..I have many theories what it could be. Seating position, mellow vibrations, perfect amount of usable power. Whatever it is, it's crazy. Just minutes after getting on the rental today, I found myself way calmer, looking around, enjoying the ride. Something that I never felt any other bike could give me.

^(Feel free to skip the story-part and jump straight to the questions :))

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Today I rented the final two candidates before I buy a new bike. Been without one for 2 weeks, and ...ugh. Coming from upper middleweight or even litre bikes (MT09, R1250R, Striple 765) I want to decelerate a bit. Put the joy back in riding. The bikes I have narrowed it down to were the Honda CL500 and the Guzzi V7 850.

I rented both for half a day today. And while I love the smoothness and ease of ride of the Honda (lightest clutch anyone will ever pull), and to absolutely squeeze the engine to the limit without losing my license, it is the Guzzi that I want.

The V7 and I have a weird history. I rode one last year (after coming back from my 4yr hiatus) and loved it, but was unsure. And then I rode it again. And again. And then I rented it for 2 hours. I always kept coming back but was never fully convinced.

The major reason for it may seem stupid to those who cannot relate. But I have tinnitus (despite earplugs and a good helmet), and it tends to get aggravated through pressure on the ears, either through sound or thumping vibrations. So since the first time I rode it, I thought the heavy vibes at standstill made my T worse every time I tried it. Because it certainly was worse when I got off it. Today I realized what it was really. Not the vibes, because there are barely any, but rather the road-chatter/jitter (see below).

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Anyway. I want one. There is a 2022 with 5'000 mi / 8'000km on it at a super friendly Piaggio/Guzzi dealer 10 minutes away. But before I finally buy it, I have questions:

• Is there anything wrong with the 2022 year? Any recalls since then that I should ask about ? Any particular thing that I just inquire about when buying used (they give 12 months warranty, on transmission and engine)
• How do Guzzis deal with salty roads in the winter? Anything that's prone to rust?
• Can anything be done to improve brake performance? Really annoying that the little Honda had so much brakes
• Is anyone familiar with the "road chatter"? It translate to a jitter that shakes the whole bike and makes it's way to my helmet. Since it is not perpetual, and speed- not rev-related, I assume it's got somethjing to do with the suspension. Sadly it's both front and rear, so only adjusting preload in the back won't do the trick. ... Or is this not a common thing and maybe just a quirk of the rental bike? Please tell me it is so... *I am not even gonna ask about Guzzi reliability, as they seem very reliable until they aren't, but that's the same with any bike I guess

Moto Guzzi “The Trip 500” Parallel-Twin Is Nearly Ready

Link: https://www.cycleworld.com/motorcycle-news/moto-guzzi-the-trip-500-parallel-twin-spy-shots/

I have browsed the forum here and could not find a recent post on it, but I was curious what your take is here? I have seen 4 prominent outlets across the UK and Germany report it, so perhaps it will really drop soon.

Personally, I have ridden the V7 quite a few times, though never owned it. I know it is sacrilege but for multiple reasons I am not too keen on the vibrations. So as someone who loves modern classic bikes, the 457cc engine, and generally squeezing the last bit of power out of small engines, I am quite delighted with these news.
I also believe that it is a good strategic move. It won't take away the V7 or the brands image, and it may bring in some of the A2 license-holder money from the mainstream.

But curious what your takes are!

I love scramblers! Not because I want to ride offroad, but rather because they are basically naked ADV bikes. I get the clean airflow of a naked bike, but the travel-friendly ergonomics of an ADV .

I am stuck between two. The brain knows it should be the Honda. Because, well, it's a Honda.
But my heart is not in it. It is looking for others to take, but the scrambler market is pretty slim.

Here is what I need it to do: Be friendly (not choppy) in the city, be fun in the twisties, not cook my legs (*cough* Triumph *cough*) and be able to carry me 5'000km around Western Europe starting in 10 days. Is the Bear up to the task?

And beyond that, is it worth 3'500 coins more? The CL500 I can get used for around 6'000. The Bear is only available new, costing 9'500, nearly 60% more.
Quite literally the only issues I have with the CL is that I wish it had 10Nm more, and the high exhaust. That's exactly what the Bear brings to the table.

So. Bear 650. Up to the task? Worth the extra money? Would you rely on it as your only bike for city, fun and travel? (Not interested in actual ADVs, just fyi)

^(FWIW, I have over 100'000km riding experience, so not a newbie.)
^(Also, I was gonna get a second "fun" bike, likely a sportsbike like an R3, R7, or RS660. With the CL I can buy both at the same time. But if I get the Bear, I will have to defer the "fun" bike to next year, so the Bear needs to be more fun than the CL out of the box...)

I love scramblers! Not because I want to ride offroad, but rather because they are basically naked ADV bikes. I get the clean airflow of a naked bike, but the travel-friendly ergonomics of an ADV .

I am stuck between two. The brain knows it should be the Honda. Because, well, it's a Honda.
But my heart is not in it. It is looking for others to take, but the scrambler market is pretty slim.

Here is what I need it to do: Be friendly (not choppy) in the city, be fun in the twisties, not cook my legs (*cough* Triumph *cough*) and be able to carry me 5'000km around Western Europe starting in 10 days. Is the Bear up to the task?

And beyond that, is it worth 3'500 coins more? The CL500 I can get used for around 6'000. The Bear is only available new, costing 9'500, nearly 60% more.
Quite literally the only issues I have with the CL is that I wish it had 10Nm more, and the high exhaust. That's exactly what the Bear brings to the table.

So. Bear 650. Up to the task? Worth the extra money? Would you rely on it as your only bike for city, fun and travel? (Not interested in actual ADVs, just fyi)

^(FWIW, I have over 100'000km riding experience, so not a newbie.)
^(Also, I was gonna get a second "fun" bike, likely a sportsbike like an R3, R7, or RS660. With the CL I can buy both at the same time. But if I get the Bear, I will have to defer the "fun" bike to next year, so the Bear needs to be more fun than the CL out of the box...)

Servus zsammen!

Vorweg: Ich fahre seit über 100'000 km, wäre also nicht mein erstes Bike :) Will nur etwas entschleunigen, zumindest fürs Touring. Zum Spass haben gibts bald ne R7...
Auch danke ich euch für freundliche Vorschläger anderer Bikes, aber ich habe echt schon alles getestet. Und ich brauche recht zügig ein Bike. Eines der beiden wird es werden!

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UPDATE: Danke für die Hilfe! Ich denke, dass die Guzzi mit zu vielen Fragezeichen kommen würde. Wenn ich noch andere Bikes hätte, und die V7 hier und da mal auf die Probe stellen könnte bei Tagesausflügen, wäre es wohl kein Problem. Aber als Bike, das ab Kilometer Null für mich da sein muss, dafür ist sie mir etwas zu bedenklich.
Aktuell schaue ich mir noch die RE Bear 650 an. Wer dazu Meinungen hat, gerne teilen!

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Ich bin hin und her gerissen. Bin beide bikes mehrmals Probegefahren, hab beide mal für nen Tag gemietet. Die Moppeds sind natürlich grundverschieden, aber gebraucht preislich fast gleich!

Was mich von der CL 500 abhält:

• Wiederverkaufswert, falls es nicht passt. Weiss nicht, wie gut die sich verkaufen, aber ich sehe kaum welche rumfahren...
• Kleine bikes machen mir Spass, aber ich glaube mit Beladung wären 10 Nm mehr besser
• Nicht "ready to go", soll heissen ich kann meine Packtaschen nicht einfach draufschnallen, weil der grosse Endtopf die Zurrbänder zerschmoren würde. Brauche also ne Gepäckbrücke + Adapter für mein SWmotech Rackpack bevor es losgehen kann...

Was mich von der V7 abhält:

• Weniger Wertverlust, *aber* es kann ewig dauern, die zu verkaufen. Hab hier ein paar Maschinen gesehen, die sicher 4 Monate online waren...
• Guzzi Qualität. Hier weiss ich nicht, wem ich glauben soll. Hunderte schwören, dass die Dinger keine Probleme machen und easy 5'000km Touren wegstecken. Andere reden von Elektronikproblemen, gebrochenen Schrauben, Ölverbrauch...
• Lässt sich nicht so sportlich fahren wie die CL, weil schwerer, Sitzposition, Komponenten, etc.
• Ich habe Sorge dass die groben Vibrationen meinen Tinnitus durch "Bone conduction" verschlimmern... klingt doof, kommt aber nicht von ungefähr, da ich genau aus diesem Grund keine Einzylinder mehr fahren kann

Wer hat Erfahrung mit den Bikes? Reicht die Power der CL 500 aus, um auch mit Gepäck auf Touren zu gehen (BAB meide ich sowieso) und dennoch Spass zu haben? Sind Guzzis Qualitätsprobleme übertrieben und man kann die bedenkenlos fahren?

Bin gespannt!

I know this is a stupid question but bear with me.

The last bike I owned was an MT09, and before that a BMW R1250R. Both great bikes, but I really love twisting throttles and squeezing engines. If I did that on any of the former two, I would not be typing this right now.

So I have been wanting to scale down from too much power. My sweet spot is 50Nm of torque between 50-70hp. Very few modern bikes still offer that.

One bike I keep coming back to is the CL 500. It was the first bike I rode after my hearing-damage induced 4-year hiatus (despite earplugs...) last year. And I recently rode it again just two weeks ago.
The feedback as I recorded it for myself was simple: Fun bike, great ergos, Honda reliability, good modding potential, great power for the city, lacks on country roads though.
Since I intend to travel (solo, but obv with luggage), the last point is a big deal. I know people tour on them and are happy. Tbf one of the coolest tours I ever did was on my 30hp DRZ400SM. Yet I still worry if it's enough.

What's your take? Who has the bike? Who likes the power, who got rid of it because it was missing just that bit more?
FWIW, my alternative is a Z650RS, which I have owned before, but I am just not excited about it.

^((PS.: Funny enough, I had completely rejected the CL 500 after I tested it a few weeks ago. But then last week I tested an R3 with only 42hp, and I had a great time on it. Made me wonder if the CL suffered in comparison to the Speed Twin 900 I had rented that day...))

Today was gonna be the day. After not having a bike for 2 weeks now, I finally was gonna test the Ninja (again, years after I first rode it), be amazed by it, and buy it on the spot.
(FWIW, I have owned 15 bikes in my 100'000km / 60'000mi of riding. Most recently an MT09, Striple 765, RS660, and R1250R)

And I need a bike too. Both for my mental health and for getting around. Though I live in Switzerland and have great cycling paths and public transport, going everywhere by bicycle can be limiting and tiring. I should know - I cycled 30km (roundtrip) just to get to the test ride.

Anyway. It did not grab me. Maybe I hyped it up too much by watching too many YT videos. Maybe it just is not for me. Don't know. Maybe I am being a B and should just get it. What's your take? Go for it, or listen to the "gut"?

Here's what I did not like:

• vibrates like a mofo. Tbf, I have only ridden triples and boxers this year. Guess Twins just vibrate like that, and I forgot about it
• It feels a bit toy-like. It handles great, no question. And it's really fun to give it the spurs. But it just does not give me the sport-bike feeling. When I sat on the RS660, I knew immediately. It felt great. It felt sporty. It "felt" cool. This one just "feels" like a naked bike with weird handlebars and a bucket of plastic in front of me. That's no diss on anyone who likes it or the bike itself - just how I felt on it. FWIW the ZX4RR, the RS660 all felt more high value (because they are, I guess)
• The windscreen dumps the wind right under my helmet, *unless* I sit perfectly straight. Not the biggest deal but a big deal for touring. Could get the high seat but that leans me forward more. Had the same on the 1000SX and GSX8R...
• Ergos are not ideal, knee's weren't too happy, and the seat felt curved and had me slide forward all the time.
• I don't love how it looks. This may be the first bike that looked worse in person than it does online (to me). Usually it's the other way around, and I find a lot of bikes a lot more agreeable when seeing them in front of me. This one I did not. It looks great in pics, mouth-watering really. But when it just stands there... Did nothing for me (unlike my RS660 I used to have. That thing was a beauty from every angle...). And it's the only color way I would want. They had all other 2026 models there too and I did not like any of them...

That's a lot of text. Sorry. I guess through writing this down I feel less and less like buying it. It's a shame. I love the motor, it has the perfect power for my taste and use case. I think the biggest hurdle is the price. I always try to "feel out" how much a given package would be worth to me. Before I tested it, I was almost read to buy new (9'000 coins). This one above is 7'600 moneys, with 6'500km / 4'000mi on it. Given how I feel about it, I would not want to pay more than 6'000 for this bike. Sadly, there are none around at that price point.

My gut tells me no. I know my future stall will have a naked bike and a sport bike in it. I need to be able to tour on one of them. When I started considering the Ninja, I felt I could have it all. A sport tourer that looks the part, and then maybe an aggressive naked bike or SuMo to complement it. But alas.

(I am almost embarrassed to admit that I am considering a Honda CL500. I always liked the bike. It's like the little ugly engine/bike that could. And it's fairly cheap - 2'000 cheaper than the above bike...)

My (fwiw: 10 years, 100'000+ km of riding and bikes from 20hjp to 150hp) bike search is nearing its end - I hope. I thought of going back to the R12x0R, but I just did not vibe with it anymore. The F700GS is way overpriced for what it is. So when I got a chance to try the F450GS today, I had to take it. And I was very impressed. It is near perfect for me (I intent to use it for local rides as well as solo travel), almost as though BMW just made it for me . Almost. The only concerns I have are:

• It's barely available, and only in red - my least favorite color for a bike
• I hate buying new (I don't keep bikes for long, so I always lose a LOT of money), and I should not buy without renting it for at least a day. Neither is possible here
• If it had 10Nm more I'd be the happiest guy in the world. Tbf, I love small, light bikes and riding the hell out of Them. My usual preference is 50-60Nm, but very, very few bikes fall into that range.
• It vibrates like crazy. Tbf, my recent frame of reference are triples and the boxers, so maybe this is not that crazy for a twin. But when pushing the bike - which is both fun and necessary - handlebars and footpegs really start to shake like stupid

So, does anyone have experience with it? What are reasons against buying

^(Here it costs roughly 9'000 (chf) new. Alternatives are F700GS (6'000 and up), F700GS-lowered (4-5'000 + cost to reverse lowering), and F800R (old: 4'000, new: 6'000). I've tested nearly every other reasonable candidate in existence, so it really is down to these models. I hate windscreens, which eliminates nearly 95% of all travel bikers. The F-Rs would be the last option, as I am not crazy about the seating position for 6-7hrs rides, multiple days in a row)

I know it sounds a bit cheeky, but the prices they ask for these bikes which are now over a decade old is downright insane. I have half a heart to actually plot the stability of F700 prices vs gold...

Anyway. I am looking for a fun bike that I can tour on. I thought going back to the R1200R was gonna be my ticket (yes, this was me...). But after riding it today (I owned a 1250R before) I was reminded just how unwieldy that beast is, and how much power of it I wouldn't use. (before anyone drops a demeaning or patronizing comment: I can handle the power and I have for over 10 years now, I just prefer less because...because I do!)

Anyway, the F 700 GS is the only bike I have owned twice. So that tells you something about my feelings towards it. The two biggest reason are that 1) with a high seat it sort of rides like a big fat slow and boring supermoto, which I like, and 2) I can ride it "naked". Well, not me, but the bike. I can just take off the windscreen and get the good clean airflow that I so love. A feature sorely missing from modern ADVs...

But yea. 8'000 chf for a bike like this is madness. (for reference - that's how much a KTM 790 Duke costs new...). Or is it?

My alternative is the F800R. Pre-facelift models are so cheap that I almost feel bad for the people selling it. Some can be had for 3'000.

For those that have ridden the bikes, especially the 800R: would you consider it good enough for touring? I am 178 / 5'10 with a 82cm / 32" inseam, a modestly strained knee and a somewhat bad lower back.
Or should I just swallow my pride and get the 700GS after all?

This right there is my dream bike! Sadly, they hide quite well. There are only 2 in the country (Switzerland) and both are about 2.5hrs (one way) away.

Since we are in a bad heatwave and I cannot think of anything worse to do with my time than sit in stuffy trains, I want to make sure the bike is all I want it to be. Bear with me.

I had a 1250R not too long ago. One of the best features of the bike was that the rain-mode was truly mild compared to "road", allowing me to give it a bit of throttle even in the city. Felt like riding a 600 twin.
Can anyone confirm the 1200R rain mode is the same? Or feels at least very detuned? It's not that I cannot handle the open power, it's just that I want a more mellow mode for city riding.

Any help is appreciated!

I am somewhat at a crossroads. Over the past few years I have bought and sold so many bikes that the losses I took could have gone towards buying a house...
I just want a fun roadster that I can occasionally tour on. The BMW R12x0R was the closest I ever got to that, so now - currently entirely without a bike - I might buy one again next week.

However, since I started riding again 2 years ago, I always wanted an electric one. Prices have come down so much too that it no longer remains a pipe dream. But I am not sure.

I live in an apartment block with a communal garage that does not have any sort of charging infrastructure. Somewhat fortuitously, I have a Level2 charger right across the street though. It's close enough where I feel like living with an eMoto could be feasible, though the reality of it may prove very frustrating. (we do have chargers at work. I commute by bicycle, but I guess I could also take the eV on days when I know it needs a charge...)

Would you do it? Would it be a big hassle to live with it if I cannot charge it in my garage where I typically park it? I know it can tour, and here in Switzerland and neighboring countries we do have a decent enough charging network I think. But I do wonder if I'd be really happy doing a 5'000km trip to Spain, or to Ireland.

Very curious to hear your input!

A fool and his money are soon parted.
I feel like that's gonna be the title of my biography.

I bought the 1250R last summer, because on paper it was the perfect bike. Now, I will be honest here. I did enjoy it, but it never made me grin like an idiot. It was the sane choice. The girl you marry, which may not always be the girl you want to spend a long sweaty weekend in an opium den with. At its worst, it was heavy, lethargic at slow speeds, and a pain to navigate tiny French city streets on.
Part of the blame is on me too. I fitted setback-risers, which made it comfy but took away the last bit of sportiness the bike had besides the engine.

This March I felt like I wanted a sportsbike to join the Beemer in my stall. But upon testing a few, I realized how much more fun small and lightweight bikes are. So the 1250R went, and a Street Triple and later MT09 followed it.

Now I am sitting here in one of the most grotesque heatwaves Switzerland has had in forever. And I have no bike to escape on. I realized that the Triples and lightweight sportsbikes made me ride like a maniac, always chasing the thrill of the next curve. So they had to go if I wanted to live. The 1250R never did that. It was the perfect blend of a chill ride, but with tons of power reserves when one wanted it. And the suspension...gosh darn I miss the suspension. So does my back.

I am considering buying a R1200R LC again. They are fairly cheap, and tbh I never liked the Shiftcam or the TFT. I dread it a bit, as I know it's not what my heart wants, but I know it will be good for me.

There is no point to this post other than maybe that we should cherish what we have and not chase after that hot new thing on whim.

Also, has anyone cross shopped the Guzzi V7? It has the perfect power band for my taste, looks a little better/different (imo) and costs around the same. Curious if you have any arguments as to why the 1200R would be the way better choice!

Had a buddy do a bit of photoshop to merge my future Z650RS with my favorite color scheme from the Speed Twin 900. What do you all think? Will it turn out as nicely in real life? Does anyone have experience with having the bike repainted? I see surprisingly few custom versions of the bike on the web...

EDIT: I was getting the feeling that the friend used AI instead of using good ol' photoshop or gimp. Don't worry, he got an earful for it...

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PS.: Why the Z650RS? Tbh it is the end of the road. I have tested so many bikes. I really wanted to avoid the RS. Not because I hate it. I owned it before, and it gave me lots of good memories. It's just that the engine...well, you know. Which would be fine if I could find the damn thing used. But I cannot. So it has to be new, which is what I wanted to avoid.
After testing nearly every single naked bike on the market, I could not find anything better. So I guess the RS it is...

After a grueling year of bad purchases, the Speed Twin 900 is the only answer left. Incidentally, it is also a fantastic bike that I loved riding.

I already had an ST900, 2021 model, a few years ago. But that gave me quite some trouble. So I am a bit scarred. I am not super-eager to buy completely new, simply because of the value drop off. New Price is 10'800 dineros.

There is a used one with only 300km / 200mi available. Costs 8'200. Thats 25% below new. Sold by a reputable Triumph dealer.
I asked and apparently it was not only their demo bike, but also their rental bike. No way this thing was broken in carefully!

However, it also has 18 months of factor warranty left. Part of me is scared to take the deal, since things that are too good to be true usually are. On the other hand, due to the warranty, and the fact that I ride a lot (10'000km / 6'000mi per year at least) would mean that any issues that would have been caused by poor break in surely would surface during the warranty period.

What would you do? Save a massive amount of money and hope the warranty covers potential issues? Or get wasted, say "f it", buy new, and regret it a few days later?