r/kotor

Ignoring the old republic and just focusing on what we know from kotor games/lore.

I’m trying to better understand the actual timeline. So let me run through it and see what yall think, and help me out fill in if I’m missing anything.

1.) the mandalorians decide to conquest

2.) the republic responds.

3.) the Jedi order split. Half saying they will fight with the republic. The other half seeking to wait and see. The fighting half is lead by Revan with Meetra Surik as his second in command.

4.) the fighting Jedi activate the the mass shadow generator on malachor 5. Ending the war, and killing 99.9% of all force users and others there.

5.) the remaining republic and Jedi forces then leave into exile.

6.) the dark triad come to power

7.) the dark triad outcast treya.

8.) treya trains Revan.

9.) that exiled Jedi and republic forces later convert into Sith. Seeking to conquer the galaxy. They return and start a war against the republic

10.) the Sith start winning big time.

11.) a Jedi strike team is sent out to capture/kill Darth Revan.

12.) malak betrays and fires on revans ship. The Jedi capture Revan and mind wipe him.

13.) the Jedi then send him out on the Endar Spire for some reason, in which the first game begins.

14.) the malak bomb the remaining Jedi order on Dantooine. Leaving essentially very very few Jedi left.

15.) fast forward… Revan destroys the star forge. Is light side with Bastila redeemed. The Sith are eliminated and the few remaining go into hiding.

16.) Revan Marries Bastila, they have a child.

17.) Revan disappears into the unknown regions to face a future threat

18.) the remaining Sith fall under the dark triad.

19.) Meetra Surik some how is adrift among a dead crew on the ebon hawk. (Revans ship)

20.) the events of Kotor 2 take place.

21.) Meetra Surik and team kill the dark triad and destroy malachor 5. The remaining Sith forces are all defeated and killed.

22.) She then goes after Revan to find and or help him.

Am I missing anything? Any details that would be good or helpful?

I’m thinking of finally playing the Restored Content Mod (I’ve played vanilla on Switch), and I was about to play it when I heard of the PartySwap mod. I really liked the Handmaiden and I felt it would be a shame to miss out on potential extra content with her just for the sake of learning about who the Disciple is.

I’ve looked up how to download it but I am VERY computer illiterate, lots of big words, it’s why I haven’t played it before and had to settle with vanilla (which is still good, don’t get me wrong).

To my understanding, since I’ve already downloaded the game and the TSLRCM mod off Steam, it’ll be more difficult to add PartySwap? But honestly I’m not even sure of that, is it even worth it at this point?

The confrontation (or lack thereof) with the Jedi Masters in KOTOR II is quite famous for Kreia's takedown of either the Masters or the Exile themself in the event of having killed them throughout the game.

However I always found the dialog in this section a bit clunky a good example of how the game can often fail to really give the player the ability to appropriately explain or defend the thought process behind their actions.

When you kill the Jedi Masters Kreia basically accuses the Exile of just devolving into a bloodthirsty Sith led entirely by revenge or simple sociopathic desire for power for power's sake.

Kreia asks "First - let us return to my question. If by killing these Jedi, if you achieved any measure of peace. "

Your options to respond are fairly limited

"I will not rest until every Jedi lies dead."
It has been satisfying yes, but not all the council who sentenced me are dead.
"No, for Atris still lives."
"Yes, but there are still other opponents - it is not enough to kill Jedi, when the Sith remain."
"Such peace is not possible if the Sith still hunt me. "

The first three are basically confirmations of what Kreia condemns. The Exile thinks of nothing except murder and revenge.

Four has some small measure of ambiguity as to what the Exile's motivation for killing the Jedi and then the Sith are. The fifth option comes to the closest to a somewhat more cerebral answer, as there is still a threat that must be pragmatically dealt with before the Exile can achieve a measure of peace.

Regardless of what you pick, Kreia condemns you and calls you a failure. I find this a little bit odd as it seems her condemnation comes entirely down to your methods which clashes with many established facts, even those from Kreia herself.

There are many pragmatic reasons for the Exile to strike down the Jedi Masters. Kreia gushes constantly about Revan's power and pragmatism but he used the Dark Side and immense cruelty/force in achieving his goals. Not unlike a Dark Side Exile imo. The Jedi Masters took hostile action towards the Exile and were both a hostile force and a major potential threat (both to the Exile personally and to the galaxy at large due to attracting the Sith when they gathered). Not only that, they can be a ideological enemy to an Exile that is taking Kreia's teachings to heart about the failures of the Jedi alongside the Sith. I see very little difference between the Exile killing the Jedi Masters to element a major potential threat and to gather the power taken from their defeat to help them defeat the Sith that are actively hunting them. Ironically enough this view is indeed vindicated by keeping them alive as doing so causes them to attempt to strip the Exile of the force again.

This is made worse by the fact that even in her condemnation Kreia admits that this outcome was not only likely, but probably necessary.
"Regardless... it had to be done. To have such powerful Jedi still live, still be felt in the Force even on such worlds as they had chosen, was a threat that had to be ended."

It's a little frustrating that the game essentially pigeonholes you into being a generic mustache twirling "for teh evulz" Dark Side user for killing the Jedi Masters when there's frankly a lot of room for nuance for why the Exile would do that, many that would seem to align with Kreia's worldview.

EDIT: A worthwhile addendum I think would be good to add after thinking of the issue more and reading some responses

""Because to her, it was never about you, and admitting you've got things figured out removes your reliance on her." (Credit to Ethan_the_Revanchist)

I think this touches upon something I sort of realized thinking about it more and it makes me appreciate this section and the following confrontation with her after more. I think it's a touch too harsh to say that she have "no" truly defined philosophy. It's more that she does have one but she is still all too human with her own biases and flaws. People are often self contradictory when it comes to what they believe and the actions they take. "Do as a I say, not as I do" etc.

Kreia teaches and preaches a selfish pragmatism and severe individualism/autonomy to the Exile. However as her own person with her own agendas teaching the Exile to be their own autonomous person creates friction when the student and the teacher disagree on a topic. In a way it perfectly mirrors the final Student vs Teacher duel. To fully assimilate Kreia's teachings, the Exile must ultimately become capable of choosing contrary to Kreia's will and accepting responsibility for that choice.

However this does end with the inevitable friction that comes with being a mentor who teaches their student to reject strict obedience to the codes of others, even to one's own detriment. Eventually the student will have to overcome the authority of the teacher instead of a strict obedience to their will. Kreia the woman with a grudge towards the Jedi wants to have her big moment where she gets to gloat before them about their failures, but Kreia the mentor warns against simply doing whatever others want one to do.

"Learn from me, my mistakes, and use that knowledge to become greater than I. That is all I ask of you, and that is all I desire. In you all my hopes rest, for the future, for the Force.""

I suppose after this revelation my criticism is more that the player is allowed less fulfilling roleplay options in how they respond to Kreia's questioning that can feel more like the player is being forced into a certain explanation instead of Kreia forcing an explanation that supports her personal bias.

Not a game dev myself but I'm sure of you are. On a whim I went to check out the website to look at the screenshots and teaser, and they've posted some openings today and yesterday it seems. Go check it out if you're a game dev near Edmonton, Alberta CA I suppose!

Would be a dream to work on something star wars for a lot of us I bet!! Good luck if any of you apply

Got the bug that makes him not appear in the fuel line and I do NOT have the patience to deal with replaying everything I just went through. If this is the case any cheats that can force him into the party? nothing like it in the save editor. On telos now

(funny seeing him enter the ebon hawk despite not existing)

Just a heads up! I was struggling getting the final influence with atton to make him a jedi.

If you go with him to the mechanic on Dantooine right when you land, have your saber equipped and the mechanic tries to warn pther about you being a jedi. Choose the option to atrack the mechanic and kill him. Atton will gain influence with you if you do this. It was the literal last thing I could do as I already went past the mind pazak thing.

just finished a light side play through and don’t get me wrong bastila and malak are cool but literally everything before that where they just spam the hallways with waves of dark jedi and sith troopers is really tedious and frankly fucking infuriating

im not seieng a swconfig.exe inside the kotor 2 files so unlike for kotor 1 i cant seem to disable the movies with out editing the ini files for kotor 2

all so side note it crashes if i at al lalt tab out of it.

I'm not sure when this happened on reddit, but I noticed a few subs have a background color now.

I take the sub is green to match the subtitle color from KoTOR2, right?

But shouldn't it also be KoTOR's blue sometimes? Or half the time considering this sub is about both games?

Or is this user defined and I can change?

Anyway, just a semi-random thought, while we wait for the remake... ...

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