u/FNAF_Professor

Have some Adam art y'all cuz I am so pissed right now. So apparently the Season 2 Blu ray commentary confirms that we don’t see anyone in Heaven mourning Adam because nobody liked him and they’re probably glad he’s gone.

Yeah I call bullshit.

And before anyone says "Adam was an asshole!" I KNOW. That’s not the damn point.

The problem is that the show established Adam as a fucking celebrity. This man is a rock star. He performs gigs. He’s famous enough that his status is basically common knowledge. He’s implied to have had a ridiculous number of relationships. And on top of that, he’s literally the father of humanity. If we’re talking about Heaven’s population, Adam should have an absolutely enormous amount of cultural and historical significance by default.

And nothing in Season 1 suggested that Adam was universally despised by the Winners, either. In fact, Adam seems perfectly comfortable in Heaven. He’s happy, confident, social, and clearly feels like he belongs there. Most importantly, his hatred is directed overwhelmingly toward SINNERS. There’s no indication that he’s walking around Heaven treating every Winner like shit and being universally hated by everyone around him.

So apparently we’re supposed to believe that this famous rock star, the literal first human, who has had numerous relationships and presumably spent thousands of years interacting with Heaven’s population, had zero people who actually liked him? Not one fan? Not one friend? Not one former partner who was upset? Not one person who appreciated his music? Not one Winner who thought, "Damn, Adam was an asshole, but I’m still going to miss him"? Nah, apparently the only person in Heaven who cared that Adam died was Lute, because that makes perfect sense!

And it's such an extreme writing choice that it actually makes the world feel smaller and less complex than what they want it to be. Because here’s the thing: Being an asshole does not make someone universally disliked.

There are plenty of celebrities and public figures who are arrogant, abrasive, controversial, or outright awful people while still having massive fanbases. Human beings are complicated. People can admire someone’s talent while disliking their personality. Someone can be a terrible person to you and still have friends who love them. Someone can be an asshole and still have people who genuinely mourn them when they’re gone. That’s how social relationships work.

And I’m not even saying EVERYONE should've mourned Adam. Of course some people in Heaven could hate him! Hell, I would actually expect that.

I’m saying that "nobody liked him and everyone is probably happy he’s dead" is an incredibly broad statement that doesn’t mesh well with the character’s established social status.

And honestly, this is part of why I’m so frustrated with how Adam has been handled. Vivziepop has repeatedly talked about loving Adam as a character, but the writing increasingly seems determined to remove anything that could make him an interesting or complicated person outside of being an asshole.

He’s a celebrity? Cool, but apparently nobody actually likes him.

He’s the first man? Cool, but apparently that doesn’t matter socially.

He’s had tons of relationships? Cool, but apparently none of those people cared about him.

He’s capable of being charismatic and entertaining? Cool, but apparently that doesn’t translate into anyone actually enjoying his presence.

At some point, you have to ask: what is the point of establishing these traits if the world around him is written as though they don’t actually have any social consequences?

And no, I don’t need Adam to secretly be a misunderstood sweetheart.

I just want the world to acknowledge that a person can be an asshole and still be a person.

Give me people who loved him. Give me people who hated him. Give me people who were conflicted about him. Give me former friends who admit he was awful but still miss him. Give me fans who are devastated that their favorite musician is dead. Give me Heaven actually reacting to the death of someone who was an incredibly famous and historically significant figure. That would make Adam feel like a real character who existed in a real society.

"Everyone hated him anyway" just feels like the narrative saying "Don’t worry, guys, we don’t have to feel complicated about this. He’s dead, and nobody cares."

And that’s exactly the kind of thing that makes me feel like the writers are more interested in making sure Adam remains a hate sink than actually exploring the character they created. Which might as well be true at this point. Adam deserves better than Vivziepop's bullshit.

I made one! Everyone is free to join! https://discord.gg/RrHPQwHhJ I'll post the link in the comments too! Feel free to suggest any tweaks I could make to the server! I'm also accepting mods! As of now the mods of the sub aren't part of the server.

People are upset and calling it pointless because all she did was remove the last letter of her name. This really upsets me because y'all would NOT be saying this shit if Vaggi changed her name because she's trans, even though it's damn near the same thing. Trans people change their names to take charge of their identity. Vaggi changed it to do the same thing, just not in a gender related way.

A name doesn’t become meaningful because you changed 15 letters instead of one. It’s HER name. She’s the one who gets to decide what she wants to be called. The entire point of Vaggi’s arc is that Adam gave her that name. The same person who abused her, abused her fellow Exorcists, and ultimately treated her like she was disposable. For a long time, she allowed the identity he gave her to remain part of who she was. Now she’s choosing her own identity.

"But she only changed one letter!" Mf the fact that she didn’t completely reinvent her name is part of the point. I've seen people upset because Adam named her after "vagina" yet she didn't change her name to sound very different from the original degrading name he gave her, but that's literally the point. Vaggi realized she didn't need to do a big dramatic name change because she's already taken charge of who she is, and just because Adam named her doesn't mean it defines her.

"She could've at least changed the pronunciationi!" she did you clown 😭 it was just before the actual name change arc. The original pronunciation was Vaj-ee, she changed it to Vag-ee. So I don't understand why people are complaining about the fact she apparently didn't change the pronunciation (she literally did).

What if a trans person changes their name from Aaron to Erin, or from Chris to Kris? Are we gonna berate them then because it sounds the same as their previous name or because it's not a big enough change? Like "that's stupid, you barely changed it. Pick something else"? No, of course you wouldn't. The hate for Vaggi's name change is so gross imo cuz it's like people are expecting the name to appeal to others rather than the person literally choosing their name.

You can think the name change arc was underwhelming or didn't feel as important or authentic as it should've been, that's one thing, and I agree with it. But calling the name change itself dumb is just such an arrogant thing to do. It's like you think you're owed what YOU believe another person should do with their identity.

The value of a chosen name isn’t determined by how dramatically different it looks from the old one. The value comes from the person choosing it.

Obviously Vaggi’s situation isn’t literally the same thing as a trans person’s experience, but the underlying principle of having the autonomy to choose what you’re called is absolutely comparable. And that’s why I think saying "Vaggi’s new name is dumb because she only changed one letter" is such an arrogant criticism. Saying the name itself is pointless because it isn’t different enough completely misses the character’s agency.

Vaggi doesn’t need to choose a completely unrelated name to prove that she’s free from Adam. She doesn’t need to erase every trace of the identity she had before. She doesn’t need to pick a name that OTHER people think sounds better. Part of her arc is realizing she doesn't have to completely change who she is in order to take charge of her own identity. That's literally the whole point and it's flying right over people's heads.

SHE chose Vaggi, and she's happy with it. That’s enough. The whole point is that Adam gave her a name, but he doesn’t get to decide what that name means anymore. Thank you for coming to my TedTalk.

People are upset and calling it pointless because all she did was remove the last letter of her name. This really upsets me because y'all would NOT be saying this shit if Vaggi changed her name because she's trans, even though it's damn near the same thing. Trans people change their names to take charge of their identity. Vaggi changed it to do the same thing, just not in a gender related way.

A name doesn’t become meaningful because you changed 15 letters instead of one. It’s HER name. She’s the one who gets to decide what she wants to be called. The entire point of Vaggi’s arc is that Adam gave her that name. The same person who abused her, abused her fellow Exorcists, and ultimately treated her like she was disposable. For a long time, she allowed the identity he gave her to remain part of who she was. Now she’s choosing her own identity.

"But she only changed one letter!" Mf the fact that she didn’t completely reinvent her name is part of the point. I've seen people upset because Adam named her after "vagina" yet she didn't change her name to sound very different from the original degrading name he gave her, but that's literally the point. Vaggi realized she didn't need to do a big dramatic name change because she's already taken charge of who she is, and just because Adam named her doesn't mean it defines her.

"She could've at least changed the pronunciationi!" she did you clown 😭 it was just before the actual name change arc. The original pronunciation was Vaj-ee, she changed it to Vag-ee. So I don't understand why people are complaining about the fact she apparently didn't change the pronunciation (she literally did).

What if a trans person changes their name from Aaron to Erin, or from Chris to Kris? Are we gonna berate them then because it sounds the same as their previous name or because it's not a big enough change? Like "that's stupid, you barely changed it. Pick something else"? No, of course you wouldn't. The hate for Vaggi's name change is so gross imo cuz it's like people are expecting the name to appeal to others rather than the person literally choosing their name.

You can think the name change arc was underwhelming or didn't feel as important or authentic as it should've been, that's one thing, and I agree with it. But calling the name change itself dumb is just such an arrogant thing to do. It's like you think you're owed what YOU believe another person should do with their identity.

The value of a chosen name isn’t determined by how dramatically different it looks from the old one. The value comes from the person choosing it.

Obviously Vaggi’s situation isn’t literally the same thing as a trans person’s experience, but the underlying principle of having the autonomy to choose what you’re called is absolutely comparable. And that’s why I think saying "Vaggi’s new name is dumb because she only changed one letter" is such an arrogant criticism. Saying the name itself is pointless because it isn’t different enough completely misses the character’s agency.

Vaggi doesn’t need to choose a completely unrelated name to prove that she’s free from Adam. She doesn’t need to erase every trace of the identity she had before. She doesn’t need to pick a name that OTHER people think sounds better. Part of her arc is realizing she doesn't have to completely change who she is in order to take charge of her own identity. That's literally the whole point and it's flying right over people's heads.

SHE chose Vaggi, and she's happy with it. That’s enough. The whole point is that Adam gave her a name, but he doesn’t get to decide what that name means anymore. Thank you for coming to my TedTalk.

Also GOD Adam is so hot just look at his fine ass 😍😍😍 I'm gonna give him so many kisses istg HE'S MINEEEEEEE

Does anyone else thinks this makes no sense?Realistically she should be upset with both of them. It just feels like another ploy to make Stolas look even more pitiful, especially since we borderline never see Via and Stella interact. We should've seen them interact more by now, or at the very least have Via mention Stella more. Stella doesn't even try to hide how she treats Stolas she's even been preventing him from talking to Via. Stolas has also been there for her WAY more than Stella has, from what we're shown. Isn't Via's whole thing being upset with Stolas because he neglects her? It seems like Stella does the same thing and actively prevents Stolas from contacting her, yet Via doesn't really care to get upset at her. Maybe the story will shed some light on this since Stella apparently does love Via, but right now it just seems like they're tryna make you feel bad for Stolas rather than actually making Via's feelings seem valid, authentic, and understandable.

Being so deadass I did NOT get that he was talking about pussy until I read it online. It sounded like a different pronunciation of veggies and I thought it was a reference to how he was vegetarian in the garden of Eden idfk 😭😭😭 I was like "awww that's actually a little wholesome Adam thinks vegetables are the best thing ever" but alas, my dreams of him having a singular redeemable trait were crushed 😔 please tell me I'm not the only one who didn't understand that he meant vagina-

No telling why she's saying this but I have a feeling it's because the trailer's gonna show everything that haters criticize the show for becoming more consistent. I assume it's just the stolitz aspect of it but at the same time it's a bit odd she was so anxious that she made a tweet about it. Like damn bruh what is in this trailer??

u/Aidonpor

u/_SageR

u/Opposite-Virus1958

u/GarlicLoose506

u/crybbu

u/ForktUtwTT

u/disappearing_now

u/AgentShovel

If any of y'all don't wanna be included in this lmk and I'll take it down

https://humanstatement.org it's basically the idea of ai serving humanity rather than replacing it. It seems like the best outcome to me. What do y'all think?

Yes I'm slandering myself 😭

If y'all have ever seen me argue in defense of Adam vs the miles I'll go to shit on Lute then you know 💔 I swear I really wanna like Lute but I just can't, she's too thirsty for my man and she pmo 🥀

For basically the entirety of season 2, Lute has been treating Abel like shit. She’s constantly undermining him, insulting him, and refusing to take him seriously, while Abel is too soft and scared to actually stand up to her. Then, in the finale, Lute is attacking Vaggi and Abel finally steps up as the HEAD OF THE ARMY and tells her to fall back.

Yes, he called her a bitch. But context matters. Lute had been acting like an asshole toward him for the entire season, so him finally snapping and calling her a bitch isn’t misogyny. It's literally just the truth. She was in fact being a bitch.

And I don’t buy the argument that Lute only listens to him because he used a misogynistic insult. There’s nothing in the scene that indicates she’s thinking "Oh no, a man called me a bitch, I’d better obey him!" It’s much more consistent with what we’ve already seen from her: she didn’t respect Abel’s authority until he actually established it.

Abel had tried being gentle with her before. It didn’t work. So when the situation became serious, he stopped asking nicely and gave her a firm order. And suddenly she listened. It's similar to how children act. Kids often ignore gentle correction and then immediately listen when the adult gets stern. That doesn’t mean the kid suddenly respects the adult because they were insulted; it means the adult finally made it clear that the boundary wasn’t optional.

And Lute can be incredibly childish herself, so I don’t think it’s unreasonable to interpret her reaction similarly. She wasn’t being submissive because Abel called her a bitch. She was just finally recognizing that he was her commanding officer and she needed to follow his orders.

If we’re going to call a scene misogynistic, there should actually be something in the scene demonstrating that Abel is treating Lute differently because she’s a woman.* *And I’m simply not seeing that here.

Also ADAM IN THE BG OMGGGG HE'S SO HAWT I LOVE HIM SM HE'S MY HUSBAND EEEEEE

For basically the entirety of season 2, Lute has been treating Abel like shit. She’s constantly undermining him, insulting him, and refusing to take him seriously, while Abel is too soft and scared to actually stand up to her. Then, in the finale, Lute is attacking Vaggi and Abel finally steps up as the HEAD OF THE ARMY and tells her to fall back.

Yes, he called her a bitch. But context matters. Lute had been acting like an asshole toward him for the entire season, so him finally snapping and calling her a bitch isn’t misogyny. It's literally just the truth. She was in fact being a bitch.

And I don’t buy the argument that Lute only listens to him because he used a misogynistic insult. There’s nothing in the scene that indicates she’s thinking "Oh no, a man called me a bitch, I’d better obey him!" It’s much more consistent with what we’ve already seen from her: she didn’t respect Abel’s authority until he actually established it.

Abel had tried being gentle with her before. It didn’t work. So when the situation became serious, he stopped asking nicely and gave her a firm order. And suddenly she listened. It's similar to how children act. Kids often ignore gentle correction and then immediately listen when the adult gets stern. That doesn’t mean the kid suddenly respects the adult because they were insulted; it means the adult finally made it clear that the boundary wasn’t optional.

And Lute can be incredibly childish herself, so I don’t think it’s unreasonable to interpret her reaction similarly. She wasn’t being submissive because Abel called her a bitch. She was just finally recognizing that he was her commanding officer and she needed to follow his orders.

If we’re going to call a scene misogynistic, there should actually be something in the scene demonstrating that Abel is treating Lute differently because she’s a woman.* *And I’m simply not seeing that here.

Also ADAM IN THE BG OMGGGG HE'S SO HAWT I LOVE HIM SM HE'S MY HUSBAND EEEEEE

For basically the entirety of season 2, Lute has been treating Abel like shit. She’s constantly undermining him, insulting him, and refusing to take him seriously, while Abel is too soft and scared to actually stand up to her. Then, in the finale, Lute is attacking Vaggi and Abel finally steps up as the HEAD OF THE ARMY and tells her to fall back.

Yes, he called her a bitch. But context matters. Lute had been acting like an asshole toward him for the entire season, so him finally snapping and calling her a bitch isn’t misogyny. It's literally just the truth. She was in fact being a bitch.

And I don’t buy the argument that Lute only listens to him because he used a misogynistic insult. There’s nothing in the scene that indicates she’s thinking "Oh no, a man called me a bitch, I’d better obey him!" It’s much more consistent with what we’ve already seen from her: she didn’t respect Abel’s authority until he actually established it.

Abel had tried being gentle with her before. It didn’t work. So when the situation became serious, he stopped asking nicely and gave her a firm order. And suddenly she listened. It's similar to how children act. Kids often ignore gentle correction and then immediately listen when the adult gets stern. That doesn’t mean the kid suddenly respects the adult because they were insulted; it means the adult finally made it clear that the boundary wasn’t optional.

And Lute can be incredibly childish herself, so I don’t think it’s unreasonable to interpret her reaction similarly. She wasn’t being submissive because Abel called her a bitch. She was just finally recognizing that he was her commanding officer and she needed to follow his orders.

If we’re going to call a scene misogynistic, there should actually be something in the scene demonstrating that Abel is treating Lute differently because she’s a woman.* *And I’m simply not seeing that here.

Also ADAM IN THE BG OMGGGG HE'S SO HAWT I LOVE HIM SM HE'S MY HUSBAND EEEEEE

This beautiful piece is by my good friend u/mikethesecurityguard he's taking commissions! Please consider helping him out cuz he could really use the money 🙏🏾

Got this amazing commission of Adam and Ella from @serenityanimat1 on X, it's so beautiful I'm gonna cry!! HEARTSONG FOREVER!!!

Art by u/haley566 I love this

I really hope we're shown Adam in a sympathetic light like this eventually, there's just no way he didn't suffer on Earth. I'm so curious what his family dynamic was like and how he survived and cared for his family. I swear the fans are doing more for Adam than Vivziepop ever will. Adam deserves so much more. Matter fact he deserves the world I love him he's my husband

Ella and Adam's wedding 💛 I'll prob draw a more detailed version one day

u/RoofDelicious7754 I promised to tag you in this I'd I ever drew it

Did these gifts for my friends u/XxThe_HumanxX and u/emilijah4ever, I hope y'all like it!

For clarification, it's bisexual Lute and aroace omnisexual Sera

I took y'alls advice and added more demonic elements, darker colors and horns and I think it real helped!

u/Level-Opposite-4702

u/Spampharos

u/Infinite_Form8884

u/ForkUtwTT

u/MadmansScalpel

Ty guys for the advice! Her design was originally meant to be deceiving but y'all were right she needed more demonic elements. So the second image is her Eden design and the first is her in Hell

Kinda rushed but wtv 💔 I tried to make her dress similar to Arabian type outfits since I believe that's around where the garden of Eden was? I tried to make her more historically accurate while keeping the original vibe