u/florian-sdr
r/VintageLenses r/pentax r/trichromes r/analog_bw r/SprocketShots r/LondonPics r/Darkroom r/AnalogCommunity r/Nikon r/analog r/pentax67 r/AnalogCircleJerk r/mediumformat
▲ 18 r/AnalogCommunity
RGB Narrowband light follow-up. The double down? The utter confusion? NegPy is best
To follow up on my yesterday's post, I found the reason why my results for scanning 350 frames where so poor initially. Because Capture One automatic inversion handles the inversion for RGB Narrowband light sources very poorly when you "expose to the right" of the histogram, and a +0EV matrix metered scan comes out best. (This problem does not occur for scanned files based on a white light source!).
However, I went down the rabbit hole to compare which inversion methods would yield the best results, with the tools that I have. The caveat: I am not chasing excellence (probably a pixel-shift scan of three individual trichromatic RGB Narrowband light, composite back to a single image inversion in Photoshop, or with Analogue Toolbox). But I need something that works in practice for hundreds of images in a session. A minute per frame.
Taking these constraints, I tested my v3 JackW's RGB Scanlight against the CS-Lite from Cinestill, shot at +0 EV, + 0.7 EV, + 1.7 EV (matrix metered on the Fujifilm X-T5), inverted using:
- Capture One - my own manual inversion workflow
- Capture One - automatic inversion workflow
- Analogue Toolbox (for the trichromes)
- NLP (CS-Lite only, it doesn't work well with RGB Narrowband light)
- NegPy
What I consistently find with RGB Narrowband light, is a strong cyan cast in the cooler colours, and sky and water leaning strong cyan, blues are too bright, and a magenta/pink cast across most of the other colours, with also warmer hues being too bright and too saturated. Rooftops become bright pink instead of orange, red flags become dark pink, skin tones are too magenta.
Overall, I would rank the results when it comes to neutral colours and no choppy colour transitions (NLP!), and no overall colour casts the following – for this example image, for my copy of the Scanlight, for my camera, for Kodak Colorplus:
- NegPy – CS-Lite white light
- Capture One – CS-Lite white light + manual inversion
- NLP – CS-Lite white light
- Analogue Toolbox trichromatic inversion with Narrowband RGB light
- Capture One – RGB Narrowband light + manual inversion
- Capture One – white light + automatic inversion
The third image of the post has a brief comparison between some methods, you can see from the file title of the screenshots what has been used.
If you want to knock yourself out to compare the same raw files, I uploaded it all to a Google Drive:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1P0-GKWcztux61nxiRs1as0F2WJC_hgSI?usp=sharing
Happy to hear your thoughts on this, but I am at this point a bit disappointed by the RGB Narrowband light rabbit hole.
u/florian-sdr — 8 days ago
▲ 15 r/AnalogCommunity
I might back-track on Narrowband RGB scanning...
I have been a bit of a vocal proponent of using RGB Narrowband light for camera scanning over the last half a year. I might change my mind on it.
Had a bit of a frustrating day, scanning film rolls from the last months, couldn't figure out what the problem was with my results.
I have not done extensive testing yet, but I wanted to raise this point, to see if others made similar observations over time.
Overall I was frustrated by magenta and teal casts that weren't resolving, and whites that were not turning white, and full-image colour washes.
Then I went back to the drawing board and thought, "why not test my old light"?
I had pretty bad conversions today, crunchy colours, etc... but for a simple comparison I wanted to chose a more neutral photo.
This is the RGB Narrowband light scanned photo, converted in Capture One, using my own manual conversion method.
It has a overall teal leaning blues and a red tint in all other colours.
Further editing – HSL sliders – red and orange saturation reduced, yellow shifted a bit towards green, cyan towards blue all the way, blue shifted strong towards purple. Removing some contrast. Okay, this starts to become useable, but it still looks a bit off, doesn't it? It was also quite some work getting there, adjusting HSL individually. There is still a weird cast in the sky on the left and right 1/3 of the image.
Then the photo with the High CRI white light (Valoi Easy 35) (Which uses an Ulanzi light source). Just the basic conversion using my own manual workflow in Capture One is pretty good. It is a bit dull still, and the blues have a bit of a purple cast.
After some slight adjustments of the blue HSL slider, some overall contrast and saturation, I am quite happy:
I a bit torn. I feel the Narrowband RGB method has potential, but out of the box, the red/magenta and cyan cast and saturation issues are quite strong.
One probably could dial in the workflow better, but at this point I feel the white light is actually easier?
One last thought: I know that somebody will be asking about shooting three RGB trichrome images, for example using Photoshop or using Analogue Toolboox. And to preempt this question, and to satisfy my own curiosity, I am adding this too.
This is probably the most neutral image. It was quite hazy on that day.
After seeing how neutral this image is, I am also reducing the saturation and contrast in my CRI white light scanned negative a bit, to match it better:
This is now overall the most satisfying conversion out of the bunch.
Okay, but what about NegPy 0.29?
High CRI white light - very satisfying
Narrowband RGB light:
Okay, but these are all decent, what is the drama in the beginning?
Well, my usually quite good out of the box Capture One scans inversions came out like this. Scanned on the RGB Narrowband light, and then converted with the Capture One native workflow, not my own manual workflow.
u/florian-sdr — 8 days ago
▲ 9 r/analog
Seven Sisters Cliffs [Minolta Autocord | Plus X & T-Max 100]
Both film stocks were 20y expired
u/florian-sdr — 9 days ago
▲ 292 r/AnalogCircleJerk
Gotta shoot the prime minister’s resignation on a 16mm Bolex - for the vibes!
Complete with a black beanie
u/florian-sdr — 11 days ago
▲ 9 r/pentax
Vintage lens prices seem to have increased for Pentax, even for the usually more affordable ones? E.g. M 28 and 35 f/2.8
Do you see the same or is this just a UK thing?
Definitely a doubling in price compared to a year ago.
u/florian-sdr — 12 days ago
▲ 212 r/AnalogCommunity
If you could resurrect three extinct film stocks, which ones would you picks?
u/florian-sdr — 12 days ago
▲ 62 r/AnalogCircleJerk
Some days I just want Grainydays to review my favourite camera 🥺
Who else is searching YT for reviews of your favourite camera, just to see other people enjoy it as well?
u/florian-sdr — 16 days ago
▲ 76 r/AnalogCommunity
End game capabilities
The Zeiss Macro Planar 50mm f/2 probably doesn’t need any introduction. Perfected for flat field, and sharpen even wide open, it is a brilliant walk around lens for everything but a meagre physical statue of the photographer – granted an attribute I do not fulfil.
The Nikon FA has a reputation of being fragile. I’m of the opinion that the ones that were bound to fail probably already failed and that the ones that work hopefully should remain working. But who knows I’m not an expert. It is my fourth FA, as I sold a fine working one stupidly (paranoid due to the fragile electronics myth/issue), and nr.2 and nr.3 were indeed broken. This one seems to work so far! I hope it will last. I also read that the early series of Nikon FA had more issues than the later models, but can’t confirm that, as all four cameras that I had were either from 1984 or 1985.
This one here is from 1985 again.
Looking forward to the photos of today!
Oh, why end game capabilities? Of course the combination of the (first flavour of) matrix metering on the Nikon FA and the Zf Zeiss Macro Planar lens.
Although size wise the lens would better fit on a mainline F camera :) - but the first F with matrix metering is the F4
u/florian-sdr — 22 days ago
Why is nobody talking about the severe focus shift of the Nikkor Ai-s 50mm F/1.4 at portrait / close-up distances?
This lens must be the worst optimised vintage 50mm f/1.4 lens for the types of spherical aberrations that lead to focus shift.
At a distance between close up and approx 1m the focus shift happens. So exactly the distances where a full face (0.66m) or a head and shoulder (0.9) portrait would fall.
Apertures slower than f/2 are all focus shifted behind the viewfinder indicated focus point. At f/2.8 the focusing point is just barely at the very front of the actual focal range. F/4 the point you actually focused on is significantly out of focus and the entire focus range is centimetres behind what you actually focused on. This does not improve. F/5.6 and f/8 are the same. At f/8 the original focusing point is slowly starting to creep back into the focusing area, but it doesn’t do so until you are using f/11
Takeaway: if you are using this lens for portraits, use it between f/1.4 and f/2.5 or from f/11 onwards. Or stop down the depth of field preview to focus.
The focusing shift seems to disappear somewhere around 1.2 meter subject distance.
I have compared a good dozen+ of vintage 50mm lenses for the K, M42, and F mount, and this is the only lens that showed this extreme behaviour at this focusing distance.
The Ai-s 50mm f/1.8 lens is so much better, as is the Pentax 50mm f/1.4 lens.
I am honestly surprised that nobody mentions this massive caveat for a very common use case at a lens that is so often recommended, and hailed as the 1970s grail for a fast 50mm lens.
In my experience it doesn’t hold up.
I tested three copies including the late SIC production copy, they all behave the same way.
u/florian-sdr — 1 month ago
▲ 75 r/AnalogCircleJerk
Why don’t they come with washing instruction labels? Looks like I shrunk my camera.
u/florian-sdr — 1 month ago
▲ 32 r/AnalogCommunity
What are shooting with this weekend?
Sometimes you have to use what is fun, not what is reasonable. B&W on a sunny side hike, with beautiful colours around you?
Why not?
I am shooting a few tools that are more experimental, some that I have not tried before, some expired.
Sometimes it’s more about the journey than the results, isn’t it?
u/florian-sdr — 1 month ago
▲ 6 r/pentax
“Aerochrome” Trichrome with the Pentax LX and Rollei Infrared
K 28mm f/3.5 lens
Hoya R72 filter
Tiffen 25 Red and 58 Green filter
u/florian-sdr — 1 month ago
No idea why this untested(*) LX hasn’t sold on EBay at this price for 15 months
(*) they do say that the shutter is sluggish, the bane of this model, needs a service.
I finally want to see some kind of giga chad pulling off a pimped up camera IRL.
u/florian-sdr — 1 month ago
▲ 50 r/trichromes
Take a stab at false colour infrared “aerochrome” trichrome
Not fully satisfied with the result, but I guess it isn’t bad for a first attempt.
u/florian-sdr — 1 month ago