Garp is the biggest blow to the admirals agenda

So, we've seen multiple times in the story Garp being showcased the strongest marine we have ever seen in the story. Regardless of one's headcanon about current Akainu, or Kong or Sengoku, the only one who consistently showcased best feats and best portrayal is Garp. He is routinely put in the same category as Roger, Whiteboard and Rocks. And that's while being the ONLY prominent marine figure(outside of new gen like Koby) who doesn't have a Devil Fruit. He is the purest form of hakiman we've seen, and he is one of the absolute best.

But what differentiates him from any other marine is his freedom. We know for a fact that he could become an Admiral if he wanted to, but he refused because he despises celestial dragons. He refuses the orders if he wants to, he goes to do something if he wants to. He frees Dragon after he committed the treason against WG. He attacked Imu of all people, and helped free Rocks from his grip. The only reason he is the marine is because he wants to be, because he thinks it's the right thing for him to do. Rocks himself said it would be better for him to be a pirate, but Garp decided to raise a new, better generation of the marines. And this is the reason he is so strong. He has all the qualities that make Yonkos and other great pirates strong. Indomitable will, absolute confidence when facing an unreal dangerous threat, refusal to step away from his goals and dreams. Haki is the manifestation of person's will, and since Garp has such a strong will, his haki is on top of the world.

Meanwhile, if you look at other marines, they all sacrifice massive freedom for their position of power. Kizaru being a servant of Saturn, obediently killing his friend. Aokiji participating in Ohara massacre. Akainu being forced to follow orders of Celestial Dragons, Greenbull, Sengoku, etc. Even Fujitora, who is objectively the best Admiral, he stopped Greenbull from attacking revolutionaries, didn't capture Luffy, is still forced to somewhat follow orders. He absolutely can twist them to follow his sense of justice, but Garp outright needed to be begged to follow orders. Akainu would never be able to exile Garp the way he ordered Fujitora, Garp would just show up if he wanted and laugh in his face. Fujitora is a kind character, but he still lacks the absolute will of Garp.

In the end, Kaido said that haki transcends everything. Of course it's not the full picture with enhanced focus on God's fruits like Luffy's and Imu's, but we clearly saw in Egghead that Joyboy haki was insane. It knocked vice admirals out, and forced gorosei out of their transformations. DFS are nice, but haki is the only way to become a true top tier. And as long Admirals grovel before celestial dragons, even though they all see things they disagree with/do what they don't want, they will never be anywhere near as strong as true top tiers.

In my opinion they can reach lower Yonko tier, but the way the whole system is set up prevents Marines having anyone becoming a true top 1 on the seas(we are not counting Imu of course), Garp is just a unique exception to the rule.

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u/RealisticDebt9380 — 3 months ago
▲ 259 r/WoT

I just realized something about Nynaeve and Lan

So, I am rereading the series, started the New Spring, and in the prologues we see a young Lan. And that got me thinking by the end of the series Lan is already 47. Nynaeve is like 25. Age gap is already significant, and Nynaeve is gonna live for hundreds of years. Unless she dies in a freak accident, she is gonna bury him, knowing that she still has a majority of her life to live without him, and she is madly in love with Lan. It's gonna hit her very hard.

​

Honestly, this discrepancy in the life expectancy makes it perfectly reasonable for Aes Sedai in the third age to rarely marry someone. Probably there will be a ton of relationships between Asha'man and Aes Sedai in the Fourth Age

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u/RealisticDebt9380 — 4 months ago

My analysis of LotM writing and how it could have been much better

So, this is probably gonna be a very long post. I've finished LotM some time ago, and I've really loved it. I enjoyed it immensely all the way through, it was great. But recently I decided to reread my favourite series, Wheel of Time , this time listening to it as an audiobook. And it helped me formulate in my mind what problems LotM for me had. And it's that LotM is essentially a great first draft, with some unique conditions that also limit it story.

​

So, first I want to talk about WoT(Wheel of Time) a bit. It's not a perfect series, it drags a lot in certain parts, but overall it has an incredible world building, great cast of characters, outstanding character development, a lot of PEAK moments and a great ending(despite it being finished by another author). You could say many of these things(not all though) about LotM, but it's how they are handled showcases the limitations of LotM.

​

So, what are my problems with LotM? The system of it being released chapter by chapter forces it into an incredibly awkward cycle where you have to keep your reader's engagement from chapter to chapter, whereas in full books you can have down moments, provided that you hit on a key moments to make those "dull" moments worth it. As much as WoT gets flak for slog, and truthfully sometimes Robert Jordan did wonder around a bit too much, but also it's those moments where seemingly nothing happens that set up future pay offs that just hit me so hard during both first time reading and a re-read.

​

First and foremost, having a completed and thought out draft that you can then analyze, edit, remake certain parts can help you clean up a lot of what happens in the story. LotM pacing is great, but if it was released by volumes, Cuttlefish could have easily spend more time intertwining arcs, characters, removing extra fluff for the finale. You could maybe put in a little bit of povs from other perspectives, set up various factions better or sometimes create a better plot twist. For example, volume 3 has a great finale, but you could throw in a lot of snippets of Mother Tree of Desire cultists throughout the volume, to showcase their abilities, influence, their derangement and danger, slowly building up to Klein's confrontation with them. Perhaps you could focus more on the artificer and their ties with MToD cult, develop a character and showcase a villain. There are a lot of possibilities to have once you've already outlined what and how happens.

​

Second, is character writing and development. I actually think that Volume 1, while slow, has the best character building and development, because it allows itself to breath more. It allows Klein and others to live day to day life. And a lot of the times character shines in these moments more than high stakes life or death situations. When writing a whole book, you have a luxury to actually write and think about the character's arcs, and not just how to fit them into the story. I think it's very easy to fix the problem of many Tarot Club members being flat and unimportant compared to others(like Xio) could be solved much more easily in the book format.

​

Also, I think Klein could be a lot better. Klein is great, don't get me wrong, but in my opinion he still has a little bit of what I call "Solo Levelingness" in him. What I mean by that is that outside of his loneliness, which is almost never the forefront of his arc, all of his struggles are external. Monsters, enemies, other humans? External. Corruption? While it's inside of him, it's still an external conflict. QiDian release style can't allow him to mess up without it being immediate or very high stakes, like for example Amon kidnapping. You can't allow the arc of Klein consistently struggling with something internal without it paying off immediately, cause, once again, it can slow down the hype. Or can make the readers uncomfortable. In WoT it could be a harrowing experience reading Rand's POV at some points of the story. Sometimes due to stuff being done to him, but sometimes because of his actions. But resolution of his arc is the highest peak I experienced in any media, ever. But when reading a story continuously from chapter to chapter, you have to wait weeks, months maybe a year for a resolution of that said internal conflict, and it can put off people adapted to high pace constantly keeping moving storytelling. In the book format you can plan this whole thing in a compact personal story arc connected to the main plot, that can then enhance the resolution of what you've been building for both character and plot wise.

​

Lastly, while LotM has a great world building, it's still messy, and while it's very deep, it could be wider actually. For such a deep, well thought out lore with complex history, Eldritch horror entities, strong artifacts that influence everything around them, the countries themselves can of the be classified as an adaptation of real world places/cultures. You can put a lot of depth, mystery and shock in the webnovel style story, but you can't focus on a small details of a concrete nation, island, geographical place without dragging the chapter , end it feeling like nothing happens. WoT has done it masterfully alot, when I'm the slow moments you can feel the culture, identity of a certain group, nation or organisation. A lot of the times it was interesting to read it on it's own, even if you didn't feel the plot progressing much. Which allows for much more unique and interesting setting, instead of a bunch of fantasy England, France, Russia, Africa, etc. It would be so cool to see these places evolve to their own cultures, and how they interact with each other. What can our characters learn from them.

​

So, in the end I think Cuttlefish could have a much clearer view of how to get all the chess pieces to where he wanted for the finale of every volume, and the story overall, greatly enhance the quality of the characters and character arcs, and sprinkle a lot of interesting world building to elevate it all to the next level. I think Volume 8 would improve the most, it probably would not feel rushed and had a lot more set up and a lot more satisfaction and hype, and feelings.

reddit.com
u/RealisticDebt9380 — 4 months ago

[LotM general] LotM is amazing, but it could have been so much beter

So, this is probably gonna be a very long post. I've finished LotM some time ago, and I've really loved it. I enjoyed it immensely all the way through, it was great. But recently I decided to reread my favourite series, Wheel of Time , this time listening to it as an audiobook. And it helped me formulate in my mind what problems LotM for me had. And it's that LotM is essentially a great first draft, with some unique conditions that also limit it story.

​

So, first I want to talk about WoT(Wheel of Time) a bit. It's not a perfect series, it drags a lot in certain parts, but overall it has an incredible world building, great cast of characters, outstanding character development, a lot of PEAK moments and a great ending(despite it being finished by another author). You could say many of these things(not all though) about LotM, but it's how they are handled showcases the limitations of LotM.

​

So, what are my problems with LotM? The system of it being released chapter by chapter forces it into an incredibly awkward cycle where you have to keep your reader's engagement from chapter to chapter, whereas in full books you can have down moments, provided that you hit on a key moments to make those "dull" moments worth it. As much as WoT gets flak for slog, and truthfully sometimes Robert Jordan did wonder around a bit too much, but also it's those moments where seemingly nothing happens that set up future pay offs that just hit me so hard during both first time reading and a re-read.

​

First and foremost, having a completed and thought out draft that you can then analyze, edit, remake certain parts can help you clean up a lot of what happens in the story. LotM pacing is great, but if it was released by volumes, Cuttlefish could have easily spend more time intertwining arcs, characters, removing extra fluff for the finale. You could maybe put in a little bit of povs from other perspectives, set up various factions better or sometimes create a better plot twist. For example, volume 3 has a great finale, but you could throw in a lot of snippets of Mother Tree of Desire cultists throughout the volume, to showcase their abilities, influence, their derangement and danger, slowly building up to Klein's confrontation with them. Perhaps you could focus more on the artificer and their ties with MToD cult, develop a character and showcase a villain. There are a lot of possibilities to have once you've already outlined what and how happens.

​

Second, is character writing and development. I actually think that Volume 1, while slow, has the best character building and development, because it allows itself to breath more. It allows Klein and others to live day to day life. And a lot of the times character shines in these moments more than high stakes life or death situations. When writing a whole book, you have a luxury to actually write and think about the character's arcs, and not just how to fit them into the story. I think it's very easy to fix the problem of many Tarot Club members being flat and unimportant compared to others(like Xio) could be solved much more easily in the book format.

​

Also, I think Klein could be a lot better. Klein is great, don't get me wrong, but in my opinion he still has a little bit of what I call "Solo Levelingness" in him. What I mean by that is that outside of his loneliness, which is almost never the forefront of his arc, all of his struggles are external. Monsters, enemies, other humans? External. Corruption? While it's inside of him, it's still an external conflict. QiDian release style can't allow him to mess up without it being immediate or very high stakes, like for example Amon kidnapping. You can't allow the arc of Klein consistently struggling with something internal without it paying off immediately, cause, once again, it can slow down the hype. Or can make the readers uncomfortable. And when you have to wait weeks, months maybe a year for a resolution of that said internal conflict, it can put off people adapted to high pace constantly keeping moving storytelling. In the book format you can plan this whole thing in a compact personal story arc connected to the main plot, that can then enhance the resolution of what you've been building for both character and plot wise.

​

Lastly, while LotM has a great world building, it's still messy, and while it's very deep, it could be wider actually. For such a deep, well thought out lore with complex history, Eldritch horror entities, strong artifacts that influence everything around them, the countries themselves can of the be classified as an adaptation of real world places/cultures. You can put a lot of depth, mystery and shock in the webnovel style story, but you can't focus on a small details of a concrete nation, island, geographical place without dragging the chapter , end it feeling like nothing happens. WoT has done it masterfully alot, when I'm the slow moments you can feel the culture, identity of a certain group, nation or organisation. A lot of the times it was interesting to read it on it's own, even if you didn't feel the plot progressing much. Which allows for much more unique and interesting setting, instead of a bunch of fantasy England, France, Russia, Africa, etc. It would be so cool to see these places evolve to their own cultures, and how they interact with each other. What can our characters learn from them.

​

So, in the end I think Cuttlefish could have a much clearer view of how to get all the chess pieces to where he wanted for the finale of every volume, and the story overall, greatly enhance the quality of the characters and character arcs, and sprinkle a lot of interesting world building to elevate it all to the next level. I think Volume 8 would improve the most, it probably would not feel rushed and had a lot more set up and a lot more satisfaction and hype, and feelings.

reddit.com
u/RealisticDebt9380 — 4 months ago