u/Old-Butterscotch2428

For context, i typically play one champ at a time, play them for a few hundred games, then move on. the previous 4 champs ive mained(viego, nocturne, jarvan, shyvana) ive felt like i can more or less pick them every game no problem. elise is the first champ where i feel like if my team comp doesnt play well with her, the game is cooked. if my teamates also pick assassins, if my team is heavy ap, if my support picks something with no setup like soraka or lulu etc, my confidence in my ability to win just plummets.

i guess my question is, to what degree is it true that shes worse with certain teamcomps, or how much of this is just me being new to the champ and not feeling confident? is it worth picking her every game or should i just play one of my backups if the team comp doesnt look good?

also, if its relevant, im playing in mid elos, ie above plat below master.

they finally make the obvious choice to fill in the pit in the engineering building, and their first thought was to put CARPET THERE?????? this building is so ugly and outdated that you could do literally anything to make it look more modern, and they choose carpet. insane.

TLDR; >!harder build to maximize, but has alot of optimizations to take advantage of: tempo, jack of all trades, dark seal, fury gen/ult maintaining, AOE damage, access to Q3. favorable WRs and WPAs.!<

Hey all, i previously made a post asking about a few scenarios and whether kraken+DnD might be better, and my ultimate takeaway from it is that many people in this subreddit think that tri+shojin is way better. now i do not think it is bad by any means and i think it still has its place, i have spent much time thinking about it and doing practice tool tests and listening to hybradge, agurin, this subreddits etc opinions, and i think things have been blown out of proportion. i will preface this by saying that im not a challenger player, just a nerd who likes thinking about the statistics and optimizations league has, especially with shyvana. note that my statement was originally written as a response to the u/Hybradge video on why he thinks tri+shojin is better, but i decided to post it in here instead:

ill start by saying that i do agree that tri+shojin is easier, makes you tankier, has a good first item spike, and has similar single target damage, and even that its a good build for the average person to go. i think your comparison failed to account the unique benefits of kraken+DnD though.

first of all, kraken is 333 gold cheaper than triforce. now that alone is pretty nice, but you could also use that to buy a dark seal, which has by far the best WPA for any early component on shyvana(plus gives the option to opt into mejais, which is broken on shyv due to the 10% ms at 10+ stacks). second of all, kraken+DnD has great synergy with jack of all trades. you can get >400g worth of value from it by the 6 minute mark, by getting a rectrix+dark seal+dagger, which is pretty much unheard of value from a minor rune that early. you can get all 10 stacks pretty quickly with kraken+DnD+mercs+cloth armor too. you can still buy dark seal on the other build, but youre delaying an already very expensive first item and you cant use it for jack stacks like you can with kraken+DnD. i know you take approach velocity, which i agree is good for tri+shojin, but i dont think its 400g at 6min good, especially since kraken gives ms(slightly better total than phage) and the extra AS makes it easier to get q3 off anyway(you made it seem like in your video that you can get your full combo off the same with either build, which i also disagree with, and if that was true then you wouldnt be emphasizing approach velocity so much).

you also didnt properly acknowledge the increased AOE damage that kraken+DnD give, saying it "washes out" b/c of less survivability, but again i just disagree, all of your AOE abilities scale with AP and getting the extra upfront AOE off is pretty damn strong with cut down+teamate followup, and if you get bursted faster you can weave in and out with w, flash, or if you take gluttonous youll just heal alot back, and if you die, it likely just wasnt a good engage in the first place; you have the ability to adjust what engages you take based on the build you go.

kraken+DnD also has better farming and tempo, leading to more scalemail stacks, more cs, and more ults, gank opportunities, objs, etc. DnD passive also makes fury gen faster, again leading to more ults and allowing you to keep ult longer. admittedly this isnt super useful in early game fights, but i find late game when its do or die, being able to more easily keep your ult while going from objectives to fighting to sieging is a pretty big deal.

now a note on win rates and WPAs. the typical argument one may say for tri+shojin is "more popular builds usually have a lower wr since its the build newbies go, so the fact its still so high makes is obvious its better". a couple issues with that. first of all, kraken+DnD isnt some niche build only shyv mains are going. it was the most popular build previously, still has attention from other challengers(like you mentioned in your video), and many casual players didnt even realize it got overthrown in popularity by tri+shojin, including me before i became a shyv main. second, kraken+DnD is undisputably a harder build. it is harder to take advantage of its perks i mentioned before, and it makes you squishier, so to me the fact it maintains such a similar wr to the "easier" build just makes me think even more how good it is in the right hands. now as for WPAs, coachless.gg itself states, "estimates how much completing this item changes your win probability on average". in your video you do include that tri is higher than kraken, but you dont really acknowledge that DnD is quite a bit higher than shojin as a 2nd item. keep in mind, the vast majority of the time these items are built its after kraken/tri, so to me this just shows more favorably for kraken+DnD. also, as of 26.17 in emerald+, the statements you made about WPA arent even true anymore. kraken has a higher WPA, and its components are also higher WPA than tri's.

Now one final note. I recognize that hybradge is a way better player than ill ever be, and his opinion is super valuable. im just trying my best to make an argument using the facts and statistics ive found rather than my personal in game experiences, since mine are blatantly less valuable. i am happy to hear any counterarguments about my takes. Lastly, this post is for 26.17 and may or may not be true in the future.

Hey all, im starting to play alot of shyvana for the first time since her rework. i miss the days of 1k damage fireballs, but ive accepted the fact that tri + shojin is her best build. it seems like there may be some space to go kraken + DnD as well though despite its worse wr. please tell me if you think it would be optimal in any of these scenarios:

1. you recall with enough money to buy kraken but not enough for triforce. this one just makes sense to me, seeing as though youll likely have lvl6 too, meaning you can go all in for an objective fight with a full item.

2. your team is full ad. this one im more suspicious of since her on hit magic damage scales with ad, but i imagine the kraken dnd build still does a little bit more ap damage overall.

3. you have enough frontline on your team. this one also makes sense to me. shyvana seems like she can be a pretty good backline flanker with her ult if your team already has alot of frontline, and kraken DnD will help secure the kills on their squishies faster.

PSA that the antimatter chroma for dark star J4 is back in the mythic shop, get it while you can!

Might be a little soon for this, but is there any good general advice for playing jungle on league classic? Even with a leash, ive had to recall during all my first few full clears to not die or not go OOM. I think the default runes and masteries definitely have something to do with this, but would they be enough to make the difference? should i rush madreds? should i just perma gank? it seems like thats the main(only?) way to keep up in gold + XP with laners from the games ive played so far.