r/AnimeDiscussion

I found the show about a year ago and ive watched it like five times over already. The vibes are simply unmatched and I can't get enough. Anyone feel the same way?

I just want to come in here and say I am not really trying to critique it or anything like that.

So I have watched a bunch of stuff from the Nasuverse - mostly Fate, including UBW, Strange Fake, Zero, Heaven's Feel. And I also watched the first three episodes of Garden Of Sinners. And I think I have been exposed enough to the Nasuverse to actually ask this.

So, for every single Nasuverse anime that I have watched, I have felt just this emotional apathy towards it. Not because it is bad and has flaws, and not because it is good and has strengths. In fact, I think for me, I just never felt anything from the Nasuverse, whether it was bad writing or good writing. I can't really describe it anything other than emotional apathy, and I really don't know why. I can recognise its flaws and strengths, but I was never really frustrated or thrilled watching any of those weaknesses or strengths on screen. Simply put, I felt nothing watching them. I don't know why, and I don't know how. I can't explain why, even though there are things that are great about the show. I never felt entertained beyond the animation, but I never really felt like I hated it. And I can't say it is quite like eating bland bread, a gourmet meal, and not a bad meal either. I can't really explain it but I haven't felt much from it and I can't explain why. And it isn't an attack on Nasu's writing, and it isn't an attack on the writers of Zero and Strange Fake (on the contrary, the person who made Strange Fake made Durarara, one of my most favourite shows).

My question is more asking if anyone else has that unexplainable apathy towards the show where there was nothing bad, but felt perhaps sterile even though there really isn't any problem with the it? Like, this feeling that I have for it, or lack thereof, to me feels like an experience that I am sure other people have, and it isn't just a case of it not being for me specifically (although it clearly isn't for me to be fair, but I'd argue I have a pretty diverse taste of anime).

Again, I'm not trying to critique anything if you're a fan, and I'm not trying to hate if you hate Nasuverse, but I'd appreciate it if there was anyone else that can relate to what I'm trying to describe.

Thanks.

We need to admit it: Naruto has aged poorly, and Kishimoto's script is an "Innocent Chaos" of wasted potential.

I know I'll attract a lot of hate, but after years of reflecting on and reviewing the work, it's impossible to ignore the truth: Naruto is an anime with a problematic, inconsistent, and, in many aspects, bad script.

I don't hate the work, but I admit that it's the biggest example of "potential thrown in the trash" in the history of Shonen. Kishimoto created an incredible world, on the level of Harry Potter or Avatar, but proved that he didn't know what to do with it. Here are the points that nobody wants to accept:

1. The Lie of "Effort vs. Talent":

The anime begins with Naruto's fight against Neji, preaching that destiny doesn't exist and that a failure can beat a genius. Lie. In Shippuden, we discover that Naruto is the son of the Fourth Hokage, heir to infinite chakra (Uzumaki), has the strongest fox, and is the reincarnation of a god. Where is the effort? Rock Lee, who was the true symbol of this message, was thrown in the trash to make way for divine "power-ups."

2. The Toxicity of Team 7:

Team 7 is not a "family," it's a cycle of abuse. Sasuke tries to kill Naruto and Sakura several times, joins terrorists, and in the end, is forgiven with a pat on the back. Sakura, who started Shippuden with enormous potential, was reduced to a character who lives for a man who despised her her entire life. It's terrible female writing. And Kakashi? A negligent sensei who only paid attention to Sasuke while Naruto ate expired ramen.

3. The Alien Mistake (Otsutsuki):

Kishimoto made the mistake that Akira Toriyama avoided. In Dragon Ball, aliens make sense. In Naruto, which was about ninjas, strategy, and folklore, shoving Kaguya in at the end was the laziest decision in history. He destroyed Madara (a legendary and well-developed villain) to introduce an uncharismatic alien just to pave the way for Boruto.

4. The Hypocrisy of the Leaf Village:

Naruto's message of "overcoming" is actually Stockholm syndrome. The village that mistreated him, isolated him, and let him starve (where was the Third Hokage at times like these?) only began to respect him when he became a useful weapon of war. Naruto didn't change the system; he became the greatest defender of the system that oppressed him.

5. The "Zuko Effect" that Sasuke never had:

Comparing Sasuke to Zuko from Avatar shows how weak Kishimoto's script is. Zuko had redemption because he suffered, sacrificed, and changed. Sasuke changes his mind after a beating in the Valley of the End, and everyone forgets he was an international criminal. It's artificial.

6. The Extermination of the Uchiha Clan: The "Whitewashing" of Itachi

This is one of the biggest plot holes. In the Classic series, Itachi was a terrifying and complex villain. In Shippuden, Kishimoto tried to transform him into a "saint" who sacrificed everything for the village.

The Problem: To make Itachi seem good, the script turned the Third Hokage and the Leaf Village leadership into accomplices in the genocide of children and innocents.

The Inconsistency: Naruto, who should be the hero of justice, treats Itachi as a hero. Accepting that "killing one's own family on the orders of the government" is a noble act is an extremely sick and poorly written message.

7. Neji's Death: A Useless Sacrifice

Neji's death in the Ninja War is considered by many to be the lowest point of the script.

Why? Neji died to protect "NaruHina" (the couple Naruto and Hinata). He, who fought against the fate of being a "shield" for the main family, ended up dying exactly like a shield.

The Waste: Such a rich character, who symbolized freedom, was used only as a plot device to bring the main couple closer. It was a total disrespect to the character's arc in the Classic series.

8. The Waste of Other Villages and Nations

Kishimoto created a map with Five Great Ninja Nations, but:

Centralism: 99% of the story takes place in the Leaf Village. The other villages (Sand, Mist, Cloud, Stone) only appear to be saved by Naruto or to serve as a setting for fights.

World Potential: He had a world as rich as that of One Piece or Hunter x Hunter, but preferred to focus only on the family tree of the Uchiha and Senju clans. The world seems "empty" outside of Konoha.

9. The Banalization of Death (Edo Tensei)

The Fourth Shinobi World War lost all its emotional weight because almost no one important on the "good guys" side died, and all the villains from the past were resurrected by Edo Tensei.

The Effect: When you turn death into a revolving door, the viewer stops feeling fear for the characters. Seeing Asuma or Zabuza return only to "talk" and fight a little took away the impact of their original deaths.

10. The "Talk no Jutsu" (Talk no Jutsu)

Although the idea of ​​"breaking the cycle of hatred through dialogue" is beautiful on paper, Kishimoto's execution was lazy.

Example: Villains who killed thousands of people, like Nagato (Pain) or Obito, change their convictions in 5 minutes of conversation with Naruto.

The Criticism: This makes the villains seem to lack real convictions. It seems Naruto has a "hypnotic power" that compels people to agree with him, instead of it being a real ideological debate.

11. The "Luxury Filler" of the Other Clans

Where are the Aburame, Yamanaka, Inuzuka, Nara and the Akimichi?

In Shippuden, if you don't have a Sharingan or a Rinnegan, you don't exist. The importance of the clans was reduced to zero to make way for Kishimoto's obsession with the Uchiha. This turned the anime into "Uchiha Shippuden".

12. The Inconsistent Technology

In the beginning, we had radios and monitors, but they lived like in feudal Japan. In Boruto, out of nowhere, they have video games, skyscrapers, and robotic arms. The technological evolution doesn't make sense temporally with the age of the characters. It's a forced aesthetic change to try to look "modern".

13. The Free Will Farce

The blind forgiveness in *Naruto* is not merely a plot hole; it represents the moral deconstruction of the story itself. When Kishimoto introduces the revelation that Naruto and Sasuke are the reincarnations of Asura and Indra, he strips the characters' choices of their weight. The conflict between them ceases to be a genuine ideological debate and becomes nothing more than the fulfillment of a predetermined cosmic fate.

To ensure the prophecy's "peace" comes to pass and Asura's destiny prevails, the narrative forces an artificial forgiveness. Naruto does not forgive Sasuke because of a genuine process of reparation, remorse, or justice for the victims; he forgives him because the plot requires proof that "Asura's love" has triumphed over "Indra's curse."

This transforms forgiveness—which ought to be a noble and mature act—into a shallow narrative obligation. International terrorists, clan-slaughtering assassins, and genocidal leaders are granted instant absolution or redemption without ever paying for their crimes, thereby invalidating the suffering of the countless villages and innocent people destroyed along the way. Ultimately, the concept of Asura did not foster empathy; it merely validated impunity in the name of a manufactured destiny.

14. The Myth of Utility

The village only comes to love Naruto once he becomes an "indispensable military asset" (upon defeating Pain), rather than through the residents learning an ethical lesson about how to treat a child. The problem with turning Naruto into the "hero of the system" is the bizarre moral message the story ultimately conveys: that victims should serve as shields for their own tormentors. Konoha is a military village founded on oppression, the isolation of minorities, the use of children as human weapons, and acts of state-sanctioned genocide—such as the massacre of the Uchiha Clan. Naruto, who was the primary victim of the abandonment and neglect perpetrated by this military government, never questions the structure itself. He does not seek to reform policy, dismantle the militarized hidden villages, or hold accountable the corrupt leaders who committed atrocities. His solution for "peace" is to become the Head of State (Hokage) and keep that very same machinery running.

The implicit message becomes extremely dangerous: that if you suffer in silence, make no complaints, and prove yourself useful to the oppressive State, it will eventually accept you. Naruto did not break the cycle of pain inherent to shinobi diplomacy; he simply became the guardian of a corrupt, militaristic system that punishes dissent and condones bureaucratic genocide in the name of "village stability."

My conclusion:

The Naruto fandom is one of the most toxic because it refuses to see these plot holes. Kishimoto is a brilliant illustrator and a creator of awesome concepts, but as a screenwriter, he got lost in his own greed to stretch the story. Nowadays, I much prefer reading AUs (alternate universes) made by fans that truly value secondary characters than the original material.

The final "villain" of Naruto wasn't Kaguya, it was Kishimoto's pen.

What do you think? Did he really get lost, or am I being "too harsh"?

I can't be the only one who feels like a lot of recent anime adaptations, like Skeleton Knight in Another World, In Another World With My Smartphone, Kuma Kuma Kuma Bear, and plenty of others, have become watered-down, dumbed-down or overly sanitised versions of the stories they're adapting.

Now, I'm not talking about things they have changed to avoid depicting inappropriate content. A lot of these authors even write those parts in ways where, if they were faithfully adapted, there still wouldn't really be an issue. I'm talking about cutting out key elements of the stories, things that might not seem important at the time, but can become very important several books later.

And I don't just mean that they cut scenes because they only have 12 episodes to work with. Sometimes they remove or change things that are actually important to the characters, their relationships or the worldbuilding, which then makes later interactions feel strange or incomplete.

One of the biggest examples for me is when the original story has an established polyamorous relationship, but the anime changes it into something monogamous or deliberately vague.

The problem isn't just the relationship itself being changed. The later character interactions were written around the original relationship. The anime then has to awkwardly work around something it deliberately removed, so the characters either continue behaving like they did in the books, which now makes some interactions feel strangely intimate or gives them this weird air, or their behaviour gets rewritten and comes across as forced or out of character.

It sometimes feels like adaptations are afraid of anything that makes the original story slightly complicated, an openly healthy but unconventional relationship, intelligent or thoughtful concepts, morally messy situations, powerful and strong female characters, characters having to genuinely struggle against prejudice, having to work through their traumas, or worldbuilding that actually takes time to explain.

These are often some of the things that made the original stories interesting and popular enough to justify getting an anime adaptation in the first place.

Instead, they change or remove them, seemingly without thinking about what happens later because they are only planning around the first season. Then, if the anime gets a second or third season, they are suddenly left trying to make later parts of the story work when they already removed the foundations those parts were built on.

The same thing happens with other parts of these stories.

A young female adventurer might originally have to prove herself, or even fight people at nearly every guild she visits because nobody takes her seriously, but the anime removes most of those encounters. It might seem like an easy thing to cut at first, but those experiences can be part of how the character develops and why she acts the way she does later.

An example of this is in Kuma Kuma Kuma Bear, where the lack of a fight actually throws the main character off balance and helps highlight that there is something wrong with the town. If you remove all the previous times she had to deal with fights at guilds, that moment loses some of what made it stand out.

Or a character might run through town riding giant bears, again like in Kuma Kuma Kuma Bear, terrifying everyone while desperately trying to rescue a friend, but the adaptation cuts down or completely removes a lot of the buildup and consequences. Then later dialogue or reactions are still there, except now they don't hit nearly as hard because the events that gave those moments weight are missing.

That's one of my problems with Kuma Kuma Kuma Bear. Some lines, actions and emotional moments feel oddly placed in the anime because a lot of the long preparation that made those moments land in the books just isn't there.

It feels like they're simplifying these stories to make them easier or safer for what they think a wider audience wants, but in doing so they're stripping away the things that made people fans of the source material in the first place.

And it can create an even bigger problem later.

Eventually these anime reach a point where something that was cut or changed becomes important to the plot. At that point, what do they do? Retcon it back in? Pretend it happened off-screen? Completely change the story? Or just never do another season?

Now, true, this can be how you end up with a story eventually having to pull a Fullmetal Alchemist and diverge heavily from the source material because the adaptation has written itself into a corner.

And yes, something like that can work, but only if they fully embrace it and actually put the effort into creating a good alternative story. Fullmetal Alchemist still had depth, real moral dilemmas and a story that could stand on its own. It also wasn't really a case of them changing things because they wanted to simplify the source material or dumb it down.

I've almost given up on Skeleton Knight in Another World after Season 2, episode 7 because of their changes to the storyline. The way they changed how the water works, and people who know will understand what I mean, has removed what I think is a really important aspect of Arc's development, as well as some of the character development between Arc and the others.

It might not seem huge if you've only watched the anime, but when you know where the story goes, changes like that become much more noticeable.

It makes me miss adaptations like Fairy Tail and Bleach.

Yes, they had a ridiculous amount of filler arcs and filler episodes, I'm definitely not pretending they were perfect, but the main story was still basically the same. The main changes were usually them trying to make the filler fit into the story once they got back to the non-filler material.

The important relationships, character development and major events from the source were still there. When they added filler, they generally tried to make small changes around it so it could fit, rather than cutting pieces out of the original story and then leaving behind scenes that no longer have the context they were written for.

There are a few anime adaptations coming that I'm excited about but also genuinely dreading.

Reborn as a Space Mercenary is the big one for me because I LOVE the books, and I'm worried about how much they're going to cut, change or ignore, especially the seemingly small things that don't look important at first but have consequences much later.

I understand that an anime can't include absolutely everything from a light novel or manga.

My problem is that a lot of these adaptations aren't taking one book and carefully condensing it into a 12 episode season. They're forcing multiple books into a single season, then cutting huge amounts of character development, worldbuilding and connective story out just to make all of that fit.

It's almost like they don't think viewers have the attention span for a long story anymore.

There's a big difference between condensing a story and removing the foundations of the characters, relationships and world, while continuing to build the rest of the story on top of those foundations.

Sorry for the rant, but this has been bothering me for a while and I've just reached the point where I need to know if this is a "me" issue, or if other people have noticed it too and it just doesn't get talked about much.

So, does anyone else feel this way about anime adaptations over the last few years?

Especially people who read the light novels or manga before watching the anime, do you feel like this has been getting worse and worse?

Hey guys! I’ve heard a lot about Kagurabachi and am excited for its premiere in April! As someone who knows nothing about the show I wanted to ask - **what’s your favorite thing about Kagurabachi, and what makes it so good for you?**

I take yoruichi anyday, love her design so much, and shes so hot.

Actually I'm at ep 11th. I have listened abouth it's plot twist and I'm really excited for it. But after watching 11 eps i considered it as mid. I can't say it's peak anime.

For me, It's a 10 like it was PEAK but as most people said the animation was bad but i think I don't agree because an anime is not only based on how good the animation that anime had right? What do you think?

Did they do it gngs!???Im confused like why Hori's shoulder exposed!??? Explain😭😭😭

Witch Hat Atelier
might be worse than fucking human centipede. its episode 10 and coco is out here sick 😒 (shes faking it) instead of TRYING TO SAVE HER MOTHER. shes spent more time cuddling with an earthworm than trying to save her mom. Coco’s poor mother has been an excellent han solo except her ass is never getting unfrozen. When i found out this sorry anime had 99 chapters i almost considered becoming part of a human centipede.

This trash ginger Tartah might go down as more useless than fucking miwa on her broom. He really spent a whole episode trying to figure out what medicine to give Coco just for the doctor to figure it out in thirty seconds. speaking of jjk, they made my boy gojo a pedophile who only takes in girls as apprentices. if gojo saw his counterpart in another multiverse, he’d just stay in that cursed prison 😹.

AND DONT EVEN GET ME STARTED ON THE OTHER THREE APPRENTICES. This woman with the purple hair deadahh tried to kill coco within the third episode of the anime with one of the weakest presses ive ever seen. cus how hard can it be to press ur feet together and fly nah she actually is worse than james harden in the playoffs. And this girl with the blue hair talm bout sum “i hate taking the apprenticeship tests” THEN DONT BE A WITCH BITCH

the hardest watch was when coco looked into the eyes of her friends and told them with full sincerity to bait the dragon with a pink cloud. how on earth did that plan work 🤨. These witches have the strongest fucking plot armor of all time

“where could the casting seal for this dimension possibly be”

MAYBE ITS THE HUMUNGOUS CIRCLE YOU CAN SEE FROM SEVERAL MILES AWAY WITH PATTERNS COMPARABLE TO AQUAMAN’s TATOOS

i got nothing else to say about this garbage. human centipede clears

I finished the entire manga and I feel that Light Yagami / Kira was a weak character and also, childish full of ego with zero emotions. Other than that, L was also similar. However, I think Near and Mello are pathetic actually. The only sorted character I think was Aizawa. Matured and in control throughout. I wonder what others think about this or it's just me?

Spoilers for Season 4 >!I know anime love amnesia plot lines and yes it does make sense. It just bugs me. And I get it we are seeing Subaru go through what he did before and really shows how he has changed and that what he goes through is not as trivial as a show may make it seem. I just get so tired of Amnesia plot lines, so Im starting to check out.!<

Anyone have any words of encouragement for continuing or is this a short stint in the story I only have to wait out an episode or 2?

so i never watched Clannad. but iv seen many clips and how it ends, so it feels iv watched it. its the ending that made me to never watch this unless i want to ugly cry, and cry out loud. to much inpact in this anime, i will be broken if i watch it.

Do you prefer watching anime in Japanese with subtitles, or do you like English or local dubs better? Are there any specific series where you think the dub actually outshines the original audio?

Don't get me wrong I've been watching anime since I was 10 I'm 18 but for one the fam service and sexualization of women is crazy to me not only that but their always minors with big ass chest and can't think for themselves outside of the MC it's just mind boggling to me that people chalk or up to "it's just fictional it's not that deep" if that were the case why do people cry over anime or get excited? Not too mention more times than not there's a grown ass man writing behind the story if I'm being honest it feels as though women aren't even a human being just a sex doll that's there too look good. just a reminder I love anime but man it's getting hard to find ones I like anymore because this stuff just throws me off AND IM A GUY people need to stop defending these sort of things because if anything even close to that was in America it's getting cancelled quickly also keep in mind impressionable kids watch this this is painting a very dangerous narrative for Young children.

Either people voting need to realize that 5/10 shouldn't be your lowest score and 7/10 shouldn't be your average score or Mal needs to just switch to a 1-5 scale instead of a 1-10 scale.

Mal has a total of 15206 ranked anime listings, out of those listings 4900 are above a 7, and around 11000 are above a 5.

If we go based on only listings marked as "tv series" there's a total of 5439 total listings, out of those 2419 are above a 7 and 4690 are a 6.

ONLY 62 are below a 5.

Ive been trying to get into anime, I slowly getting used to understanding its tropes like being very sexual, obsessed with student councils, being overly dramatic, etc

Granted I have not seen much but I get the impression the Dragon Ball style level up to get out of a problem seems very common.

If so why? I would consider that lazy writing. Is there something im missing about style or Japanese culture in relation to anime?