A possible connection between Mouthwashing and How Fish is Made

I've already talked about how the cake in Mouthwashing is basically a marshmallow a few times, and in any case, we know for a fact that it's made with gelatin, right? It turns out that, while gelatin can be made from any sort of bones, fish bones are a common ingredient. In other words, the fish from How Fish Is Made might have been what supplied the raw material for the birthday cake. Which also means that the one fish we see trying to eat the cake in the expansion pack was practicing cannibalism without realizing it.

The cake is the real link between the two games, essentially. That's why it appears both in the HFIM expansion with the Curly cameo and also Mouthwashing proper.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 12 days ago

I wish Vox X Velvette were taken more seriously as a ship

I think it has a lot of potential. For one thing, Vox has way better chemistry with Velvette than he ever does with Valentino, and seems to enjoy her company more as well (I think it's significant that, in Season 1, he seems a lot happier to interact with Vel than with Val, and in Season 2, it is Vel that he takes out with him in public, and uses as a go-between when Val isn't in the mood to communicate directly). Moreover, Vel's distaste for Carmilla makes a lot more sense if you assume she views her as a romantic rival for Vox's affections (I also really like the idea of Vox and Carmilla being exes, but that's a topic for another time). "Respectless" in particular would work perfectly if it were understood to be an unconscious cat fight over Vox.

Plus, if the Vee's were a polycule, it would not only make Vox's supposed bisexuality an actual plot point, but would also add an interesting tension to their relationship as Vox uses both Val and Vel for sex while trying to convince each one that his love for them is real and the other is only a distraction. In addition to having Vox seem more manipulative and villainous in general (if that's what the show is going for), it would also further his persona as a seductive rake in general (which is only ever glanced over in the show proper despite being--again--full of potential). Instead, the show seems determined to bluntly force the point that Vox is ONLY EVER into Val (and sometimes Alastor), and his interest in Vel is as a totally platonic friend, which is, IMO, just plain boring. And what's worse is that (unlike with some other pairings) the fandom doesn't seem terribly interested in making up for it by going where the show won't.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 15 days ago

Does anyone else think that Alastor deliberately helped maneuver Vox into a position where he almost won, only to rip it all away at the last possible moment?

Offering to be Vox's prisoner so that he could gather dirt on Vox and weasel out of his various deals on a technicality certainly seems like it falls under this rubric. Above and beyond that, it's a basic psychological fact that to have something (or think you have something) and then lose it feels a lot more painful than to never have a chance at getting it in the first place. And we all know how much Alastor likes seeing others in pain (Vox in particular)....

Which once again just shows how messed-up Hazbin's priorities are in relation to its characters, IMO. How are we supposed to root for Alastor and against Vox when the former is willing to do one of the absolute worst things you can do to someone, out of sheer spite? In any other series, Alastor would be the unquestioned villain, and Vox would be showered with sympathy and praise for clawing his way back from the abyss.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 27 days ago
▲ 17 r/VoxCult

Another reason Vox should be the main character: Christian Borle!

Seriously, you can't have someone with THAT level of star power (someone who was already widely-known and loved in the world of stage and screen acting even before "Hazbin"), and then just relegate them to a supporting role. Or, rather, you can, but it's a huge waste of talent. If the Powers that Be want to show Christian Borle the proper respect due to someone of his massive skillset, they'll make his character one of, if not the, main focal points of the show from here on out.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 1 month ago

Vox deserves so much better and it really sucks...

I just wanna rewrite Vox's backstory from the ground up to fully highlight how awesome and inspiring he is. Then I want to write a new ending where he atones for his murders while alive and doesn't go to Hell. But writing is haaaaaard!

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 1 month ago

Staticbelle is sexist now apparently?

A bit ago I posted (mostly jokingly) a comment in the Staticbelle community about how if Vox were the main character, he'd be more likely to end up with Charlie. I ended up getting this very weird response about how bad and awful such a thing would be because it would reinforce ~*~sexist stereotypes~*~ or whatever, which I just do not get at all. Like, first of all, I thought it was obvious that I was trying to be funny. Second of all, the idea here is that Vox would win the heart of Charlie, not that she would literally be "given" to Vox as a prize (who would even "give her away?" Her father who lets her do whatever she wants in any case?). The same comment also included a remark about how Staticbelle should never, ever become canon, and that it's fine to "ship" Vox and Charlie as long as you have no intention of supporting it in canon. I do get that Staticbelle supporters don't necessarily expect it to become canon, but really, is it so surprising that someone in a community dedicated to rooting for Charlie and Vox to get together would genuinely believe that they should be together? Isn't that just what shipping is most of the time?

But now I'm genuinely curious: do you think that one reason why Staticbelle is controversial is that some people find the idea of Charlie being with a man sexist? Or do they just resent the idea that Vox (who is a man) is better-liked or has more star quality than Charlie (who is a woman)? It would certainly explain the sheer amount of "B-b-but Charlie is the main character and she's in love with Vaggie!" that you see the moment you step outside communities specifically dedicated to praising Vox.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 1 month ago

Reason #1847 why Vox should be the official main character of Hazbin Hotel...

...is that it would dramatically increase the probability of Staticbelle actually happening, simply from a genre convention standpoint. Stories where the Hero(TM) proves himself and is rewarded by marrying a beautiful princess are as old as humanity itself. Thus, once Vox had overcome his demons with Charlie's help, the next logical step would be for the two of them to recognize their love for each other and decide to get married (or at very least, start going out). But this only becomes obvious if Vox is the main character; otherwise he's just one more sinner Charlie sets out to redeem who COULD turn into something more.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 2 months ago
▲ 76 r/VoxCult

Little something I found as I was driving through Georgia

The Georgia Aquarium is a tourist attraction in downtown Atlanta. Apparently, it's the largest of its kind in the country. And yes, they have sharks (including Whale Sharks!).

u/MissDeborah8060 — 2 months ago
▲ 15 r/SafeSpaceofVox+1 crossposts

For those of you who own Vox plushies, has anyone tried swaddling him like a baby?

I've been thinking about this ever since I saw a video on swaddling babies a while back (featuring a real live baby, no less). I don't have a Vox plush, but I feel like it would be a lot of fun to try.

u/MissDeborah8060 — 2 months ago

Small change I would make to the "Brighter" sequence

Although I like the "Brighter" music video in itself, I always found the leadup to it a bit underwhelming. If it were up to me, I'd make the following change:

Before the song officially begins, when it's just Vox in his lair saying "Failure. I'll show you failure," instead of leading right into the song, his words would be punctuated by flashbacks showing Vincent as a young person, terrified of his father, who says some variant of "Get out of my sight, failure!" or "You're such a failure, I wish you'd never been born!" Maybe there'd also be a scene in there of Vincent killing his father in a fit of rage or something, I don't know. But either way, only then would it slide into the song.

The reason this would work so well is twofold. In the first place, it would show exactly why he's so obsessed with being this powerful person whom everyone worships and takes seriously. As it is, the "Brighter" video adds some interesting context to his plans to declare himself a god, but doesn't actually explain how or why he wants that in the first place. In the second place, there's the element of surprise. There's something about seeing a bad guy who's almost certain he's won flashing back to a younger, more vulnerable state that is super compelling for fans (myself included). If the show had managed to pull something like this off, I think Vox would be even more universally loved than he already is, and the show itself would get a massive boost in prestige for helping the audience see this character in a whole new light (as opposed to what we actually got, which for me at least is the sense that Vox COULD have been an amazing character if only the writers put more thought into how he was written).

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 2 months ago

Supposing Vox had died at the end of Season 2 (there's a point to this, I swear)...

Not so long ago, I was watching some YouTube videos that actively wondered why Vox is still alive after the end of Season 2, now that big arc is seemingly "over." One YouTuber in particular went into more detail about a proposed Disney villain-style death in which the laser cannon somehow detaches from Lucifer before exploding and taking Vox (and presumably the other Vee's) with it. Vox would then be dead, but he would make a spectacle of his death that would be permanently etched into the minds of everyone around him, and so retain some of the "fame" he so desperately wanted. And, the path would be clear for a new villain to emerge in Season 3.

I realize there are problems with this scenario (notably: less Vox), but I still can't help but think it sounds like a better ending for the last season than the one we ultimately got. At least a big, dramatic, spectacular death scene would allow him to exit with dignity, so to speak, and come across as a genuinely tragic character. As opposed to what we actually get, where Vox finds himself alive but humiliated and trapped while his two biggest abusers (Alastor and Valentino) get away with everything and are seen as heroes for helping to bring him down. Couple that with all the merch and fan art of Vox looking miserable surrounded by his happy abusers and it starts to get really uncomfortable in the way a simple, dignified death scene never would--almost like someone (or several someones) on the art team finds the idea of miserable Vox more gratifying than dead Vox. Because Vox is just that horrible, apparently.

Of course, the best-case scenario for future seasons is that Vox will recover, do some soul-searching, get his power back, and become a heroic character himself; but I just don't think that's ever going to happen. If he does get a "happy ending," it's probably going to involve him utterly submitting to Alastor or Valentino or both. I could be wrong, of course, but I'm not optimistic. And I honestly think that would be a fate worse than death, at least in relation to how Vox has been presented thus far. No one likes to see a beautiful wild animal locked in a cage or turned into a house pet, unless they themselves are exotic animal collectors who enjoy breaking them.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 2 months ago

Small change I would make to the "Brighter" sequence

Although I like the "Brighter" music video in itself, I always found the leadup to it a bit underwhelming. If it were up to me, I'd make the following change:

Before the song officially begins, when it's just Vox in his lair saying "Failure. I'll show you failure," instead of leading right into the song, his words would be punctuated by flashbacks showing Vincent as a young person, terrified of his father, who says some variant of "Get out of my sight, failure!" or "You're such a failure, I wish you'd never been born!" Maybe there'd also be a scene in there of Vincent killing his father in a fit of rage or something, I don't know. But either way, only then would it slide into the song.

The reason this would work so well is twofold. In the first place, it would show exactly why he's so obsessed with being this powerful person whom everyone worships and takes seriously. As it is, the "Brighter" video adds some interesting context to his plans to declare himself a god, but doesn't actually explain how or why he wants that in the first place. In the second place, there's the element of surprise. There's something about seeing a bad guy who's almost certain he's won flashing back to a younger, more vulnerable state that is super compelling for fans (myself included). If the show had managed to pull something like this off, I think Vox would be even more universally loved than he already is, and the show itself would get a massive boost in prestige for helping the audience see this character in a whole new light (as opposed to what we actually got, which for me at least is the sense that Vox COULD have been an amazing character if only the writers put more thought into how he was written).

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 2 months ago

Daisuke and marshmallows

This is just a cute little reference that I, a science nerd, noticed as I was thinking about Daisuke's hibiscus shirt. Hibiscus is a member of the mallow family (Malvaceae), whose most famous member is the Marsh-Mallow plant. In historical times, this plant was used to make the sweet treats we call marshmallows, though nowadays they're mostly made with gelatin instead. In other words, the game is encouraging us to identify Daisuke with marshmallows! Whether the emphasis is on his being sweet or soft (or both) is, I suppose, a matter of interpretation. There's a lot of dialogue in the game about how much he likes sweets, too.

Actually, going off of this, if you look closely at the ingredients used to make the cake in the game (water, gelatin, and sweetener), they're the same ingredients used to make marshmallows. The characters are eating a marshmallow cake. All these marshmallow connections go deeper than I thought!

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 2 months ago

Is TADC the new The Room?

For those of you who don't know or weren't around at the time, The Room is an independent film from 2003, which is often included in lists of the "worst films ever made." What's even more interesting is that Tommy Wiseau, who created the film, reminds me a little of Gooseworx: a difficult personality; a decision to go indie to avoid dealing with unsympathetic gatekeepers; and a finished project that miraculously blew up and became a big hit despite not being "good" in any true sense of the term. Even the storytelling beats are kind of similar, since both stories feature a self-insert character who believes he is a victim despite all his faults, and who is ultimately driven to suicide after his friends are (ostensibly) insufficiently caring and deferential to him.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 2 months ago

Seeking advice (for context, I rent an apartment in Florida)

On the balcony to my apartment are several paper wasp nests, some of which have been there since last summer and others of which are new. I almost never use the balcony, so I rarely interact with them in any way, but the few times I have opened the door they've paid me no mind. I obviously don't want to hurt the wasps, so I haven't called an exterminator or anything and mostly just let them be. That being said, because I rent the apartment, I'm a little worried that if the nests get too numerous, I might get in trouble with the complex, especially if/when I move out. My current plan is to leave them for now, and then, when there's a cold winter night (it does get cold in this part of Florida, just not very frequently), find a way to knock the nests down to the ground (at least the inactive ones). That way, I'll get rid of the nests while limiting damage to the actual wasps (since they presumably would be hibernating somewhere more sheltered), and minimize my chances of getting stung. However, I wanted to run it by you all first, in case you have any better ideas. To be clear, the wasps don't bother me, I'm just concerned because I live in a rental.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 2 months ago
▲ 11 r/VoxCult

For those of you who like Wawa...

Wawa is a North American convenience store/gas station chain. Apparently, they now sell red-and-blue smoothies (sound familiar?) with an option to add GUMMY SHARKS!

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 3 months ago

Mouthwashing and Memento

This is something that occurred to me in light of the discourse about Christopher Nolan's new Odyssey movie. Back in 2000, Nolan made a film called Memento, which seems to have prefigured Mouthwashing in some very interesting ways. Both are told from the perspective of a bad man who is trying to construct a narrative of himself as a hero, and both have non-linear narratives that confuse and disorient the audience. There's even a minor character in Memento named Jimmy, who is a drug dealer. Then, by the end of the story, we learn that the bad man has killed (or as good as killed, in Jimmy's case) the one person who genuinely seemed to have his best interests at heart. I don't actually think any of these parallels are deliberate, but they're still pretty fun to think about.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 3 months ago

Just out of curiosity, what are people's opinions of Tomotasauce's "Hazbin Hotel Abridged" series of videos and shorts?

To me, they're kind of a wash, because Vox is often the butt of the joke, but so is everyone else. The fact that Vox isn't taken seriously matters less to me if nobody else is taken seriously either.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 3 months ago
▲ 13 r/VoxCult

Two new Vox headcanons just dropped!

Headcanon 1: Vox spent most of his teenage years in, effectively, foster care. What happened was that, after he lost his father at about age twelve, he was sent to an orphanage. However, because his epilepsy made him difficult for the poor orphanage staff to care for, he was eventually taken in by a family in the city of Fargo, so that he could have proper medical care. He resisted all attempts to be adopted by them, however, and moved out as soon as he became a legal adult.

Headcanon 2: During World War 2, he was a radio operator on a US Air Force plane. Eventually, his plane was shot down over the open ocean, and he was the only survivor. That evening, a whole bunch of Blue Sharks (one of the most widespread and in-your-face shark species) swarmed around him while he clung to a piece of floating debris. At first he thought they were going to eat him, but in fact, they turned out to be friendly, and kept him company all night long until he could be rescued by a patrol boat. This led to an epiphany about sharks being more than just mindless killing machines.

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 3 months ago

It's hard being someone who doesn't like Jax OR Caine

To me, both of these characters have essentially the same basic problem. They both choose to be cruel to others, either discounting or reveling in their victims' suffering, only for the series to pull a 180 and insist that they actually deserve sympathy after all. Yet, even as more and more people come around to the idea that Jax really is as awful as he first appeared, I still see a lot of people (often the same people) making excuses for Caine: that he was pushed, that he doesn't want to act like this but some force compelled him, that he doesn't know any better because he's not human (ahem, then why did he figure out Kinger's absence meant the others were plotting something?), that he's somehow "more human" than Jax or "earned" a redemption that Jax didn't, and so on. And I just don't buy it. He's nothing but uncaring to the other characters for the first 7-8 episodes, spending all his time trying to get THEM to go on the adventures HE wants, steamrolling their own preferences, and generally making everything all about himself. Even if you make allowances for the fact that he's not supposed to be human, in practice, how is he not every bit as toxic as Jax? On the flip side, there are those who dislike Caine because he's mean to Jax, even though Jax clearly causes most if not all his own problems. I feel like there's pressure to "pick a side," when I mostly just find them BOTH to be toxic, shallow, uninteresting, and annoying. What about the actual LIKABLE characters?

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u/MissDeborah8060 — 3 months ago