of the less inspiring sculpts. I would have preferred a more Eastern-style monk. It seems to me like a missed opportunity to add some more variation to the game.

https://preview.redd.it/wot6t47cjt5h1.jpg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=42998607f0fe857d4ad77f3523c1e5232b60efda

Elf -vs- Troll

Not your typical Dungeons and Dragons troll, or even the slim trolls of World of Warcraft. This fellow is beefy and required two photos.

I am happy with the miniatures in this box. These did not have odd warps and bends. They are packed snugly in a plastic tray that has enough give to allow for the release of the miniatures without bending them.

I have posted a PDF file of these reference images for download on my website.

reddit.com
u/Lord-Drucifer — 29 days ago

Pattern Recognition is real, kind of accidental Where's Waldo.

I happened across this box of stuff on Ebay, and my eyes were drawn immediately to the right-hand corner at the top of photo 1.

It was more apparent in Photo 2

In Photo 3 I was certain that the bum of the original Yeti was peeking out.

Photo 4 has stuff from both the original Elf and Barbarian Quest Packs.

In Photo 5, sure enough, the yeti's bum shows up.

I guess after years of playing with these things, even subtle images can lead you down a rabbit hole. No, I did not purchase this box of stuff; I just thought I would share the experience.

This is not an advertisement; this is not my stuff. I have no interest in whether this gets sold or not.

u/Lord-Drucifer — 1 month ago

UK Games Expo: New HeroQuest promo models

UK Games Expo: New HeroQuest promo models

Photos by u/talismanisland

I love the boxes and the miniatures.

u/Lord-Drucifer — 1 month ago

HeroQuest adjacent "Would You Buy a Second Hand Game for $1,000.00?"

Would You Buy a Second Hand Game for $1,000.00?

Recently, I went looking for a specific board game. It has been out of print for the last four years and has a 20-year production history. During my search, I found several collections on eBay priced at more than $1,000 USD. Since that is a high price for the game, I contacted the seller after all, and they had several “Buy It Now” listings available.

The response to my questions could be summarized as: “We do not check, and we will not check, until a paying customer complains after purchase. Then we will do what we think is appropriate.” This was presented as quality customer service. Knowing I am not the only person buying used games, I felt it was appropriate to provide some guidelines for buying and selling secondhand games.

First and most important is completeness.

You cannot play a game without all of its parts. You are going to want the following:

  • A complete component inventory
    • to include the count and condition of all the parts present in the sale.
  • Photos of all damaged components
    • If there are multiple-part pieces, as is the case for miniatures, are all of the pieces accounted for to allow for the item to be reassembled?
    • Are the cards worn, torn, or stained?
  • Photos of the insert, trays, and box, if the game had them.
    • Are the inserts, trays, and box in good shape, damaged, bent, or crushed?
  • Photos of cardstock components.
    • Cards, cardstock chits, standees, and the playing board
    • Are there rips, gouges, cuts, or sections of cardstock delamination?
    • The worst is cardstock creasing, where the fibers have frayed, and the printed section has begun to flake off. This leads to delamination and part degradation.
  • Photos of miniatures, tokens, pawns, and dice.
    • Are the miniatures in good shape? Are they broken, or have they been painted? Painted parts are always valued less than unpainted parts unless the game came prepainted.
    • Are there specialized dice that the game requires? Are all of them accounted for, and are they legible? Sometimes people attempt to replace the issued dice with “acceptable alternatives.” This would be like using Pip Dice rather than Digit Dice.
    • Specialized pawns and tokens used to represent concepts are generally plastic or metal, and they are present and undamaged.
  • Photos of rule books, quest books, scenario books, handouts, fliers, and other game documentation.
    • Look for rips, tape, and stains.
    • Sometimes there are print errors; this should be disclosed.

Promotional materials can be advertisements, posters, or freebie giveaways that are used to drum up interest often times sellers will want extra for these items. They should be treated as though they were normal items and judged in the same manner. Once the quality has been determined, the “collectible” aspect should be considered.

Unique or limited print items can cause the cost of a game to skyrocket and the game is generally playable without them. These types of items should be considered on a case-by-case basis.

Remember 2 very specific points:

  1. A seller saying “I think it’s complete” is not the same as verified complete.
  2. A seller saying, “We will figure it out after you determine there is an issue.” They already have your money and are in no way accountable to make certain you are made whole.

Second, learn the differences of “previously owned”.

The terms generally used are, “New in Box (NIB)”, “Unpunched”, “Punched”, “Lightly played”, and “played”. Consider that most sellers overvalue their products. They will ask for top dollar for their sale, even if it is not in top condition.

When buying ask your seller the following questions:

  • Has it been played? This will give you an idea of soiling.
  • Was it stored vertically or horizontally? This will give you an idea of bent or twisted parts.
  • Was it in a smoke-free environment? The stink is very difficult to get off board games and requires the parts to be cleaned, then placed in an ozone chamber, which is bad for plastic and rubber parts.
  • Was it stored in a damp or moist environment? Mold and mildew never come off board games. The porous nature of board games makes them susceptible to fungal infection, which becomes embedded in the materials and can not be removed.
  • Are there any warped boards, bent cards, or broken parts? All of these are situations that can be mitigated, but will affect the enjoyment of the game.
  • Are the miniatures, tokens, or other parts painted or modified? This is important as my gamers dislike it when the game pieces are altered from their issued state.

When selling take the time to inform your potential buyer of any and all of the previous situations prior to the purchase. A happy, informed customer is far more of an asset than a bitter, disgruntled customer who feels as though they were taken advantage of and left to rot.

  • New in Box (NIB) or New in Shrink Wrap (NIS): These are factory-sealed products; be certain you know the type of factory seal for your chosen game. Shrink wrap machines and peel labels are easily replaced.
  • Opened but unpunched: In this case, the game box has been opened, but the Chits and Tokens are still on their card-stock or plastic sprues. Sometimes these sprues are shrink-wrapped separately from the rest of the game. As with the NIS classification, make certain you know if the sprue is supposed to be wrapped.
  • Punched: This is when the Chits and Tokens have been removed from sprue sheets. Here is where the item list comes in handy. Knowing you are supposed to have 35 of a particular Chit will help you determine if all of the parts are, in fact, in the game.
  • Played Once, Lightly Played, or Like New: This is an attempt by the seller to increase the value of the game by suggesting that a single play through or a light playing experience makes the game less used than it often is. The game is used, either it is damaged used or it is playable used. If it's not new, it’s used.
  • Sorted: This means the seller has attempted to separate the parts. If it is sorted, then there should be no issue with the seller giving you an inventory of the parts. Components are generally organized in little plastic baggies.
  • Sleeved: Cards in protective sleeves are to be treated with caution. Opaque sleeves can hide damage to the cards.

Third, know the market for your game.

Just because it is Out of Print (OOP), doesn’t mean that it demands a high price. Many sellers overvalue their items because they equate OOP with “Rare and Valuable”. Just because a game is no longer available at retail stores does not automatically make it collectible. Always check multiple locations for a good idea of the market price of a game.

When buying be clear about your requirements and what you are willing to pay, be willing to walk away from a bad deal or a seller that refuses to answer your questions directly.

When Selling: price your product fairly, and describe the product accurately. A statement of “see the photos” and then not supplying detailed photos is a dead giveaway of a bad deal.

Whether buying or selling, always check your pricing:

  • Check actual sold listings on eBay, not just the current listed prices; lots of items sit for months in stores waiting to be sold because they are overpriced.
  • Check the marketplace history on Board Game Geek.
  • Check your social network listings.
  • Check Reddit.
  • Check Craigslist, it's an oldie but a goody for stuff locally.

Consider shipping costs from the supplier to your address. This can make or break a sale. Anything shipping into the United States has a ridiculous import fee tied to it, as with shipping to Australia or the European Union, if you are not in those places.

Fourth, is to intimately know your product.

Many modern games have lots of expansions and sellers, either by chance or by intent, erroneously classify expansions. This is easy to do when the game title is first, and the expansion name is second. Be certain you know the expansions issued for your chosen game.

When Buying Expansions you should be clear about the title of the expansion, what year it was published (this helps with edition issues), and what edition the expansion is intended for. Some games, like HeroQuest and Descent: Journeys in the Dark, have multiple editions, and not all of the expansions are intended for all editions.

When Selling Expansions you should be clear about the title of the expansion, what year it was published and the intended edition of the expansion.

Kickstarter and promotional expansions can be difficult to verify without photos and records of what exactly is included in the Kickstarter or promotional pack. Always be wary when buying open Kickstarter kits. When selling Kickstarter kits, always include the information from the Kickstarter that applies to what is being sold.

Fifth, the fake products.

With the advent of the 3D printer, game part printing companies, and game card printing companies, fakes, counterfeits, bootlegs, and other non-official products make it to the secondary market. HeroQuest, Magic the Gathering, and HeroScape are all subject to this situation. When you have a product that you believe is a fake, do not sell it to someone else. Notify the individual from whom you purchased it and let them know why it is a forgery.

A few giveaways to help determine forgeries.

  1. Blurry, hazy, or grainy printing on the cards and or materials. Yes, recently Magic the Gathering and Dungeons & Dragons have both suffered these issues from the manufacturer; still, it is best to be aware of it.
  2. Cardstock is different than the rest of the game. It is very noticeable when cards are not the same as previous releases, this is also why sleeved cards are always suspect.
  3. Incorrect colors and low-quality printing. These are generally because of scans used to reproduce cards or rule books.
  4. “Resealed” new in box items, a shrink sealer is not expensive, and I know of several large retailers that reseal products regularly. These types of reseals will have a thick center plastic seam that is not consistent with a new product. It may be a sign of a used item repacked as new, or a return item repacked to resell as new.
  5. Proxy items are always unofficial items and should be clearly marked as not official.

Always protect yourself financially.

This is for both buyer and the seller. As a buyer, eBay has some buyer protections in place, as dose Paypal Goods and Services, and your credit card. As a seller, your protections come from a clear and concise description with good communication. The term buyer beware, is an old adage for a reason. For large purchases, use an escrow company or a payment plan system that will allow for termination if the situation goes awry.

Some things that are red flags to recognize from either the buyer or the seller.

  1. Requiring a down payment using a non-buyer-protected service.
  2. Requiring a cash payment
  3. requiring the use of a wire transfer
  4. requiring the use of a cryptocurrency

Trust is earned and can be demonstrated.

A trustworthy buyer asks all the questions and expresses all concerns. They pay on time and have a history of doing so. They do not balk at paying for tracking on their purchases. Striving to be a trustworthy buyer is a worthy goal. That way, if or when you end up in a situation, you are more likely to be judged as honest.

A trustworthy seller answers the detailed questions, provides clear and quality images of the items for sale, honestly describes the flaws of the product, ships with a tracking number and allows returns if there are issues.

Seller red flag behaviors to consider for a buyer.

The seller refuses to give an inventory, refuse photos, claims “lots of interest” trying to garner the Fear of Missing Out. They use stock only photos and avoid or refuse to answer component questions. They expect the customer to inventory the purchase and then file a complaint rather than supply records of the contents of the game.

Buyer red flag behaviors to consider for a seller.

The buyer refuses to use tracked shipping, they refuse to provide verified address, they decline to ask any questions (this is a dead giveaway that the sale is going to head south). They want the cheapest shipping possible. They request to pay in cash, via a non-certified cash system, or through a questionable third-party process. They wait a week after the receipt of the product to notify you of issues regarding the purchase.

For both the seller and the buyer it is a good practice to review the history of the other party to get an idea of the individual with whom you are doing business. Look at the negatives as well as the positives. Look at the age of the account; this is a gauge of the stability of the other party.

Shipping a game is a risky proposition.

Second hand games should be packed inside with filler to keep the box from crumpling during shipping. They should be wrapped in a layer of bubble wrap, and the corners should be protected to prevent the box from being damaged during transit. Components and cards should be securely packed to prevent damage during shipping. It is the responsibility of the customer to express this requirement and be willing to pay for the shipping and handling charges. It is the responsibility of the seller to make certain the game is delivered in as good a condition as it can be within the limits allowed by the buyer. If a buyer wants to cheap out on the shipping, then the damages they receive will need to be clearly communicated to them prior to shipping.

FOMO / Collector Hype

As touched on earlier, there is a modern phenomenon that is pushed by game manufacturers through the use of artificial and perceived scarcity. This is the Fear of Missing out (FOMO) and Collector Hype, both are fed into the board game community consistently through limited releases like Kickstarter or Gamefound, or through bad distribution practices like Hasbro. This effect can have an undue effect on the behavior of buyers and sellers. The thing to remember is that in the secondary market, all used things come around again and again. Patience is a key attribute when trying to complete a collection or find just the right game. The scarcity is inevitably false.

Practical Checklist Before Sending Money

Here is a 10 point practical checklist to use before purchasing any game on the secondary market:

Ask the seller for:

  • Game title and expansions, if any.
  • A complete contents inventory.
  • Photos of all the contents, not in bags or piles.
  • Rule book and documentation photos.
  • Box photos of all six sides and the inserts.
  • Confirmation of missing or broken pieces.
  • Details for the edition, printing, and date.
  • Shipping method to include packaging and tracking.
  • Protected payment method.
  • A return guarantee if there are issues.

If anything feels evasive, rushed, or too good to be true, it probably is. Often, it is better to walk away. In the secondary market for games, another copy will almost always appear.

https://www.grammarly.com/ai-detector

reddit.com
u/Lord-Drucifer — 2 months ago

Would You Buy a Second Hand Game for $1,000.00?

I posted previously ,but was removed, the reasons seamed off but ok. I rewrote the entire thing for my web page and elected to share it here anyway. I think that it might help some folks when buying on the secondary games market.

Recently, I went looking for a specific board game. It has been out of print for the last four years and has a 20-year production history. During my search, I found several collections on eBay priced at more than $1,000 USD. Since that is a high price for the game, I contacted the seller after all they had several “Buy It Now” listings available.

The response to my questions could be summarized as: “We do not check, and we will not check, until a paying customer complains after purchase. Then we will do what we think is appropriate.” This was presented as quality customer service. Knowing I am not the only person buying used games, I felt it was appropriate to provide some guidelines for buying and selling secondhand games.

First and most important is completeness.

You cannot play a game without all of its parts. You are going to want the following:

  • A complete component inventory
    • to include the count and condition of all the parts present in the sale.
  • Photos of all damaged components
    • If there are multiple part pieces, as is the case for miniatures, are all of the pieces accounted for to allow for the item to be reassembled?
    • Are the cards worn, torn, or stained?
  • Photos of the insert, trays and box, if the game had them.
    • Are the inserts, trays and box in good shape, damaged, bent or crushed?
  • Photos of card-stock components.
    • Cards, card-stock chits, standees, the playing board
    • Are there rips, gouges, cuts, or sections of card-stock delamination?
    • The worst is card-stock creasing where the fibers have frayed and the printed section has begun to flake off, this leads to delamination and part degradation.
  • Photos of miniatures, tokens, pawns, and dice.
    • Are the miniatures in good shape, are they broken, or have they been painted? Painted parts are always valued less than unpainted parts unless the game came prepainted.
    • Are there specialized dice that the game requires, are all of them accounted for, and are they legible? Sometime people attempt to replace the issued dice with “acceptable alternatives” this would be like using Pip Dice rather then Digit Dice.
    • Specialized pawns and tokens used to represent concepts are generally plastic or metal, are they present and undamaged.
  • Photos of rule books, quest books, scenario books, handouts, fliers, and other game documentation.
    • Look for rips, tape, and stains.
    • Sometimes there are print errors, this should be disclosed.

Promotional materials can be advertisements, posters, or freebie giveaways that are used to drum up interest often times sellers will want extra for these items. They should be treated as though they were normal items and judged in the same manner. Once the quality has been determined then the “collectible” aspect should be considered.

Unique or limited print items can cause the cost of a game to skyrocket and the game is generally playable with out them. These types of items should be considered on a case by case basis.

Remember 2 very specific points:

  1. A seller saying “I think it’s complete” is not the same as verified complete.
  2. A seller saying “We will figure it out after you determine there is an issue.” Already has your money and is in no way accountable to make certain you are made whole.

Second learn the differences of “previously owned”.

The terms generally used are, “New in Box (NIB)”, “Unpunched”, “Punched”, “Lightly played”, and “played”. Consider that most sellers over value their products. They will ask for top dollar for their sale even if it is not in top condition.

When buying ask your seller the following questions:

  • Has it been played? This will give you an idea of soiling.
  • Was it stored vertically or horizontally? This will give you an idea of bent or twisted parts.
  • Was it in a smoke free environment? The stink is very difficult to get off of board games and requires the parts to be cleaned then placed in an ozone chamber, which is bad for plastic and rubber parts.
  • Was it stored in a damp or moist environment? Mold and mildew never come off of board games. The porous nature of board games makes them susceptible to fungal infection which becomes embedded in the materials and can not be removed.
  • Are there any warped boards, bent cards or broken parts? All of these are situations that can be mitigated but will affect the enjoyment of the game.
  • Are the miniatures, tokens, or other parts, painted or modified? This is important as my gamers dislike when the game pieces are altered from their issued state.

When selling take the time to inform your potential buyer of any and all of the previous situations prior to the purchase. A happy informed customer is far more of an asset than a disgruntled, bitter customer that feels as though they were taken advantage of and left to rot.

  • New in Box (NIB) or New in Shrink Wrap (NIS): These are factory sealed products, be certain you know the type of factory seal for your chosen game. Shrink wrap machines, and peel labels are easily replaced.
  • Opened but unpunched: In this case the game box has been opened but the Chits and Tokens are still on their card-stock or plastic sprues. Sometimes these sprues are shrink wrapped separately from the rest of the game. As with the the NIS classification make certain you know if the sprue is supposed to be wrapped.
  • Punched: This is when the Chits and Tokens have been removed from sprue sheets, here is where the item list comes in handy. Knowing you are supposed to have 35 of a particular Chit will help you determine if all of the parts are in fact, in the game.
  • Played Once, Lightly Played, or Like New: This is an attempt by the seller to increase the value of the game by suggesting that a single play through or a light playing experience makes the game less used than it often is. The game is used, either it is damaged used or it is playable used. If its not new, it is used.
  • Sorted: this means the seller has attempted to separate the parts. If it is sorted then there should be no issue with the seller giving you an inventory of the parts. Components are generally organized in little plastic baggies.
  • Sleeved: Cards in protective sleeves are to be treated with caution. Opaque sleeves can hide damage to the cards.

Third, know the market for your game.

Just because it is Out of Print (OOP), doesn't mean that it demands a high price. Many sellers over value their items because they equate OOP with “Rare and Valuable”. Just because a game is no longer available at retail stores, does not automatically make it collectible. Always check multiple locations for a good idea of the market price of a game.

When buying be clear about your requirements and what you are willing to pay, be willing to walk away from a bad deal or a seller that refuses to answer your questions directly.

When Selling: price your product fairly, and describe the product accurately. A statement of “see the photos” and then not supply detailed photos is a dead giveaway of a bad deal.

Whether buying or selling always check your pricing:

  • Check actual sold listings on eBay, not just the current listed prices, lots of items sit for months in stores waiting to be sold because they are over priced.
  • Check the market place history on Board Game Geek.
  • Check your social network listings.
  • Check reddit.
  • Check Craigslist, its an oldie but a goody for stuff locally.

Consider shipping costs from the supplier to your address. This can make or break a sale. Anything shipping into the United States has a ridiculous import fee tied to it, as with shipping to Australia or the European Union, if you are not in those places.

Fourth, is to intimately know your product.

Many modern games have lots of expansions and sellers, either by chance or by intent, erroneously classify expansions. This is easy to do when the game title is first and the expansion name is second. Be certain you know the expansions issued for your chosen game.

When Buying Expansions you should be clear about the title of the expansion, what year it was published (this helps with edition issues), and what edition the expansion is intended for. Some games like HeroQuest and Descent: Journeys in the Dark have multiple editions and not all of the expansions are intended for all editions.

When Selling Expansions you should be clear about the title of the expansion, what year it was published and the intended edition of the expansion.

Kickstarter and promotional expansions can be difficult to verify without photos and records of what exactly is included in the Kickstarter or promotional pack. Always be weary when buying open Kickstarter kits. When selling Kickstarter kits always include the information from the Kickstarter that applies to what is being sold.

Fifth, the fake products.

With the advent of the 3D printer, game part printing companies, and game card printing companies, fakes, counterfeits, bootlegs, and other non-official products make it to the secondary market. HeroQuest, Magic the Gathering, and HeroScape are all subject to this situation. When you have a product that you believe is a fake do not sell it to someone else. Notify the individual from who you purchased it and let them know why it is a forgery.

A few giveaways to help determine forgeries.

  1. Blurry, hazy, or grainy printing on the cards and or materials. Yes recently Magic the Gathering and Dungeons & Dragons have both suffered these issues from the manufacture, still it is best to be aware of it.
  2. Card-stock different than the rest of the game. It is very noticeable when cards are not the same as previous releases, this is also why sleeved cards are always suspect.
  3. Incorrect colors and low quality printing. These are generally because of scans used to reproduce cards or rule books.
  4. “Resealed” new in box items, a shrink sealer is not expensive and I know of several large retailers that reseal products regularly. These types of reseals will have a thick center plastic seam that is not consistent with a new product. It may be a sign of a used item repacked as new, or a return item repacked to resell as new.
  5. Proxy items are always unofficial items and should be clearly marked as not official.

Always protect yourself financially.

This is for both buyer and the seller. As a buyer ebay has some buyer protections in place, as dose Paypal Goods and Services, and your credit card. As a seller your protections come from a clear and concise description with good communication. The term buyer beware, is an old adage for a reason. For large purchase use an escrow company or a payment plan system that will allow for termination if the situation goes awry.

Some things that are red flags to recognize from either the buyer or the seller.

  1. Requiring a down payment using a non buyer protected service.
  2. Requiring a cash payment
  3. requiring the use of a wire transfer
  4. requiring the use of a cryptocurrency

Trust is earned and can be demonstrated.

A trustworthy buyer asks all the questions and expresses all concerns. They pay on time and have a history of doing so. They do not balk a paying for tracking on their purchases. Striving to be a trustworthy buyer is a worthy goal. That way when, or if, you end up in a situation you are more likely to be judged as honest.

A trustworthy seller answers the detailed questions, provides clear and quality images of the items for sale, honestly describes the flaws of the product, ships with a tracking number and allows returns if there are issues.

Seller red flag behaviors to consider for a buyer.

The seller refuses to give an inventory, refuse photos, claims “lots of interest” trying to garner the Fear of Missing Out. They use stock only photos, avoids or refuses to answer component questions. They expect the customer to inventory the purchase and then file a complaint rather than supply records of the contents of the game.

Buyer red flag behaviors to consider for a seller.

The buyer refuses to use tracked shipping, they refuse to provide verified address, they decline to ask any questions (this is a dead giveaway that the sale is going to head south). They wan the cheapest shipping possible. They request to pay in cash, via a non certified cash system, or through a questionable third party process. They wait a week after reception of the product to notify you of issues regarding the purchase.

For both the seller and the buyer it is a good practice to review the history of the other party to get an idea of the individual with whom you are doing business. Look at the negatives as well as the positives. Look at the age of the account, this is a gauge of the stability of the other party.

Shipping a game is a risky proposition.

Second hand games should be packed inside with filler to keep the box from crumpling during shipping. They should be wrapped in a layer of bubble wrap and the corners should be protected to prevent the box from damaged during transit. Components and cards should be securely packed to prevent damage during shipping. It is the responsibility of the customer to express this requirement and be willing to pay for the shipping and handling charges. It is the responsibility of the seller to make certain the game is delivered in as good a condition as it can be with in the limits allowed by the buyer. If a buyer wants to cheap out on the shipping then the damages they receive will need to be clearly communicated to them prior to shipping.

FOMO / Collector Hype

As touched on earlier there is a modern phenomenon that is pushed by game manufacturers through the use of artificial and perceived scarcity. This is the Fear of Missing out (FOMO) and Collector Hype, both are fed in to the board game community consistently through limited releases like Kickstarter or Gamefound, or through bad distribution practices like Hasbro. This effect can have an undue effect on the behavior of buyers and sellers. The thing to remember is that in the secondary market, all used things come around again and again. Patience is a key attribute when trying to complete a collection or find just the right game. The scarcity is inevitably false.

Practical Checklist Before Sending Money

Here is a 10 point practical checklist to use before purchasing any game on the secondary market:

Ask the seller for:

  • Game title and expansions if any.
  • A complete contents inventory.
  • Photos of all the contents, not in bags or piles.
  • Rule book and documentation photos.
  • Box photos of all six sides and the inserts.
  • Confirmation of missing or broken pieces.
  • Details for the edition, printing, and date.
  • Shipping method to include packaging and tracking.
  • Protected payment method.
  • A return guarantee if there are issues.

If anything feels evasive, rushed, or too good to be true, it probably is. Often it is better to walk away. In the secondary market for games, another copy will almost always appear.

- Dru

reddit.com
u/Lord-Drucifer — 2 months ago

Would you spend 1000 USD on a used game where the seller refuses to verify parts?

https://preview.redd.it/vebucpapsi2h1.png?width=1584&format=png&auto=webp&s=efd194c0da8252eb43ac9a0bad33381061be723f

Individual components have not been counted, but are believed to be complete except where noted above. "

Questions:

  1. If they have not verified the parts, how can they believe all of the parts are there?
  2. How do they know what items to be included in the "except where noted above" if they don't verify parts?
  3. How can the seller expect a customer to spend 1000 USD without spending the effort to verify the content of the item being sold if the photos are of boxes and bags of parts?

I could understand if this were a single one off situation, but ebay is riddled with this nonsense. Noble Knight Games used to be a good place to get the hard to find stuff because they took the time to do the job right. Now, not so much, and this is in all of their listings that I have looked at, which is about 10.

Sadly this behavior is it is appearing across a large swath of the board games I have been looking at.

So the question is, would you spend 1000 USD on a used game where the seller refuses to verify parts?

reddit.com
u/Lord-Drucifer — 2 months ago

AI tool usage for the r/HeroQuest Community

TLDR: r/HeroQuest will not ban content made with the help of AI tools.

HeroQuest is the reason we are here. Our community includes people from many countries, religions, and backgrounds. We may come from different places and speak different languages, but we come here because we enjoy HeroQuest. The excitement of the game, the fun it creates, and the friendships it builds, that is what brings us together.

Artificial intelligence (AI) has been part of digital artistic tools for decades. Programs like Photoshop, CorelDraw, and CAD use AI in their functionality. Phone camera filters use AI. Major technology companies such as Microsoft, Google, and Apple also use AI in the background of their systems. Simply put, AI is common in today’s digital world and cannot be avoided if you use creative software or a computer.

Hasbro, which owns the HeroQuest intellectual property, and Avalon Hill, which currently holds the license to the game, both use AI in game development and item production. AI is also used in the official HeroQuest companion app.

This community is a place to share ideas, creativity, and joy related to HeroQuest. Arguments about politics, religion, personal lifestyles, and prejudice, do not belong here. We understand that people have different opinions, but this community is not the place to discuss those opinions.

Personal attacks against members of this community will not be accepted. Harassing a community member because of a perception that AI may have been used is not permitted. Attacking their shared work is not allowed. Posts intended to create conflict will be removed. Repeats of that behavior will lead to temporary warning bans, continued actions in the same vein will lead to permanent removal.

If you are concerned about a post, contact the moderators.

The only thing better than HeroQuest is more HeroQuest. If someone creates homebrew content, it belongs here. If you do not enjoy certain content or disagree with it, express your self civilly or simply choose not to interact with it. If you find it offensive report it, our Mod team takes all reports seriously.

reddit.com
u/Lord-Drucifer — 2 months ago
▲ 66 r/HQhomebrew+1 crossposts

A “How to” for moving large creatures in HeroQuest. Written using the mobile application as the source of the research. This is how the app works, it is not a homebrew rules set. As with all of my new articles a PDF version is available for download at the end for the readers located in countries where the image hosting provider is banned.

The actual article exceeds the size limits for images on reddit, so there are only 3 pages for the example. (Link)

u/Lord-Drucifer — 3 months ago