u/New-Discount9058

Shout out to the nerds who thought I'd cave.

We are so back boys.

See you on the ladder.

So, I played a bunch more games on this patch and was still losing a decent amount to zerg and protoss. Got me thinking why they even did it.

Terran gets their first macro boost from the mule. For a mule you need a rax and a depot.

So in an 8 worker start Terran is early on behind protoss and zerg for their recent changes

You get your first supply depot slower, and your first rax is a few seconds slower, so your mule is a few seconds slower.

Zerg and Protoss get these boosts immediately:

Zerg larvae spawn is technically faster than before, thus faster drones

Protoss starts with chrono boost, mitigating the 8 worker start if chronoing Nexus.

Their economic boost scales too, I dont know exactly the math, but the cost saved on the natural CC sure, it buys you a bunker for safer early expansion, less need to reaper scout.

Protoss and zerg know its popular to go CC first on this patch, so protoss often can open 2 gate or 8 pool to pressure the early CC. This changes the meta, its riskier to go CC first. The game still has that rock paper scissors effect of the opener, what you expect the other guy to do with his initial timings. If you can mind read your opponent in a current patch, you can exploit common openers and get an advantage. The workers being lower means this creates variety in opening strategies.

The workers mean more. Scouting is more of a potential loss if your opponent is playing safe. This encourages aggressive one base plays. You could do marauder pressure, roach pressure, 2 gate pressure as an actual safer opener.

But by the time your first CC goes down, for your natural 300 minerals is starting to decline in its value because the way minerals overtime decline in value and gas becomes superior (especially for terran moving to the late game)

Alot of people say the planetary boost in cost is "marginal" because by the time you take your fourth, minerals are "not as meaningful" right? Doesn't everyone say that? so you save the hundred minerals for your fourth, but the 250 for the planetary eats that savings. The mechanics of the game make it to where protoss and zerg have strong map control at that point, so the meta feels surprisingly familiar.

Orbitals are riskier to mass because they cant defend themselves, you need an army near them. Thus a terran massing orbitals will either have to spread them around the map or tuck them in his main or peppered around in a defensive sim city. And orbitals decline in usefulness as the map drains out, usually around the 30 minute mark. Hellbats, marines, and turrets are the only pure mineral fighting units terran has.

Marines without gas units get rekt by all late game armies, broodlords, ultras, even skytoss can shred marines if they have no support via gas units. Hellbats are even more useless against an end game army.

And by the time that late game gets there, protoss and zerg have scaled with their snowball boosts, Protoss still has great map control with gateway spam, zerg has more hatcheries from the snowballing larvae boost. Protoss are figuring out the gateway boost and its frightening! Loootsa zealots. And I'm definitely feeling Adepts and Collossus are stronger against more types of terran units than marines. Collossus hits tanks, marauders, and ground mechs harder, shredding the gas value from terrans army.

Anyone can tell you an all mineral late game army is trash because light armor attack bonuses and splash damage exists.

So just grab the gas on the map against Terran if hes going mass orbital. Pressure him since its a greedy play, and CC's dont become useful until theyre orbitals. Contain with a more advanced army and use the protoss mass cannon, battery, tempest, storm bs and zerg creep into brood lord, lurker, viper, spread and loads of spores and spines etc. Those mules arent going to be useful the entire game.

But wait, Terran is fucked then lategame right? No, ghosts are 2 supply and dont get interrupted via their snipe :) It's a gas war at that point, not a mineral war. And thats kinda how it always is.

I'm trying to be charitable and see the other side of people defending the change. Im sure there's some cool exploit to this, but no one seems to have found it yet. If protoss and zerg had no initial chrono and no larvae boost, yes, this change would be insane.

This is an insane patch :D

Happy to be wrong.

Im Terran, but this is arguably just as strong as the faster larvae for zerg.

You can basically skip gas now, a mule mines 225 mins so each mule is almost the cost of a new CC.

You can wall with a CC now for what would have been 3 depots.

You can skip gas and overwhelm zerg or protoss with mass marine since they will be behind mineral wise. The math just works so hard in favor of a mineral economy for faster mules.

Revert back to 12 workers, end this insanity and constant patches, i want my game back; 12 worker patches weren't perfect but they were fine, all we needed were a few range and supply tweaks, not this hot mess.

It highlights the contradiction, lets start with 8 workers, oh the games too slow now, wait, lets make game breaking economy changes that fucks with a game that was balanced already, whoever is running these patches is a certified nutter at this point.

I can't imagine how stupid Terran builds can be with this change, you can get 6 gas that much faster. It's not fun anymore, its whiplash and headache inducing. Just watch, now everyones gonna play Terran because its busted just like Zerg was a few weeks ago.

No one can find the time to make builds right to teach new players now; everything has this caveat with these stupid patches and this long beautiful history of people tweaking builds is just bunk, which shits on their hard work and dedication.

This is the equivelant of giving terran the Persian AOE2 villager production bonus and giving the other races nothing; balancing unit ranges and spawn time is one thing but fucking with major economic and snowballing metrics in the games economy will always break the game. Stop fucking with the game, 12 workers, go back to that patch

Yea now we can do proxy openers and marauder rushes with very little risk since you can expand for less. plus you can wall easier against z with what would have cost 3 depots.

The 250 planetary cost wont matter since by the time you take your 4th you'll easily afford it and the minerals you save on the CC will easily pay for the PF.

Not gonna last, and money on ghosts being 3 supply again next hotfix. These patches are like watching Donal Trump news flip flip each day, oh what a time to be alive

Just my hunch <3

I keep running into this and dying constantly to it. im 3500mmr

The style is they go planetary at their natural, turtle up on 2 base then take lots of planetaries slowly and put mines out and auto turret you to death with like 40 ravens

So i think Vikings probably suck because they cant outrun the turrets,

Sensor towers where the ravens come in seems to work

Tanks are useless, mines are useless as they see the mines.

Only think i think works is MM and medis to replace the HP of the bio.

Ghosts to emp seems risky as you might miss and its a high value unit,

maybe rush neo steel? i have no clue

"Im not sure im familiar with this term" everyone reading the new patch