u/FairMiddle

So, I‘m pretty sure it was established once that you can only be born with a bloodline ability and never learn one, no matter what. But Mephisto doesn‘t have one because „he is the only one of his bloodline“, so we now know that the first demons of a clan didnt get created with their bloodline ability inate. meaning that either:

1. One of his abilities (maybe the age shift?) may get passed down as a bloodline ability should he reproduce

or

2. Through mutation, something like a bloodline ability eventually manifests in a clan and gets passed down from then on.

What do you guys think about the origin of bloodline abilities?

So we have some points to most ranks so i wanted to ask about additions to this list.

Rank 1 Aleph: Anyone can be an Aleph, almost universally treated bad by everyone else. If there are any adult Alephs is unknown.

Rank 2 Bet: Atleast during your first year at babils, people with this rank will be shown atleast basic respect, you either have to get the rank assigned from the beginning or can raise it with the exams, both practical and theoretical, in written tests, being above average may warrant a promotion to bet.

Rank 3 Gimmel: During school this rank is already considered a high rank, clubs and such will trip over themselves to recruit you, maybe you could even be scouted for the student council if you‘re a gimmel during your first two years. Also reachable by being exceptional well during written exams (seen by allocer getting promoted)

Rank 4 Daleth: The minimum rank needed to graduate Babils, this however doesn‘t mean every adult is atleast daleth, we do not know if students who don‘t achieve Daleth will simply be expelled without graduation or something else. Daleths are also respected when they reach the rank at a young age and first years getting it is really rare.

Rank 5 He: The first rank considered high rank universally (the fancy restaurants only serves He and above and that was described as high rank) also the last rank a babyls teacher can hand out themselves. Really exceptional performance is needed to get promoted to this.

Rank 6 Vav: To reach this rank, a thirteenth crown has to acknowledge that you made a visible contribution to the world. Due to the way the rank-up is handled, it can be concluded that there are few Rank 6 and above, as a thirteenth crown has to be present during the examination that may last weeks if months.

Rank 7 Zayin: The minimum rank to become a teacher at babyls Zayin‘s can use many if not all advanced magics along with whatever they specialize in.

Rank 8 Chet: Even more exceptional to achieve, we don‘t know how the scala scale with the higher ranks but it was alluded that kalego commanded an army during one of his scala examinations. Those of this rank most often occupy very high positions in society.

Rank 9 Tet: Probably the Rank you can find most of the thirteenth crowns in, how you become a Tet is unknown but these people have truly some of the most authority in the netherworld.

Rank 10 Yodth: Essentially only the demon kings or those that have the qualification to become the demon King are at this Rank, its very likely that you only get to this rank when the three greats or even most/all of the thirteenth crowns support your promotion.

I just remembered, their ability lets them reproduce anything they have seen before, so she should be able to produce many eared carrots now, no? Further, its strange the clan lives secluded and seems to not be well known when they have the „No shortages of anything, ever“ ability, limitations were not set, so rare materials, exquisite foods, etc. they should be able to produce all of that en masse.

Do you think that sometimes the thieves (can also be extended to the teams of P3 and P4) try to use their metaverse abilities in real life? Like Ann trying to make a fire to heat up during the winter or using the enhanced physical abilities? Imagine Ruyji trying to do a backflip and eating shit because he misjudged his strength compared to the metaverse.

I mean, every recent release of persona has one, a special move that you utilize in battle thats most of the time stronger than regular skills. P5R had showtime, P3R had theurgy, if P4R has one is unclear still. Do you think there’ll be something like that in P6 or do you think they’ll save it for extra content in the inevitable remake?

The team/group/whatever getting forced to flee/beaten/captured by “sheer number of shadows” while there are maybe, 4 shadows present, which should be an amount thats beatable with ease.

Oh also a character being fatally wounded and those with healing abilities just standing by, atleast have it be outside the place where you can use personas or have them try to heal and fail.

During some regressions, some other world lines interfered so I will try to compile a list of such occurrences and a bit of my own interpretation, feel free to correct me if something is wrong!

0th Turn: The original turn lived by YJH. Knowledge from ways of survival is wrong in this regard as HSY from the 1863rd turn didn’t have that information so she just included some surface level stuff so Dokja reading it won’t question it much. Kim Dokja as the Most ancient dream used a lot of Probability to give YJH information about the future to lead him to the “perfect ending”. As he grew older and frail due to [Life lived to the fullest] YJH became curious to the wall he couldn’t cross and his benefactor who resides there. Not being able to persuade him, Kim Dokja generated the Stigma [Regression] and gave it to Yoo Jungheok, who embarked on his lonely pilgrimage. To preserve the world lines, his memories were fractured so he couldn’t recall the most important information. These memories only returned to YJH shortly before starting the [group regression].

2nd Turn: In this turn, Shin Yosung arrived as the disaster of floods. Being send by the 41th turn, she gave YJH information before ending her own life to end the 5th scenario. If she learns that she is in a turn after the 2nd, she succumbs to her anger and decides to end the turn then and there. What disaster would’ve been there instead of her in the 0th and 1st turn is unknown, aswell as if she will stay the disaster after the 41th, but thats likely.

999th turn: After obtaining the absolute throne, YJH received an offer for an other world pledge, the pledge gives him fortunate opportunities aswell as strengthens him in exchange for damaging his soul. The pledge allowed more companions to survive than usual aswell as allow them to reach the final scenario. He used it once again at the Last scenario, which cost him his life. The Pledge was actually offered by YJH after he became the secretive Plotter and is also the main reason why Kim Dokja destroyed the throne, because he knew of such a pledge that cost the turn right at the end.

1863rd turn: Secretive Plotter sent the avatar of Han Sooyung to the turn to kill YJH, the goal being that if she succeeds, they can use the disconnected film theory to end their own existence. Due to Kim Dokja’s actions, secretive Plotter sends him there aswell. Dokja foiled the plan to kill YJH, the latter regaining his will to fight and obtaining the avatar skill, he split himself in half so one dies and one regresses aswell as give Dokja [hellscape of eternity]. HSY of that turn breached the wall and then traversed to the world before ways of survival published along with the Dokkaebi King. She incarnated into her younger self, only getting control once her conscious self falls asleep. Realizing Dokja will die if the novel isn’t released, she becomes the author of it. Over the time, her Fable crumbles and eventually fuses to the subconscious of her younger self. The Dokkaebi King takes the final chapters aswell as the revisions to publish them themselves or give them to Dokja at the right time during the scenarios, he then becomes the [4th wall] to protect Dokja.

3rd (1864th) turn: The turn we follow, JYH forgot everything beyond the 2nd turn, thus believing he was in his 3rd turn. He actually is the YJH of the 1863rd turn who split himself and regressed. Its likely that its either probability constraints or a fusion of losing half of his memories due to avatar and giving Dokja [hellscape of eternity] that caused the memory loss, as he only regained the memories when that fable is used. Some memories aswell as some talents still remain, causing YJH to grow faster and know more than the 3rd turn should be allowed to.

Is it ever explained how Maple can survive any piercing skill at all? Because its said they ignore defense completely and she only dumps points into vitality, however, hp is a separate stat so she should still be at base hp. Do these skills just do abysmal damage that they might aswell just be called “anti-maple skills” because any other great shielder still should have alot more hp than maple.

To begin, I love the story, truly, I‘ve read it multiple times just to experience the story again, but one thing that always seemed odd to me were the aspect of personal attributes. I mean, its very much established that alot in the world of ORV, especially at the beginning is luck of the draw, which constellations find interest in you, where you start the scenario etc. but personal attributes are insanely unbalanced its not even funny.

I‘ll base my assumptions on that there are skills tied to your personal attribute(s) so I try to deduce which skills in the „exclusive Skills“ list come from attributes.

Kim Namwoon has the personal attribute [Chuunibyou] with the skill [Blackening], this gives him a pretty good boost at the beginning scenarios, anyone who doesn‘t know how to use coins for stamina couldn‘t withstand his attacks, the skill is good even until the later parts of the scenarios.

Gong Pildu has [Landlord] and [Great Land Owner] which have [Private Property] and probably [Profit calculation]. Here are some of the first issues, [Private Property] is always coupled with his stigma [armed Zone], its very possible that they have a good synergy but without the stigma, the skill loses a lot of worth, [profit calculation] was used once, its good for negotiations but there are definitely skills that far exceed it in that regard.

Jung Heewons attribute [Crouching Figure] is a special case, in exchange for not providing any benefit at first, which makes someone who gets it very likely to die early on, you can awaken it to an attribute up to the legendary grade. She got [Judge of Destruction] that comes with [Judgement Time] a skill, that as long as it actually gets permission to activate, makes the user extremely strong for its duration, not invulnerable but still strong enough to fight opponents that usually outclass you. This attribute later evolved into [Judge of Apocalypse], this evolved multiple of her skills, gave her the chaos attribute (element?) aswell as modify [Time of Judgement] activation requirement.

But then you have someone like Yoo Junghyuk, his attribute [Pro Gamer] is useless outside of specific settings. It makes him understand all settings/scenarios in the form of „games“ quicker than the rest, which is only used during the Demon King Selection and even then, it almost immediately became [Momarch of Amusement] a legendary attribute. It says that while in a „game“ he will be closer to a god than any Constellation, but that too isn‘t omnipotent. This Attribute feels extremely lackluster compared to other legendary attributes, it has super specific requirements and even in those requirements you can still beat/kill him.

Lee Hyungsung has [Soldier who turned a blind eye to Injustice] which is also a weird case. He later evolves into [Person who regained his justice], it grants him the skill [Sense of Justice] but the evolution was mainly so he unlocks a new Stigma. And even later he evolves again but also just seemingly unlocks more of his sponsors powers. Which makes the personal attributes in itself feel lackluster.

Kim Dokja is Kim Dokja, his circumstances are special so he is outside the norm and thus I don‘t include him. Doesn‘t change that the skills he got due to the attribute are pretty busted.

Lee Jihye starts with [Scarred Sword Demon] the included skills are a bit harder to decypher. Its alot easier to guess which skills are tied to the attribute early on while the characters don‘t have alot. Point is, she later evolves into the Attribute [Monarch of the Great Sea] another Legendary attribute and where my main gripe with [Monarch of Amusement] comes from. Its probable because it gets awakened in a much later scenario, but they are still both legendary attributes and Jihyes attribute has a more lax requirement, which is fighting on the sea. Then she can display powers to rival almost anyone, unless someone else has that attribute.

Han Sooyungs attribute(s) give her the skills [Avatar] and a skill that lets her see the Attribute Window of all people that have read. three ways of survival but didn‘t finish it. [Avatar] is a very good skill, letting you always gang up on someone and use it for [predictive plagiarism], a pseudo foresight. The later is decent for organizing said readers and identifying them.

Anna Crofts [Prophet] is also legendary and it really shows its worth, it lets you see glimpses of the future, which in and of itself is broken, but also makes her a pseudo regressor. She can use [Retro Cognition] to inherit the last turns memory, its good for information of all kinds but doesn‘t come with the regressor skill to restore skills learned in past rounds. Her [Savior] is also Legendary, but that one always seems to not do much compared to [Prophet]. Whats troubling is that we don‘t know how the [Great Demon Eyes] play into it all, it always is used in tandem for [Future Sight] but we don‘t know if they are just enhancing it, or are necessary to use it. Anna Croft simply didn‘t show alot of her potential in the story, because futures involving Kim Dokja are out of reach for her most of the time so she isnt relevant as much as ways of survival make her out to be in our round.

And then is the thing about how personal attributes are given, during the Disaster of Questions Yoo Junghyuk said its based on what you are „best“ in. Him being a pro gamer and Dokja being a reader, but other attributes feel less like they are „good“
at something but more „shaped by circumstances“ like [Crouching Figure] and [Soldier that turned a blind Eye to Injustice], both not being qualities you are good in but the circumstances around you.

Constellations are a special case, since we don‘t know their full stories theres not really anything to say about attributes, I don‘t think a constellation ever had an attribute awakening (those that were constellations at the beginning of ORV, Dokja and Han Sooyung are special cases)

Slightly off topic, but past experiences can also give exclusive skills without a corresponding attribute, which makes the term „exclusive“ a bit weird-ish. Because the same skill can exist multiple times like [Demon Slaying] owned by Jihye and Heewon, so the skills aren‘t really exclusive to them, maybe it simply means skills you can‘t buy from the shop or gain after the scenarios started.

And even then, the attributes also aren‘t set in stone, seen as how Yoo Jungheok of the 1783rd turn awakened to the [Avatar] skill.

So yeah, personal attributes are really good and are often mentioned again, but at times they feel spotty. Hyungsungs attributes are mostly just „He is awakening his attributes and now gets more powers from master of steel“ other skills like Pildus are reliant on him getting defense master as constellation and stuff like [Monarch of Amusement] are so specific in their activation you might aswell don‘t have them most of the time, because [Monarch of the Great Sea], you can very easily force a naval battle, but to have a game setting, the scenario has to be built upon a game, which happened once in the scenarios we saw.

After rereading the story again I want to compile a list of Rules in the world and ask people to verify/correct them.

-Most coins we see gained in the novel are donations or scenario/achievement rewards, those coins either belonged to the constellations or the bureau, the only time we saw Coins being gained by them being generated was in the 0th turn where Dokjas fable spread and he gained some coins.

-In the sponsor selection you see every Constellation that wants to support you and enter a contract free of charge. However, you can still get a supporting constellation after the 2nd selection via Support Contract bought in the shop as seen right before the cinema dungeon.

-Stigmas are unique skills rooted in a constellations being, they get shared to incarnations at will or can be gifted to other people as seen in sword song and self justification

-You become a constellation by getting 5 stories/fables without having a supporting constellation.

-A nebula can be formed even with non constellations, the founding requires 5 constellations to support the notion.

-You can get “stuck” in a scenario if you aren’t strong enough to clear it, scenarios with no time limit and perpetual danger can thus become a prison to participants as seen in the korean constellations seemingly being stuck in a scenario shown during the beginning of the arc ark

-Scenarios can be hosted by nebulae, rewards are handled by the nebula, seen in the journey to the west scenario and during the eden visit

-By paying a hefty price of probability, you can force fate on someone else, making something definitely happen to them, this fate may have a loophole to escape it. Seen in the dark castle ark. THEORY: The price is linked to the targets strength as no one tried to use it on dokja or his companions again even when they became even more hated by the nebulae.

-Ever being defeated and gaining a losing story becomes a fatal weakness, even a benign loss like a lost bet can cost you your life when someone uses what the winner used against you. Seen in the gigantomachia fight against Poseidon. A losing story also puts you at a disadvantage against the winner, its not a deciding factor in every fight however, seen in Athena not being able to stop Poseidon.

-Outer Gods seem to both be Eldritch beings and beings from forsaken Worldlines. Since the devourer of dreams seen in dark castle doesn’t seem to be something from a discarded world line. Every Outer god that can only communicate by repeating the same words over and over seem to all be characters from those world lines however.

-You can take on a debt of coins from the bureau, non repayment leads to being imprisoned by the dokkaebies, seen during the gourmet association.

-When you die, you get placed in one of the worlds afterlives, sometime after that, you might be turned into a literal meal and consumed by constellations, seen during the first tartarus visit.

-You can give your stories to other people, seen during dark castle and right after dark castle, why noone gets rid of their losing stories that way is unknown, possibly probability issues.

I want to ask you all who you think Rimuru will outlive and who will stay alive as long as he will. Because people like Gazel and Youm still are the same species they were born as with limited lifetimes. Just like Myourmiles and Vesta, who are important to Rimuru. Shuna, Souei and Hakuro also didn’t evolve into immortal races afaik. So, who from Rimurus friends, do you think he will outlive and who will stay till the end?

Its weird, in arena and arena only I sometimes just cannot control my champ, nothing happens be it move commands or using spells. Its not fps drop or ping as the other champs still move regularly. When it happens during something like Augment select, it also doesn’t react. If I play say SR or ARAM something like that never occurred