u/MiaMega

Yes, I do hate ribbun, but I'm analising that fumbler, not talking about shipping in the fandom, let's not change topics.

Now that I've put some time between myself and the finale before rewatching again because despite everything I like it, I kind of got the feeling that, even in that weird fantasy, stew material wasn't actually showing real attraction to Gangle, but more like it was a mix of repressed envy of Zooble and another read on Gangle that is just as shallow as "the sad one".

Let's be fr, everyone in the Circus can be considered woketron 3000 with how they vibe with Zooble's gender or lack thereof, specially in a mid 2010s context (I know how it was, I was in the Undertale fandom), meanwhile, future meat, instead of seeing it as an opening to do some growing, tries to drag them down to her level and fails. Even beyond gender, Zooble is extremely honest and not afraid of making their desires known and perfectly capable of doing so without losing their gentleness as long as you don't abuse their patience, while owl food would rather abstract than accept that someone might not want to shoot her in the face. They're everything she's not strong enough to be and she knows it.

Gangle is a little easier, and because of that more infuriating. She violates Gangle's privacy all the time, she's the one who brings up most implications that she might be a sexual being. But to fit python lunch's worldview, this can't be just, you know, an adult woman having sexual frustration from being stuck in a sexless place where any privacy she could have is constantly violated. The only logical conclusion is that she's the archetype of the perv who only values people for sexual gratification.

Of course, it comes to a head with: the two's connection is something that you'd have to be blind deaf and stupid to not see. But it can't be real human connection because everyone in the Circus is too shallow to have genuine connection.

Therefore: if Zooble was gone, fox dinner could swipe in and have what they have, and by extention be the center of Gangle's world again, and that'd really work because it's not she actually loves them, they were just the first ready to put out. She's still her property to use and abuse, and can't be too timid to get away, pervs aren't timid, they're pervs, obviously she's getting her rocks off from being mistreated, context mattering takes nuance, which shallow archetypes don't have.

Once again, for that flavor of misogynist, sex is not about sex but power, and shopee Bugs Bunny feels powerful by bending a mentally and emotionally vulnerable woman to her whims.

I've read a few reasons why some people have a CNC kink in the "target" role, and many people admiting to wanting to roleplay the "target", but almost nothing about someone who enjoys the "agressor" role. I'm not trying to imply that someone who roleplays like that wants to assault someone for real, the whole point is it being a scenario where no real damage is being done, but like, are those just rarer? Is being eager right off the gate seen as a red flag? I just didn't look at the right places? Kinks I don't have fascinate me, so having no reference feels like a bummer.

... And shows that they're both not white, and canon.

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It's so rare for media in general to make PoC queer characters, let alone let them have a happy ending, so it feels great, as a PoC queer myself.

I'm happy and relieved that sex only became possible after he abstracted.

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Goose SAYS that there's lines he wouldn't cross, and I myself would like to believe that that's low even for him, but the more I think about his behavior, the more I realise that not only there's no evidence that he's against forcing it, but there's actually evidence that even if thinks something is too far, he's perfectly capable of doing it anyways. And his misogynist streak doesn't help.

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He already tortures Ragatha and Gangle physically and psychologically, they REALLY don't need to get raped too!

Because I also liked it and think it's a good closure for the series.

If you use it to complain I'll block you. We have plenty of posts to complain, don't highjack the conpliment post.

I'm opening: as sad as it is, narratively speaking, I couldn't really see Jax's arc ending in anything other than abstraction. We've seen again and again that he was unwilling to change, unwilling to accept help, and the mind dive showed that he was even willing to oppose getting help out of pettiness. It's not a "if you're suicidal, go ahead, it'll make things better" message, saying that's what the series is saying is taking one piece out of context. We saw multiple times that the characters get scarred by the abstractions and the fallout is things getting worse, the more solid exemples being Queenie and Ribbit, and Kaufmo to some extent. Jax is not an exemple to be followed, he's a cautionary tale, and being a focus character doesn't mean it can't be the case - some of you have never watched Requiem For A Dream and it shows.

We've known from the start, the series is about how even a stagnated life can be meaningful. He failed to give it meaning, made it everyone else's problem, and no amount of empathy can help someone who slaps every hand that gets extented. Even Zooble, who hated him with, was willing to show compassion, and it was useless because it got rejected. There's only so much someone can sabotage themself before it destroys them and those around them. And the sad reality is, if you make everyone around you miserable, they'll be less miserable without you around. That, too, is a cautionary tale. The message in Jax's ending is not that suicide is the answer, is that, if you never steer yourself into a better path, you'll eventually reach a point of no return and things won't get better. I can even defend it happening off screen because of that: you don't know what the point of no return is untill it's reached, and then it's too late.