r/wicked

Ok so why wouldn't Elphie use a spell to fake her death instead of hiding in the floor boards

I just finished reading Out of Oz and I really love Rain and Tip together I was routing for them the whole time I was so happy when they finally got together by the way how old is Rain supposed to be by that part of out of oz I'm guessing 16 maybe then when the truth is revealed that was wild but when they finally see each other again I hate how distant they are now and I actually feel really sad because I believe their love is real and they need each other most now more than ever before

I was talking to another Wicked fan and they point this out to me about Elphaba, it made a lot of sense to me and I wanted to share.

So i know alot of this fandom blames Elphaba for sleeping with Fiyero, they consider her a bad friend or it's considered a betrayal to Glinda for breaking the "friend code" but here's an alternate perspective, what if Elphaba didn't know she was breaking the friend code? Let me explain.

Elphaba wasn't like Glinda or Fiyero she didn't have "socialization", when she was around people she was mocked and she had to be defensive. Elphaba didn't really know anything about friendship or anything social, she only ever had one friend. She probably didn't even realize that your best friends ex is considered off limits. How would she know about the "girl code" or whatever when she only ever had one friend?

She fell for Fiyero while he was dating Glinda, yes that's questionable I guess but she didn't plan it, it just happened. She never intended for it to happen.

She kept her feelings for Fiyero to herself because he and Glinda were together and she didn't wanna come between them or hurt Glinda. She accepted they were together and she was being a good friend. She just didn't wanna hurt Glinda so she kept her feelings to herself. She wanted Glinda to be happy and she didn't wanna ruin her relationship with Fiyero

In for good she didn't even go see Fiyero, she went to see Glinda before the wedding to wish her well, it must have hurt when she found they were getting married but she was trying to be happy for Glinda. She didn't even see Fiyero, she didn't try to get him to leave with her or anything, she didn't tell Glinda not to marry him. She accepted that Fiyero chose Glinda and she was trying to be happy for Glinda. That's being a good friend not a bad one. With this in mind why would she suddenly betray Glinda or hurt Glinda when she kept her feelings to herself because she didn't wanna hurt her?

When Fiyero chose Elphaba at the wedding, he turned on the Wizard and commited treason. Once he did this, he made himself a fugitive and he was considered a traitor, The Wizard even says " these two traitors...". It wasn't just him choosing Elphaba but it was him officially chosing a side, the side he knew was right. He put a target on his back. If Elphaba hadn't let him leave with her he likely would have been killed or imprisoned. We all saw what happened later when he publicly defended Elphaba, so there's no reason to think that if he hadn't left he wouldn't have been executed. So Elphaba really didn't have a choice but to let him leave with her, it was either that or let him die IMO. So Elphaba didn't really have a choice. If any of us were Elphaba in that situation, you have a choice, the person you love just put his life in danger, you have to choose, reject him and not let him leave with you and there's a good chance he would be killed or let him leave with you and there's a decent chance it will save his life would any of us have chosen any differently? I doubt it. I don't see it as Elphaba choosing Fiyero over Glinda or betraying Glinda but rather Elphaba saving Fiyero but Glinda saw it as Elphaba choosing Fiyero over her.

Elphaba was apologetic to Glinda she started to say " no it wasn't like that....". I think Elphaba felt bad that he chose her and he was leaving with her, she knew Glinda was hurt and she was apologetic for it. I honestly don't think Elphaba realized she was betraying her friendship with Glinda by letting Fiyero leave with her, that Glinda saw it as Elphaba choosing Fiyero over her. She was saving him and i think she thought Glinda was upset because he was leaving her and yes that was part of it but she didn't see how she was betraying their friendship.

If Elphaba was apologetic for Fiyero choosing her and for Glinda being hurt why would she purposefully betray her?

Elphaba probably didn't realize that a best friends ex is considered off limits, he chose her over Glinda and he left Glinda which is the same as a breakup so technically he was single.

This is something i hadn't really thought about before until another fan pointed it out but it makes sense for Elphaba's character.

The timing was bad but that was really more on Fiyero than Elphaba, she went there to wish Glinda well and expose the Wizard, she didn't intend to stop the wedding. He turned on the Wizard and chose her then so she had to let him leave with her.

Anyway my point is that while Elphaba did break the friend code, I don't think she did it on purpose. From her perspective, Fiyero left Glinda, he was single, he chose her, he loved her and wanted her and she felt the same way about him. I don't think Elphaba would purposefully betray Glinda like that, she just didn't realize about the "rules" of friendship or however you wanna put it.

Thoughts?

It's 6 in the morning I read all night I could not put it down I don't really know how I feel right now

Let's discuss

there is a lot to unpack here

I'm probably in the minority with this one but I wanted to share this anyway, this is my analysis of as long as you're mine, I really liked it in the movie but that might be because i haven't seen the stage show. Please remember this is just my analysis, just my opinon.

As long as you're mine is one of my favorite songs and probably my favorite scene in either movie. It was romantic, tender and even though they kept it pg there was a level of steam.

First of all, Elphaba lived in a tree in the woods and she made it into a home, upon seeing this Fiyero fell more in love with Elphaba. You can see his face light up when he sees her treehouse and he was amazed at the home she made.

Also it makes more sense if we look at it from Elphaba's point of view, she didn't know what we knew, as far as she knew Fiyero chose Glinda and until Fiyero turned on the Wizard she thought he'd turned against her and was hunting her. She had accepted that she wouldn't have the happiness other people had and that he would never feel about her the way she felt about him, then he turns on the Wizard and chooses her. Elphaba didn't know what to think at first, she needed a minute to wrap her head around the fact that he just committed treason, made a fugitive of himself, put his life in danger, and chose her.

Elphaba invited him into her world, which was something she didn't do with anyone else, not even Glinda.

Fiyero removing her cape is significant, the cape represented her armor, her protection and by removing it he was telling her she didn't need her armor with him, she was safe with him. Also, the fact that Elphaba let Fiyero remove the cape was telling, it showed she trusted him.

They are standing in front of a mirror when Fiyero removes her cape, she leans into him, she wants him too but she can't quite believe he wants her to. The mirror is important because in the "eyes" of society they don't look right, he should never be with her and this plays into Elphaba's insecurities, the would would say they shouldn't be together but they were alone together for the first time since the lion cub rescue. This is why she moves away from him.

The start of her verse is " kiss me to fiercely, hold me too tight" is her telling him how she feels and what she wants, this is her telling him she wants him. The rest of it also explains why she is distant " I need help believing you're with me tonight...my wildest dreamings could not for see lying next to you with you wanting me." Elphaba didn't know what to think and she needed help believing that was really happening.

Also, as far as we know, Elphaba was inexperienced, there's no reason to believe she'd been with anyone before and this is also why she acted shy and nervous.

Fiyero is mesmerized by the home she's made and that's why he's looking around her house, he's holding a propaganda flyer that portrays her as harsh and hideous, Fiyero realizes that she believes this is how all of Oz sees her and he needs to reassure that he doesn't see her that way. This is why he says " you're beautiful", all her life Elphaba had been led to believe she wasn't attractive at all, the only other person to tell her she was beautiful was Glinda and this was a different situation and she didn't believe Glinda when she told her either. This is why Elphaba gets defensive again when she responds with " you don't have to lie to me." Fiyero realizes from her response that Elphaba doesn't believe him, she thinks he's just telling her what she wants to hear. This is why he gets on his knees in front of her, he wants to look her in the eye, so she knows he's sincere. He then tells her " it's not lying" " what is it then?" " it's looking at things another way." This might sound awful at first hearing it but what he is saying is he doesn't see her the way Oz does, where they see angry, he sees passionate, where they see stubborn, he sees determined , where they see emotional, he sees fierce, etc. He's saying the because he looks at her differently than society does he really does think she's beautiful. He'd always seen her as beautiful and he'd always "seen" her.

He's also saying it's not just about looks, he thinks she's a beautiful person, he thinks who she is as a person is beautiful to him.

Elphaba knows what he's telling her and this is when she starts to let her walls down.

Fiyero's verse is him telling how he feels about her, " you've got me seeing through different eyes", he's saying she changed the way he looked at the world. " somehow I've fallen under your spell" this is a play on words but he's saying he's fallen in love with her, he's telling her loves her. " Somehow I can't help feeling it's up that i fell" he's telling her he's glad he's fallen for her, despite the dangers, it's made his life better and he doesn't regret it's happened. This is when Elphaba knows it's real and she gets alot more confident.

This is when the scene gets more "active" if you watch she was leading him towards her bed, she was now convinced that he loved and wanted her and she was so happy. When he caught her by the waist she was laughing and smiling, her magic reacted to her happiness and that's why they levitated. Fiyero was briefly surprised by the levitation but he showed no fear or reservation about her power. She levitates both of them onto her bed, which is interesting given how shy and nervous she was at the start.

Elphaba's line " for the first time, i feel Wicked" is another play on words, Wicked had a double meaning and can mean really good so she's saying that she's never felt the way he's made her feel before but she likes it, she feels good. She drops her arms at the end as Fiyero starts to remove the cardigan, this is her surrender, where she gives into love and desire.

Also i wanted to say that i know some people were confused by the cardigan and black lingerie here's my interpretation, the cardigan was something she would normally sleep in, she came home, got undressed like she would to go to bed, it was her getting comfortable but also the cardigan could represent more of her insecurity, like she was trying to hide her body from him because she'd been mocked for her green skin so much.

The lingerie was simply her underwear, she was wearing under her clothes, she probably got it when she and Glinda went to the emerald city. Also the lingerie is the most skin she'd ever shown around anyone, this shows she did trust Fiyero and she was comfortable with him.

It may have seemed like their relationship progressed quickly but Fiyero spent a year searching for and protecting Elphaba, he spent a year longing for her and worrying about her. Elphaba was alone until Fiyero chose her, he gave up everything for her and he chose what he knew was right like she did. They already had feelings for each other long before this and they were both just overwhelmed by joy and love. Also, given that they were both fugitives and were wanted there was a good chance they might not have long left, there was a chance that one or both of them could be killed and they didn't wanna waste more time, they knew this could be the only chance they would have so they took it.

There are alot of layers and alot of symbolism in the scene.

i just wanted to share this because apparently the scene was pretty controversial so i wanted to share my analysis of it.

Thoughts?

Imo Fiyero leaving Glinda was probably the best thing he could've done for all three of the characters in the love triangle.

Fiyero leaving Glinda was sad and it hurt her but if he had stayed and married her it wouldn't have been fair for her or to himself. She would have been married to a man who didn't love her, and Fiyero would have been married to a woman he didn't love and to a woman who was supporting the people who vilified the woman he really loved.

Fiyero wouldn't have been happy if he had married her and to be honest I'm not sure Glinda would have been happy either, sooner or later she would have realized the marriage was a mistake. They would have been trapped at that point.

Also Elphaba would have been alone and it wouldn't have been fair to Elphaba if Fiyero had married either because he wouldn't have been honest about his feelings for her.

To sum up my opinion is that Fiyero leaving Glinda was the right thing to do, it was sad and it hurt Glinda and the timing was bad but it was when he could get out and when he finally found Elphaba or rather when she found him and he took that chance, he probably wouldn't have gotten another one.

This way Fiyero was able to be with the woman he truly loved, Elphaba wasn't alone anymore and Glinda wouldn't be married to someone who didn't love her. Honestly, it was best that Fiyero and Elphaba were finally together IMO, it was pretty obvious they belonged together.

Thoughts?