Sub rules will apply.

The other mods will handle the modding.

Someone get word to Will.

Let's see if he has the stones.

I've never really been in the pet dog world so what I see of it on Reddit is absolutely wild. I theorize that most of these dogs never get the chance to act like actual dogs, because they are thought of as being, and treated, like human children instead. So when they do act like a perfectly normal dog, the owners have no idea what to do because they have never seen an actual dog acting like an actual dog either. This is why people are so immediately out of their depth when they get a puppy that has absolutely no training on it and they are responsible for putting the training on. They have no idea what a puppy actually acts like and they expect it to act like a human child and develop mentally like a human child. Most likely all of their friends treat their dogs like human children as well. And then they are even more susceptible to the misinformation from the positive only cult, which reinforces the idea that dogs are like human children. And then they are off and running on the behavior problem cycle and can never get out of it, because they simply don't know what a normal dog acts like.

Has anyone eaten at the Bonanza since it reopened with new management recently? We used to eat there when we took coastal vacations when it was still run by the Andersons, but I'm a little bit spooked by the new offerings of American, Mexican, and Indian food. I like all of those things but I don't know how one restaurant can be good at all of them. Anyone have any insight or recent experiences to share?

What the title says: is a trainer who claims success with a dog that they just drugged up until it was compliant someone people should go to for advice?

People claiming "success" when really they have just turned to pharmaceuticals are rampant in dog training. What do you think?

I pulled this out of a comment (with permission) as a debate topic:

>I'm sorry I ever did get training treats for [my dog]....he didn't need them, I succumbed to marketing or whatever. Dogs don't need treats, we are the ones that introduce them, we teach the dogs to perform for them and then wean them off of them.

I thought this was a very interesting statement with some truth to it.

Are we doing our dogs a disservice by bribing them with food rewards and then removing the food rewards?

This is AI generated and I found it interesting. What are your thoughts?

When dog training ideologies become rigid and reject biological realities in favor of a one-size-fits-all narrative, the results can indeed be damaging—and sometimes dangerous.

Challenging the "all aggression is fear" paradigm is a critical step toward better animal welfare and public safety. When trainers or owners are forced to view every aggressive act through the lens of anxiety or trauma, several major issues arise:

1. The Danger of Misdiagnosis

If a dog is lunging at a child because it has a high, unchanneled predatory drive, treating that dog as if it is simply "afraid" of the child is a recipe for disaster. Tossing treats to counter-condition a "fear" that doesn't exist won't stop the behavior; it might even inadvertently reward the dog's focus on the target. Understanding that the dog is operating from a place of confident arousal, not fear, drastically changes the safety protocols and training required.

2. The "Unfixable" Dog Myth

One of the most tragic outcomes of rigid training ideologies is what happens when the ideology fails. If a professional operates strictly under the belief that all aggression can be cured by relieving fear (using distance, treats, and avoiding stressors), what happens when they encounter a dog with confident, offensive aggression? Because their specific toolkit doesn't work on that dog, they often conclude that the dog is broken, rather than their methodology. This leads to confident, highly-driven dogs being recommended for behavioral euthanasia simply because they didn't fit into a specific ideological box.

3. Ignoring Canine Genetics

Modern pet culture often tries to strip away a dog's genetic history to treat them like furry humans with complex emotional traumas. But form follows function. A livestock guardian breed was genetically selected to make independent, aggressive decisions to kill predators. A terrier was bred to kill vermin with zero hesitation. Denying the reality of genetics—and insisting that any manifestation of these drives is just "anxiety" or a "lack of socialization"—does a massive disservice to the dog.

4. The Loss of Accountability

When aggression is always framed as an involuntary emotional reaction (fear/stress), it removes the concept of the dog making a choice. However, confident dogs absolutely make choices. They learn that intimidation works. If a dog realizes that snapping makes you drop a piece of steak, and they confidently choose to snap at you the next time you have steak, treating them for "fear" ignores the fact that they simply learned a highly effective, bullying behavior.

By pushing back against these blanket statements, you are advocating for a more ethological, reality-based approach to dog behavior—one that looks at the dog in front of you, rather than the narrative we want to project onto them.

Aside BE and medications, how do you train a dog that is actively aggressive?

I recently ran into a dog trainer who said they are certified force free and don’t use any corrections. I think force free training is great for a lot of training! But do you think there are situations where force free is not adequate? If not, how do you handle situations like this

Breaking this out from the other service dog topic:

It seems that many prominent "assistance dog" organizations have a hidden force-free agenda. They will not validate any trainer or organization that uses tools "at any time, for any reason."

That leads me to ask:

1. Should any talented service dog trainer be barred from validation despite the capabilities of the dogs they produce, simply because they use tools?

2. Should a viable, well trained, and validated service dog be barred from service simply because it was trained with tools?

3. What is more important, the capability of the assistance dog in easing someone's disability, or the way it was trained?

Example: Trainer opts to use a prong collar to train a boisterous juvenile dog to walk more appropriately on a leash. The tool is used for about a month and the dog goes on to exhibit a high level of reliability in its service dog task. Should this trainer and dog be barred from certification/accreditation/participation in the service dog industry?

Reminder, all sub rules still apply.

We are developing a new feature in this sub, which is a structured classic debate. We will identify a topic, and then participants will be assigned a stance, either Pro or Con. Participants will be expected to debate their assigned stance intelligently and effectively. Yes, this means that you may have to defend a stance that you personally do not agree with.

Mods will refrain from participating so that we can moderate effectively. Participation will be limited to people who have been assigned a stance. No one will be permitted to choose their own stance. You might get the one you actually agree with and you might not. You will still have to vigorously defend your stance in a good faith manner.

This post serves both to gauge interest in such an exercise, and to ask for proposed topics for the inaugural structured debate. If we get enough proposed topics that we think have merit, we will post a poll to select the inaugural topic.

So! Is anyone interested in this exercise, and if so, please drop some proposed topics into the comment section.

I am a newbie to the flashlight hobby, it's fun so far!

I got the H1 SST40 in 5000K, the T6 SFT40 in 5000K, and the 3X21C SFT42-R also in 5000K.

The H1 SST40 didn't come with much of a charge, which led me to the slightly unpleasant discovery that the smaller lights don't have a USB charging port; I was supposed to buy a separate battery charger. Live and learn! I sent a message to Simon asking which charger I need to buy. During the short time the beam was active I really liked the light. I look forward to using it more when I can get it charged.

The T6 was fully charged and is my favorite light of the three. It just feels great in the hand and is super bright! That is going to be my daily carry for sure.

The 3x21C was the one I was looking forward to the most. I do really like it but am slightly disappointed at the flood to throw ratio as I wanted more throw, but since I don't have familiarity with the other configurations I'm not sure if I'd like something else better. I haven't had much time to play with it, just a little bit just now, but when I hear the critters come out to play later this evening I'll see if I can spot them with it.

I now see why some of you have so many lights. This is one of those instantly addictive hobbies.

This is USA specific as the requirements for service dogs vary by country.

USA has absolutely no controls over service dogs, their level of training, the "tasks" they perform, the person's actual need for the dog, and the reliability and veracity of the dog's performance, and whether or not the "tasks" actually mitigate a disability.

This has led to an absolute epidemic of "owner trained" dogs doing the most outlandish "tasks" and causing mayhem in public. We have fitness influencers yarding their giant dogs onto planes for clout, random dogs in grocery stores and restaurants, aggressive and disruptive dogs everywhere, with staff and management afraid to confront said owners due to the permissive laws in the USA.

We need:

• Establishment of a validating agency with authority to determine service dog standards and issue (and rescind) licenses and public access
• A ban on "owner trained" dogs with few exceptions for those with demonstrated, validated dog training expertise
• Establishment of a realistic, validated list of acceptable tasks that the dog must reliably perform in order to be a "service dog" and testing to demonstrate that the dog actually performs said tasks and that it benefits the person's actual disability.
• Breed, size, and temperament standards
• Licensing and documentation to be carried at all times after the dog has passed standardized testing, including documentation of vaccinations
• Yearly re-testing of all dogs
• Standardized vesting and badging
• A ban on MOST "service dogs" in restaurants and grocery stores
• A system by which handlers/dogs can be identified and reported for violations

It should not be left to hapless managers to monitor and assess whether a dog is a true "service" dog. The current situation in the USA is much too permissive and needs to be brought under control.

I live in a buggy place and use my red light options as much as possible to reduce the clouds of bloodsuckers. Problem is, none of my red lights are bright enough to really do much of anything when I'm trying to accomplish anything after dark. Anyone have recommendations for headlamps and flashlight with red lights bright enough to be functional for detail work?

The controversy surrounding Denise Fenzi as a speaker at a balanced training conference got me curious so I looked at the rest of the speaker lineup. It seems to me it is 100% comprised of social media dog trainers, few of whom compete or have a significant history in the industry. Who are these people??? They're no one outside of social media, for the most part. People like myself who don't use facebook or instagram have no idea who these people are. Why should we turn the industry over to people with more facebook skills than training skills with more social media posts than they have titles or accomplishments with dogs?

Meanwhile there are many very experienced and accomplished professionals out there absolutely full of knowledge and experience whose contributions are falling by the wayside in favor of some random sitting on a stool in studio lighting running their mouth to the camera?

Is all you have to do to be a dog trainer these days is make a logo and a social media account?!? How can we preserve the vast amount of experience and knowledge that exists outside of the internet in our industry?

Under California Penal code, harming or killing a dog by leaving it in a hot car is a misdemeanor punishable by a $500 fine and up to 6 months in jail. Denise habitually used her vehicle as a management tool to get her dogs out of her house for whatever reason. One day last year, she failed to supervise them adequately while they were closed up in her car, and one of them died a terrible death of heat stroke, and the other barely survived. She blamed her vehicle, saying the air conditioning failed, but that claim doesn't hold up under scrutiny, nor does it eliminate the fact that the vehicle was not supervised and the dogs were not monitored. Should Denise be held accountable legally for the harm she caused to these dogs?

Please justify your answer in the comments. Please keep your answers factual, and be mindful of over emotional and water carrying comments, which will be removed. You must support your stance with a logical explanation.

View Poll

This isn't too scientific. Rather, it's not scientific at all. Just some observations.

I train recall with negative reinforcement via e-collar. Meaning, I estimate working level, stim dog while recalling, release stim the very moment the dog turns towards me. This has never failed me, ever. Takes just a few stims for them to really get the message and then recall from then on is very reliable.

We currently have one of our past puppies, now an adult, in our kennel for long term boarding. This dog has been trained with e collar as more of a high stim correction. I notice a TON of behaviors in this dog that indicate to me overreliance on e-collar, avoidance, and general arousal. For example, he comes out of his kennel and reflexively shakes his head, something I've seen many times in dogs trained with high stim corrections. His arousal level stays high in general, whereas the dogs trained with negative reinforcement readily can settle and reduce their arousal. I also notice he has many compensatory habits such as strange head positions, bouncing, spinning to find position, etc.

TL;DR I really do not like the results I see from dogs trained with e collar as a positive correction.