u/ContributionLevel593

I have Gran Trail Courmayeur a week on Friday, a 100k 7000m+ race in the Italian Alps. I’ve trained hard and well and did my last big sessions on Sat/Mon/Wed of last week which was a recce of the course with rest days in between. These were ~6h30/7h50/6h15 days.

I then took another day’s rest and then 2 shorter days (1h45 800m) with a bit of intensity. Then 2 forced rest days due to other commitments.

Since my last session my CTL has dropped 15 points to 100 and ATL to 57 leaving me with a TSB of 43.

As I understand it TSB should be around 10-25 on race day?

I have a dilemma. Do I train to keep CTL and ATL up to keep TSB down or do I just forget about these numbers?

I mean I will be training anyway but with reduced volume, aiming for about 10-12 hours this week which will be about 50% peak volume (the recce) but this doesn’t seem to be enough to stop my CTL falling and TSB going through the roof.

**edit**
It hadn’t crossed my mind that the post would come across as acronym heavy. I presumed ATL/CTL/TSB were coming terms. I don’t know where they came from but I used to use them from Training Peaks and now in Runalyze. They are Actual Training Load (last 42 day average I think) aka fitness, Chronic Training Load (last 7 days) aka fatigue. Training Stress Balance aka form is just ATL - CTL.

I put my Fenix 7x pro in the washing machine in a launderette that couldn’t be stopped. I had to listen to it clattering against the glass for an hour. it still works and it’s now clean.

The first section of the main rout out of Courmayeur goes up to Bertone and then left along the balcony. it’s stunning.

Don‘t go that way.

Take a right at Bertone and head up in the direction of Mont de la Saxe. on the way you’ll reach a meadow on a ridge with an even better view of the massif to the left but also the mountains to the right.

Keep going a bit further and the meadow will climb slightly and at the top you’ll have a 360 degree view of the mountains. it’s spectacular.

I spend 4-5 months of the year running in the Alps and this is one of my favourite places.

Keep going and you’ll end up going over testa Bernadetta and tete de la troche before reaching Col Sapin.

You then have a descent and a climb up to Pas-Entre-Seux-Sauts before you descend to Bonatti.

if you prefer not to go further than Mont de la Saxe you can just go back down to Bertone and rejoin the main route.

I finished doing a recce of the course today. I've been in Italy for a while and have done parts of it already but only so far as the snow would let me. I did it over 5 days. Saturday I went from the start to La Thuile. Sunday I rested. Monday I went from La Thuile to Brevna. Tuesday I rested. Today I did Brevna to the finish.

The snow has been lighter this year so I was really surprised at the extent of the snow in places. The main areas where there's still snow is where you go left at Col Youlaz, the right turn at Col des Chavannes - this is really steep, there's loads of snow just after that all the way to Col de la Seigne but it's all easy to cross. Then finally the gullies between Col Sapin and Suche Damon. There's 4 gullies to cross, some are steep and the snow isn't nice. It's quite hard in places so take it easy.

Throughout all my training and including this recce I had no issues finding enough water. Do take it when you find it though. I got caught short today between Col Sapin and Courmayeur. In the race you'll have the aid station at Currù. There is a water point at Suche Damon but it has a red and white tape tied around it and there's a sign attached saying it's not controlled. I drank from here last year but I don't remember the sign so didn't risk it. I drank from rivers and stream without a filter.

I did the race last year and death marched the last 50k due to fuelling issues. I've been training with 90g carbs so hopefully that will sort that out. My plan is to carry enough sachets of home made powder to cover me for the race and then take food from aid stations as I feel like it. I relied on the aid stations last year in both the GTC100 and TOR330 and it didn't go well. The races are infamous for their food choices and stock.

The route itself is hard. Now that I've sorted out my fuelling I've been trying to keep to a certain pace in training and in this recce. The first and last legs I was slight over and the middle leg slightly under.

The start of the race is mostly downhill all the way to Pre Saint Didier and I do recommend you make the most of this as it's all runnable and there's not much of that on the course. The last couple of years there's been a landslide just before Pre Saint Didier and last year I believe they re routed over the bridge, however people still ended up going by the GPX and over the landslide. I went over the landslide on Saturday and it was fine. In the race I'll do what they say but atm the GPX says to go that way.

The first climb starts in Pre Saint Didier. You're going to be in a conga whatever you do so you may as well just chill. The climb opens out onto a road that has plenty of runnable sections before you take a right for a short climb up to Arpy where the first aid station is.

From there there's an unmade road for a couple of km that's at a slight incline but some is defo runnable. Then you climb all the way up the the lake and from there up to Col Croce. The Croce section is steep in places and there's tons of places to overtake people if you're impatient.

The descent off Croce is horrible. It's a V shape most of the way down with lots of lose stones. Take it easy.

At the bottom you traverse all the way to Deffeyes. There's about 400m climbing here. Some parts are runnable but some are pretty slow, especially the boulder hopping and there are some sections with iron steps and ropes. There's one rope section that's a little gnarly that had a lose bolt last year so take care.

Deffeyes feels like it will never come.

From Deffeyes the first part of the descent is also horrible. Lots of lose stone that you'll do well not to fall on. There are also a couple of sections where you'll be down climbing. The second half of the descent is just a lot of steps because this is the tourist route up the Ruter waterfall. Take care at the nottom when you go over the bridge because you turn left, away from La Thuile, not right. If you go right you'll add some extra distance. You get a few kms of runnable road all the way to the aid station in La Thuile.

From La Thuile you have a long climb up to Mont Fortin via Youlaz, Col d'Arp, Col de Youlaz, and Fourches de la Youlaz. As you leave La Thuile the climb goes across several gullies and they're in a really poor condition, especially the third one. When you get there stay to the left. You'll see that someone has made a half arsed attempt to make a route, but it's terrible and it's dangerous. Go easy here.

You'll eventually hit a road that's paved for ages and then becomes unmade. Just after the bridge there's a sharp turning to the left that cuts out a long road sections. The vegetation is dense here - I think it was cut for the race last year but it wasn't when I went through. I check myself for ticks when I got out the other end. Once you hit the unmade road there's 6 hairpins then you're at the Youlaz aid station.

From there's a slog up to Col d'Arp. Most of it is an unmade road but there's sections where the route cuts across. I saw my first live snake on this section on Monday. I was going up and it was coming down. It was surreal. I thought snakes got out your way but this one wasn't bothered by my presence at all. I stepped out the way and fumbled for my phone to take a video but it shot off into the grass. ChatGPT things it was a harmless grass snake.

The clib up to Col d'Arp is steep. The section from there across to Col Youlaz is slightly uphill but runnable in places. From there you traverse a bowl that has a steep snow section was I was there. The snow was soft and it was pretty easy to make imprints. By the time you get there it may be gone or at least there will have been many more people that have been through it in the meantime so it should be straight forward.

After that there's a short climb up to the Fourches and then it's pretty much a traverse all the way to Mont Fortin. Lots of people struggled with water up until Fortin last year and by the time I got there they were rationing water. Take whatever running water you come across after leaving Col de Youlaz.

From Mont Fortin it's more or less downhill all the way to Brevan, except for the Arette du Mont Favre just after the Combal aid station. You'll know it if you've done TMB or UTMB.

As I mentioned before there's a nasty snow section after Cavannes and then there's a lot of easier snow to cross on the way to Col de la Seigne.

When you leave Seigne make sure you stay to the right as they've added a checkoint at La Casermetta. If you go left you'll have to backtrack or go back up the mountain on the other side of the ridge.

You can open your legs up from Col de la Seign all the way to Lac Combal where the aid station is. Note that the GPX doesn't always follow the route - it has some short cuts.

The climb over Arette du Mont Favre is only notable for being annoying but once over it you can run most of the way down the La Maison Vielle and from there all the way down to Brevna.

Brevna is the start of the climb up to Pavillion, which is an utter pig. At least someone has does some maintenance to the trail since last year so those really nasty steep sandy sections are mostly steps now. Save yourself for this climb. Pavillon is where there's hot food and your drop bag.

The first half of the descent off Pavillon is horrible. It's steep and just constant lose stones. the worst is the very last road. Unless you're adept and going down fast on loose ground keep to the left or right and you'll find a path most of the way down except for the very last bit where you just hail mary and close your eyes. It turns into a technical wodden descent after that and then eventually a road which is all runnable. At the bottom you'll be in Palud.

From Palud you follow the road for a bit and then cut off the start the Lechey climb. Some parts are steep but a lot of it is easy going. At the top you begin the long traverse to Bonatti. This is one of the rare runnable bits so take advantage if you still have it in you.

From Bonatti you have a 500m climb up to Deux Sauts and then a windy descent all the way to the bottom of the Col Sapin climb. I found it really hard to make up any time on this descent.

The climb up to Col Sapin is only 200m and you have another time sink of a descent after that.

From there you traverse to Suche Damon via the Currù aid station and then down to Courmayeur.

The Currù aid station is off the main trail up what look like it could be a path but you're not quite sure. It's about a 50m climb.

You'll come across a series of Gullies with snow that the sun can't get too. The snow is hard and steep and it's difficult to get purchase with just trail shoes. I was slipping all over the place.

The descent from Suche Damon goes on and is very technical. I'm not that bad at descending but I found it really hard going on tired legs today due to the roots and stones. At the end though there's a long runnable section all the way to the finish.

Enjoy!

My run took me on the TMB route today and I passed a lot of hikers. Some of the bags they had are gigantic. What on earth do you have in them?

I’m going to do TMB for the first time between June 23-25 Going anti clockwise and starting in Courmayeur. It will mean the first night is in Switzerland and the second in France. I know bivouacing is not allowed in Switzerland but how strictly is it enforced if I can’t get a place at a campsite? I intend to bivvy and be gone by dawn. As I understand it France isn’t an issue?

If anyone has done a 3 day or similar fastpack on the route or wild camp I’d love to receive tips

I’m an experienced ultra runner and particularly experienced at DNFing. The pattern is that I’m fine for about 35k and then gradually fade. I know the fade is upon me because people start passing me. I get slower and slower and eventually death march, sometimes to the finish line. I‘ve never vomited in a race and can’t remember having stomach issues other than just not feeling like eating. I convince myself that my stomach has shut down and there’s nothing I can do.

Over the past 18 months or so I’ve been experimenting with all sorts over all sorts of distances to try and sustain a decent pace. I tried Tailwind, double strength Tailwind, sweets (candy) and relying purely on aid stations. At some aid stations I ate meals. Nothing I did seemed to be able to keep me going at a decent pace.

I resumed mountain training in the Alps in May and I think I’ve finally cracked it. I’d never paid much attention to the amount of carbs or electrolytes I was consuming. I mean, I bought Tailwind and used their recommend a portion size and just assumed the electrolytes content would be what I needed because, well, Tailwind works right? I know this is a bit embarrassing in hindsight for an experience runner who invests so much time into running but there you go. Maybe others are in the same boat.

How do I know I’ve cracked it? I can now sustain 5km/h for 50km in the Alps with 3000m ascent without any noticeable fade To the extend I’m running down steep inclines at the end. I haven‘t gone longer than this yet but will. I’m doing weekly runs of 40-50km and it’s working well.

I ended up buying maltodextrin powder, fructose powder, sodium citrate powder and citric acid crystals. This allows me to control the ratios of carbs, electrolytes and taste.

I‘m a heavy sweater to the extent I have crust on my face at the end of runs and my clothes have white stains on them so I suspected I needed more salt.

I have experimented with different ratios of maltodextrin and fructose but am currently using 2:1 with 60g maltodextrin and 30g fructose. I use 4g of sodium citrate (this is not 4g of sodium) and 2.5g of citric acid in a 500ml flask. I consume a flask per hour plus another 500ml water every 2 hours (i am going to increase this when possible). I doubt I’ll try more that 90g for long ultras but if I do I’ll add more fructose to get closer to the 1:0.8 ratio I‘ve seen talked about. I did a control test where I did 60g of carbs and faded after 4 hours.

My races this year will be 20+ hours and 100+ hours so the next thing I’ll be experimenting with is adding natural foods and I‘ll start carrying wraps with things that will keep out the fridge on long hot days.

I‘ve also noticed that I’m not ravenous after really long runs and my recovery is really good. The day after the day after a 50k training run I can carry on with normal training.

I’d be really interested to hear how others fuel for longer stuff and in particular how you mix in proper food.

I’m 59M and ~80kg

I haven’t hit taste fatigue yet but have found that it’s much nicer to drink if just made with cold water so if I know there are streams or other water sources on the way I delay filling the flasks.

I use milk powder storage bags to carry hour portions. There are some on Amazon that even have a funnel shape where you can bite off the end to decant easily into running flasks. They are resealable at the other end so I prefer to reuse them. The other end is wide enough for powder scoops.

I’m an ultra runner and come to the Alps around 20th May each year and train through until mid September. I’ve been in Coyrmayeur/Chamonix since May 22 this year. I’m not doing TMB but I do run on some of the route, mainly in between Col de la Seine and Rif Bonatti. I follow the sub for info myself but I see a lot of newb questions so thought my experience may help some.

The snow is lighter this year and it’s soft and so easily passable. I run in La Sportiva Prodigio Pro and don’t use hiking shoes/boots at all. I always carry microspikes but haven‘t had to use them on any snow fields I’ve crossed.

Despite the snow being lighter there are plenty of snow fields as well as some steep ones. I recommend learning how to traverse them and practise on less steep sections. watch YouTube videos on self arrest using hiking poles - it may save your life.

My routes are much less trodden than TMB and my experience is that there are usually very clear paths through the snow where people before you have been. The TMB route is heavily used so you’re unlikely to be making fresh tracks through snow.

Waterproof shoes are not important. Your feet will dry in no time. Having good grip is. Poles are essential. Travel as light as you safely can. When I fast pack (hut to hut 50km days) the Tor des Géants route I use a Salomon 12l vest and my pack weight is no more that 5kg including water.

For water I carry 4x500ml soft flasks. 2 fit in my running vest and 2 are stashed away so I have the option of 2l. You’ll find water every where to drink and I drink from streams unfiltered all the time. Just avoid where there’s livestock upstream.

It may seem obvious but bring a spare warm top, preferably merino wool and a waterproof jacket. All waterproof gear wets through eventually but will still give your warmth through layers.

I ran towards Bonatti from Bertone recently and turned back just because the snow fields were slowing me down too much but the ones I did go through were very easy. it is very wet at the moment though. Maison Vieille is clear of snow and the paths beyond that have snow fields too but I haven’t venture far that way yet.

I recommend following tourdumontblanc.club on instagram as they have ‘ambassadors’ hiking the route as I type and they are vlogging their journey. There are still some spicy snow sections but they’re getting round going clockwise.

Happy to answer any questions

Background. 58M. Ultra runner. Disovered I have heart disease (CAC 38, mild soft plaque) after a succession of slightly raised LDL results (130,143,126) and ApoB 93. As soon as I received the CAC I changed my diet immediately and 2 weeks later started 20g Atorvastatin. 2 weeks after LDL down to 39. I’ve been sticking the both diet and statins. I have not retested ApoB as it’s not available on the NHS.

I‘m starting to think about relaxing my diet just to give me a bit more flexibility. I responded very well to statins and I think I have some wiggle room. it was reading about stearic acid that triggered this post.

As I understand it stearic acid is at worst neutral and possible a little beneficial and the following foods have more stearic acid than the other sat fat acids: -

• Extra virgin olive oil
• Avocado
• Dark chocolate
• Cocoa
• Almonds
• Walnuts
• Pistachios
• Peanuts/peanut butter
• Oily fish
• Olives

I already eat most things on this list but not liberally. I no longer count sat fats as I know having done so previously that my average per day is no more than 10g.

It‘s mainly these that I plan to relax. EVOO is probably the main one as it’s the basis of most of the cooking I do. I know it’s about 14% sat fats. But generally my plan is just to eat the above to desire.

Finally, I plan to add parmesan back into my diet but only as an addition to certain pasta dishes as an accouterment. I’d use no more that 1-2 heaped teaspoons (~10g and 1.7g sat fats).

This seems like such common sense that it must surely be being doing by others so I thought I’d ask for feedback.

Ultimately I know this is about LDL and ApoB and I will retest both in a couple of months.

I’m going to be in Italy on and off from now until end of September so I have a great opportunity to immerse myself. I know some Italian from attempts to learn it in the past and I know a fair bit of Portuguese so I recognise some words. I’ll mainly be training for Tor des Géants while I’m there and so can use some of that time for listening exercises. My training will make it harder for me to join traditional classes but I could definitely do online lessons. Clearly I want to put myself in Italian conversational situations as much as possible but at the same time I need to improve to be able to hold those conversations. I’m prepared to go all in. What do you think the best approach would be?

I ran the UTS 50k yesterday. I’m not new to Snowdonia or the event but yesterday’s weather made it so much harder. It rained pretty much the whole way round and the wind chill the higher you went was crucifying.

I heard people were pulled from the course but I didn’t see that myself. I did see people without gloves although everything I wore was wet through so I wasn’t much better off.

The only way I could stay warm was to keep moving. If you stopped you got very cold very quickly.

I don’t see what more I could have done kit wise. I have warm gloves with waterproof mittens over them. I had a long sleeve merino top with a waterproof jacket and I wore leggings. I know that everything wets through eventually.

What do others do in races like this to stave off the cold and from getting wet through? How do 100k and 100 milers cope with prolonged bad weather?

I hope it's ok to do this. It seems that there are many of us that exercise a fair bit that have discovered we have heart disease. A pattern seems to be that we have shrugged off higher LDL readings due to thinking we're immune to heart disease due to the exercise we do.

There's an increasing amount of literature about the effects of exercise on heart health beyond that it's just good.

I think we have a duty to pass on our knowledge about the impact of diet on our hearts and how exercise can and can't help us, without cluttering up this sub.

r/ExerciseDietHeart

Anyone got any recommendations for insurance that covers UK+ Europe for racing and training in the mountains that also covers things like via ferrata? I’m specifically looking for something that gives you mountain rescue so I don’t end up with a massive bill if I get into trouble.

Total cholesterol: 200 mg/dL (5.2 mmol/L) → 116 mg/dL (3.0 mmol/L)
LDL: 126 mg/dL (3.3 mmol/L) → 39 mg/dL (1.0 mmol/L)
HDL: 59 mg/dL (1.5 mmol/L) → 66 mg/dL (1.7 mmol/L)
Triglycerides: 74 mg/dL (0.84 mmol/L) → 56 mg/dL (0.63 mmol/L)
Total/HDL ratio: 3.39 → 1.76

First tests were 18th Feb and I received the results a week or so later. ApoB was 93. ChatGPT/Claude told me to get a CAC/CCTA scan. I did a CCTA scan on 26th Feb and got the results on 1st April. CAC of 38 with mild soft plaque with no stenosis. At this point I booked a GP appointment and changed my diet, reducing sat fats to under 10g per day average and upping fibre through supplements (psyllium husk, flax seed, plant sterols) and eating more oats, beans, lentils, fruit and veg. I've had 5% beed mince twice in the month and both times in a chilli con carne.

I proposed having a period with diet and no statins to the GP to see what could be achieved but she talked me out of it. She said while interesting I have heart disease and should treat it because the statins do more than just lower the LDL. She prescribed 20mg Atorvastatin. I did ask if 20 was necessary and she insisted, saying there was really no difference between 10 and 20 and if I was taking it I may as well do 20.

I don't drink or smoke and I exercise a lot - roughly 10 hours a week this month with a marathon in the middle and taper before and recovery after. I've had no muscle issues. Found myself in a restaurant once and ordered the friendliest looking meal on the menu but it came with the potato cooked in cream and the veg in butter and I was in heaven.

As a wold guess I'd say 50% came from the statins and 20% from diet.

I checked the Salomon reviews for this and saw that a few people had had issues with the flask elastic breaking on first use, the sizing being very small and there being no way to attach a quiver.

Is anyone using this that can share their experiences with it?