r/exjew

Recently, my Israeli relatives (who are Dati Leumi and fairly liberal) visited me in the United States. I was telling my cousin that the trappings of present-day American Orthodoxy are luxuries. The must-have items, ever-tightening social expectations, and constant "chumra creep" are far beyond what our ancestors could imagine.

Did shtetl-dwellers in 1897 Russia turn up their noses at fruits and vegetables? Did ancient Judeans wear $8000 lace-front wigs imported from Moldova? Did 1960s British rabbis publish extremely long books about the primacy of tznius?

No, no, and no. The truth is that being able to eat very specific hechsherim is a luxury. Shopping at frum-owned, tznius-only stores is a luxury. Adding new foods to the Kitniyos list every Pesach is a luxury. Being financially supported by one's in-laws because one is too important to work is a luxury.

My cousin agreed with my assessment. What do you think?

For those who no longer identify as religious, are there parts of being in Israel that you still enjoy specifically because of the Jewish cultural environment?

Does being there feel different to you now than it did when you were religious?

Listen to this b.u.l.l.s.h.i.t

https://www.facebook.com/share/v/1C32Cdg8PD/

I did but im not sure if it was just my family or if everyone did

Just for clarity, I am not ashmed of my penis.

"The uncomfortable truth is that some beliefs are held for the same reason some people buy Rolexes: they look good in public.

In the same way that many people buy expensive material possessions, not because they especially like the possession itself, but because they know it will impress other people, there are people who express luxury beliefs not simply because they believe them, but because they know those beliefs will bring them clout and status.

So the motivation behind the luxury good and the luxury belief is often very similar. But many people convince themselves that their motives are completely sincere.

Take a guy who buys a Lamborghini. If you ask him why he bought it, he might say, “Look, it makes me feel confident. I like driving it. It makes me feel good. That’s why I bought it. I’m not trying to impress anyone.”

And I think part of you might suspect, “Well, all of that may be true. But I also think part of you likes the fact that when people see you in that Lamborghini, they think of you in a certain way.”

The same thing can happen with luxury beliefs. People may sincerely believe what they are saying. But part of me thinks that, somewhere deep down, there is also a sense of satisfaction that comes from expressing a belief and having your peers, your social circle, and other similarly credentialed elites applaud you for it. They think, “What a compassionate, interesting, sophisticated person you are for holding that view.”

A belief can be sincerely held while also conferring status to the speaker."

https://x.com/i/status/2089387704286929102

I just got home from visiting my brother's family. My oldest nephew will be starting mesivta tomorrow, and he showed me a pamphlet that included the yeshivah's daily schedule. It also listed many behavioral/technological/informational restrictions.

He'll be at yeshivah for nearly fourteen hours a day. Two and a half of those hours (in the late afternoon, of course, when the bachurim are tired and hungry) will be devoted to general studies.

The rest will be spent "learning" about things like tumah, ox-goring, and the laws of Shabbos. To me, these are useless, wasteful subjects. And they're being prioritized at the very stage of a young man's life when he should be discovering what his own interests and goals are.

At this mesivta, there is no computer course. There is no musical education. There are no sports teams. There is no science lab. There is no secular library. There's just a factory designed to produce clones who dress, think, and act alike.

My nephew says he wants to be Yeshivish, but how can he truly know that he wants when his exposure to "outside" academics/culture/skills has been so limited? How can he know what career or education to pursue when years of Yeshivish surroundings have taught him that only one narrow path is acceptable?

I worry about his future. I worry about his siblings' futures. It seems they're being robbed of real educations, hobbies, skill acquirement, and individualization. I love to spend time with them, but listening to them "learn" with my brother makes me cringe as it reminds me of how much they're missing out on.

Thanks for letting me vent.

Hello everyone,

This is just a venting post i know there is no easy solution to the situation.

Basically the story is that I have been dating my non jewish boyfriend for two years, and we want to get engaged in the next few months.

Ever since they found out about our relationship, they constantly brought up the topic of conversion and for a while it seemed like maybe he would consider it to make them happy. A few months ago, after doing some more research, he decided converting was not for him, not even a reform conversion. We are both atheists and he feels uncomfortable lying about his religious beliefs.

Yesterday, my mom broke the news to me that because he is not converting, they will not be attending my wedding. She said it in a pretty nice way honestly, and was basically saying that it would be too emotionally painful for my father and that if he attended he would just break down and she didn’t think it was in my best interest for my parents to be there. It hurt a lot but in a strange way I did feel like she was really trying to protect me.

I feel really heartbroken. Of course I knew this was the most likely outcome deep down, but I guess after spending so much time around non-jewish friends who would say stuff to me like “they’ll come around in the end” I was starting to really believe maybe they would come around. But obviously I think if you’re not in the Jewish world you are not going to have the full context. I would also say my dad is probably more personally religious than the average modern orthodox person. Like he talks about God and Judaism all the time and he was halachilcy stricter than a lot of my friends parents. Though he still picks and chooses plenty imho. Like he’s super strict about hechshers and davaning and intermarriage but then he’ll listen to music with womens voices and rip toilet paper on shabbos. i guess it’s a stupid religion that never made any sense in the first place. and trying to find logic to it is a losing game.

i just feel sad i guess and needed to vent. my father is so depressed over my relationship and it’s hard to watch the happiest thing in my life be his biggest tragedy. the worst part is i can picture exactly what he is feeling bc i used to believe the same things he believes. he’s thinking it’s the end of the jewish people and the ultimate failure of his life and all that kind of stuff. basically almost like i am dying or something.

So far in the past few weeks I’ve tried: Big Mac Meal, Popeyes chicken sandwich, Bacon egg and cheese 2X from breakfast place. I need more things to try please leave recommendations in the replies! (Nothing too expensive pls)

Wow, just found this reddit community...

I am looking for honest perspectives from people familiar with Chabad communities.

I am a Sephardic Jew and I am connected to my Judaism spiritually. I also have more progressive beliefs and I value questioning, personal autonomy, and healthy boundaries. I joined a local Chabad community because I wanted to feel connected to Jewish life, there are no local synagogues in my area.

Over time, I became uncomfortable with some dynamics I experienced. I am trying to understand whether these are normal community dynamics or whether they are examples of unhealthy leadership and boundaries.

One of my concerns is around boundaries between this rabbi, his family, and congregants. For example, the rabbi asks Jewish congregants to babysit, including on Shabbat, uses a congregant's personal swimming pool for his kids on a weekly basis, asks a congregant who is converting to Judaism and another congregant who is not Jewish but married to a Jew to turn off their refrigerator light for Shabbat, gives birthday gifts to various adult congregants, asks congregants to drive his kids back and forth to Hebrew school, has a congregant perform housekeeping, change the baby's diaper, bathe the kids, and had a congregant assist in the home delivery in one of their kids. A congregant shared with me that she and her husband don't know "how to say no" to the Rabbi and rebbetzin, and the rebbetzin tried to pressure her to change her Dr's appointment to babysit for them. He only pays one congregant to do these things.The majority of these congregants were either Jews who were raised Christian, Jews who weren't raised Jewish, or those who converted to Judaism. And they're all in their 40s/50s/70s. The Rabbi and Rebbetzin are friends with all the congregants on Facebook and someone told me he "monitors" their lives through FB. The Rabbi and Rebbetzin are pretty young, in their 30s. The congregants frequently get together outside of chabad and will talk about how they feel pressured to do things for the Rabbi and they do it because they feel sorry for all his kids that "wear dirty clothes and have socks with holes." The kids are kind of mean. The kids have asked me why my skin color is brown, they've asked another person, "why did you marry a non-jew? Didn't your mother raise you any better," and to another person, "I've heard you're not a real Jew." All these congregants are making major donations to the Chabad, too. The congregants will also discuss how some of them have been upstairs in the Rabbi's house, they've seen the Rabbi's underwear on the floor, the baby sleeping in the closet, the two beds, the kids bathing in the same bath water...a lot of gossip about them. The Rebbetzin also stated that the Rebbe is "Jesus for the Jews," which I found very odd. They have multiple portraits of the Rebbe up.

A situation involving a male community member became very uncomfortable for me. I raised concerns about inappropriate behavior and expected the issue to be handled carefully. Instead, I later heard that the Rabbi described me as being in a “place of evil," to another congregant and in front of the congregant who made me uncomfortable. I found that language very disturbing and felt like I was being victim-blamed. I've never heard a Rabbi use such words. I followed up with the Rabbi on why this statement was made and he never responded. And the congregant that informed me what the Rabbi had said...she's the one with the husband who can't say no to the Rabbi... she went dark the next day and blocked me on social media with no explanation.

I was also told by the Rabbi when I reported the community member to him that discretion and keeping things quiet were emphasized because community conflict could create division. I understand the importance of avoiding gossip and unnecessary conflict, but I also struggle with the idea that people should feel silenced when they raise concerns about boundaries or behavior that makes them uncomfortable. And this Rabbi is apparently gossiping about me stating that I'm in a "place of evil."

I am trying to understand whether what I experienced is normal for Chabads or was this Chabad more cult-like. This all just happened and it's been overwhelming.

You know the deal by now. Feel free to discuss your Shabbat plans or whatever else.

I recently remembered about the song ‘Yakob’ by R Yomtov Ehrlich. What was that about? I’m not great at understanding innuendo especially not in the way frum people do it. Why did he run away? Was the local girl bride being forced on him somehow?

Additionally, what were the individual stages of going "OTD" (or was it just one instant realization)? Was it purely intellectual? Were any of your doubts prompted by experiences you've had with your community? What kept you on the derech until you went left?

Ok, so context: I am 14, female and in an ultra orthodox commmunity. I’ve been here my whole life but as of four years ago, I’ve noticed the gaps that don’t make sense. I slowly drifted away and began discovering even more things, like how sexist and racist and islamophobic the Jewish community is. We’re not tought about periods until 12, and some not even then. Some have to run to their parents in a panic. even then, periods are something “private”. They pretty much frame it that we should be ashamed of our gender and periods and stuff. Most people aren’t even taught about sex until a couple days before they get married.

but I’m going off topic. I go to a Bais yaakov, and I have a couple friends (outside of school) who are like me and want to go OTD. Besides for that, they are the only ones who know. I have friends in school, may siblings and two parents. And too them I am a normal, robotic Bais Yaakov girl. The rules we have have been normalised to the extent I didn’t even realise how ridculous all of them are until I started looking into it a bit.

Im gay. Only one person I know knows. Everyone else I know is severely homophobic, and say pretty much that gay people choose to be gay,and are mentally insane.

i despeerately want to live the life I want, wear the clothes I wanna wear. I don’t even mean anything insane, just not having to wear tights, wearing pants and short sleeves in the summer or something. I want to be able to talk about period cramps with someone.

I once tried to get small jobs to earn a bit of money. My father didn’t allow me. When I asked him why, he said “because I own you”. I asked can I not get a job when I older? He said “no, because then your husband will own you” I was very angry. I don’t want to be owned. I want to be my own person.

But the vent ends there. I need advice of how to tell my parents I don’t want to live like this anymore? And even if I do, what then? If I get kicked out of school, my family will be gosssiped about constantly.i will lose most of my friends, if not all of them.

I’m only a teenager, but I’m so done with this life. Please help?

Stressfully questioning my beliefs and the way I grew up Looking for someone Ultra-Orthodox/Haredi or ex Orthodox to help me processing my thoughts