2 weeks ago I underwent a septoplasty with turbinate reduction. I really wish I found this subreddit beforehand, but here we are. Things are going okay so far, and I hope they continue this way, but there are reports here of people developing ENS months/years after their surgery. Is there anything one can do post-surgery to prevent drying/damage of the nasal mucosa?
My brother had septoplasty 3 months ago
At first month he feels so scared when he having crust in nose and getting too scared
2nd month he started taking medicine of anxiety given by doctor coz hes feeling his chest very lighter like cotton
3 month when he breath still feels his chest lighter and stomach lighter
I’ve tried all doctor some says time will recover him, some say anxiety hes so fuck*d up. Anyone please help me
My brother had septoplasty 3 months ago
At first month he feels so scared when he having crust in nose and getting too scared
2nd month he started taking medicine of anxiety given by doctor coz hes feeling his chest very lighter like cotton
3 month when he breath still feels his chest lighter and stomach lighter
I’ve tried all doctor some says time will recover him, some say anxiety hes so fuck*d up. Anyone please help me
28m Recovery started of smoothly, then noticed a whistle followed by dryness around week 4. This went on for a while whereby I would get dryness and soreness in both nostril. Tonight out of nowhere after a rinse I can feel air going straight into my throat. Is this how it starts? I’m terrified of this illness, I’m worried I’m going to loose everything and not being able to live a normal life
I know the first thing people will say is, "dont get a turbinate reduction". But please consider my current predicament. It is simply a fact that my turbinates are swollen and I have a slightly deviated septum. Three ENTs have said so and is clearly visible in a CT scan. When I'm in bed it feels like I am breathing through a cocktail straw. I have lived with this for my whole life until this past year when I developed severe daytime fatigue. I'll be honest, this has since ruined my life. I cant work or function like myself. I have since been diagnosed with OSA with a baseline AHI of 22. I have been using CPAP for 9 months and it has effectively dropped my AHI to 1.8. Although, because I am always huffing for air through my nose, I have extremely disruptive aerophagia that wakes me up multiple times a night. I also suspect UARS. 90% of my fatigue remains on CPAP. I was a week away from getting a turbinate reduction and tonsillectomy before I told my surgeon my concerns about ENS and opted to just get the tonsillectomy. He clearly conveyed that these concerns are overblown, but accepted my decision. This operation was successful, dropping my baseline AHI, fixing my snoring and reducing my fatigue to 75%. Although, this is still not enough to work or be a contributing member of society.
I am not considering this operation to breathe better for the fun of it, rather I am hoping it can fix a truly life altering concern. The stakes are incredibly high, I simply cannot live with such consistent, disruptive fatigue. All evidence points to a turbinate reduction being an obvious next step but because my life is already so challenging, I genuinely could not afford another condition like ENS. Because it has been a year of chronic fatigue, I have non-ENT doctors suggesting I have CFS/ME. Although, I cannot in my right mind restrict my activity level and write off having a normal life before doing everything I can first. It also seems insane to consider MMA, palate expansion, inspire, and other incredibly invasive surgeries before trying a turbinate reduction.
I have been considering trialing nightly afrin to see if addressing my nasal breathing could even help with my fatigue. Although I have experienced afrin "addiction" years ago, and I know that is an extremely short term solution and I may need more time to see an effect.
In a nutshell, this surgery is like going all-in at the poker table with a 80-90% chance of nothing happening, 10-20% chance to give me my life back, and an ambiguous chance to develop ENS.
The turbinate on my left side (1st pic) is pinned up against the outer wall after my surgery as compare to my right (2nd pic) which has a little air gap underneath the curl. ENS issue are much worse on my left side and I'm convinced this might be a potential culprit. It remains relatively unchanged throughout the nasal cycle and will trap mucus in there and cause pressure. I mentioned to my ENT and he's unconvinced it causes issues and is skeptical to perform an infracture on me to correct. Anyone else have insight or had something similar?
I choke on too much air. Thats the only way to describe it. What can I say to my new therapist in a way he might understand? I struggle coming up with the right words, especially in the moment. I get nervous, emotional.
Hi everyone,
I have ENS-type symptoms after nasal surgery and a few questions for ens type patients.
Neuromodulators (gabapentin, pregabalin etc.)
Has anyone tried them? What were the results, dosage and side effects?
PRP
Has anyone tried PRP? How many sessions, results and how long did benefits last?
Cotton test & Lidocaine test
Was it worth doing? Did positive results help confirm ENS and guide treatment?
How to know if it's ENS-type
How can I tell if my symptoms are true ENS-type versus neuropathy, dysesthesia, or other conditions with similar symptoms?
Any experiences appreciated. Thanks.
Yesterday I had Bimax surgery to solve my UARS/OSA sleeping problems. Even though i told my surgeon that i didnt want my turbinates touched, he saw they were very hypertrophic and perform total mucosal resection of the medial face, leaving the bone and under and over the turbinate. The surgery itself went well, but I’m furious and kind of afraid. I underwent this because my condition was causing me to be suicidal, and wouldn’t want to deal with somelse, moreover I explicitely told him…
Hei.
Jeg lurer på om det finnes andre i Norge som har eller kjenner til Empty Nose Syndrome (ENS)?
Jeg utviklet alvorlige problemer etter neseoperasjon/turbinatkirurgi. Selv om nesen føles åpen, opplever jeg konstant følelse av å ikke få nok luft, tørrhet, søvnproblemer, uro i kroppen og en merkelig følelse av at pustingen ikke fungerer normalt. Det påvirker livskvaliteten veldig mye.
Mange leger virker ikke å kjenne til tilstanden, så jeg lurer på om noen her i Norge har fått hjelp eller møtt en ØNH-lege som faktisk har erfaring med ENS?
Finnes det noen klinikker eller leger i Norge som tilbyr behandling, for eksempel implantater eller andre typer rekonstruktiv behandling?
Setter stor pris på alle svar eller erfaringer.
I have had many surgeries on my nose for several things mostly structure and valves but I have also had two turbinate reductions. The turbinate reductions were done by a different doctor than my nasal valves which I just had done. During my follow up the other day I told the doctor I still cannot feel air passing through my nose. He told me I might have ENS but to wait a year to see if the nasal valve affected the nerves and returns. Do you think this is a valid take or should I talk to a different doctor about this? I have all the symptoms but I guess I just mouth breathe mostly now and try to ignore the symptoms. I am afraid I wait a year and I will just be gas lit by the doctor saying its too rare and not possible etc
I’ve been trying to understand the actual physiology behind why ENS feels so overwhelming — the air hunger, the inability to relax, waking up in a panic. Most medical sources either dismiss it or just say “anxiety.”
What I’ve been looking for is a system-level explanation: why does losing turbinate tissue cascade into autonomic dysfunction, hypocapnia, baroreflex suppression, and sleep fragmentation? Has anyone come across resources that actually connect all those dots?
I recently found something that goes through it subsystem by subsystem — the trigeminal signalling, SAR/RAR imbalance, CO₂ dysregulation, the role of the insula and amygdala — and it finally made things click for me. I’m happy to share the link if anyone’s interested.
https://ensmemorial.blogspot.com/2025/11/why-empty-nose-syndrome-causes-severe.html?m=1
So this would be roughly around two years back when I hit my nose. I have always had a slight left side septum deviation and some right side nasal blockage but it was manageable.
After the hit it became quite pronounced and the blockage started to persist in the right nostril (also some sort of protrusion developed on the right outer nose)
The blockage is manageable during the daytime but at night I think I've resorted to mouth breathing and wake up really agitated with a dry throat.
What do you think should be the best way for me to treat this?
I had a nasal endoscopy done a few weeks back and the doctor straight away reported me going forward with septum deviation and a laser-based surgery for turbinate reduction but I was sceptical and eversince looking forward to some other methods to solve this
Hi. I've previously posted on reddit regarding my incredibly bad sleep for the last ~5 months due to turbinate hypertrophy. I've essentially tried everything (including Buteyko breathing, I score 25-30 now and it has given me 0 improvement regarding my sleep and hypertrophy), diet, saline cleanses, allergy drugs (different kinds), corticosteroid sprays (like Dymista), sleeping upright, nasal dilators (like breathe right strips), etc. Nothing works. I've tried for literally months now. I workout regularly (even though it has been very difficult with this low energy). I also don't have a narrow jaw and I have asked my doctors regarding this and they all said it would be pointless in my case. I don't have a deviated septum either.
I am trying to be very specific here, as when I make these posts, people tend to steer away from the particular thing I'm asking for (help with spray advice and/or turbinate reduction) and I usually get suggestions that I know won't help me that are unrelated to my question.
I already had a visit with an ENT known to be very aware of ENS (I believe he even treats it to some extent) and he recommended CELON reduction with an endoscope, but a very conservative one (since he is aware of my fear of ENS). I've heard other people get it with him and they feel great now. Reference video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4_5g0b7Nec
Before I get the surgery, one thing I saw is that people seem to be micro-dosing oxymetazoline (mixing saline with a very low amount of it) and it seems that it can be used long-term. This is similar to Allermi, but even a lower dose. I tried it yesterday (mixed half a bottle of saline with a tiny amount of my oxymetazoline spray) and while it didn't unblock my nose fully, it definitely helped me sleep a tiny bit better.
Has anyone tried this for an extended period of time? Have you gotten rebound congestion? For example, I have a person in my friend group that has been using oxymetazoline sprays (full dosage) for ~10 years and he seems to be doing just fine (no crazy side effects). So I am really questioning whether all of the side effects that are listed are always applicable, especially at lower doses. There is quite a lot of research regarding this, for example here's one for Allermi which is at 0.0125ml which is significantly lower than Afrin (0.5 mg). https://www.jacionline.org/article/S0091-6749(25)01934-7/pdf
Curious to hear about peoples' experience with this.
I’ll go from easy to hardest. Short-term to long-term. I’ve done all this things and they have had a positive impact on my turbinate hypertrophy, mechanical breathing, nervous system. Etc.
Wash Sheets.
Chew raw garlic.
Eat cayenne pepper and other spicy foods
Go on a jog.
Neck Fascia stretches
Fast for 18+ hours
Do a heavy workout. (Pull ups)
Sleep flat with no pillow on back on a Japanese futon.
Take Cold Showers
Take NAD+ supplements for a month
Start a keto diet for a few days
Cut Sugar and carbs.
Lower body fat %
Switch from coffee to tea.
How common of a symptom are dry eyes? In the beginning it started with just blurred vision. Then I started feeling some eye pain and headaches in the back of my head. Now every morning when I wake up I can feel the dryness behind my eyes and gotta use drops throughout the day. Eye crusts forming around my eyes all the time too. Looking at screens for 14-15 hours a day doesn't make it any better either 🤣
I have ENS and looking for implant surgery opinions if anyone underwent through Citardi/Das or any other doctor ?
21 years back I had a sinus + septoplasty nasal surgery (both my inferior turbinates were almost removed by doctor in that surgery - one side complete, other side almost - it is 90%+ turbinates removed on both sides. Actually for this surgery he should not remove but he removed), immediately after surgery I got ENS . This screwed up my entire life and I got many other health issues due to ENS. I used to have suffocation, no air sensation, no moisture, severe nasal dryness etc. Until few years back I dont know that these symptoms comes under ENS and through some doctor came to know about it and he suggested to meet Nayak. I got rib cartilage implants with Nayak few years back - it improved my symptoms but did not fix all my problems. I did not see much improvement in dryness even after implants - its almost same. I would say it brought me from severe ENS to moderate ENS in all symptoms except dryness. I have continuous dryness even now which impacts my productivity a lot. One reason is that on left nostril, tissues got broke during surgery, so Nayak could not implant much on left side and it is almost open. On the right side he implanted but still I have dryness, it requires further augmentation as there are gaps. Based on my understanding even 1mm less turbinate can cause huge difference in airflow. I was working with Nayak and he suggested I might require one more surgery. I scheduled follow up appointment last year to re-evaluate my condition but all of a sudden he went to Sabbatical and appointment was cancelled. I waited for him till now but based on discussion with his team he might not come back to see patients it seems.
To my knowledge, in USA Steven Houser, Nayak, Das and Citardi are doctors who treat ENS. Among them Houser is not taking ENS patients, Nayak is in Sabbatical and might not come back to see patients. Nayak is very good doctor for ENS but he is not seeing any patients now. So I met Citardi and he did cotton test which turned out to be positive and he told he would like to do surgery using Bovine Derived Collagen Matrix.
I had virtual appointment with Das too where he talked about rib implants, injection treatments to treat ENS and he wants me to visit in-person to evaluate further. I did not visit Das in-person yet.
ENS is very complex as materials (rib cartilage, alloderm, bovine derived collagen matrix - BDCM etc) being used, placement of material, surgeon experience in carefully creating submucosal pocket matters a lot. Rib cartilage is very good material for implants but not all doctors use it as it requires very technical expertise. Among Citardi and Das, Das uses rib cartilage implants whereas Citardi prefers BDCM. I asked Citardi explicitly if he is fine in doing rib cartilage - he told he prefers BDCM
Nayak uses IMAP (inferior meatus augmentation procedure) whereas Citardi uses Augmentation Turbinoplasty. Das does not do IMAP and he places rib cartilage implants at different place.
Based on my analysis I saw many negative reviews on regenerative treatments (PRP/Acell/Fat grafting etc). So I wanted to undergo implant surgery and unable to make a choice between Citardi and Das. I have seen many negative reviews on Das for injections and few negative reviews on his implants where he placed implant at wrong location which caused many more problems to patient. There is so much of confusion on which is right.
I wanted to know if anyone in this community can suggest their experiences with Citardi/Das and who is good for implants ? If anyone has undergone implants with any of these doctors kindly share your experience. Data with BDCM is very less and not sure if that material gets absorbed over a period of time requiring repetitive surgeries. I got many surgeries in my life and among them 5 are nasal surgeries. So I don’t want to have again and again. Rib implants if done correctly it will be for long term but only Das does that now. I dont see enough positive reviews on him for implants. Reviews on Citardi in google are good but those are general ENT related but not on ENS.
Also if there are any other doctors who can treat ENS condition (preferably rib cartilage implants), please kindly share it would be helpful.
Because we have had a lot of questions from people who are planning on getting surgery, I wrote this article. Please let me know if you feel something is missing.
Hi, had a turbinate reduction 7 months ago and have been back multiple times to ENT cause my issues are still apparent. When I have both nostrils unblocked, I only really feel like I’m breathing through my right one. When I block the right one with my finger, I can breathe and don’t feel any sense of suffocation. Idk what’s going on with my nose but it’s been like this pretty much from a month post op to now. My surgeon offered me more surgery to help since he saw inflammation in my left nostril at my most recent procedure but I’m hesitant. Has anyone had this experience and then develop ENS down the line? My turbinates are still mostly there and I can feel the sensation of menthol when I use a stick so I know TRPM8 still has function.