I've been looking at expanding my collection so I've been going through ebay listings. In the past I've had good luck buying on ebay with decent hatch rates, no deceitful or poor sellers etc. Everyone I've purchased from on ebay always packs their eggs well.

However, it's also been several years since I've bought any online and have been focusing on my own projects. Between then and now I've learned that sellers who ship across state lines need to be NPIP certified, and actually have since become NPIP certified myself. As I am NPIP, it is also a requirement that anyone I buy from (locally or not) is also NPIP or I lose my own certification.

NPIP certification is a biosecurity testing, it varies slightly state by state, but all of them test a % of the sellers birds for AI and PT. Some states also offer extra testing for mycoplasma or other diseases. Once the results come back for a clean flock and pass any additional testing (state-by-state basis) they are given an NPIP number and are certified avian influenza and pullorum-typhoid free.

This is also a LEGAL requirement. It's also a legal requirement that they give you a VS 9-3 form, either a real paper but most commonly nowadays via email. Some places may only offer it on request. Hatcheries are supposed to send you one also but for some reason they generally don't, but you can request one. A VS 9-3 is actually useless to you unless you are NPIP also, but it's another form of proof that the seller is NPIP certified.

This week I've been going through and messaging sellers asking for their NPIP number. A surprising amount of them do not have one, or they just read my message and don't answer (which is an answer in itself). These people are not certified AI/PT clean and have not made any efforts to be a reputable seller. Most people who have gone through the tremendous effort to become NPIP certified (it's a huge ordeal, generally hours worth or a full day of testing, they often inspect your facility and your processes, it's not easy, and it costs money to get it done as well) will proudly proclaim their number for everyone to see - they won't make it a secret.

Once you get that person's NPIP number, you can go to https://www.poultryimprovement.org/statesContent.cfm and click the state the seller is originating from and look them up to see if they're legit. Being able to look them up also helps you weed out scammers on Facebook - if they give you information that doesn't match up, guess what, it's a scammer. There are also stock code numbers on the person's listing that shows what kind of birds they have had tested - so if someone is shipping quail eggs but they don't have the quail code "Z93" next to their name - that's another sign something is awry.

(Here is the stock code list https://www.poultryimprovement.org/documents/Stock-Codes-Alphabetical.pdf)

TLDR: a lot of sellers online are not actually certified to ship eggs across state lines. ask for their NPIP number. NPIP numbers also help you verify if someone is a scammer or not.

Had them cooped up for around 5, 6 months. About 3 of them out of 8 will return to the coop, sometimes they sit on top of it or next to it on the ground. Most nights I just walk over there and herd them around the corner to the door, because they seem to continually forget where the door is even when their lights are on inside, but it is getting really old really fast.

But the part that's getting REAL OLD RIGHT NOW????

We have a perimeter fence around our property to keep multiple species in and multiple species out. However, the guineas, obviously, find their way out on a daily basis. Not all of them, but usually 3 or 4 of them. I think perhaps on accident, because there's no way these birds do anything intentionally? I don't think they are even aware they can fly, I think it surprises them when they do it. Because they definitely aren't aware that they can come back in the same way they went out. The one time I managed to herd one back OVER the fence was an absolute accident on his part and I should have bought a lottery ticket immediately because luck was really shining on me.

Anyway, it's getting real old going outside perimeter, to the guineas, herding them back to the entrance... 1-2x a day. We're not on a small amount of property, so this is not super convenient. We're also in a thick, old forest, full of poison ivy and brambles so navigating out there as a human is difficult.

Someone told me to cut holes in the fence for the guineas and I was like, uh, really defeats the purpose of having a fence, don't it?

I feel obligated to care for these stupid birds so I want to make sure they come back and are safe at night. But they are actively working against me.

I mean really, do I just give up and let them do whatever? This never gets better, does it? I think I'm just looking for commiseration. Because I'm pretty sure there's no real advice for this.

Had them cooped up for around 5, 6 months. About 3 of them out of 8 will return to the coop, sometimes they sit on top of it or next to it on the ground. Most nights I just walk over there and herd them around the corner to the door, because they seem to continually forget where the door is even when their lights are on inside, but it is getting really old really fast.

But the part that's getting REAL OLD RIGHT NOW????

We have a perimeter fence around our property to keep multiple species in and multiple species out. However, the guineas, obviously, find their way out on a daily basis. Not all of them, but usually 3 or 4 of them. I think perhaps on accident, because there's no way these birds do anything intentionally? I don't think they are even aware they can fly, I think it surprises them when they do it. Because they definitely aren't aware that they can come back in the same way they went out. The one time I managed to herd one back OVER the fence was an absolute accident on his part and I should have bought a lottery ticket immediately because luck was really shining on me.

Anyway, it's getting real old going outside perimeter, to the guineas, herding them back to the entrance... 1-2x a day. We're not on a small amount of property, so this is not super convenient. We're also in a thick, old forest, full of poison ivy and brambles so navigating out there as a human is difficult.

Someone told me to cut holes in the fence for the guineas and I was like, uh, really defeats the purpose of having a fence, don't it?

I feel obligated to care for these stupid birds so I want to make sure they come back and are safe at night. But they are actively working against me.

I mean really, do I just give up and let them do whatever? This never gets better, does it? I think I'm just looking for commiseration. Because I'm pretty sure there's no real advice for this.

I had my girl spayed this week. I originally noticed blood in her urine and on her wheel. I loaded her up to the vet with a urine sample (put plastic wrap under the wheel and go pack it up in a small dish or syringe in the morning - doing a live urine catch on a hedgehog would be miserable) and off to the vet we went. Do note this vet does see exotics but they aren't equipped with an exotics surgery room.

#Vet visit #1 total $304

• exotic exam $63
• fecal analysis $42 (optional - I brought it in just because I could)
• urinalysis $62
• xrays 2view SMV/lateral $177
• discount (not sure what the code is for) -$40

Urine was more blood than anything else. Was obviously not a UTI and we were subsequently sent to surgical consult at an exotics vet hospital.

#Vet visit #2 at vet surgical hospital total $80

• consult exam: $80

Consult was straightforward but did feel like a waste of a time/money, though we were consulting with the vet who would be performing the procedure this time.

#Vet visit #3 - the surgery itself total $583.01

• Exam pre surgery/sedation $55
• Preanesthetic small mammal $38
• Meloxicam injection $19.93
• Anesthesia isoflurane $60
• Surgical patient monitoring $60
• Surgical nerve block $48
• Small exotic mammal spay/neuter procedure $225
• Surgery suite $45
• Medical waste disposal $3.50
• Tramadol RX (take home) $10.08
• Meloxicam RX (take home) $18.50

Our post-op appointment is in a few days - I'm currently unsure if the post-op appt fee is wrapped up with the cost of the surgery like it is in human medicine or if that will be an additional charge. There's no external stitches to remove, it's most likely an "is she OK, it looks OK, all's good, you can continue on with your life" type of visit.

Total so far: $967.01

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##Some additional notes & fun facts:

We were originally quoted $600-800 for the cost. Going over the itemized bill things are billed per unit (dose) of medicine or per minute (the isoflurane was charged at 15 minutes). So depending on how long it takes or how much medicine is pushed the charge will be higher or lower. Our surgeon said it was pretty straight-forward, there is some "work" involved in scraping the ovaries out of the cavity and mostly they do the best they can but it's not like just plucking a grape from a vine. Risk vs reward comes in to play. They don't want to keep animals under anesthesia longer than necessary and she said the uterus didn't look diseased so she didn't feel like digging in there longer than she had to.

Speaking of diseased uterus. The medical waste disposal. We didn't send the uterus off to pathology to be tested for cancer because it doesn't really change the outcome unless it does come back positive and you want to spend a lot of money on chemotherapies etc. So sending off to pathology would cost more, but you do need to pay for having it incinerated.

The charge for the surgery suite. Vets book/"rent" the surgery suite out for your procedures and have to pay to use it, which means you pay to use it. It's the same in human medicine. It's also the same in salons - your hairdresser is renting the booth in the salon just like renting an apartment. You pay for it!

The medication mix: just for funsies, in the preanesthetic was hydromorphone, midazolam and alfaxalone.

XRAY terminology. The x-rays taken was a "bottom up" view - the SMV aka submentovertex. It means the beam is shooting through the sub(bottom) of the mentum(chin) through and coming out the vertex (top of the head). The SMV is also an xray view for humans for TMJ. In animals it can also kinda be called AP - anteroposterior - which means the beam is going through your anterior (front) and out the posterior (back). Then the lateral view, which is, well, the lateral. From the side. In humans we most frequently do a left lateral (which means you are laying on your left side), in veterinary it's most often the right lateral for some reason, I don't know why.

#LAST BUT NOT LEAST... how do you give a hedgehog liquid medication?

This was a frustrating part for me. I put it on her food the first night, hoping she would eat it with her food. Unfortunately she wasn't really interested in eating at all and when she did go to eat she must have tasted the medication and changed her mind. Which means I had to make her take it somehow. Hedgehogs are not known for cooperating. She would ball up when trying to give her anything. Fortunately there is a spot on their back that you can stroke that makes them unball long enough to wedge the tip of the medicine syringe into the corner of their mouth and get some in. It takes some time, it can be very frustrating, but you need to be kind and be patient. You just stroke - they will huff and puff and unball briefly - keep trying and it'll take a few minutes to do it. It only takes me 2 minutes every 12hrs.

YOU CAN NOT SKIP GIVING YOUR HEDGEHOG MEDICATION. This is cruel. Imagine you were given no pain meds after a serious surgery? How awful that would be, how painful and horrible. You cannot skip this.

I have a video on my social media, which I'm not going to post here (but you can DM me if you want to know and I'll send you the link privately), that shows how to do it and how easy it actually is.

###My thoughts overall...

I did not enjoy this at all. I am lucky I can afford it, but this was a cost I was not prepared for at this moment. I put it all on credit. Hedgehogs are not cheap pets. Hedgehogs are prone to cancers and neoplasias and your female will almost guaranteed need to be spayed at some point in their lifetime. So I knew she'd need to have it done at some point, yknow, but maybe not like... right now. But now we've got that over with and can move forward. We've taken some steps back in our bonding process because now instead of associating me with free-roam playtime and bug hunting, she now associates me with interruptions and yucky forced medications.

I think it's about time for me to start letting my guineas out of their coop. I purchased 8 of them from TSC when they were already around 2-ish weeks old, maybe, so I estimate they're about 10-11 weeks old now. They've been cooped outside for almost 5 weeks now. I'm hoping this is long enough to help establish this as home?

I also have them in with 3 chickens they were brooded with, but there appears to be two clear different 'gangs' in there and they don't really hang out together the way I'd hoped they would so I don't have a lot of hope in them following the chickens.

I've read to let 1 out at a time, so they want to come back. And then next day do two at a time, three at a time and so forth. I did try this briefly to see how it would work and I let 1 chicken and 1 guinea out, but boy howdy it was really hard to catch them to get them out the door.

Can y'all give me tips or walk me through how you did this? I am fully aware that this might not work out the way I want it to and I'm ready to accept that, but I want to at least try.

I do have around 80 other chickens in my main LF flock they'll be hanging out with, free ranging in a forest. I suspect the 3 chickens they're in with will eventually gravitate toward my main flock and the guineas will remain in their own gang.