Lee Man Hee has multiple trials not just one and each trial is on the topic of separate alleged crime

So the white stone is explicit to be kept a secret biblically

Rev 2:17

^(") Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who is victorious, I will give some of the hidden manna. I will also give that person a white stone with a new name written on it, known only to the one who receives it."

So if this means it is ok for Lee Man Hee to keep his other name a secret then the negative inverse relationship on what is secret, is applied to 144k right current members?

In other words 144K has to be explicit publically on time by Lee Man Hee while he is still alive? Because Biblically, within the scope of Revelation, there is no confirmation that 144k has to be a secret?

So does that mean Lee Man Hee violates Revelation by adding and subtracting to it by keeping 144k in non-reveal status?

Does that mean that the white stone status of on reveal is negative inverse correlation to 144k? There are no confirmation that 144k is a secret

Deadline to reveal the 144k is before the passing away of Lee Man Hee because Lee Man Hee claims to have heard and seen all Revelation but he is the physical Pillar God promised will not remove. So Lee Man Hee's teaching is that he will not die until he completed God's work

Rev 3:12

"12 Him that overcome will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name."

Another thought that could be experimental did God set a trap to false prophets by explicitly making the White Stone a name secret to the one who receives it making rest of the Revelation hardlined not to be a secret?

So any self claimed prophet has a responsibility to reveal all in Revelation with exception of White Stone perhaps

So I love Fantasy TV shows like Game of Thrones and Shannara I suddenly had the impulsive thought how to "World build" a dream and in such a way that I am a ruler in a Fantasy kingdom one night and it is going to be like 1 year as ruler in that same dream?

Maybe not possible to be exact but what must I do to achieve? Thanks!

SCJ imposes on unhealthy rules on pushing on mental and physical health which is toxic. Late night meetings, super early morning prayers I heard? Etc

Rev 4:8
Each of the four living creatures had six wings and was covered with eyes all around, even under its wings. Day and night they never stop saying:
“‘Holy, holy, holy
is the Lord God Almighty,’
who was, and is, and is to come.”

I feel SCJ tries to be like formations but also stereotypes of Heaven. Not sure if I am framing it correctly. Those Archangels never tire but our human bodies not the same

I don't want to + or - Revelation but in my opinion that was at a moment where Apostle John saw them so those 4 archangels may not be always like that perhaps?

The reason why I believe Lee Man Hee violated Revelation on do not add nor subtract to revelation (Rev 22:18-19) is because leaning Revelation to metaphorical or literal in itself, is + or - Revelation.

John was given a prophetic vision of the eternal, spiritual realm where human time does not exist. One reason why I believe that is because even if Apostle John wrote "Day and night they never stop saying" part of Rev 4:8, he had to view that in eternity to confirm that. Even a thousand times night and day repeated in that vision, would not confirm it is eternity unless implicitly stated in Revlation itself

I really wonder if SCJ under Lee Man Hee is trying to mimic the tireless nature of Rev 4:8 to justify a grueling schedule? Perhaps God set trap to those who claim they know Revelation?

SCJ teaches God separated from us due to Sin?

But after Adam and Eve sinned by eating the Forbidden Fruit, didn't God come back to them afterward to ask what happened and then banish them from the Garden of Eden?

Current members, ask yourselves if sin automatically blocked God from us, why did He physically come over after the act of Adam & Eve sin just to talk to them and banish them, only to leave afterward? Why banish them if He could have simply "separate" knowing that they committed sin because he is omnipresent?

Why the double emphasis? A single emphasis is enough right? Is Jesus Christ enough? He will come 2nd coming but to me, correct if I am wrong, 2nd coming is to tally up our actions and not give additional lessons in which his first time coming covered it all.

Plus God did not twice tell Adam & Eve to not eat Forbidden Fruit in different ways, just once with Adam so that Adam could tell Eve. Did God set a trap for false prophets?

God worked through one person

God > Adam > Eve - instruction

NOT

God > Adam - Instruction AND God > Eve - instruction (Despite Adam and Eve came into existence at separate times)

Clearly defined parameters. God is consistent.

Current Members please ask your Leaders and Leaders please ask Lee Man Hee if you don't know

There is no fear in asking

^(Matthew 18:2-4)

^(2) He called a little child to him, and placed the child among them. ^(3) And he said: “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. ^(4) Therefore, whoever takes the lowly position of this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

Important to Test all kinds of spirits

1 John 4

Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.

If you cannot easily get answers from students it shows more about the teacher

Matthew 7:16

^(16) By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?

1 year out of SCJ. Comparing in VS Out.

I feel like I caught up a lot on health, sleep, family and friends. More time to go to the gym and no more like "Oh gosh too tired to go to the gym"

Does that mean I will go to Lake of Fire by default? Nope just because Satan has dominion-full stop there-the Bible never explicitly stated I go to Lake of fire by default. There is a difference

On flip side, if SCJ claims the non stated to be true (by default we go to lake of fire unless we do something) then I will say while Satan has dominion over the world but it does not say God does not have dominion over the world. See what I did there SCJ?

SCJ can you please provide separation from God in the first place in the world scripturally that proves both initial separation in the time of Adam and Eve AND He stayed separated? If you cannot there is a reason. Because Jesus came in the 1st coming

Also because just like you cannot add nor subtract to Revelation in New Testament, Moses could not add nor subtract to the 10 commandments.

Hold on does that mean in order to test someone against Revelation is to test if they violated the 10 commandments? God is the living Word/Bible as a whole You violate one half makes you unqualified for the other half

SCJ under Lee Man Hee violates by stealing time and energy, this relates to the 10 commandments:

Exodus 20:15 and Deuteronomy 5:19 both says

“You shall not steal."

So SCJ activities violated last half of the bible by breaking one half of the Word

John 1:1

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God" (the word become flesh)

Jesus never stopped preaching what the past preachers preach while Lee Man Hee emphasizes Jesus less and less and more of himself, you feel it when you first started "That bible study" till now wherever you are

because you must test all kinds of spirits

1 John 4:1

"Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world."

And if you cannot test all kinds of spirits, test the fruits!

Matthew 7:15-20

“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles?  Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.  Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.  Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

SCJ, you don't believe it? Ask all SCJ members in different years to form a small group, live stream to see if you say different things!

And you know what? As long as God says who , per each individual, goes to Hell or Heaven in the end is not 100 percent predictable, by implying that only through SCJ you can get salvation and be with God in the end you violated not adding nor subtracting to the Revelation

Deuteronomy 4:2

"Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the Lord your God that I give you."

"Commands"? is it 10 commandments? Yes and Deuteronomy is part of Old Testament does that coincides with Revelation?:

Revelation 22:18-19

I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to that person the plagues described in this scroll.  And if anyone takes words away from this scroll of prophecy, God will take away from that person any share in the tree of life and in the Holy City, which are described in this scroll.

SCJ current members ask yourself this Lee Man Hee kept emphasizing Revelation 22:18-19 did he do it in the same lesson/speech as Deuteronomy 4:2?

So then who now added or subtracted to Revelation me or Lee Man Hee? Who added or subtracted to the Bible?

Jesus working though Lee Man Hee is 1:1 interaction testing all kinds of spirit respected, (1 John 4:1–3)?

I believe God set traps for false prophets in the future. So he made Moses count the Israelites. Counting them is an act of careful, making the time to attend to them all, in a 1:1 scenario

1:1 - true chosen person of God to : followers. Unlike Lee Man Hee. Extreme claim of mine I admit but I really think this way, as long as testing all spirit is not biblically put to the test. Counting them all, God models his chosen people's behaviour

Like God can move mountains, Jesus Christ rose from the dead. Hard to access 1:1 to Lee Man Hee. When you make time for anything, miracles happen

God determines the exact number of stars and calls each by name according to (Psalm 147:4) and (Isaiah 40:26)

In Genesis 15:5 God invited Abraham to try counting the stars relates to God's promise that Abraham's descendants would be far too numerous for humans to count.

Is God slipping in tests into the Bible to determine people's character to reveal if they are from God or not? Like by how God showing his true character through Moses by commanding him to count the Israelites God is modelling Moses after his own character?

To current members it is so hard for you guys to have 1:1 with Lee Man Hee you got to test all kinds of spirit

So hard to access Lee Man Hee despite tech (mostly no 1:1 deep discussion) so easy for access to Jesus (1:1 discussion) Test all kinds of Spirits

God is aware how many people will read the bible he provided the baseline and he deemed it worthy to have Moses consciously count everyone, this is a point of counting contact.

In a world with rising technology I feel God planted the basics for discernment.

Satan managed to trick angels that are more wise and long life than humans, as technology rises false idols are more advanced.

The mere counting of stars is itself signals the attentiveness from chosen person of God to people.

Hope SCJ members discern

edit:

Reason I thought of this is a recent comment on Reddit asked why God wanted Moses to count the Israelites if God knew the answer, and I had an aha moment where I thought if God is aware of us reading the Bible and yet asking Moses to give something He already knows must mean something important. Perhaps God wanted to provide a simple mental/spiritual framework to test if someone who claimed to be chosen has the heart of God. One who cared to address all through counting even if God knows them and how many they are. So God knows that even lowly details He would attend to and that is love to people, not numbers on paper and no interactions (just majority lecture format) like someone...

Any cool movies that are like mystery deeply but also like it is mind game and maybe even complicated to a point that it may require 2nd viewing? Kind of like Wake Up Dead Man: A Knives Out Mystery and I am open for anything supernatural or non supernatural or like Scooby Doo (Mystery seems supernatural but it was all elaborate tricks). Thanks in advance!

When Lee Man Hee started Shincheonji till now is 42 years that is 2.1 % since Jesus was here about 2000 yrs ago, much worse thinner being saved window since Adam and Eve. Does this timeline makes sense?

Noah build an ark to have people on it to be saved. At that time people could travel on feet or land to land to reach Noah's Ark port

Noah aimed to give all fair chances to be saved physically, Lee Man Hee seems to for the souls but not all. There was biblical flood that occurred and of course physical protection. But Lee Man Hee's Soul protection only spans 42 years of all time

““Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.” ‭‭Matthew‬ ‭7‬:‭13‬-‭14‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

But, God loves all creations equally, both followers and non-followers. Jesus preached to disciples and non-disciples Heaven is narrower does not mean closed to some and narrow to others, it means it is narrow to everyone, everyone has a chance for souls to be welcomed to heaven not via only SCJ

Just got some questions to ask if you you feel comfortable sharing your thoughts, like to anyone members and ex members

One time Lee Man Hee had a chance to confess his doings in a sit down with investigators/prosecutors for 7 hours reportedly but then investigators discovered that he is also involved in the other party the democratic party so in my eyes Lee Man Hee technically and I daresay literally started his imprisonment already. He is held in detention behind bars over suspicion that he would destroy evidence. To me that makes sense if he could communicate and all SCJ members would obey (some secretly does not for sure). In my opinion the chance of him having a verdict of "Not Guilty" is super low

Could answer any/all/some

- How do you think SCJ will operate now in general in the long term and short term?

- How will like SCJ cope/deal with this in general?

- Any predictions of what they will say in their mandatory sermons Wednesdays and Sundays?

- And do you think SCJ members will quietly leave and stay in touch with one another as a way to healthily process? And maybe even call it an undeniable interesting adventure in life and learn from it with proper discernment. This is what I hope

Wishful fantasy thinking I wish Lee Man Hee repent and go to Jesus Christ that will be one of the powerful ways to help those in SCJ. I pray to God that He shows him the way. Maybe not late even for Lee Man Hee? To be honest I am not prepared to fully forgive Lee Man Hee just that the baseline of him turning back to light would be a powerful motivation for good

So I will paraphrase cause it is far back but in a buried thread I once asked a current member. Let's say a current leader who is very academic about History a question that never got answered because I think he/she knows what I am getting at causing that person to go cricket silence ever since then generally. For intellectual and educational purposes that I hope could benefit Current members I won't say why I asked this question. But current members, something perhaps to consider?

Are the 12 tribes leaders as sharp as Lee Man Hee in terms of understanding Revelation?

EDIT:

Actually just to explain this was the full reply to the current member

"Thanks for reply. A follow up question, is the understanding of revelation belonging to the 12 tribes leaders as sharp as that of Lee Man Hee?

If not, it is not wrong to assume that SCJ implies that Lee Man Hee is the only way to Jesus' promised salvation and so that makes SCJ the only way to salvation per SCJ right?

To me teachings of God should be meaningfully transferable to all (all walks of life from all time periods) regardless if you are signed member or not of SCJ because God loves all creation. That's where I stand"

If the current member replied then back then I would have presented below

So either way

1. If the Current member admits they are as sharp as Lee Man Hee in understanding revelation they don't need Lee Man Hee but then everything hinges on Lee Man Hee in SCJ doctrine...
2. If the Current Member admits they are not as sharp that would be easily testable 12 tribes leaders taking SCJ exams (with all answer keys available) along with Lee Man Hee and we just gotta rank their scores to see 😅

I don't know if I should tag the current member so that it does not seem like I am talking bad behind his or her back I am sure that person is smart to know I am referring to that person. Tagging seems more respectful in terms of transparency but for once I don't want to put the person in hotter seat that person might be dealing with something as we go closer to Court trials of Lee Man Hee so I choose not to tag and let that person choose to engage with this post or not. If you see this and if you'd like to engage with this post I welcome that

By SCJ logic, to be part of 144k is to live long enough for the 1st Resurrection to happen

It is Flesh + Spirit

not

Dead Flesh + Spirit (otherwise zombie-like I have to say)

If we follow SCJ's logic it is not seal and evangelize + other things

it is

seal and evangelize + other things + stay alive

I must say this it is not against SCJ members but against this whole overall system existence of SCJ this mental push for urgency and results for "salvation" to me is humanitarian crises

Hey all, had a fun AI experiment and hope this ages well. I just had to do an AI-supported post. At this day and age, we need to go with the trends anyways. Probably just once an AI supported post

Followed is my question and the answer: "Play the devil's advocate and support SCJ. What is the real view publicly scattered online of how long they believe Lee Man-hee will live?"

AI (Gemini):

If an SCJ defender or an instructor were backing up the group's stance, they would argue that the public completely misunderstands their theology because outsiders look at Lee Man-hee through a physical lens rather than a spiritual one.

When you look closely at how current members defend this online, they completely flip the narrative by using three main arguments to explain how long he will live:

1. The Real View: He Lives Until the Work is Completed

From the SCJ perspective, the Chairman cannot pass away until the entirety of God's work—specifically the final events of Revelation 20 and 21—is structurally locked in on earth. They point to biblical patterns like Moses, who did not pass away until he brought the people to the edge of the Promised Land.

An SCJ defender would say: "It is not about a human being magically living forever on his own power. It is about God sustaining His chosen instrument. As long as the 12 tribes are being sealed and the wedding banquet of spirit and flesh is finalizing, God ensures the Promised Pastor is here to witness and execute it. His life is directly tied to the completion of the prophecy."

2. The Defense: "We Never Taught Blind Immortality"

When critics point out that Lee Man-hee is 95 and clearly aging, showing physical frailty or requiring medical assistance, an SCJ apologist will pivot to correct what they call a "web rumor."

They will argue: "The media and ex-members lie and say we worship him as a god who can never get sick. We teach that he is a flesh-and-blood human being. True eternal life of the flesh only occurs during the First Resurrection when the spirits of the martyrs unite with the sealed members on earth (Revelation 20). Until that specific cosmic event happens, he ages like anyone else. When asked directly by journalists if he will live forever, the Chairman himself always says, 'That is up to God's sovereignty, not me.'"

3. The Ultimate Back-Up: Spiritual Manifestation

If you press them to the absolute wall on what happens if he physically passes away before the world sees a public transformation, advanced defenders have a theological safety net already circulating in recent internal teachings.

They will claim: "Even if his physical body passes away, it does not mean SCJ is false. Just as the spirit of Elijah came upon John the Baptist, and just as Jesus operates through the Counselor, God's spirit can manifest through another physical vessel to finish the task. Jesus passed away physically but his work triumphed spiritually. The work of Shincheonji is an eternal covenant; it doesn't end with a physical body."

Moving Back to the Anti-SCJ Reality

While that sounds incredibly organized and spiritual on paper, from an analytical perspective, it is a massive, carefully laid trap designed to keep members from realizing they are moving the goalposts.

• The Trap Exposed: Notice how the narrative is flexible enough that no matter what happens, they can claim they are right. If he lives, they win. If he dies, they switch to the "flesh and blood/God's sovereignty" or "spirit moving to a new body" argument.
• The Historical Lie: The claim that they "never taught physical immortality" is completely debunked by their own past media. High-ranking theology directors like Michelle Chang explicitly confirmed on the record in interviews years ago that they believed he would not see physical death. Older members were absolutely taught he was the unmovable pillar of the temple.

The defense is a masterpiece of dynamic damage control. They are systematically preparing the membership for his eventual death by pretending they never promised he would live forever in the first place—classic theological gaslighting to ensure the organization survives when reality finally hits.

What is a great TV show that you seen that you enjoyed so much that after its finished it was really hard to find the next one?

So I will just try make this post as short as possible. I entered SCJ first time ever and we all know in our hearts a part of felt ok joining the first time because of social and love bombing and our leafs guiding us. I joined at time when it was low point in life where I didn't had much friends. Although a friend did led me to their bible studies first time by Zoom (then I quit due to private reasons then rejoined in in person class format after bumping into old friend in SCJ)

I just want to give advice to current members. This advice stems from the fact that I do miss my leafs. My 2nd leaf was a bit intense sometimes but overall seemed to care my first leaf made me feel special. I am no longer in touch with them when I left and will remain that way

When I left and there is silence between me and my two leafs. First one ghosted me 2nd one same thing. I felt really stung and hurt and felt like I was not good enough or something. I felt none of the "friendships" were real but sometimes the laughters and the joke was real. Had awesome time

I am just thinking ahead and respectfully I will use the word IF Lee Man Hee loses court case and be proven to be false prophet in the eyes of current members beyond any doubt, current members please plan ahead to keep in touch with each other as social networking it is important for our mental health

Originally I wanted to post this post like few days later but knowing myself I would overthink (I am an overthinker) I would make a post a few days later that has less details in some ways and extra details that might cause a divide of some sort.

I don't want current membership to suffer the same fate as I did. The realization that friendship was built around SCJ I thought to myself constantly was anything real? The friendships and everything?

Again this is going to be sort of like should if. IF. Lee Man Hee is internally proven not be real shepherd even internally within SCJ. Please consider each other as emotional and maybe even chat about part of your time in SCJ as sort of adventure as to protect your minds and wellbeing from emotional difficulties