Image 1 — How important is spatial coherence in Metroidvania level design?
Image 2 — How important is spatial coherence in Metroidvania level design?

How important is spatial coherence in Metroidvania level design?

I've been thinking about something while playing Metroidvanias: how important is it for the world to actually make spatial sense?

I love labyrinthine maps. Getting lost, finding shortcuts, coming back somewhere from an unexpected direction, slowly building a mental map... that's a huge part of why I love the genre.

But I'm starting to think there's a big difference between a world being labyrinthine and a world simply not following its own spatial logic.

I'm replaying Hollow Knight right now after getting all the Steam achievements, and honestly, the more I replay it, the more I notice how controlled Hallownest is. It's incredibly complex, but most of the time I still feel like I'm moving through an actual place rather than a collection of rooms.

Fallen Tear is a convenient recent example of the opposite feeling I sometimes get. I'm using it because it just came out and I'm currently playing it, not because I want to shit on the game. I actually think it's visually beautiful.

These two screenshots are a good example.

In the first one, I'm standing in front of a huge tree with a dark opening. Visually, everything tells me: I'm about to enter this tree.

So naturally my brain builds a mental model. I'm going inside the trunk. It could be one small room or an entire network of passages, I don't care.

Then I enter and get the second screenshot.

It's suddenly a huge open environment with what looks like another gigantic tree inside.

And my brain just went: wait... where am I?

This isn't about realism. It's fantasy. Put an entire kingdom inside the tree if you want. But then establish that somehow.

What interests me is the relationship between what the environment tells the player and the mental map the player builds.

If I enter the bottom of a giant tree and climb through several rooms, I love being able to think: "OK, I must be somewhere near the top of the trunk now." And if I eventually emerge onto a branch that I saw earlier from outside, that's incredibly satisfying.

The world can be extremely labyrinthine while still having an internal geography.

And that's where I'd genuinely love to hear from people who know more about level design or have worked in studios.

I've never worked in a game studio and this isn't remotely my actual job, so I don't know what the production constraints are.

Are rooms sometimes designed independently and connected later? Does gameplay take priority over geographical coherence? Do art changes or late level design changes create these inconsistencies?

Because as a player, sometimes I see a transition like this and immediately think "wait, that doesn't make sense." And it makes me genuinely curious about what happens during development and playtesting.

Is this something level designers actually care about a lot? Or am I putting way more importance on spatial coherence than most players do?

u/Igafann — 11 days ago

Fatal Claw, and I’m still not done with it.

EDIT 5: Man, I've almost completed everything now, except for one or two minor achievements. Huge thanks to the Discord community, I love you all! This game is clearly a BANGER. I warned you guys before its release!

I finished Fatal Claw, and I’m still not done with it.

This game is excellent. For me, it’s already fighting for a spot in my personal top 5 Metroidvanias, and it might actually push SotN out. My current favorites are Hollow Knight, Silksong, Nine Sols, Ori 2 and SotN, so that should tell you how highly I rate Fatal Claw.

Just to be clear, I bought the game myself during Early Access with my own money. This isn’t sponsored or anything like that.

I’ve finished the main game, explored pretty much everything I could find, and I’m still going back because I have a few "puzzles" left to solve after credits...

The visuals are absolutely gorgeous, especially from the middle of the game onwards. Some areas genuinely look incredible. The music is beautiful too, calm and atmospheric without being stressful, which fits the exploration perfectly.

Even after finishing it, I still want to keep exploring and figure out the remaining puzzles on my own.

I won’t spoil anything, but it’s absolutely worth finishing the game. Keep going after the end.

Fatal Claw is seriously good.

Edit 2. For Early Access players, check the official Discord for info about accessing version 1.0. (Edit 1 made it sound like I was trying to sell the game. I am not).

u/Igafann — 2 months ago

Devs, what is the point of collectibles with no proper tracking?

Honestly, I don’t get this design in Metroidvanias.
I’m REPLAYING Blasphemous 1 & 2 for 100% steam Trophee completion, and I keep hitting the same issue: missing collectibles with no tracking.
In Blasphemous 2 I’m at 26/33 Cherubs, and I have no idea which ones I’m missing.
Same thing happened in Ori: I ended up re-checking the whole map in “inspection mode” just to find what I missed.
At that point I have to ask: what’s the point?
It doesn’t reward exploration (I already explored everything).
It’s not a skill challenge.
It doesn’t add meaningful content.
It just turns into backtracking every area with a guide open.
I’m not asking for everything to be marked from the start, but once you find something, it should be tracked (map markers, per-area counters, late-game reveal item, etc.).
Because “26/33, good luck” isn’t difficulty, it’s just busywork.
And it actually kills exploration, since the optimal strategy becomes stopping normal play and systematically checking everything with a guide.
So I’m curious: what do devs think the player gains from this?

EDIT : I already use the markers, but that’s not really the point. I’m talking about cherubs I’ve already missed and whose locations I don’t know.

How am I supposed to mark them if I don’t know where they are even with completed map?

EDIT 2 : I have all achievment on Hollow Knight (I've try harded P5 and got it), Silk song; Nine sols (and some souls likes, it's not a get gud issue).

Edit 3 : Enders serie ? they did right.

EDIT 4 : Ended up to check every locations. thanks Devs and Enstein redditers who told me to check and put markers on the map, that was totally useless. Do you read ??? I already finished the game !

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u/Igafann — 2 months ago

la "phobie administrative" de Thévenoud, j’ai réalisé un truc… je crois que j’ai exactement le même problème

Salut à tous,

Ça va peut-être vous faire marrer, mais il fallait que je sorte ça.

Vous vous rappelez de Thomas Thévenoud ? Le mec qui s'est fait virer du gouvernement en sortant l'excuse de la "phobie administrative" parce qu'il payait pas ses impôts. Tout le monde lui est tombé dessus et s'est foutu de lui. C'est clair que le gars s'est totalement trompé de métier en devenant député puis ministre.

Mais franchement, avec le recul... je le comprends à 100 %.
De mon côté, la paperasse me paralyse complètement. Dès que je vois une enveloppe à fenêtre bleue dans la boîte aux lettres, j'ai un nœud au ventre. Je la pose sur un coin de table, je me dis que je verrai ça plus tard, et la semaine passe. Résultat : le courrier s'accumule, le stress monte, et plus j'attends, plus j'ai peur d'ouvrir pour voir les dégâts. C'est un cercle vicieux complètement idiot.
Je me sens con et irresponsable parce que je gère le reste de ma vie sans problème, mais là-dessus, mon cerveau bloque totalement.
Bref, l'élu était à côté de ses pompes, mais la réaction d'angoisse dont il parlait, elle est bien réelle chez moi.
Il y en a d'autres ici qui galèrent avec ce genre de blocage ? Vous faites comment pour vous forcer à ouvrir ce foutu courrier quand ça s'entasse ?

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u/Igafann — 2 months ago

HK's Pantheon 5 will forever be my peak gaming achievement

I’ve officially hit my limit with hyper hard games for now. Got the platinum on Elden Ring, grinded DS3 to death, cleared Sekiro, Super Meat Boy... you name it. But Metroidvanias are my true love, and I've 100%'d all the heavy hitters. Still, across every game I’ve ever played ans platinumed, nothing has ever come close to the challenge of Pantheon 5.

And it wasn't just P5. I wanted those blue lifeblood seeds, so I forced myself to do the first three Pantheons with all bindings (didn't feel the need for P4 all B though). 2 out of 4 P3 bindings especially turned into an absolute nightmare. That whole process alone took me two months.

Once I finally unlocked all the upgrades, I went allin on P5. My initial goal was just to reach Absolute Radiance. But as soon as I got there, reality hit: you can’t just hope to beat AbsRad in a P5 run. You have to master her. You need to be able to beat her consistently in the Hall of Gods before even attempting P5 again.

The mental frustration of dying right at the finish line especially in phase 3 of AbsRad was brutal to swallow. But I kept practicing, and eventually, I did it.

...Except I had unlocked the achievement on a save file where I left Zote to die. I felt like I cheated myself, so I loaded up my main save and beat P5 again the very next day, this time with Grey Prince Zote in the lineup.

P5 will forever represent my single biggest commitment in gaming. 2.5 months of pure tryharding and uncountable deaths. Something that felt completely impossible at first actually became reality.

Now, having 100% Silksong, I’m terrified. Are they going to put us through another Pantheon ? Silksong feels like it's going to be way harder. It took me forever to truly read Hornet pixel-by-pixel in HK (can no hit her easily now), but the thought of a "Lost Lace" at the end of a boss rush... I'm genuinely scared. I don't want to lose my 100% achievements. Imagine pantheon versions of : Groal or savage beastfly ? Or Lost lace ?

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u/Igafann — 3 months ago

Il est temps pour le piratage de revenir en force comme en 2000

J'ai payé le film interstellar sur youtube film (aussi passengers)

Ce soi j'ai envie de le revoir mais non impossible. Toutes les 10 secondes il me sors "Désolé, une erreur s'est produite lors de la mise en licence de cette vidéo "

Plus JAMAIS JE NE PAYE UN FLM EN LIGNE. J'ai payé ce p..... de film mais non je ne peux pas le regarder légalement. Du coup je tape un certain mot clé et là je peux voir le film sans aucun pb ni aucune pub.

J'arrête tous mes abos sauf netflix pour mon fils, mais dès qu'il grandit un peu je dégage cette merde aussi.

Ah oui, aussi on été voir un film avec mon fils au ciné y'à 3 mois, ca faisait longtemps : 60 balles avec le popcorn WTF ? : j'ai direct voulu faire demi-tour mais va expliquer à ton fils de 5 ans que tu refuses de payer le ciné parce que c'est trop chère.

PLUS JAMAIS LE CINEMA C'EST MORT. PLUS JAMAIS D'ACHAT DE CONTENU DE MERDE EN LIGNE DE MERDE.

Je retourne regarder mon interstellar en streaming PIRATE.

EDIT : l'industrie des voleurs menteurs ne croit pas au 60e pour 2 et me sort des 7 euros la place... Donc 24 balles X 2 ciné Convention Paris. donc oui 48 euros sans pop corn.... mais en vrai on a pris du popcorn et 2 boissons. Je m'excuse j'avais tort, 48 euros les places, en fait j'étais plus vers les 70 euros pour 2.

Edit 2 : Et puis merde. allez tous au ciné. c'est pas cher. c'est moi qui suis con.

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u/Igafann — 3 months ago

Une loi pour autoriser les clims sans syndic

Tout est de le titre.

J'ai envie de poser une clim dans tout mon appartement.

dois présenter ma demande au syndic et soumission à votes.

Je suis dans un bâtiments avec beaucoup de religieux amis entre eux. Ils sont tout sauf tolérants envers les athés ou non pratiquants. Je vais devoir demander leur avis alors que je sais qu'ils vont tous dire non à cause de mon mode de vie.

Je vais tenté au cas où mais sans aucune espoir.

C'est injuste je trouve.

reddit.com
u/Igafann — 3 months ago

L’équipe du Paraguay n’a eu aucun carton

Je hais l’équipe du Paraguay : le pire jeu jamais vu.
Ils ont pris en otage le match avec leur stratégie d'anti-jeu pour aller aux pénaltys.
Comment peut-on être fier de sa nation si elle joue comme ça ? Et surtout après qu’ils ont perdu.
Je hais l’équipe du Paraguay.
Le Maroc va être dur à battre, mais je suis certain qu’ils ne vont pas jouer comme des lâches comme l’a fait le Paraguay.
PS : ils étaient là à embrouiller physiquement les joueurs français. Si Mbappé avait vraiment voulu répondre… mais non, il a souri ❤️😎🫡

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u/Igafann — 3 months ago

Muting the game to play better ?

I’m playing Nine Sols right now. It’s an absolute banger, such an excellent game. I’ve already taken down Ji and now I’m facing the twins. Phase 1 is easy, but Phase 2 is tricky, as usual. I decided to mute the sound.

Which leads to my question: when a boss is putting up a fight and you have to go through multiple attempts, do you mute the audio?

I’ve noticed that I perform much better in total silence. It feels like a shame to have to cut the sound, but at the same time, how do you compose a soundtrack that stays fresh after being looped for an hour?
I don’t have the answer.

Let’s talk about it, I know there are plenty of devs here

Ps :I muted the music in Silksong for a boss fight and forgot to turn it back on. I ended up playing for 10 hours like that. My bad.

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u/Igafann — 5 months ago