This is the song version of palpatine and anakin’s conversation in revenge of the sith. I started this today and am doing 5 frames per second. I have completed 14 seconds of this but have not imported the audio. I don’t want to pay for that but I may have to.
This picture speaks volumes.
Disclosure up front: this is my own essay, and I'd genuinely love this community's read on it.
I got stuck on two Star Wars videos side by side. One is Star Wars Theory premiering his Vader fan film after years of work, no AI, no shortcuts, given away for free, thanking fans at the door one at a time. The other is a commentator spending half an hour explaining why Revenge of the Sith is "garbage," isolating the worst line and ignoring everything around it.
I ended up reading them through Iain McGilchrist's Master and Emissary: one attends to the whole (six films of buildup, the pure cinema of a scene, the lore), the other grabs one decontextualized piece and holds it up as proof. It turned into an essay about the difference between people who build and people who burn, why the prequels became a kind of generational scapegoat, and why "this is bad" is so often a scapegoat rite wearing the costume of criticism.
It's not really about whether you love or hate the prequels. Most curious what you think about the "every generation gets its own Star Wars" part.
It dawned on me that a good 90% of the times when I think about Star Wars it's in relation to the Prequel Trilogy Era. I love all 6 Lucas films and I'd have a different favourite film at any point of the week. Some days its ROTJ, other times it can be AOTC.
But for whatever reason my imagination gravitates towards and lingers on Prequel events. Whether its Windu and company attempting to arrest the Senate, Obiwan and Anakin's complex father-son relationship, Quigon's maverick ways, Dooku's political machinations, podracer standings, the myriad of Jedis and their backstories etc.
Given there are at least three generations of fans in this franchise, I was wondering what era you guys fixate on when thinking about Star Wars.
Let me just say at the start that I'm fine with people even having different opinions, having aspects of a franchise they do or don't like. I've been active in many fandoms to some degree for many years, so I'm familiar and comfortable with all of this. That said, out of every fictional property I'm a fan of, Star Wars has the least fun fandom from my perspective. This is largely due to how divided the online fanbase is.
Yes, a lot of it has to do with the prequels. As a prequel fan, I don't mind people not liking them, it's basically impossible to avoid prequel hate in online circles anyways. It's just that in totality, the constant debate over the prequels, and just the franchise in general has gotten very tiresome to me. With most other fandoms, while people certainly have their own opinions, likes and dislikes, you still get the sense most of the fanbase are united in their love for the franchise, and respect for the creators.
Dragon Ball is my favorite franchise, and while the fans will certainly voice their criticisms, and poke fun at the late great Toriyama's flaws and quirks as a writer, they all still love the franchise, respect and appreciate Toriyama, even before he passed. But with Star Wars, it's always felt to me like the fanbase is made up of warring factions. It sucks because it's not just a matter of liking or disliking the OT, The Prequels, the EU, Disney Star Wars. It's that fans have fundamentally different views of the franchise depending on how they feel about those things.
Yes, I'm tired constantly debating over if the prequels ae bad movies. Yes, I'm tired of half or more comments under any prequel related topic on any platform being variations of "prequels suck" "good ideas, bad execution" "Lucas good ideas, bad writer/director" "Midi-Chlorians bad" Honestly, even though I don't like the sequels at all, I can look at the people who like them and feel some pity because it's far worse for them with finding positive discourse on their movies. The prequels do get a good amount of praise online, but they're still very polarizing, the lovers and haters see Star Wars very differently.
And of course, there's the hate for George himself. Look, the man is not perfect as either a person or creator, but when I feel compelled to buy making of books to disprove that he's a hack that just got lucky, or a weirdo who needed everyone else to do all the heavy lifting in work in making his ideas, I take issue with that. Other creators get criticism of course, but it feels like no fanbase has a larger percentage of people that distain their creator like Star Wars. No other franchise has these incessant debates over who deserves credit for what, who truly created the series.
Sorry if this a rambly, or even whiny, but I just get little enjoyment from engaging with the Star Wars fandom and do so very little compared to others . To sum it up, everyone has their own ideas on what Star Wars should be, everyone disagrees, and everyone hates each other. It's making more and more sense to me why I just enjoy the original six movies and stay disengaged with everything else.
I’ve seen a lot of people complain about the prequels causing Luke growing up on Tatooine to make less sense by having Anakin grow up there too. But this was not something that was created in the prequels. Obi-Wan explicitly said in ANH that Owen thought Luke’s father should’ve stayed “here” when they’re on Tatooine; there’s nothing else that could mean other than Anakin growing up on Tatooine. When Lucas wrote about Anakin growing up on Tatooine in TPM he was simply staying consistent with the OT’s established lore.
If anything, the prequels actually fixed that plot hole by establishing Tatooine as somewhere Vader would never want to go back to.
In this interview with George Lucas in the book “The Star Wars Archives: Episodes 1 - 3 (1999 - 2005)”, he explains what the Force is and how it works, as well as how individuals can use it and the role of midichlorians.
I can see why it was seen as a disappointment to many back in 1999, but I’ve always liked it honestly.
I enjoy the characters and overall storyline. Qui-Gon especially is a standout but I like Obi-Wan, Anakin, Shmi, and Padme as well. It’s also the best looking prequel due to being shot on film unlike 2 and 3, and uses more practical effects than those two as well.
Jar Jar never bothered me much honestly, and the Gungan’s in general I always found neat and I loved their underwater home. Really great visually and has a fun set-piece with all of the fish.
It’s definitely my most re-watched of the Prequels too, and I personally like how disconnected it is to the rest of the trilogy. It’s more of a stand alone entry with what feels like a complete story by the end of the movie (same with A New Hope, which is my favorite Star Wars movie.)
To me it’s got the best lightsaber duel of the trilogy, the best music of the trilogy, the best sound mix of the trilogy (the pod race is so good,) and I think it’s an overall solid movie. Revenge of the Sith is usually seen as the best of the prequels and I like that one too, but I enjoy watching TPM more.
It’s an overall fun time for me despite some cringe moments. It gives me this strange feeling of nostalgia and comfort even though I got into Star Wars with the sequel trilogy, and I think people were too hard on it initially. Personally I really enjoyed seeing it in the theater for the first time back in 2024.
I’d love to hear others thoughts on it in the comments!
Front-and-center of each episodes’ area, I decided to have iconic representation.
I - Duel of the Fates with Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, and Darth Maul
II - Obi-Wan and Anakin confronting Dooku on Geonosis in his escape tower
III - Obi-Wan and Anakin on Mustafar
The biggest complaint I hear is that Hayden’s acting is wooden and stilted and George Lucas gets blamed for it because he’s supposedly wasn’t a good director. The way I read Anakin as a character is heavily emotionally suppressed, traumatized and unsure of how to express himself in a normal social situation completely outside of the Jedi order.
Not to mention Padmé was a senator so there was a certain level of decorum that Anakin would have been instructed to follow and he didn’t know where the balance was between talking with the professionalism of a Jedi, the formality of speaking to a senator, the casualness of talking to an old friend and the nervous excitement of trying to impress your crush.
And he was not equipped on how to strike that balance. This is a man with a painful past who’s been taught to suppress and ignore that past by an order that tells him that his core values are wrong and what he wants out of life, to be able to love freely and openly, is sinful.
He’s internally stuck between what he’s been taught and has to abide by for his career and what he truly believes and wants. I think Hayden did a wonderful job of showing Anakin’s internal conflict through his delivery of the dialogue and his body language and facial expressions. Anakin doesn’t need to say or think “I’m conflicted” because it’s written all over him in the delivery of the character. And it was all the point of the delivery. The stilted, wooden dialogue is the point in portraying a heavily conflicted man who’s been taught emotions compromise his ability to be a good Jedi
Use this thread to talk about anything and everything (stick to the site-wide rules and strictly no NSFW posts).
People hate the idea that Padme just "lost the will to live." It makes no sense. She is a strong-willed character, she just had twins, and she knows Anakin is alive and not completely lost to the dark side. So why the hell would she give up and die?
Many think Palpatine drained her life force. But that doesn't fit his goals. He obviously wanted her dead eventually, but * not * in childbirth. If Vader found out she died exactly like his vision predicted, he'd know he threw it all away for nothing.
Now look at it from Padme’s perspective. In SW universe, healthy women with elite medical care don't die in childbirth. She tried telling Anakin she’d be fine, but he ignored logic and slaughtered younglings to ‘save’ her anyway. This trapped her. If she survived the birth, she would accidentally prove him right.
Reasoning with him failed. On Mustafar, she couldn't reach him at all, even when she threatened to leave. If she survived, he'd just commit more atrocities for the next vision. Padme had to prove that the dark side would * never * actually give him what he wanted. And the only way to do that was to let his vision come true anyway.
But how do you just will yourself to die?
I think carrying Anakin's twins made her temporarily Force-sensitive, but she couldn't tap into it until she desperately needed to. Two details back this up. First, how does she even know Anakin is alive (‘there IS good in him’, not ‘WAS’)? Her very last memory on Mustafar is Obi-Wan preparing to kill him. Then she wakes up and asks if Anakin is alright, but Obi-Wan just stays quiet. Logically, she should assume he’s dead. But on her deathbed, Padme doesn't hope-she knows Anakin survived.
Second, her last words: "There is good in him." When you think about it, that’s a strange choice for a dying mother. Normally you'd expect something like “please take care of my children.” Padme focuses on Anakin's redemption because protecting that spark is * why * she’s dying. Newborns don't remember quotes, yet 20 years later, Luke begins his redemption of Vader with those exact words. Padme Force-imprinted that mission into him before letting herself die.
Intentional sacrifice fits Padme far better than dying of a broken heart. Her goal was for Anakin to realize she died in childbirth anyway, proving the dark side was a lie.
The only hitch was the double cover-up. Palpatine lied and said Vader killed her, while the Jedi made her look pregnant at the funeral. So for 20 years Vader just assumed she would have lived if he hadn't choked her to death on Mustafar.
But when Vader learns Luke is alive, the lie falls apart. He realizes he didn't kill Padme-she lived long enough to give birth. And then he puts it together: Palpatine lied because Padme * did * die in childbirth, meaning Palpatine never had the power to stop it. He just played him from the start.
That is the exact moment Palpatine lost Vader.
Thoughts on this?
I've seen some doubts about George's ideas for the sequels, mainly due to other sources having contradictory information (and I even made a post clarifying this very thing), therefore, I would like to share Lucas's own statements from the book “The Star Wars Archives: Episodes 1 - 3 (1999 - 2005)”, written by Paul Duncan and published in 2020.
Where the creator of the saga reveals interesting facts about it and his true ideas for his films that unfortunately did not come to fruition.
(The last image is from the book of the series “James Cameron's History of Science Fiction”, where George stated one of the elements that would be important in his sequels).
I get that the Sith (on paper that is) are all dubiously united in their long game of subversion in the senate, assassinating key targets up the ladder for chancellorship, sowing chaos in the galaxy to start wars, planting seeds of the Darkside on coruscant and ultimately destroy the Jedi to pave the way for the rise of their empire and to become an invincible Darkside god.
But what about the Jedi? what is their vision for the galaxy? (Not the Republic!)
As the supposed peacemakers, are they working towards an everlasting utopia to ensure no more wars, no more tyranny, no more deaths from disease and famine?
Have any Jedi from the year 36, 450 BBY (the founding of the Je'daii Order) to the present day ever laid the groundwork for some grand ultimate purpose to fulfil as servants to their force?
Because someone please tell me why the Jedi were created in the first place?
Which of the two most important wars in Star Wars saga do you think meets those fourth requirements.
The war between the Galactic Republic vs the Confederacy of Independent Systems (Clone Wars); or, The war between the Rebel Alliance vs the Galactic Empire (Galactic Civil War).
To make it an interesting debate, aside from the movies, they can also take events and elements from both the current canon and Legends (series, comics, videogames, novels, etc). It doesn't matter if it's canon or not.
The one thing I often here, is people wondering how Padme doesn’t run away in terror after Anakin confesses to the Tusken village slaughter in Attack of the Clones.
Early in the film, Padme stops by her parents’ place to get some things before she goes into hiding in the lake country.
As she packs, Anakin notices some holo-pics on her wall. One shows her with several young alien children.
Padme tells Anakin that she was helping with a relief effort to relocate the children from their home planet to another one as their sun was imploding.
However, she tells Anakin that the attempt to save the children was unsuccessful, as they couldn’t adapt to their new home, and succumbed to death.
I saw this possibly being an “echo” as to what Qui-Gon had attempted with Anakin in Episode I: remove him from an inhospitable place to give him a better life…but in the end, Anakin struggled to adapt as well.
Plus, perhaps the reason Padme was being so willing to help Anakin, was buried in this deleted scene, of how she would try to help others even under such dire circumstances.
Prequel-era Palpatine and Vice President Dick Cheney are often compared as archetypes of the powerful, security-focused insider operating behind a more publicly prominent leader—not as literal equivalents. George Lucas himself reportedly framed the analogy bluntly: George W. Bush as Darth Vader and Cheney as the Emperor, while Palpatine’s original political model was Richard Nixon.
However I’d like to think that the political themes in the prequels had to eventually update and make with the times given how much social and political commentary was made to reflect post 9/11, Bush-Cheney, Iraq War and the War on Terror in general.
Which between Palpatine and Cheney there are some close and realistic parallels:
Palpatine guides, manipulates, and ultimately controls institutions and allies across the Republic
Cheney despite being George W. Bush’s Vice President, became identified with the idea of a powerful behind-the-scenes adviser and executive-branch operator
Palpatine engineers the Naboo crisis and Clone Wars, then uses wartime fear to obtain emergency authority
The post-9/11 security environment enabled Cheney to have an expansive national-security agenda, a stronger executive branch and more executive power that was legal for a Vice President to do at the time
Palpatine receives emergency powers, expands control of the military, and hollow-outs Senate oversight
Cheney advocated strong presidential power, particularly in wartime and national-security matters
Palpatine maintains a benevolent public persona while concealing his Sith identity and larger strategy
Cheney is known for secrecy, closed-door policymaking, and limited public visibility compared with many major officials despite being the most powerful VP in American history; leading to many to call him the real puppet master of the Bush administration
Palpatine exploits legal procedures, Senate rules, bureaucracies, the Jedi, corporations, and military structures
Cheney had deep experience in Congress, the White House, Defense Department, and corporate leadership, giving him unusual institutional fluency
Palpatine directs the clone army, influences the Republic’s war machinery, and handles Separatist corporate interests
Cheney was a defense secretary and later Halliburton CEO; critics connected his worldview closely to defense and security institutions
The closest story details between Sheev Palpatine and Dick Cheney in Revenge of the Sith:
“Emergency powers” parallel: Palpatine gains extraordinary powers through a Senate responding to war; the Cheney comparison usually focuses on how post-9/11 fears heightened acceptance of broad executive and security powers.
The useful frontman parallel: Palpatine makes himself the reassuring institutional leader while others—Amidala, the Jedi, and later Anakin—bear visible political or military burdens. The analogy casts President Bush as the more publicly visible figure and Cheney as the strategic elder shaping major choices.
The apprentice parallel: Palpatine cultivates and grooms Anakin’s anxieties, resentment, and desire for control into being Darth Vader. In Lucas’s words from a 2009 interview, he frames Bush and Cheney’s relationship as being closer to Anakin/Vader: a powerful but less seasoned figure influenced by an older political operator (Dick Cheney)
https://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/19/opinion/19dowd.html?utm\_source=perplexity
War and permanent authority: Palpatine turns a supposedly temporary emergency into a new regime. The Cheney comparison is a critique of the tendency for emergency-era security policies to outlast the immediate crisis—not a claim that the U.S. became the Empire.