r/BethelSnark

It's taken a minute, but good to see leaders in the charismatic camp finally refuse to mince words about the danger of Danny Silk's book, Unpunishable.

"Ten years ago Gary Morgan was caught red-handed and bad pastors covered up for him. Solid evidence of fake prophecy and even email fraud. But he got away with it and the godly Christians who tried to call him out were vilified and abused by their pastors. Bill Johnson knew about Gary Morgan and still went and did ministry with him. Che Ahn had endorsed Gary as a great prophet like Shawn Bolz (I'm not making this up). Yet, Che's system of accountability not only failed to protect people from Gary, leaders in his network attacked the only people calling for him to be dealt with biblically.

This video will have the evidence, and I mean a TON of evidence, showing not only that Gary is guilty but that other pastors have been lying in order to protect him. I pray this video vindicates Nathaniel and Hayley from the lies that have been told about them for the past ten years. I also pray that it rightfully exposes not only Gary Morgan but the people who have lied to protect him. People like Peter McHugh, who I confronted on video and caught in several lies.

The broader Charismatic church needs reform and a renewed commitment to truth and biblical handling of the gifts. I pray this video helps make that a reality.

Dear Charismatic brothers and sisters of mine,

I know that my name is mud in many of your circles now. I know that I can be seen as a wrecking ball, meddler, accuser of the brethren, or otherwise someone who has evil motives, has "gone too far," or just isn't doing this right. I just want you to know that do this because I believe in you. Please prove me right."

Anyone have any bad or toxic experiences dating Heidi Baker’s Mozambican sons??
George described mistreating an ex girlfriend from Europe who was too interested in shopping and eating out…. #abuse

Delete if not allowed: I just need to vent about this charismatic ministry I grew up following.

Backstory (grandpa’s story):
My elderly grandparents and my whole family went to a large KCM gathering back during Covid. They did limited to no social distancing in the auditoriums. My entire family came back terribly sick. My grandpa was in the ICU for a month and barely pulled through with only part of his lungs. He has never fully recovered and has to wear oxygen when he walks now. Not blaming the ministry or anything, but I feel like if they had listened to some reasonable guidelines maybe this wouldn’t have happened to grandpa. It makes me wonder if anyone else who attended the same conference got sick like grandpa and didn’t make it. Every time he gets sick now, we all worry he will need to be hospitalized.

Current story (grandma):

I bring this up now because my grandma has been refusing blood pressure and cholesterol medication for a long time because KCM insists you can be okay with faith in the Bible alone. Her doctor finally convinced her to let him do a heart scan and her arteries were extremely blocked and calcified. 5x the extremely high risk value. She could have had a heart attack or a stroke and may already have some heart failure. She thankfully finally agreed to take medication. She feels like a failure and is confused why “the Word didn’t work” to protect her from heart disease. I tried to tell her these ministers she follows probably also have to take blood pressure and cholesterol meds - they just don’t advertise it because it would go against what they sell, which is delusional levels of faith with “reaping and sowing.”

What these ministries advertise, truly does harm. I pray God shows these leaders the right way and protects my grandparents from any harm already caused.

This video was reposted by Mike Winger on YouTube, along with the following:

"I’ll be watching this as soon as I’m able.

I know more than I have publicly shared yet, which is why I think Sean Feucht has continued publicly lying about me to do damage control ahead of what I’m going to expose about him.

This video is only one part of the Sean Feucht story. Much of his ministry is a catfish operation."

If anyone didnt get a chance to read my original story, here it is. this is a follow up to what happened.

TLDR of the original story, I was an associate pastor in a NAR church for 2 years and one of the board members for 6. I began to burnout hard, almost destroyed my marriage and was ignored and berrated by the lead pastor for quitting. what followed was a year of confusion and heartache, filled with arguments, questions and what we thought was some level of catharsis.

We were looking for a more solid church we could attend but in the mean time we stayed as members of the NAR church. Which I will fully own as a horrible idea, We should have left immidiately, but those of you who have been in these churches long term understand how culty they can be, and how difficult it is to remove yourself from them.

So as time has gone on, we have had a hard time finding where to go next, on sundays we would attend the NAR church, and leave and discuss what we heard, what was truth, and what was nonsense. This lead to a few weeks ago, there was a trainwreck of a sermon by the lead pastor.

for context, I have a masters of divinity in Theology, and I am currently doing post-graduate research in church history and theology and I am a former professor of hermeneutics. I had some major problems with the sermon, there was some flat out unbiblical language, eisegetical interpretations, and novel revelations. All of it hinged on a word study of a two greek and hebrew words that was worse than some of the freshman papers i read while teaching.

I wrote an 8 page refute of the sermon, and gave it to a board memeber. He and I met and discussed what would follow. He said he would talk to the lead pastor but he encouraged me to do so. EDIT: He also said he would not share anything until I explicitly gave him permission or talked to the pastor first. I was clear that I am not this man's accountability, it is the boards job to deal with that, but I have many other concerns with the structure of the church and the theology so I will meet with the lead pastor.

in the time that lead up to this meeting, my wife confided in another board member with our concerns, and this board member went behind our back and told the Lead pastor.

So when i met with him, I said "i have some questions about one of your sermons" to which he replied "Oh I heard from X andY about that" and then proceeded to launch into a defensive diatribe about how he builds sermons and all that the Lord is calling him to do.

I want to share some direct quotes from the sermon so you can see the level of narcissistic control these people try to assume over church members.

______________________________
"I am teaching because you need a greater revelation"

"my preaching gets dull, I just start quoting Bible verses and not feeling them"

"I refuse to argue with them (people who are very studious of the Bible but are "dwelling not abiding"), I'm a man of conviction, once I get it solid with God you cannot sway me once I get an agreement between me and the Holy Spirit."

"How many want to hear from the Holy Spirit? There a promise that the religious spirit will say cant happen"

" Once I create an agreement with God I dont care who comes against me, I dont care about pedigree, I dont care how many letters they have after their name, if it goes against the word of God and what ive come into agreement (with God) with, you will not move me"

"If you dont believe the revelation Im giving you today, you are not fit to carry the glory of God."

"I love you but its not about you, I will use you for the glory of God"

______________________________

Now it should be clear to anyone with a brain that these words are so damaging and dangerous. This pastor places himself as an "apostle" and preaches things that sound closer to 2nd century Gnosticism than the gospel.

So in the meeting, he talked for the majority of it, and when I called out his poor exegetical work of the Psalm he was "preaching" on, He said "well I did the wordy study so Im solid in what I preached, I think its correct"

He proceeded to quote II Corinthians 13:1 that all matters should be established by two or three witnesses and said that his study and the confirmation of the Spirit are his "witnesses" that prove he is correct.

Furthermore, He said "I preach so much I dont remember everything I preach" huge red flag

He also said "was it weak? probably, but the Spirit gave it to me" ...Holy f*ckin airball dude.

The meeting went on for 90 minutes of him dodging and deflecting and changing the topic. in the end I walked out with more questions than answers.

The next day we (my wife and I) texted the two board members who we had shared with, and found out that one went behind our back, and the other was then cornered by the lead pastor to find out what He knew.

The board member who betrayed our trust said " How could I know youre having these issues and NOT tell the pastor? Its when we keep these things hidden that they become a bigger problem, nothing wrong with having questions but it cant just be left to become something bigger."

her words make it sound like critical thinking is dangerous

To which My wife firmly told her, It was our conversation to have, and we WERE engaging leadership about it, but on our terms. She told her not to do it again and she had no right to betray our trust like that.

no response.

SO here we are, standing at the end. Not sure of what comes next, but I know the time to move on came long ago and We cannot stay. The people in leadership of these churches think they have all the zeal and Spirit in the world.

With narcissistic cults of personality within Christianity, there is always an abundance of Scripture used to justify actions ,the problem is every bit of it is out of context,

for anyone considering walking away from the NAR, do it, do it now, and do NOT look back. Learn from my mistakes and dont hang around the fence, just go.

I'm not talking about "I think Israel has a right to exist but I think there are good and bad people on both sides" people. And I'm not talking about the "I think Israel is an ally of the US" people. I'm talking about people who support Israel because they think the Bible commands it. What percentage of people in these churches are Christian Zionists? Do many people to shove it into the background or is it a really central thing?

Are there pockets of the charismatic world where you do NOT find this at all? What and where are they?

Am I the only one who feels deeply uncomfortable at churches like Jesus Image?

I’ve only been there three times because I genuinely WANTED to love it. Young crowd, beautiful music, emotional atmosphere, everyone hyping it up online, I thought maybe this would finally be the church that felt right.

But every single time I left feeling more unsettled than the last.

For context, I grew up in church. My parents were worship leaders my entire life in non-denominational churches, so I’ve seen both the genuine side of ministry and the “behind the curtain” side too.

And maybe because of that, I notice things other people don’t.

The entire experience at Jesus Image feels manufactured.

The second you walk in, you’re herded around like cattle. They literally ask if you’re “single or double” while seating people like you’re boarding a ride at Universal Studios. Massive lines. Tons of workers everywhere, but somehow very little genuine warmth or connection.

It feels organized, polished, curated… but not personal.

One time I brought in a closed hot coffee that I had just bought before service. Waited in line forever with it, only for an usher to stop me at the entrance to the sanctuary and tell me I couldn’t bring it in. I was so irritated I just threw the entire thing away.

Then you walk into the sanctuary and it’s sensory overload.

You’ve got:

- a choir

- multiple worship leaders

- backup singers

- string instruments

- photographers

- videographers

- security guards

- interpretive dancers waving flags around

- people constantly moving around filming emotional moments

At what point does worship stop being worship and start becoming a production?

Because that’s exactly what it felt like to me: a show.

And before people come for me, yes, the music sounds beautiful. But I found it SO hard to actually focus on God because there was constantly something happening.

It honestly felt performative.

And look, I understand churches take photos and videos. I get wanting to document worship or share moments from service.

But there’s a difference between capturing the atmosphere of a church and plastering deeply personal moments all over social media.

Some things should remain sacred.

I cannot imagine being broken down at an altar, crying out to God during what could be one of the hardest moments of my life, only to later realize my face became content for Instagram reels and worship clips.

That just feels deeply invasive and performative to me.

That should be left for you and the Lord, not thousands of online views.

There is a line, and it’s been crossed, but this church supports it?

And maybe this is where I’ll really lose people, but I’m going to say it anyway:

I truly believe some mega churches have turned Christianity into branding.

Not discipleship.

Not shepherding.

Not community.

Branding.

Everything feels optimized for aesthetics, social media clips, emotional reactions, and growth.

Even the worship felt overly controlled to me. Growing up around worship leaders, I was taught worship is supposed to be spirit-led, not scripted and micromanaged.

My mom took worship seriously because she believed it was ministry, not performance. She would talk about sensing when the room needed to slow down, when someone was hurting, when God was moving in a different direction, she would make room for the holy spirt to move.

At Jesus Image, it feels like one person orchestrates the entire emotional experience from the top down.

You can literally hear the pastor interrupting and directing worship on their Spotify recordings.

That’s not organic to me.

That feels curated.

And honestly… out of the three times I went, I barely even saw the actual pastor preach once.

The first time he was out of town and his wife spoke. Another time a guest speaker preached. The third visit, we ended up leaving during worship because we had enough of it.

My mom always used to say, “A shepherd doesn’t leave his sheep.” And this whole celebrity pastor culture feels completely opposite of that.

Then I learned about the connection to Benny Hinn and honestly, everything clicked for me.

That man was a crook, a false healer, and a false teacher. He was manipulative, exploitative, and completely consumed by fame, money, and spectacle while disguising it as ministry. And in my opinion, this church carries that exact same spirit.

This is not humble, spirit-led Christianity.

It’s performance Christianity.

It’s emotional manipulation wrapped in aesthetic worship music and social media branding.

Jesus flipped tables over people turning faith into spectacle and profit and honestly, walking into places like this makes me understand why.

Jesus didn’t need camera crews, photographers, curated emotional moments, or a personal brand.

He knew people by name.

He sat with them.

He made time for them.

Meanwhile this church literally states online that the pastor’s schedule doesn’t permit meeting with people, so prayer teams handle it instead.

I’m sorry, but if your church gets so big that the pastor no longer knows or shepherds the congregation, something is fundamentally broken.

At that point people stop being souls and start becoming attendance numbers and dollar signs.

I know some people genuinely love this church, and if it truly brought you closer to God then honestly, I’m glad for that.

But personally?

Every instinct in me felt like something was off.

And if you’re deeply immersed in this culture, I genuinely pray the veil is lifted and that you learn to separate emotional experiences from the actual presence of God.

Anyone else feel this way about mega churches or specifically Jesus Image?

Any Bethelites go to the ceremony?