I know this might sound far-fetched but bear with me. Same arguments, same anecdotes, same dismissal of scientific evidence, same disbelief in what vets tell them.

A few examples:

But but “it’s natural” that’s what “they evolved” to do!!!

While outdoor cat owners claim there cats are only semi-domesticated and comparable to wild animals the dog equivalent takes it up a notch or two, comparing dogs to wolves. Ignoring thousands of years of domestication, nutritional science, the risks of nutritionally unbalanced diets, bacterial contamination, bone injuries…

But but my pet is thriving!!!

Keeping them indoors is cruel, cats need to hunt, my cat has never had a problem… The dog equivalent of this; dogs are meant to eat raw, kibble is unnatural, my dog has never gotten Salmonella.

The arguments are the same, and so are the anecdotes:

Dog owner feeding raw: “My dog’s coat has never been shinier!”
Outdoor cat owners: “My cat would be miserable indoors!”

The reasoning is the same, something is “natural”, therefore it MUST be healthier or better. A classic example of the appeal to nature fallacy combined with a dose of anecdotal evidence and survivorship bias. A pet can appear healthy while still being exposed to unnecessary risks.

Last but not least, there’s the similarity in how incredibly easy and straightforward it is to mitigate virtually every risk.

For outdoor cat owners:
a catio (with the door closed), leash walking, a fenced-off garden, or simply keeping your cat entertained indoors.

For raw feeders, it’s even easier: Drumroll, please… Cooking. Yes, just cook the goddamn meat like we’ve been doing for centuries. That’s all it takes.

Defending the method over welfare!

If your argument is that your dog must eat raw despite the avoidable risks, you’re defending the method and not the nutrition.

The same applies to outdoor cats. If your argument is that your cat must roam freely despite the avoidable risks, you’re defending unrestricted outdoor access and not your cat’s welfare.

We sure have had a lot of big puppy mill news today! It seems this is the one issue that can unite Americans.

The New York ban on the sale of puppies in pet stores is being enforced!

Hi everyone!

I’m new to the sub and work as a researcher in aquatic husbandry & animal welfare (this isn’t a research/survey request, don’t worry!), so I apologize if this is a frivolous question.

My professional experience is not with canids, so I was surprised to see that this sub considers dog ownership in general unethical. I’ve read some posts already, but wanted to get a better understanding directly from you all: What are this sub’s main concerns with dog ownership? I can go hard into the breeding/genetics aspect as that is what I directly research and have an understanding of. TYIA :)

“I bought my Frenchy from an ethical breeder!”

Here’s your Ethical Sticker™. Thank you for making the choice you already wanted to make.

Somehow we’ve turned “ethical” into a marketing adjective that gets slapped onto anything so people can feel morally good while doing it. It’s not enough to make a personal choice… they also need everyone else to reassure them they are a wonderful person for it.

Meanwhile, shelters are overflowing, healthy dogs are euthanized every day, and we’re having philosophical debates about whether paying thousands for a pedigree bred health mess is a humanitarian act.

Sometimes the ethical option means accepting that you don’t get exactly what you want. But apparently that’s become an outrageous suggestion. Everyone believes wanting something automatically entitles them to the Ethical Sticker™. Preferably with applause and medal ceremony.

The goal isn’t doing what is ethical anymore. It’s with making sure the thing you wanted to do gets rebranded as “ethical” so nobody can question it.

No, not every decision earns a participation trophy. Sometimes you just make a choice, and that’s all it is.

I know this post will get downvoted, and I don’t care. I just wanted to show some praise for those putting in their free time, money, and effort to fight a problem they didn’t even create to begin with.

The reputation of rescues is somewhere down at the bottom of the Mariana Trench. With bad actors mislabeling dogs or hiding bite history, which is really bad. But the hatred on Reddit right now just goes way overboard, and it’s not productive at all.
It’s ridiculous how the people cleaning up the mess get more hate than those who create it.

Breeders are worshipped and praised with titles like “ethical breeder” and with arguments about how they are not making money off it, spending soooo much money on health testing (for the issues they themselves created in the first place). They’re framed as somehow doing public good, while shelters are broadly scrutinized for cleaning up the mess.

Ethical rescues are lumped in with the bad ones and even threatened by the public when they do BE unrehomable dogs or dogs with bite histories. The no-kill movement is a thorn in the eye for them just as much as anyone else.

They are expected to have unlimited resources, only offer the breed the person wants, deliver healthy dogs, have no waiting lists, and then get criticized for taking in dogs from pedigree or non-pedigree breeders. Dogs that would otherwise end up somewhere down the drain if it wasn’t for them.

And then when they do take lots of precautions and maintain high standards, I see them getting criticized again by people who are angry they weren’t “the chosen one” or because the standards are “too high”. It feels like they can never win regardless of what they do.

I hope we can share some positivity toward our much needed ethical shelter workers. They truly aren’t doing this for profit, unlike the breeders.

I know it’s a bit random, but crabs (specifically true crabs) have always been a favorite animal of mine. I’d love to keep one as a pet one day, but only if it can be done ethically.

Hermit crabs are a somewhat common pet but I hardly hear about true crabs. I know it’s controversial because they’re very difficult to breed in captivity, so unfortunately most crabs in the pet trade are wild caught.

But are there any ways they can be ethically obtained and cared for? Maybe a certain species that are easier to breed, or have a breeder or two who have figured it out? Are there rescue crabs lol?

I dont mean to spam. Just wanted to rant.

I see lots of (understandable and good) hate towards the breeding of toadline bullies. Yet i cant help but think if the great and big AKC liked them and had them as a breed, the defense of their breeding would increase dramatically.

For whatever reason, lots of people worship the AKC for making their own bullshit and allowing bullshit from parent clubs. Why? Because they're health tested.. So the pug that cant breath doesnt matter because it ran for 10 minutes or so. It doesnt matter because it is up to conformation and the parents are health tested and also can run for 10 minutes.

A breeder could health test, exercise, fulfill, feed well, take good basic care of the dogs, socialize, does ENS, but none of it matters all because the dogs ain't purebred. I dont plan at breeding at all, but for example: i take my 10 pound chihuahua with another out of conformation chihuahua and bred them while doing the things listed above. These dogs can have the best temperment ever but it wont matter if they arent up to physical breed standards.

You could do all the things listed about and get grouped in with bybs all because they aint up to conformation or they aint purebred. But breeding pugs and frenchies is "ethical" because they have health tests and fit their lovely conformation standards!

For example, the JRTCA does not like associating with the AKC for this reason. The AKC does focus on looks more than purpose and its another reason as to why jack russells arent always purebred if i remember currectly per JRTCA standards. People would probably say the JRTCA or any other breed club like it are "bad" because of not associating with the AKC.