I think Light definitely led a couple trails to him but I'm not a big enough fan of the series to remember them however this is the subreddit for the series so if there were any you guys would be the place to ask.
Goku seems to hold Uub to the same regard as Kid Buu and seems to suggest Uub may be using the same level of power Kid Buu used (while Uub was enraged) and he was able to be stronger than Uub while holding back, so would you scale him in base to Kid Buu or above or do you think that's overblown?
Who would win, both are stronger than Ultimate Gohan right? So who do you think would win between if these 2 post Z Gokus who grew to beyond Ultimate Gohan level on SSJ3.
Before we start let me just say that we know it wasn't Goku or Beerus's actual power since Elder Kai directly said that the shockwaves were getting stronger the farther they went from the epicentre of the clash, which is not how physics work as waves decrease in power as they travel.
Next let's just mention how the waves at their strongest would still take 3 clashes together to reach universal which shows it's not an infinite increase in power as they would just infinitely grow until they were universal.
Thirdly let's discuss how even 3 clashes wouldn't actually "destroy" the universe, instead only just leave it an empty void as said by Elder Kai again, meaning it would still have reality and the universe would still exist just filled with nothing.
Fourthly we need to discuss the location of the Kaioshin Realm as since the Supreme Kai felt it from their world it means it traveled there. We know it's shown outside Universe 7 in guide books but a different guide says that there is a physical crystalin sphere around it as a barrier and what it revolves around the marcocasm as a moon.
Deuteronomy 32:8–9
“When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance,
when he divided mankind,
he fixed the borders of the peoples
according to the number of the sons of God.
But the LORD’s portion is his people,
Jacob his allotted heritage.”
Exodus 15:11
“Who is like you, O LORD, among the gods?
Who is like you, majestic in holiness,
awesome in glorious deeds, doing wonders?”
Psalm 82:1
“God has taken his place in the divine council;
in the midst of the gods he holds judgment.”
Psalm 82:6–7
“I said, ‘You are gods,
sons of the Most High, all of you;
nevertheless, like men you shall die,
and fall like any prince.’”
Psalm 86:8
“There is none like you among the gods, O Lord,
nor are there any works like yours.”
Psalm 89:5–7
“Let the heavens praise your wonders, O LORD,
your faithfulness in the assembly of the holy ones!
For who in the skies can be compared to the LORD?
Who among the heavenly beings is like the LORD,
a God greatly to be feared in the council of the holy ones,
and awesome above all who are around him?”
Psalm 95:3
“For the LORD is a great God,
and a great King above all gods.”
Psalm 96:4–5
“For great is the LORD, and greatly to be praised;
he is to be feared above all gods.
For all the gods of the peoples are worthless idols,
but the LORD made the heavens.”
Psalm 97:7
“Worship him, all you gods!”
Psalm 136:2
“Give thanks to the God of gods,
for his steadfast love endures forever.”
Job 1:6
“Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them.”
Job 38:7
“when the morning stars sang together
and all the sons of God shouted for joy?”
1 Corinthians 8:5–6
“For although there may be so-called gods in heaven or on earth—as indeed there are many ‘gods’ and many ‘lords’—yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist.”
A couple of these mention a council and a lot more mention sons of God and some of them in a way that doesn't sound like it means just humanity, and not sure if it means Angels either and many more on top of that mention other gods directly. So I'm just wondering what all these mean when it comes to the Bible.
I can't remember the scene great and I look online and see Elder Kai and Kibito Kai discussing the clash and preparing Dragonballs in either Anime or Manga or Movie but I can't actually figure it out, I'm pretty sure I've heard people say it does though maybe that has to do with just automatically assuming they meant the macrocosm when they said it would destroy the universe (though actually it was explained that the clash created shockwaves that increased exponentially in power and that it would take 3 uninterrupted ones to destroy the universe, and by destroy they actually meant create an empty void, though if the shockwaves did make it to Elder Kai world they would be transcendental despite not threatening to collapse a single reality) so I'm just asking to see if anyone can provide a scan or video just so I know if it is mentioned.
The first thing people point to about Dragonball Super being universal is the Beerus and Goku clash which was said to be able to destroy the universe, though that wasn't through raw power but from produced shockwaves that could destroy a universe universe‑destroying, but Supreme Kai makes it clear that they only could destroy the universe over time not outright which means it's not direct AP as shown in this quote explains “It seems— their destructive power amplifies… as the distance from the point of impact increases! This is not good.”
Also even if the chain reaction continued, the universe wouldn’t have been erased from existence Elder Kai describes the end state as "if those two clash against each other like this a few more times— People, planets, gods like us, even Beerus-sama and Goku— will be completely destroyed— There will be nothing left in the universe. It will turn into a vacuum made of nothingness." That’s destroying everything inside the universe leaving an empty void, not an actual universe destroying outcome and it even says Beerus would have died from it.
Another feat people look at is the "infinite" Null Realm where the tournament of power takes place but infinite is the wrong translation, and it matters. The original Japanese line “時間も空間もない 永遠と虚無だけに満ちた世界だ。” means “a world without time and space, filled with only eternity and emptiness,” not “infinite nothingness.” or anything like that and since it shows that it’s eternal rather than infinite, then shaking the Null Void during the Tournament of Power does not automatically become a universal‑scale feat as some people say.
Some people bring up Zamasu fusing with the universe but that's more Hax than AP and since Goku couldn't defeat him despite supposedly being Universal at that point it shows that he probably couldn't destroy a universe.
The first thing people point to about Dragonball Super being universal is the Beerus and Goku clash which was said to be able to destroy the universe, though that wasn't through raw power but from produced shockwaves that could destroy a universe universe‑destroying, but Supreme Kai makes it clear that they only could destroy the universe over time not outright which means it's not direct AP as shown in this quote explains “It seems— their destructive power amplifies… as the distance from the point of impact increases! This is not good.”
Also even if the chain reaction continued, the universe wouldn’t have been erased from existence Elder Kai describes the end state as "if those two clash against each other like this a few more times— People, planets, gods like us, even Beerus-sama and Goku— will be completely destroyed— There will be nothing left in the universe. It will turn into a vacuum made of nothingness." That’s destroying everything inside the universe leaving an empty void, not an actual universe destroying outcome and it even says Beerus would have died from it.
Another feat people will look at is Beerus destroying his own universe destroying ball but he only managed to cancel the expanding sphere by going all‑out, as he states in this quote “All the energy that was here— I nullified it and turned it into nothing." and then "I can, if I use a hundred percent of my power.”
Also, Whis later tells Mr. Satan: “There is no way I can stop power that’s strong enough to end the world.” and as Whis is stronger than Beerus then this should mean Beerus couldn't stop the universe from actually being destructive.
Another feat people look at is the "infinite" Null Realm where the tournament of power takes place but infinite is the wrong translation, and it matters. The original Japanese line “時間も空間もない 永遠と虚無だけに満ちた世界だ。” means “a world without time and space, filled with only eternity and emptiness,” not “infinite nothingness.” or anything like that and since it shows that it’s eternal rather than infinite, then shaking the Null Void during the Tournament of Power does not automatically become a universal‑scale feat as some people say.
Some people bring up Zamasu fusing with the universe but that's more Hax than AP and since Goku couldn't defeat him despite supposedly being Universal at that point it shows that he probably couldn't destroy a universe.
They could be Universal later on but I don't think anything proves it at least in anime events if something in Moro or Granolah arcs shows them at that level then comment a scan underneath this post.
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We will not include anything that massively changes are main characters too much such as "Dragon Ball: Mystical Adventure", but most movies, games with original storylines, filler, og Dragonball, DBZ, Daima, Super, GT, and more will be included.
We start with the Pilaf Arc where Golu is at home and meets bulma for the first time but our first change is that Dragon Ball: Curse of the Blood Rubies and Pilaf Saga happen at the same time so now they need to deal with 2 villain groups at the same time but they do meet there allies quicker though combining the 2 plots would be a bit complex since Chichi isn't in the movie and Pansy isn't in the Manga/Anime.
Next we have "Dragon Ball: Sleeping Princess in Devil's Castle" which goes unchanged, next the 21 Tenkaichi Budokai goes unchanged, the Red Ribbon Army saga has "Dragon Ball: Shenron no Nazo" happen at the same time, though after that we have Piccolo Saga which goes unchanged, and after that in Piccolo Jr which goes unchanged, and after that we have our first DBZ movie in Dead Zone take place then after is when Raditz arrived usually after Raditz is when we have Worlds Strongest but since the Dragonballs are being saved to revive Goku it's postponed till a year after Goku is revived, next we have Vegeta and Nappa arrived and that goes the same and then Namek happens the same.
However early during the Namek Saga Turles arrives but since all the stronger fighters are off world earth seems doomed for a bit as Turles has his men get beaten but he himself is just his base before a fruit it too strong but then Lord Slug arrives and Turles realizes that if Slug got his way that his Tree of Might would be destroyed so an unlikely team up happens between Turles and the remaining Z Fighters.
Then later the wish to return all the people on Namek to earth besides Freizas men happens and with a big threat on earth Goku doesn't ignore the wish to return to earth and leaves his fight with Freiza unfinished but tells Freiza to find him, Goku is able to defeat Slug and then Goku and Vegeta meet Turles and destroy the tree of might but keep him around and tell him about how Goku almost killed Freiza before needing to be called back to earth to fight Slug and the Freiza is coming, Goku then trains both Vegeta and Turles to get SSJ and together they dog walk Freiza and Cold when they find earth.
Since Goku didn't use Instant Transmission and doesn't have Instant Transmission his body won't be strained the same way it was in future timeline and it would be more like how it was in Present timeline where he doesn't get the effects of the heart virus till the Android Saga, in the mean time Garlic Jr Saga happens and with Goku and the other Siayans on earth they either are infected or stop Garlic Jr early and this changes things, do you think they would finish him early or would Garlic Jr basically win?
Grand Supreme Kai extremely weakened Buu and subsequently made all absorption versions of Buu weaker than they should be despite becoming stronger than the pure version they would be stronger without him so how strong should he be?
In future timeline when he realizes that piccolo and him and about to die because of the Androids he lets out his son's egg, (actual son not reincarnation), who could take his place as guardian of earth and can either create new Dragonballs or continue using the same ones he made.
I view the manga as it's way more consistent and doesn't have as many retcons (such as God Power in base which was carried over from the OG Battle of Gods film though gets contradicted by the Goku Black Arc), also Manga is just the usual thing considered canon and has carried on for longer after the anime stopped.
Though there isn't a definitive canon as both were developed at the same time, or at least all before Moro since all parts after that will be adapted in the upcoming anime and since there is already a manga that's probably going to be the inspiration.
I would think they could maybe use King Kai to contact Namek and get them to use their Dragonballs to bring back the sun and the earth and revive Dende so that they can use the earth Dragonballs to bring back everyone killed by Cell.
Next they could train while Cell just flies around the universe trying to find strong people, maybe Goku would stay dead or let himself be revived using Namekian Dragonballs since there is a big threat who could come back one day and they would need to be ready.
Though this is only what I think and others may have their own opinion on what the Z Fighters plan would be.
I'm trying to rank the android saga and someone said he could but need a second opinion
My idea is that he maybe finds Dabura, Broly, or Moro.
Later on Babidi would find Buu's egg floating in vacuum of space after Cell destroyed earth and would be let out in maybe a decade or 2 after finding a different planet to gather energy for it but after Buu is unleashed Cell would probably come into contact with him and if Cell has SSJ3 by that time he should be able to win.
Vegeta was able to and only let himself get controlled for a bit while Dabura in the end did go against Babidis orders and tried to fight Buu.
From what we know of Prince Vegeta was the strongest, King Vegeta was under him, Broly was next with a power level of 10,000, and then Bardock reached a power level of almost 10,000 making him the 4th highest known, but do we know who the 5th strongest Saiyan at the time was.