u/Ok-Department415

In SLOMW, Taylor's friends talk to her about honeymoon suites and using protection. She seemed to not want contraceptives. Plus, when asked about the possibility of getting pregnant by a random man / multiple men, she seemed to have an attitude of if it happens it happens.

Then, there's another mention of pregnancy later in the season finale when she leaves for Bachelorette filming. It's after that whole thing where she sleeps with Dakota a day before leaving, plus the whole thing where she almost ditches her flight and the Bachelorette altogether to be in her feelings. Before they take her phone, she texts Dakota saying she thinks she might be pregnant. Since it was a cliff hanger for SLOMW, I'm guessing the storyline was added to her Bachelorette season which may or may not release who knows when.

How would production even do the pregnancy scare storyline? Obviously pregnancy test, but it could be too early to tell, since the last time she slept with Dakota was right before filming. Would production just drag out the storyline until they could be certain? Would her men be informed?

It's often said there's a difference between a reality tv villain and an awful person, just like there's a difference between dark and entertaining. Are there likeable past or present villains in the cast? What did they do well? What did other villains do wrong? Who would you like to see, step up or added to the cast, as a villain with Whitney, Demi, and Taylor (hopefully stays) gone?

Personally, I'm getting bored of cast members worrying that the audience sees them as a villain, and all the victim complex surrounding the title. It's always some version of "I got a bad edit" when the season drops. I just want someone to own it one day.

Besides the crime rates, I really hate cities. Like they're crowded and noisy and you have no person space and there's so much trash. I'd rather have nature and open space. Could this be from growing up with dirt all around me?

For context, my sister is an unsanitary hoarder who hoards a lot, my mother is sanitary but still hoards a lot usually decorations and event stuff, my dad isn't a hoarder but still adds to it a bit. He's an adhder similar to myself, but he impulse buys stuff, plus he can store trash up for a while, and unlike me he doesn't do a regular minimalist cleaning. He does eventually clean up, so on itself it would be manageable, but along with my mom and sister it makes stuff a bit worse, which with clutter a bit worse still adds to the pile.

Although, my parents at least maintain their mess to their areas, while my sister invades family areas. I'm also yelled at a lot because I won't stop yelling in anger about the house, and how I'm cleaning only for my sister to repeat messes and my parents not to discipline her, before that it was my parents not cleaning until I decided to do it myself to have a fresh start.

We can hire professional cleaners with the bill less expensive after you pre-clean, make rules to keep it clean, and invite people over often to motivate them to keep it clean to keep having company. My family hoard is only in beginner phase, so fingers crossed I can finish a room per day, since I only have to bag clutter on the surfaces of the floor and furniture and counters, then washing the surfaces and areas themselves.

I'm getting therapy soon for neurodivergence anyway, but I also want to talk to a therapist about my anger with the current (Hopefully former soon) situation, like I'm so calm with my family with everything else, but when I see all the dirt I just feel so out of control and it makes me so angry I actually yell and curse at my sister which isn't normal for me.

I'm also making a garden outside since nature is peaceful and it's a nice way to get out of the house, while still being able to see my cats from the window, since I'll probably be living with my parents for a while transferring to a college closer to home for a while and living alone being expensive.

I don't know why I'm not the same as my mom and sister, or even my dad. I mean I also avoid things but I just avoid schoolwork when stressed, and dirt plus clutter stresses me out but it just makes cleaning and minimalism weirdly relaxing to me. I guess because growing up with the junk it stressed me out so much cleaning and more open space became my happy thing, it helps that I like nature and moving around a lot which needs more clean plus open space.

Also, when I was younger and my parents were divorced before remarried I had to help my sister and mom​ clean for company, my sister would throw tantrums to try and get out of it still the same, I think I realized that if you just clean the space clean you don't have to spend hours cleaning for company coming over.

However, even at that age my room was still clean, or my side of the room if I had to share with my sister. I also have early memories of my extended family helping us clean our room a lot when we were little, I used to make ant colonies because I thought they were cute, and then one night I just randomly started putting clothes into the hamper by myself I guess because the lessons stuck.

I guess my tipping point is the excuses from the non-hoarder, especially when you're trying to help. My dad keeps trying to bring up my mom and her clutter, but I'm like I can clean the clutter, I agreed to clean the house because my parents are overweight and can't move much, plus I actually enjoy cleaning probably due to my upbringing mess stresses me out plus I've become minimalist, also I just want to get it done especially for my health and my cats.

We also cant get one of the toilets fixed, can't get walls fixed, cant get new dishwasher, can't invite family or friends over, and can't hire professional cleaners until it's done. Professional cleaners are a no go until I clean because they're expensive so you have to pre-clean for them to get less of a charge.

I guess for context, the reason I don't want to blame my mom like my dad is he does similar things just not as bad, plus my sister is the main issue. My dad also makes mess and impulse buys stuff, it's not nearly as bad as my mom, but it doesn't help. My mom is the only one helping me clean, even with her overweight issues plus the fact that she and my dad both have jobs, and I've constantly seen her clean up after my sister only for my sister to get things dirty again.

Plus, my mother isn't as resistant to throwing things out anymore, while my sister yells at me for moving her stuff that's in my way of cleaning but she won't move them herself, plus my sister leaves actual unhygienic trash around. My mother brings in a few boxes every few weeks, however my sister leaves a mess everyday, she singlehandedly destroyed her room so she started hanging out in the basement and trashed that then she started hanging out in the living room.

Plus, I'd been making strides lately with my mom saying to just talk to her about issues with my sister and she'll tell my sister to clean, but then I found trash of my sister from a week ago which I told my mom about a week ago stuffed way under the couch. I dont want to accuse my sister but it was deep enough it seemed like she was hiding it. I told my dad since I also told him about it a week ago, and he's making excuses. This isn't the first time both my parents promised they'd force my sister to clean either.

My dad again tries to make it my mom's problem saying well she needs to discipline her, well I bring up thay you're her father you can discipline her too. He's like well you're all 18 you make your decisions, and I'm like seriously. I give him suggestions like take away the phone, shut off the wifi, don't allow her places I clean, no boyfriend until she finishes cleaning a section for the day.

He's like why do you care and I'm like I dont want to be in an unsanitary environment, he's like where else will you go. I point out his hypocrisy that he and my mom can yell at me no problem but can't discipline my sister. I honestly think it's because my sister throws tantrums while I am persistent but I don't scream and slam doors. Also, I still feel the need to listen to my parents because oldest child I actually got the harsh version of their discipline growing up, which I actually don't regret now.

Also, I think he's just so tired that he would rather yell at me to stop changing the status quo than taking the energy to try to change the status quo. He said he's just waiting for it to get worse enough for it to change or for him to not be able to handle it anyone, I'm not avoidant enough to ignore the fact that it's only going to change when someone dies or if it gets cleaned. Also, like I said, it's not a full on hoard yet.

It's still in the baby stages where I can clean a room a day, plus the basement in hopefully a week, and then it'll be gone, so obviously I want to tackle it now instead of ignoring it until it grows bigger. Then, when I'm done cleaning, plus professional cleaners do a second round now and they won't charge as much since I pre-cleaned it, we can implement rules to keep it clean. Also, I'll invite family and friends over more often, plus​ do other things to motivate them to maintain the cleanliness as well.

First of all, sorry for the long post, you can honestly skim or have a text to speech thing read it. Idk what's the norm for this sub, I'm guessing it's not unusual since childhood issues probably have lots of context and background stories needed.

My mom and sister are hoarders, my dad isn't a hoarder but also adds to the junk with impulse buying plus the trash sometimes.

My sister is seriously unsanitary like her room has piles of trash, the mattress is probably growing mold, she literally won't throw out sanitary napkins sometimes because she's too stressed. She had trouble cleaning because my parents never taught us, so I figured it out when I saw my friends holding their nose and my grandma alerted me, but my parents wouldn't do anything until I told them she was being laughed at because she smelt like cat s**t because she picked her clothes from the hallway near the litter box.

My mother moreso leaves junk, like she'll say we need to save things for family events every year or in case we ever need to use them. She used to get really mad when I would throw stuff out, but now she's a bit better. She used to get mad when I would throw stuff out, and yell at me for yelling at her about cleaning, but now I think she understands how much it stresses me out and has been working on communication with me so she is more gentle.

My sister is the main issue. My mom doesn't leave unsanitary trash, plus she will help me clean, the only issue is she also helps my sister clean. She has shut the wifi off in my house and once sent me to my grandparents for a weekend due to getting in arguments with them, and she will yell at me when I cross a line of power with her, but when it comes to my sister she backs off. I honestly think it's because my sister will start tantrums and my parents are done with it.

I've just given up with fighting over cleaning, and I can't move out anything soon with school and rent being expensive, and my parents are busy with work plus pretty overweight so they can't move much, so I've just decided to clean up myself. It's not as bad as most hoards it only takes me a day per room and the basement will only take a week at most hopefully, plus I have have free time now it's summer.

The issue is my sister, because she keeps ruining what I already cleaned. I cleaned the living room getting under couches and everything, and then I had to stop for a bit because allergies flared up, my allergies I only gained one of the first times I came home from college because my immune system became too accustomed to not living in dirt, and then I cleaning the whole dining room plus will get the downstairs bathroom today, and I was proud and felt more free.

I'm also so tired or my non-hoarding dad yelling at me for telling him to you know parent his daughter and talk with his wife, but he's tired of fighting with them so of course it's easier for him to fight with me. He literally asked me why I have an issue with it and that I should let it be, but my mom just stopped freaking out when I try to throw away stuff and started to help me clean, plus I'm not letting it turn into a full on hoard while it's just in beginner stage.

I'm tired of my hoarder mom doing the same, getting angry when I fight with my sister, but we wouldn't fight if it wouldn't take her a week to get my sister to clean new mess she makes while I'm cleaning, and my sister half-asses it too so it's still barely clean, plus she acts like she's doing me a favor for cleaning up her mess and threatens not to clean when she's mad at me.

My sister just deflects and name calls and says I can't tell her what to do, but my parents don't do much. I'm just so angry, and it's only because of the living situation, and it's only family spaces, like I'm not cleaning their rooms and the professional cleaning can skip them to keep the cost low, when we can finally invite family over they can explain why people can't see their rooms. I'm just tired of them yelling at me for not wanting to avoid the issue for my sanity, health, and pets.

It's produced by the same company and reminds me so much of secret lives, but it's also unique.

They're the same age range, exept they aren't parents. I like secret wives because mom drama is entertaining like watching a PTA fight, but I also like messy young adult drama, but messy young adult drama is too dark when kids are involved, so this show can fill that for me.

Also, there's no religion in this show, which religious trauma is obviously the elephant in the room with secret lives (said by someone religious and who is in no way mocking anyone's faith).​

Secret lives showed more of the rich people aspect, this show shows the people who work for the rich people. Secret lives already had a group business established with some friend groups in the business, while this is people trying to start a group business, while some people are also trying to be picked for a permanent spot in the business.

This is like: cast living together for the summer like Summer House, but they only hang out at the end of a work day or while waiting for job opportunities, Vanderpump Villa shows more staff at play but this shows more staff at work, I know child care fields have lots of work drama I mean it's why teacher shows plus Supernanny became so popular so I was glad they leaned into it more, and they're sort-off going for the same jobs so there's a very small competition show aspect, but it's a friendly competition because when one of them does well it helps the rest of them network.

I like secret lives showing behind the scenes of press and the show itself, because I feel like all the good drama happens behind the scenes between stressful press, plus breaking the 4th wall somehow works with their authenticity branding. However, I'm glad they didn't that with this show, behind the scenes of the difficulties of child care works better for this brand, plus having two shows focus heavily on media would be less unique.

*Also beware some people might leave spoilers in the comments just warning now*

>!Any predictions for how the fight will go down? Seems like Zach and Jasmine get heated, maybe Brittany also gets pulled in. Any assumptions about how it starts and ends? The other cast members that get dragged in, or the cast members who may have started it behind the scenes?!<

Even before the new limits the debt was bad, everyone I talked to said they just ate the 360K, and due to tuition increasing each year the current year will be 400K. Now with the OBBBA limits and the affordable repayment plans gone, plus the cost of living and cars and houses and everything sky high, even more people are going to be harmed.

I had a conversation where I told my friends I was thinking about switching to another career for a better outcome, and they told me they were worried I would be giving up my dream due to pessimism and lack of optimistic thinking, because you know they're good friends who care about me. But it's obviously hard to be optimistic when almost half a million isn't a choice to be made lightly, and a quarter of the million in private loans that doesn't care about sickness or hardship definitely isn't a joke. I mean I know there's military, but besides the fact that I'm a woman, I honestly know I couldn't handle potentially be sent into a combat zone for a war, and I would probably break from how physically and mentally they get broken down during basic training, and I would 100% cry.

My worst fear is debt can make people hate their jobs, especially a career like veterinarian where if you don't have outside interests you will burn out. I also feel like I'm at more risk to burn out that way due to my ADHD. If I have so much debt I have to work more and spend little to keep up with it, barely have any time off outside of work, have to work extra shifts and holidays constantly, can barely afford to go away for even a cheap vacation with friends, can barely afford pets (because we know pets are expensive), can barely afford hobbies, have to live with my parents for who knows how long, that's not ideal.

I've also been taking a summer off from pre-vet stuff just to separated myself from my identity as a pre-vet. I realized how much I sank into my identity of being pre-vet, and how it was actually blocking me from clearly seeing potential future paths. I also realized how much I like having time and money for my pets and my hobbies and hanging out with friends plus family. I also started thinking about if I'd rather have a job working with animals but barely any free time or money for the other stuff I like, or a job working with something else but more time and money for the stuff I like, plus I can always have animal hobbies and my pets. It also helped that my family and friends are super supportive, and they made it very clear that they don't care if I pursue this anymore as long as I'm happy.

I feel like it's safer to try to find something I love with low debt and high salary first, plus if things change in the future or I regret it vet school is always there for me. You know there are people in their 30s and 40s in school, plus I could always save up money so if I decide I want it some day I have the funds to make it easier. Trying vet school first, then regretting it with half a million of loans in general, plus a quarter of a million of that is private loans, just honestly is my worst case scenario.

I guess I was wondering if anyone else was in a similar position or could relate.

Does anyone else believe Lacy is overreacting with Janet?

I mean in this day and age in technology, if your friend is dating someone or your friend's ex-spouse who they're still tied to by a child is dating someone, wouldn't most people do some basic research? I mean I found out a big red flag about someone who I was thinking about dating because one of my friends did a social media dive.​

Also, if the allegations are true, the fact that Lacy sent a cease and desist to Michelle and possibly threatened other cast members with one, wouldn't you definitely do a deep dive then against the person threatening legal action against you? Michelle and Janet's side seems true, it just seems like Lacy is focusing on little technicalities in their phrasing or contradicting herself to call them liars.

Furthermore, I don't keep receipts of people I hang out with, because I don't have friends like this and don't wish too either. However, I feel like if I was in a highly dramatic non-public figure friend group, where you don't know when you're going to be turned against, I mean we all know one of these toxic friend groups, I would definitely keep receipts.

Let alone, a highly dramatic non-public friend group with some reality star members, who are known for being immature, I mean that's why producers wanted to cast them. Let alone, if I was going to be on reality TV with some friends and some strangers, and reality TV is known for causing friendship betrayals, plus some of the cast are strangers who have no loyalty to you at all, how could you not keep receipts?

Not to mention, there's no way the other cast members don't research each other. I mean especially if they weren't friends with some of the members before filming, they probably wanted to catch up on the lore. Plus, if you're friends with a celebrity, I feel like there's natural interest in their past, especially if you had that awkward oh you're a celebrity I have no idea who you are moment.

Also, isn't Kristen called Detective Doute because she digs up information on people. Isn't that what she did to Faith, except she got the wrong information due to racial profiling, and could've gotten Faith harmed or killed by police brutality, and only did that as a twisted sort of punishment for Faith having an affair with Jax which hypocritcally Kristen also did, except it was worse with Kristen because she was the best friend of the girl Jax was dating at the time? I mean isn't that a worse way to use information than anything Janet could do with information.

Also, I feel like that video fight had a whole half of it missing, like it looked like we were only shown small clips of what happened. While, Lacy claims Michelle and Janet were bullying her last year too, but the only witness for her is Jesse who isn't credible, and I honestly think Jesse would twist things to pit Lacy and Michelle against each other.

Besides the Danny stuff, I feel like Nia and Kristen aren't clicking this season because they aren't great at anticipating the audience, and knowing how to win.

It's like how in season 2 people didn't like Michelle because she's a calm person who doesn't express emotions much, while Jesse was always excessively crying over the divorce, to make her look cold in comparison. Also, Jesse would stay really calm in fights, while pushing Michelle's buttons or being nasty to her off camera, to make her look crazy for getting really upset at him. Jesse was winning the divorce, because besides misogyny, reality TV rewards the person who takes (or in Jesse's case pretends to take) the higher road.

Like if you really feel like she was a mean girl then go above it by coexisting with her in social groups, ignoring her on your own time, and not saying mean things to her or about her in public conversations. Be super nice to her, or at least be civil with her, to come out as the better person.

Trying to exclude her from professional groups (since they're co-workers), trying to sway your friends to dislike her, and attacking her in public, or in Nia's case not telling Kristen to stop attacking her in public, is just sinking to their level to the point where you become the mean girl. Then, because they're starting to act like a mean girl to Janet, I start to feel bad for Janet. Like there's a very thin line, especially for women who get stereotyped easily, between being assertive to a mean girl and turning into a mean girl yourself. Literally the plot of the mean girls movies, if you don't be careful sticking up to the bully, you can go too far and turn into a bully yourself.

Idk thoughts on my take or how reality stars struggle to anticipate the audience?

If you could see cast members joining another show what would it be? A current show or a spinoff? Would it be a Bravo show or another network? Hosting or starring or just in the ensemble?

Ex: Lacy gets Housewives, Jesse gets Traitors, Kiana gets Perfect Match then a visitor appearance on Vanderpump Villa as a villa guest, Janet does House of Villains to get her rightful redemption arc, Brittany gets Love is Blind, Michelle gets The Bachelor as a contestant, Schwartz goes on Age of Attraction for a younger woman. Just thought it would be fun to have a lighter conversation topic in this sub.

I watched an interview from Alyssa Grenfell about how a lot of times with mormons or ex-mormons, because they're so used to their identity being tied to mormonism, and especially for women mormonism teaches that their identity is tied to serving a man, they're more vulnerable to grooming and manipulation. Basically, that theory that people who've been in a cult are more likely to join another cult.

She basically says that Taylor seems to have tied herself to a new cult, show production and her fanbase. Her religion taught her to obey people in positions of power, and she sees production as her new authority. She sees social media as her new community, as shown by her getting upset by people not posting for the CMAs even though they sent private messages, showing how she thinks social media relationships are her version of real life relationships and connections. She thrives off production and her fans happy giving her positive feedback, because they help give her a new identity and purpose. She also can be exploited by production, because she'll continue to film even if it's detrimental to her mental health, as seen by her accepting Bachelorette even though she was clearly struggling as seen by season 4's edit of her (which was confirmed to be a generous edit so worse than what we saw too).

I like her take because she makes clear that Taylor and Dakota still definitely deserve individual blame for their actions, especially since there's a child involved. She was also the first video I saw during the incident that highlighted how production also needs accountability, since they prioritized entertainment and views over their cast members' mental health and child safety.

*To be clear, because I don't want to confuse or offend anyone, I'm not trying to excuse Taylor's behavior, because other people grew up in similar situations but don't act the way she does, so she definitely does need to take accountability for her own actions. I'm not a Taylor fan, this is just an analysis discussion not an excuse discussion.*

I just watched Jessi's interview with Girlscamp on YouTube, which was from a year ago BTW so it's not new, but I feel like I totally changed my mind on her reaction to Jen and Zac's situation. Now that I know her history with her ex-husband (her first one) I totally understand why she was so heated and frustrated when Jen wouldn't leave Zac.

She got married at 22. She said her ex-husand hit a tree when he found out they couldn't get married in the temple due to premarital sex. Her dad was happy it meant he could come to the wedding. Her in-laws sat her and her then husband down to shame them with scripture for it. Her mother-in-law told her that she'd have to explain to people why they didn't get married to the temple at the marriage reception.

When they got sealed in the temple a year after marriage, her in-laws made a public speech at the celebration party about how the dark cloud above their family is finally gone, totally embarrassing and ruining the happy day for the couple.

She always felt like her in-laws felt like she was a bad influence on him due to her family status plus the incident, while they would excuse their sons behavior. She would call her in-laws letting them listen to how their son would scream at her while chasing her around church parking lots in fights. She would tell them when he was smoking weed or breaking the rules. They would just ignore it to keep their reputation. She feels bad for Jen feeling like Jen's in-laws are similar.

It was interesting learning about her family's unique upbringing in the church, with her mom being devout while her dad left the church, leading her tight-knit mormon community to ostracize her family. She said people literally came up to her family at church and made comments about it, which I can believe after watching enough ex-mormon videos, not to mention the stuff she probably imagined they said behind her family's backs.

She said she always felt insecure and not good enough because of it, which is part of why she married her husband even with his red flags. Besides love, she also felt like marrying a super devout family would make her more acceptable.

This is probably also why she sympathizes with Jen. Jen's family also isn't traditional, with Jen being Latina and the church racism. Plus, Zac's side having a strong mormon lineage who are wealthy doctors, while Jen's family makes less money and her mother was a convert, which the church holds both having a longer mormon lineage and having more money to donate more tithes to the church as higher status.

This also could be why she was annoyed with Jen since season 1, besides being disinvited to the baby blessing. She could be annoyed Jen disinvited her due to Zac and his in-laws, feeling some projection and self-hatred for how her former self was with her ex-husband and former in-laws. She could be annoyed Jen was very judgemental of non-devout enough mormons and non-mormons, reminding her of how her community shunned and mistreated her family as a child, or making her feel offended on behalf of herself and her father who were ex-mormon.

I also like hearing her open up about her dad's struggles with mental health, leaving him to advocate for mental health a lot, and eventually leading him to leave the church.

*To be clear, not condoning or excusing her actions, because other people grew up in similar situations but don't act the way she acts*