I've been playing Mortal as a Dex Mage for 5 months, and so far, I haven't had a single PvP battle that was fun, regardless of whether I won or lost.

1. Large-Scale PvP

In large-scale PvP, my job is to heal, position myself well, and react quickly when a melee fighter runs toward me. If the situation allows, I’ll freely cast damage spells on the enemy melee fighters. If I react too slowly, I’ll die in two hits. There’s hardly any time to counterattack, if i have any. However, there are also very often situations where you don’t have time to position yourself, or the environment doesn’t allow for good positioning. But if I do have the opportunity and position myself correctly, I just cast my spells without having to think too much, and without the enemy melee fighters being able to do anything about it. That’s no fun.

2. Small-Scale and 1v1 PvP

In small-scale and 1v1 PvP, it’s very similar: position yourself or run. In small-scale PvP, as a Mage, you’re often targeted. When that happens, I run away. If there’s another Veela as a melee on the opposing team, I’m basically dead. The only way to survive is to go into melee range and spam Death Hands. It’s exactly the same in 1v1. If I’m fighting a Thursar or Oghmir, I run and free-cast at them. They can’t do anything. If it’s a Veela, I spam Death Hands. If I make a mistake or get caught off guard so that any melee can attack me, I’m dead in two hits. It doesn’t help that I have the fastest on-foot build. If they’re right on top of me, they almost always manage to land two hits before I’ve run far enough away from them. If I’ve run far enough away, or if I’m lucky and the terrain has high ground I can use, then I just free-cast without my opponent being able to do anything about it.

That’s no fun for me or my opponent.

3. The fundamental problem is that the way the combat system, movement, and abilities work in Mortal is based on hard counters. Having counter builds is actually a good thing for an MMORPG. If everyone can do everything, has the right counter in every situation, and no one has an advantage in certain situations, then there’s no point in playing with others. Still, it’s important to be able to do something. Having absolutely no options is no fun. Counter builds, yes, but no hard counters. There are simply too many situations where neither I nor my opponent has any option.

4. Gives melee characters the ability to block magical attacks. Gives melee characters the ability to slow, stun, reveal invisible characters or pull fleeing mages toward them from a distance.

5. In return, gives mages the ability to actively dodge melee attacks, teleport away, or become invisible.

6. The goal should be that, while every build has noticeable disadvantages compared to other builds, it still has options and abilities to react to the opponent’s decisions. The feeling of being unable to do anything in many PvP situations isn’t fun for anyone.

We’re back to the player numbers we had before the Sarducaa release, but now with a game world twice as large. Yet Mortal thrives exclusively on player interaction and the stories (both big and small) that arise from it. When player density decreases, player interaction also decreases, then all progress loses its meaning. The players who have remained in Myrland are well aware of this fact.

If the world gets bigger but the number of players stays the same or decreases (meaning player density decreases, and with it, player interaction), player interaction is what makes Mortal so much fun and when what makes Mortal so much fun decreases, the fun itself decreases. And when the fun decreases, players leave the game. The more players leave, the more player interaction decreases, and the more player interaction decreases, the more players leave. Simply put: The more players leave, the more players leave. That’s called a downward spiral. There’s a tipping point where this spiral begins, and I am worried it’s been reached with the doubling of the game world. When the bridge opens, the few remaining players will spread out. Imagine the activity level before the Sarducaa release in Myrland, but in a world twice as big.

If everything I’ve written so far is true, then it’s obvious what’s needed: more players!

The problems new players face have been known for many years, and neither the devs nor the remaining players are willing to change anything or allow for change.

This includes moving away from the subscription model. It includes limiting open-world PvP and add somekind of safe zones. This includes finding a solution for the login queue when the server are full. Those are actually the most common points of criticism.

I don’t like it either, but if the issues I described above logically follow, then I don’t see any other option.
there’s no point in leaving everything as it is just so that a mounted archer can kill 1 players an hour at a time because they’re “sick” PvP players and view any change in that direction as just “carebear” or "whiny" mentality. As the core player base, we must accept changes if we want to be reasonably confident that we’ll still be able to play Mortal in 5–10 years.

And yes, it is possible to structure or limit open world pvp without killing open-world PvP. And yes, it is also possible to offer a free-to-play version of the game without compromising its integrity.

During the first few weeks after the Sarducaa release, discussions about restrictions on open-world PvP were once again quite heated. Now that we’re almost back to pre-Sarducaa player numbers, as someone who truly loves this game and wants it to grow, I wonder what we can do without further restricting open-world PvP, because I actually think that open-world PvP plays a significant role in socializing and providing thrills.

The only way I see this happening is by providing players with proper escape tools and abilities, such as sneaking, invisibility, and setting traps.

I know what you’re thinking. Gankers and griefers would use these tools and abilities too. Yes, they would. But I think that with such tools and abilities, other players’ chances of survival would still increase, while at the same time giving the game interesting new mechanics for rogue playstyles. Because right now, if you’re attacked alone by a group, you have little to no options other than to run away and hope there isn’t a Veela in the enemy group, or to stand your ground and die like a man.

Especially with abilities like Sneak or Invisibility, you could escape such situations. Even if a group of players all sneak up on you while invisible, you can still go invisible yourself in response.

Skills like Sneaking could be introduced as a primary action skill, and setting traps as a profession, ideally combined with Thievery.

Skills like Invisibility could be added as a weapon ability associated with the wand.

It's questionable whether that will be enough to keep new and solo players around. But it would at least help them have realistic options in Zerg situations that lead to survival. And even if that's not the case, at least we'll have a few cool new rogue type skills and abilities in the game.

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Edit: As for balancing, so that people don't just go invisible easely as soon as they realize they're losing a fight.

Of course, there should be restrictions and conditions for invisibility so that it isn't broken.

In other RPGs, for example, you could only become invisible if enemies didn't have line of sight to you. So you couldn't become invisible right in front of an enemy, you had to get behind something (like a wall) first.

In all other games, there are also counter spells to reveal invisible players. You could use a one-handed wand to grant the ability to become invisible, and a two-handed staff to reveal invisible players. All of this would be tied to primary skill points, which would ensure that not every fighter could simply become invisible without sacrificing other important skills.

I know that many people are tired of this topic (I'll never get tired of it because I love this genre), but this is a well-written blog about the "evolution" of MMORPGs and the following quote sums it up very well:

“If persistence was the first pillar to be quietly traded away, the current wave of announcements suggests scale is next in line.”

By this, he/she means that the MMORPGs of the 2010s primarily abandoned the persistence of the game world through instancing, sharding, layering, and dynamically linked servers, there was no longer a unified and fixed game world. And now, the MMORPGs of the 2020s are also abandoning large-scale gameplay. No more hundreds or thousands of players in a single world.

You may or may not like this, but I think anyone who played MMORPGs before 2010 can confirm this change.

What, then, remains of this genre?

... so why are there hardly any (if any) tools, systems, or content created for this type of player? I very rarely come across a note with a little bit of story content, but that’s about it, or did i miss something?

Why aren’t there entire books that tell the story of the world, which you can flip through page by page, like in The Elder Scrolls titles?

Why can’t these books, notes, or other objects in the world even be relevant to gameplay, containing clues and puzzles, as we’ve seen in good environmental storytelling design from old-school MMORPGs?

If that’s too much work for SV: Why aren’t we given the tools and systems so we can write such books and notes ourselves (like an extension for Scribing) and spread them throughout the world?

1. Immersive Design

Environmental Storytelling: Environmental storytelling is when the game world itself tells the story of that world without stating it directly. For example, through destroyed houses, ruins, bloodstains leading into a cave, inscriptions.

Diegetic Design: Everything exists within the game world itself. The idea is that information and objects are present in the game world and, in theory, the character can perceive them. For example, maps actually exist as physical items in the inventory, and clues are found in books and scattered throughout the world.

Emergent Gameplay: Challenges and tasks arise when various elements in the game world come together in a way that creates something new. The player interprets these elements and figures out what to do on their own. For example, if you see a ladder in the game world leading up a hill, and you notice a light burning on top of the hill, you’ll use the ladder without the game telling you to.

OR

2. Authorial Design

Explicit Guidance: The game takes a more active role in guiding the player through the game. For example, through the interface, waypoints, minimap, quest markers, highlighted objects, and main quest lines.

Cinematic Design: Here, the presentation is key. Relevant information about the world is communicated compactly through dialogue and cinematic video sequences.

Non-diegetic Design: Much of the game-relevant information and objects is placed on the UI level. The character cannot, in theory, perceive these. For example, the health is displayed as a bar in the lower-left corner of the screen, or rewards are collected via a UI window.

Scripted Gameplay: Gameplay is fixed in a specific sequence from start to finish to guarantee a specific gameplay experience.

View Poll

I saw this KoKo video. He has a point. Why SBI didnt say anything about the zone color?

Do you think it will be a uncapped orange zone only?

would make sense since they capped yellow zones. the problem would be, that the swipers will stomp the non-swipers in the new zones and they will risk nothing for that power.

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EDIT: just find out that the new lands also be available in full-loot lethal. depends on where you enter it, from blue/yellow zone or from black/red zone. I don't understand why they don't mention such important information in the introductory video.

I'm really glad to read that. I'm looking forward to the full-loot lethal mode. It's just too bad for the Orange Zone players that it most likely won't be capped. They'll have to deal with the swipers then.

This question has been on my mind in light of the growing number of games where many people are unsure whether they still qualify as MMORPGs or not, or genres that offer highly developed multiplayer experiences, making the boundaries increasingly blurred. Some try to resolve this ambiguity systematically by examining the server structure, the balance between solo and group content, whether the presence of other players in the world is necessary or optional, or with the concept of “massively.” These are all questions about characteristics, but not about what the genre actually does.

So what does it give you that no other genre can? Or do you think that, with the variety of genre mixes out there, there’s nothing that makes the genre unique to you?

The reason for this is that it reinforces routine and structure but reduces adventure and discovery. Before this system existed, I (and many others) used to wander around the world much more. I didn’t stay at any one spot for long, rarely revisited them, and tried out different spots more often. Since the Taskmasters were introduced, I just take the most profitable task (Distance, Effort, Reward) and repeat it until I can’t anymore.

Of course, I can still play as if the task system didn’t exist, but it just feels wrong knowing that I’m missing out on extra rewards because of it. At the end of the day, Mortal is a sandbox game with various incentives, and the Taskmaster system definitely gives me the wrong ones.

I know that even without the Taskmaster System, it is possible to establish routines and structure. It's in our nature, but with the Taskmaster System, it's much stronger.

We need systems that encourage us to become more active, creative, and adventurous, so that as few structures as possible become established and everything remains as dynamic as possible. That’s essentially why so many people love fresh starts so much.

I watch BDO PvP videos -> get really excited about the game -> install it -> log in -> my muscle memory kicks in hard -> and then emptiness -> I don’t know what to do because none of the content appeals to me -> I’m frustrated that I’m not using this awesome combat system for anything I actually enjoy -> I log out and uninstall the game again -> after about 6 months, I repeat the whole thing.

My problem: I’m not a fan of instanced content, but the open world feels dead (how can a MMORPG with that many players can feel so dead in the open world??). The gear system feels like a hamster wheel. Every piece of content I might be interested in is either instanced, time-gated, or gear-capped (so what’s the point of gear progression?), and the content that isn’t gear-capped or time gated is a one-shot fest in PvP. Man, even grind spots are gear-capped and in part instanced. I'm totally addicted to the combat, but I hate everything else

Are there things in BDO that you really enjoy or do you just log in out of habit?? Or do you have any tips for me?

It would be very helpful if players could create their own markers on the in-game map and be able to share their maps with other players. Essentially, you’d be able to create your own map, complete with your own information, locations, and notes. That way, you wouldn’t need third-party sites anymore, you’d still have to explore, and the gathering of knowledge would remain community-driven within the game itself.

Played on and off since release...always solo....never turned off by the normal ganking and stuff...would just always get bored with the gameplay loop and quit.

So last night I naked ported to Ashir to hang out and laugh and the normal debauchery going on. When I zoned in there was a circle pit with a boxing match going on narrated by a hilarious drunk Thursar. After about 15 minutes so (as is usual for Ashir) some hyper nerd in plate decided to come through town and start spawn camping. This time was different though.

Our drunk Thursar decided to band the naked noobs together and get us some clubs to restore peace. 6 nakeds with starter swords ran out and zerged down a turtle....then we tamed a water dragon, and finally farmed some crocs. Back to town we went and we pooled our resources, made weapons and armor and bows between all our crafting skills and geared everyone up. We were going to restore peace....but then the unthinkable happened. The town went quiet and the shitlords left right as we got geared.

So whats a shit geared group of nerds supposed to do? Well.....i guess we had to become the shitlords. By now it was just two of us left...so we started towards Belrim and set up camp. After a little more waiting finally Odinseed came on a small run with 4. We held the choke, we charged valiantly with our two man death squad, swinging my 3 spec mace wildely and we managed to kill 1 before getting sent back to town. Success (kinda)

Shit talk resumed upon respawns, naked water boxing chases and heavy voice com PvP after our failed gank attempt with Odin. Threats of KOS list. All the good stuff​.

Point of my log post is for new guys. Don't just sit in town all day farming clade and building banks full of shit to never engage. This game is 50% what you make it, and 50% of who you do it with. Don't get stuck in the typical mmo carrot chase, just grab a stick, go for a long ass walk, and see what happens. Thanks to the naked shit squad last night, mortal finally clicked and I had an absolute blast!

I understand an environmental quest system as content in which quests aren’t given by NPCs through linear quest chains that you track in your quest log, which provide tasks to complete and tell the story and lore of the game world, but rather the environment, POIs, clues, and interactive items take on this role. these elements are not linear but interconnected.

TLDR:

You can find or buy items like books that may contain clues -> The clues lead to locations -> The locations also contain clues such as inscriptions, notes, enemies, or POIs -> Exploration is ultimately rewarded. You can jump into this quest system at almost any point. It is more a Questsystem like the non-mainquests in Skyrim.

Is there an MMORPG that has ever had a quest system like that, and can something like that even work in an MMORPG?

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Example:
You're in town with a character. There are booksellers in town who sell books containing lore about the game world. In the book “Abandoned Ruins and Their Artifacts,” you can find clues about the location of ruins. The book states that north of the Old Watchtower stands an ancient ruin called “Obscura porta,” which was once inhabited by necromancers. (environment -> Interactable Book -> Clue)

You set off and find only an abandoned hut there. At first, you think this can’t be the ancient ruin, but then you notice a sort of cellar entrance on the back side of the ruin where “Obscura porta” has been carved. (Clue -> POI)

You go inside, and the entrance does indeed lead into a ruin. There, you encounter several powerful trolls and spiders that attack you. You also find a few graves you can loot, as well as old armor and weapons. In one of the graves, you find an old book that tells you the original story of this place.

Deep within the ruins, in a large room, a necromancer still lives. As soon as you enter the room, the doors close, and the necromancer attacks you. After defeating him, you’ll receive generous rewards. In addition to a scroll containing instructions on how to summon undeads, you’ll also receive a key with no further information on what or where this key unlocks. (You can later have the key identified by a scholar at the Magic Academy, which will then lead you to a new, different quest line.)

The interesting thing about this quest system is that it’s not linear. While exploring the area north of the watchtower, you could have found the ruins and obtained the key and the scroll even without the clues from the book in town. The World is mainly your Quest giver and is more designed unlinear.

1. First- or third-person perspective (No ISO perspective)
2. Sandbox systems (economy, free trade, crafting, gathering, professions, non-linear progression)
3. Theme park content (dungeons, events, a lore-rich world with detailed world-building, puzzles, books, unique POIs, NPCs who tell stories or point out hidden quests)
4. No instances
5. PvX unity (no separation between PvP and PvE)
6. Full loot (Upon death, you lose everything you’re carrying)
7. Territory wars between guilds and alliances, battles for influence and resources
8. Dynamic game world (Player activity influences the state of the world and can trigger events, the game world, in turn, influences player behavior, resulting in changing world conditions)
9. No quest markers, highlights in the World, or other markings on the map, such as the locations of POIs or my own position. Discovery and exploration are left entirely up to the players and is a main focus.
10. Environmental quest design instead of NPC quest gatekeeping (quests arise from the environment, items, and enemies in the world, rather than from linear, marked quest chains that you accept from NPCs and track in a quest log). You can join a quest at any point if you stumble upon it by chance or figure it out yourself through clues. It’s not just A → B → C → D. it’s also possible to go → B → D.
11. Social MMORPG (conflict, cooperation, interdependence)
12. Open-sea content (shipbuilding, naval battles, piracy, fishing, sea monsters, underwater treasures)
13. No modern design (meaningless leveling phase, endgame-focused, QoL features like fast travel, LFG tools, dailies, weeklies, or in-game shop, casual-friendly, micromanagement of player behavior, holding players hands through all content, seasonal content, 1 million currencies, access to content and rewards via interface windows)
14. 80% horizontal progression, 20% vertical.
15. Progression isn’t devalued with every update
16. Rich atmosphere, visual Recognizability, no cheesy high fantasy with catboys. a slightly darker, gloomier, and more barren style
17. Real space player Housing

Anyone have any recommendations?

I still want the many solo indie devs here to be able to promote their games or simply share their progress. I actually think it’s great that they’re using this difficult time for the genre, where one disappointment follows another, to make their own MMO. I would too, if I could.

edit: They really show how much they love the genre.

But it feels like every fourth post here is one of those (and every third is about some new “MMO Lite”). It’s just frustrating because it reminds me of where the genre stands.

I just want to know what's going to happen with the game. Any sign of life from Steven?