u/Brilliant-Spirit-172

-உக்கு மற்றும் -இற்கு வேறுபாடு என்ன?

I am able to write without any mistake in tamil because of you guys. I'm very grateful to y'all. It was because of y'all that I learnt a lot about not only tamil but many other sounds and language. I have been practicing pronouncing tamil right and now I have mastered it. I have also have fallen in love with tamil because of these and learned a lot of grammar rules which decreased my mistakes more.

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

நான் தமிழில் பிழையின்றியெழுதுவதற்கு நீங்கள் - இந்த r/tamil சமூகமே காரணம். உங்களால் தான் நான் பல மொழியைப்பற்றித் ஒலிகளைப்பற்றி தமிழைப் பற்றி பலவற்றைக் கற்றுக்கொண்டேன். நான் சரியானத் தமிழுச்சரிப்பைப் பழகிக்கொண்டிருந்தேன் இப்போது அதை நான் நன்றாக கற்றுக்கொண்டேன். இவற்றினால் தமிழின் மீது எனக்கு பற்றுருவாகியுள்ளது நான் தமிழ் விதிகளைப் பற்றி பல கற்றுள்ளேன். இதனைத்திற்கும்

நன்றி! நன்றி! நன்றி

̃̃̃ண,ந can be replaced with ன. ள, ழ can be replaced with ல.ற can be replaced with ர. if the user prefers.

ஜ is removed (due to ச̬), ஸ் is the only letter used to represent s sound , ஷ் is the only letter used to represent sh ( ʃ ) sound

The wave on lik ñ is going to be used for nasilised vowels.

Ex வேணு̃/வேனு̃ - want (வேண்டும்/வேணும்)

பழோ̃/பழொ̃/பலொ̃/பலோ̃ - fruit (பழம்)

The arrow like ̬ symbol is used to represent voiced Stops and fricative

That is க̬ -Ga ச̬ -Ja ட̬ -Da த̬ -Dha ப̬ -Ba ஸ̬ - Za

ஷ̬ - Zha (ʒ , not ழ)

ஆ̆(ா̆) is used to represent o as in office, ஆ̤ (ா̤) represents a as in apple.

ː or : represents kutt(r)iyalugaram

Ex. பண்ணுː or பண்ணு: Do

ஒருː or ஒரு: a

ஆடுː or ஆடு: Goat

By using these diacritics, spoken tamil can easily be written and understanded in the Tamil script.

Are words like காவல் துறை, காவல் நிலையம், பல் துலக்குதல், பல் துறை, செய்பவள் நீயே (line from tamil Thai vazhthu - bharathidasan) grammatically wrong?

According to Tamil grammar ல் and ள் can't come before வல்லினம் or மெல்லினம் and coming before dental sounds like ந and த is nearly impossible to pronounce.

Are words like காவல் துறை, காவல் நிலையம், பல் துலக்குதல், பல் துறை, செய்பவள் நீயே (line from tamil Thai vazhthu - bharathidasan) grammatically wrong?

According to Tamil grammar ல் and ள் can't come before வல்லினம் or மெல்லினம் and coming before dental sounds like ந and த is nearly impossible to pronounce.

I pronounce "v" as v ( teeth fully touching the bottom lips) and not /ʋ/ (teeth near the bottom lips) pronouncing it as /ʋ/ feels wrong.

Is the v of Dravidian langueges actually v? Am I and the people around me mispronouncing it? Did it get misinterpreted as ʋ due to Sanskrit?

"மாய உலகம்" , "வாழ வேண்டும்" in these words if we look at the sound of அ in மாய , வாழ it sounds like uh , in words like அன்பு, அழகு, the அ in the start sounds like a shorter version of ஆ but that's not the case when it's in the end or middle.

Why? Is there a grammar rule about it?

~ to resemble nasalization like போகனு~ம் , அவ~ன், பழொ~ம்,மரமு~ம்

' before to represent voiced letters which wouldn't normally occur with the rules (inspired by a comment from a deleted user)(can also be used for written tamil)

அ'ப்'பா - Abba , ப'த்மா - Pad(h)ma, 'கௌரி - Gowri

" To represent voicelessness where it wouldn't naturally occur (can also be used for written tamil)

ப்ரஸாந்"த் , கார்த்தி'க்

^ to represent the a sound in colloquial tamil அவள்

அவ^ , இவங்க^

° to represent kutt(r)iyalugaram (optional)

கண்ணு°,பல்லு°, ஒன்னு°

I know what is குற்றியலுகரம். உ which comes after a வல்லினம் (stops) which is in the middle or end is குற்றியலுகரம்.I assume that குற்றியலிகரம்is something similar with இ (or isn't, idk) I also know ஃ, குற்றியலுகரம் and குற்றியலிகரம் are சார்பெழுத்துகள் .

I know that this is a really basic question. I hope I don't offend anyone for not knowing this.

I am a native tamil speaker who is learning Hindi and I learnt that ड़ ढ़ are not the same as ड़ ढ . I looked up many guides for it online but I don't understand any of them. Everyone says that it is the "retroflex version of र " but when I retroflex र , it becomes ष . If they mean the retroflex of English "r", it becomes a retroflex approximate (ழ/ഴ).So I am so confused on the pronunciation of ड़ and ढ़ . Some say it's in Water when said fast but it is aleveolar soo?

If we look at Tamil - the oldest Dravidian language we found proof of, it represents voiced and voiceless stops by the same character, but Ashokan brahmi didn't work that way, if they had borrowed the writing system from Ashokan brahmi, why would they represent voiced and voiceless stops by the same charector?

Sure it could be that they were trying to reduce letters as Tamil grammar was really strict or a previous brahmi was that way and tamil people borrowed it as some people say tamil brahmi or tamizhi is older than Ashokan brahmi.

But it could be that tamil and other Dravidian langueges were using a different script before brahmi which could be like drawings of objects and people and other living things like Egyptian and Indus valley civilization and as that was too hard to write, they moved to brahmi but kept the same letters with a different script?

Tamiḻ has a dental, aleveolar (now r) and retroflex t (த்,ற்,ட்) and a dental, aleveolar and retroflex n (ந்,ன்,ண்) but there's only a aleveolar and a retroflex l (ல்,ள்) .Why?

ஃ,ச,ட,ண,ந,ர,ழ,ள,ற are the usual letters mispronounced in tamiḻ, I won't go into detail but

ஃ - Voiceless velar fricative? - x

ச - Cha at start ,when doubled (ச்ச) /Ja at the end or after ஞ்

ட் - Retroflex t - Ṭ

ண் - Retroflex n - Ṇ

ந் - Dental n - ṉ

ர் - Aleveolar tap

ழ - retroflex approximate l - ḻ

ள - retroflex l - ḷ

ற - aleveolar t (Now an r) - t (Now ṟ)

but when did these started getting mispronounced ?