r/N24

I've been thinking about this a lot lately. If researchers can't cure N24 yet, what are the things they could make easier in the meantime?

Maybe it's waking up feeling rested when trying to entrain. Maybe it's having less brain fog or fatigue. Or being able to wake up feeling immediately alert.

Manuel Spitschan, a researcher studying circadian rhythms, is currently asking people with N24 what they think future research and treatment should focus on.

I went through the survey, and there are some questions that are personally important to me:

>Have you found strategies that help manage or stabilize your sleep-wake pattern?
— Page 9

>What do you think is the most urgent or most detrimental problem with current diagnosis and care for Non-24…?
— Page 10

>Which outcomes matter most to you for future research and clinical care?
— Page 11

I think these are questions worth answering.

Some of us have found that no treatments have been helpful. Some of us experience non-restorative sleep when trying to entrain. And some of us regularly struggle with things like brain fog, or not feeling a drive to sleep, even when we’re tired and it’s past our biological bedtime.

This is a chance to tell researchers what we really want them to work on. Our participation could help shape what research gets funded:

>The results of this survey may be used for future research funding applications related to Non-24

If you have the time, I highly recommend filling out the survey. If you’re in a hurry or don’t like filling out surveys, you can skip any questions you don’t want to answer and focus on the ones that matter most to you.

Here’s the link to the ReN24 initiative survey:

https://tuspl22-redcap.srv.mwn.de/redcap/surveys/?s=H9DMNMHW9X4JH4X9

Original post by Manuel Spitschan, u/mspitschan:

https://www.reddit.com/r/N24/s/zOHVs3t4I7

Have a good, restful week, everyone.

[Context: Diagnosed with DSPD but have "possible non24"— sleep specialist says I'm on the line between the two. DMLO was 5-6am when tested during my college semester, but I have been free-running over the summer. Cross posting between r/DSPD and r/N24 just to see both sides.]

For about a month now I've been consistently waking up at 9:30-10:30am, averaging about 7 hours of normal quality sleep a night. I take 8mg Ramelteon and 80mg Jornay PM at night, with 2-3 hours of sun lamp exposure in the morning.

I don't feel tired or obviously sleep deprived, just noticeably worse overall compared to when I could sleep whenever I wanted. My general motivation is lower, and I feel like I have less energy/diminished capacity to deal with things throughout the day. Jornay took the place of some of my Adderal (for ADHD), and I'm thinking it might be less effective for my motivation/executive function based symptoms.

I know that 7 hours just isn't enough sleep for me, but I cannot fall asleep any earlier on a regular basis.

Has anyone else had a similar issue—where your scedule isn't so bad that it's un-maintainable, but it isn't great either? What was your experiences with entrainment, and did you eventually resolve the problem?

Hoping this could help the doctor make a diagnosis. It is a bit noisy but I think the pattern is quite visible. If anyone wants the scripts let me know.

https://preview.redd.it/5r3sdta82rih1.png?width=1600&format=png&auto=webp&s=eb16b6a6b8ab2336ebed7a9a3973877dc0de80cf

i need smth that will automatically passively store data whether i’m sleeping or awake cuz i forget to do that manually 😭 what smart watch would do that for me?

Last time I saw my sleep doctor, we were investigating Sleap Apnea issues, after sleep study he said i'm on the borderline where insurance would qualify me for CPAP machine because of positional Sleep Apnea but a hair away under it and he suggested that i try a U pillow to prevent rolling in bed, I said " doctor, I'm usually awake when I roll in bed, if I want to avoid sleeping on my back I easily can" he laughed it off and said no, everyone are not aware when they roll in bed. which left me greatly puzzled

that happened a couple of months ago and still bothers me, I'm just not convinced, and I have my own reasons

ever since i was a kid i had many sleep issues, as most of us did i'm sure, for example there has been many circumstances when i shared the bed with more than one person and because i don't like to bother anyone i'd usually take the edge of the bed and pick the side that is facing outwards and not roll in bed the entire night, and i'd wake up on the same side every time using the least space possible on bed like a hair from falling over the edge, I never had any issues with rolling and waking up on the same position everytime

I had a history with plenty of sleep paralysis to the point i figured out how to deal with it, i figured out it triggers more when u sleep on ur back, i figured out how to pull myself out of it before it happens to the point it got as easy as breathing to me, and i would switch sides trying to make it go away , my point is when i roll in my back during bed time i usually do it to stretch or my shoulders hurt and i just needed a different sleeping position

I usually can count how many times i rolled in bed during the night , I have right shoulder injury and usually can't sleep on my right shoulder for long otherwise it gets very painful to the point i'd often need the help of someone making me sit in bed because they have to pull me upwards

because of my sleep issues, i used to ditch school or avoid classes , i'd often hear my parents footsteps climbing the stairs while in the middle of my sleep and i'd often hide before they reach my room

lately sleep paralysis have gotten ridiculously worse and hour ago i was just attempting to go to sleep and i had 5 sleep paralysis episodes and i pulled myself out of it and change sides but it kept happening and i gave up eventually , and now i'm writing this post because i can't stop thinking about all of this

do u guys have issues with hyper arousal and sleep paralysis ? or i'm thinking about this too much ?

So my disability claim was rejected. I was rejected once before, but this one included my N24 diagnosis that I didn’t yet have last time. I was hoping that it would be the main thing to get me accepted this time, but I guess the judge didn’t understand or respect just how impactful it is on my life. I haven’t figured out a system for entrainment yet and I don’t live in a walkable area or have reliable transportation. Any free runners here in a similar situation? If so, have any of you figured out a work situation that you can handle?

Does anyone else have non-24 and also DID?

I have wondered if it could be related to the experiences of parts that do not see out of the body.

Hi all, I have been trying to find a community of people who understand the struggle of a Non-24hr sleep cycle. I've read many of the posts and so much of what has been said is so relateable. It has taken decades for my husband an I to realise exactly what condition he was struggling with. At 40 years old he is finally going with the flow of what his body wants and needs. While I have been frustrated at time with when and how to organise time together, I find my biggest challenge is dealing with the lack of understanding from the outside world. I feel like I constantly have to explain away his unusual sleep patterns (I usually use the words night shift).

Understanding why he sleeps the way he does makes the whole process feel more predictable and less chaotic. We are both autistic so we are used to people not always understanding us, but this is an added layer which is extra challenging.

I'll start this off by saying that I am not officially diagnosed. However this has been a major issue in my whole life so I have the same struggles as y'all.

For the past 6 months I've only had 1 all nighter which I'm kinda proud of. I've been fairly consistent at going to work as well.

That seems like a success but for me it has been a constant struggle to fall asleep -> then sleeping 5-6h -> being very exhausted -> sleeping 12h on the weekends -> setting myself up for failure on Monday.

It just seems impossible, and I would love to stay up late, especially today because I don't feel sleepy (although I slept like 6h last night I should feel like it).

I'm so close to giving in because it genuinely makes me happier to not fight against my own biology... I'm a video editor so maybe I have a chance at a remote job?

Idk I just want your support, it's tough... Would you consider the 6 months a success? (Even though my sleep was fucked). What should I try? I'm just tired of going against of what feels like my natural state.