u/MasqueOfTheRedPost

The first time I saw Phantom on tour, I was listening for the orchestra as the bows started, and I was disappointed that they didn't have bows/exit music.

But when the curtain fell the second time, then the orchestra started up again.

This is hard to gauge since I've only seen a few shows live, but I thought it was standard to have combined bows/exit music -- the orchestra plays continuously during the bows, and it's timed so that there's a short playout after the curtain falls.

Was this setup (exit music, but no bows music) more standard for older '80s musicals? Or do some musicals just want the audience's applause to be the only accompaniment for the bows?

This occurred to me while reading u/nofunclubb's post about Hadley Fraser as Raoul. A lot of the comments boiled down to disagreements about what Raoul is "really" like, and it made me wonder -- what is his character arc in the ALW musical?

Whatever it is, it doesn't seem very well-defined. The best I can come up with is that he learns to respect Christine's feelings and opinions...mostly.

Here's my thought process, based mostly on the Broadway/US tour interpretations, with a bit of Hadley Fraser influence:

• He's an arrogant but well-meaning doofus in Act I. No notes.
• During Masquerade and his scene with Madame Giry, he realizes that Christine was right about the Phantom all along, and hey, maybe he should listen to his fiancee more.
• Having undergone this character development, he immediately...ignores his fiancee's opinion and insists she perform in Don Juan Triumphant.
• He shows up to protect Christine in the graveyard. Despite the Phantom's goading, he does (eventually) listen to Christine when she tells him to flee.
  • I don't think this is purely self-preservation, because most Raouls clearly think they can handle the Phantom, fireballs notwithstanding.
• When the Phantom kidnaps Christine, Raoul goes after her...no doubt feeling horribly guilty because, you know, exactly what Christine said would happen happened.
• Final Lair goes down, and Raoul and Christine leave the lair (see caveat #2 below on this).

So in this interpretation, Raoul conceding to Christine's wish to return the Phantom's ring would be the end of his character arc. He's spent the whole musical ignoring Christine's opinions on how to deal with the Phantom, and it got her kidnapped and nearly got him killed. And ultimately, Christine was the one who got them both out of the lair alive. So if she thinks this ring is that important to the Phantom, well...fine.

The only issue is that this conversation happens offstage. To be fair, that's kind of a theme with this couple (see also: their childhood together, the First Lair to Il Muto gap, the months-long gap between Rooftop and Masquerade), but...really?

And we never see anything to confirm this interpretation either way, because the only thing we know about Raoul post-Final Lair is that he grows up to be a sad old widower. (Kindly leave The Musical That Must Not Be Named out of this).

So, what do you guys think? Is this really Raoul's character arc, and is it as badly paid-off as I think it is? Or am I missing something?

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Two caveats:

1. For the sake of clarity, please keep comments focused on the ALW musical and not other sources, such as the novel.
2. I know that each Christine/Raoul pair plays the lair departure differently. Often it's Christine reaching out to the Phantom, or at least hesitating to leave, and Raoul has to practically drag her away. Other times, it's Raoul standing there, staring at the Phantom like he's trying to figure him out, while Christine frantically tugs at his arm. I'm not really counting that here, since it seems to be at the actors' discretion, not part of the official staging.

I'm pretty new to the opera scene, and I've seen two operas live so far -- both touring productions at two fairly large venues (2,500+ seats).

During both operas, multiple audience members used their cellphones to take photos during the performance. I asked the ushers about it, and they said taking photos was allowed -- it's only video or audio recording that's prohibited.

This was jarring to me, since I came to opera from musical theater, and trying to take photos during a musical would earn you a stern warning and/or eviction in every theater I've visited.

Are cellphone rules actually more lax for opera than for musical theater (maybe due to copyright expiration)? Or is my experience non-representative of most opera houses?

I am a lifelong phan, but this has always confused me. In the stage musical, it's not like we're close enough to see the rings, but I always thought it went like this:

• Christine wears an engagement ring from Raoul around her neck.
• The Phantom takes it from her during Why So Silent (though this doesn't happen in the 2011 proshot).
• In Point of No Return, the Phantom proposes with his own ring, a different one from Raoul's.
• Christine returns the Phantom's engagement ring to him at the end of Final Lair. (Presumably she never gets back the ring Raoul gave her? Eh, he's rich, he can buy her another one).

This would mean that Christine gets two engagement rings at different points, one from Raoul and one from the Phantom.

However, in the 2004 film, when we're close enough to see the rings, it LOOKS like the same ring the entire time:

Christine's engagement ring (2004)

...but if there was only ever one ring, this would mean that the Phantom proposed to Christine with another man's ring, and that Christine gives the Phantom Raoul's ring at the end? Um...why?

(The book also only features one ring, but that ring belongs to the Phantom originally. Christine wears it to symbolize that she's under his "protection," but loses it on the rooftop. The Phantom finds it and forces her to wear it again, and that's the ring Christine swears to bury him with. Thematically, this makes sense -- the ring was a symbol of the Phantom's control over her, which he relinquishes at the end of the story...but it was also a symbol of his love, which is why she promises to come back and bury him with it).

But if there's only one ring in the ALW story, and that ring originally came from Raoul, then I don't understand how this symbolism is supposed to work.

It's also possible that I'm wrong about there being two different rings in the stage musical...

Can someone make Christine's engagement ring(s) make sense? Thanks.

• 1st US national tour: Christine tour
• 2nd: Raoul tour
• 3rd: Music Box tour
• 5th (the current US tour): Box Five tour

Does the 4th national tour (the restaged tour) have a name…other than the many epithets assigned to it by disgruntled phans?

I think we're past the point of needing spoiler warnings, but I shall err on the side of caution.

The Madame Giry actress in each pulse also plays >!Young Giry in the carnival scene!<, right?

This is either a shoutout to an ensemble member who was really good at imitating another actor's mannerisms, or a shoutout to Tia Karaplis, who was so good at playing >!a significantly younger version of her character!< (I think she even changed her accent) that it made me wonder if it was still the same person.

Please let me know who I should be complimenting here. Thanks!